Favored Soul - mc advice

[Candela90]

So im playing favored soul. Last time i played cleric once to 16 level, then fvs to 8 level and i made sdome mistakes with fvs. So Im starting again.
Never seen mc favored soul 19lvl & wizard 1lvl.
Is it really that bad? Or I dont see sth?
My fvs is mainly a healer and offensive caster, melee only if need - but bad melee.
Sp is not a problem.
So cant I take a wizard to have some helping spells like
Detect Secret Doors
Expeditious Retreat
Feather Fall
Mage Armor
Shield
?
Theyre useful and i always lose hp falling down, or irritate cause everybody runs faster.
I dont see sense in putting skill points in search and jump, and this spell would solve the problem when wizzards are not around.
Could I inscribe spell then?
And is it bad idea?

I dont want to mulitclass now. After 7-8 level I think.
first i thoung its a good idea, but I see fvs and cleric really rare mutliclass, so Im probably missing sth. Can u help?

Oh. My starting stats:
Strength 14
Dexterity 14
Constitution 10
Intelligence 10
Wisdom 15
Charisma 16

Maybe Im mistaken in Char and it was 17 - dont really remember. I have 32-points build. Planning on using +2 tomes on 7 level.
I increased just wis and char with enhancments, so i have now with stuffs and feats:
Strength 15
Dexterity 17
Constitution 10
Intelligence 10
Wisdom 18
Charisma 20
Im level 5 now.

Can u say too what stats should i increase to be better healer? Char od wis?

[nicnivyn]

I wouldn't splash wizard for level 1 spells that are easily wand/scroll-able with just a few ranks into UMD. It's not worth losing the capstone ability and DR.

I'll expand on that. If you are going for a caster FvS build, it's far better to put no build points into STR and instead invest in a couple extra INT so you can put points into UMD. Since FvS end up with decent charisma (with items and enhancements that are available) a couple items (like the necklace from Delera's) slotted in situationally will easily give you access to those same spells you named.

It may be hard to see if you've never actually capped a FvS, but the capstone 10/ DR is huge at end game. And the capstone ability (free searing light for SF or cure light wounds for SH) are extremely nice.

[nicnivyn]

Oh. My starting stats:
Strength 14
Dexterity 14
Constitution 10
Intelligence 10
Wisdom 15
Charisma 16

Charisma affects your spell points, Wisdom is what your spell DC is based on. If you are going caster, I would (IMHO) change the stat distribution completely. Something more like:

STR 8
DEX 8
CON 16 (14 if elf or drow)
INT 10 (Concentration + UMD, +2 tome at level 7 if you want a point for Jump)
WIS 18
CHA 12 or 14 (whatever points you have left can go here.)

Full disclosure: I have a decided prejudice towards pure caster Evoker FvS.

[Candela90]

Charisma affects your spell points, Wisdom is what your spell DC is based on. If you are going caster, I would (IMHO) change the stat distribution completely. Something more like:

STR 8
DEX 8
CON 16 (14 if elf or drow)
INT 10 (Concentration + UMD, +2 tome at level 7 if you want a point for Jump)
WIS 18
CHA 12 or 14 (whatever points you have left can go here.)

Full disclosure: I have a decided prejudice towards pure caster Evoker FvS.

Im an elf. I didint put skills in con, cause i did it in mine first fvs and was diying really often ;]. Cause when gorup couldnt fight all monsters i couldnt protect myself even a little. 1-4 level for fvs dont have nice offensive spells. And I was told that 12 str is minimum to looting.
So no more in char, right? Cause FvS have nice SP. And not mutliclassing, taking scrolls.
About capstone - i never had one, but it seems im SH, so im going to have cure light wounds. (I so wanted to have invisibility, but clw would be useful too).
And i should put skill points in UMD and some stats in int and wis more.
Did i understand all good?

To this point i put skill points in concentration, tumble, balance, spot and some in UMD. Mainly in Concentration and spot, cause I was always walking in all traps And without concentration casting spells in the middle of fight could be difficult.

And I want to be mainly a healer. Caster is just for me dont end up dead. Pretecting myself always nice. Good healer is alive healer ;]

[Dandonk]

The level 20 and capstone abilities on fvs are very nice, I would generally go pure unless you have a really good reason (splashing two levels of monk for evasion, for instance, can be a decent trade off).

Yes, with a wizard level you ca use arcane wands, but generally this will not be of great use to you. Stoneskin wands are nice, but not worth the hassle - especially not at endgame when you get DR 10/something for free anyway.

As for the spells:
Detect Secret Doors - clickies for this are fairly common. Later on, you can cast True Seeing to find them.
Exp Retreat - decent at low levels, but doesn't stack with haste or striders, so not so useful later on. You can get anger boots with clickies, or find clickies with it on, for use until you outgrow the spell.
Featherfall - get clickies for free from Korthos, or find yourself a permanent ff item, not worth a slot.
Mage Armor - doesn't stack with armor, so useless.
Shield - You get night shield to block magic missiles, and the AC doesn't stack with real shields - though you might not want to use those (dual wielding scepters is popular). The AC might help a bit at the lowest levels, but is most likely useless very fast.
Jump - is nice, but you can get clickies for it later on (even just normal 1 min +10 is fine for the low levels.

Search skill: Noone but a rogue (and splashes) should ever put points into this skill.

Stats:
STR 14 : I like having a 12-14 str on my toons, so they can carry more loot and don't get helpless'ed by those ray of enfeeblements.
DEX 14 : You'll likely not have AC to matter later on, but the reflex save might help. I'd still dump it, though, I find other stats more useful.
CON 10 : Ouch. Low HP sucks, especially later on when you can't avoid all damage even if you do stay back. And really, with a caster fvs, high hp makes for fun soloing with bladebarriers and selfheals. 6 points in it at minimum, so 14 for normal races, is my recommendation.
INT 10: Seems fine; I like concentration, balance and umd on fvs, but umd does take some work to get up there to be useful (I only take it for teleport and other convenience stuff, really).
WIS 15: If you're going to be a caster, this should be as high as possible. Wisdom determines your DCs, how likely your spells are to take effect (sort of). I'd max this.
CHA 16: CHA sounds useful from the description on the character creation page - but it really isn't. You need enough to cast your spells (19 minimum to cast level 9 spells), but other than that it only gives a small sp bonus that is really, well, small. I like to start with 12 so I don't have to worry about cha items for the first few levels, but some do start with 10, or even 8.

CHA or WIS to be healer? Well CHA does give SP while WIS doesn't help your party healing - but no fvs should be pure healbot. You'll easily have enough SP for healing even with a lowish CHA, so it's better to have options for soloing or helping the party out with other abilities - melee damage (if built for that), or spells (CC, instakill, damage).

Finally: Multiclassing should ALWAYS be thought out in advance. Yes, sometimes people make it work anyway and have great fun with it - but often, especially for the newer people, it ends up not working very well at all.
Multiclassing on casting classes is even less good - you lose out on a lot (SP, spell slots, capstone, caster level, spell penetration), and should only be approached very carefully.

[samdsherman]

most important stat for fvs is con, start 18 (20 if wf) and pump con.

[Candela90]

So now firstly increase con, and dex is not needed so high, right? Then maybe some int. And stay pure fvs.
Maybe I'll invest in reicarnation to pun more in con. But ill see later in game.
So, if i wanted to reincarnate, mine stats can look like that? :
Str 14
Dex 10
Con 15
Int 10
Wis 16
Char 14
Or maybe 12 in str and more in con or wis?

Would it be better?
And skill points in balance, concentration, spot and some tumble and maybe UMD? Not bothering with jump and rest?
And ty u all for help.

[Dendrix]

Splashing 1 level of wizard for what you are proposing is a terrible idea.

Detect Secret Doors: Get a 3* or 5* a day clickie for this.
Expeditious Retreat: 1 min duration is just not worth it. Get striding boots or a striding ring.
Feather Fall: Buy a pair of feather falling boots, put on when needed. AND at 17th level as a FvS you get the wings ability which for 10sp gives you 90second of feather fall.
Mage Armor: 1min +4ac is pointless, this is the SAME bonus as worn physical armour, it does not stack with it.
Shield: 1min +4ac and immunit to magic missile. Any +2 or bigger shield provides more AC. Protection from Magic Missiles can be gained from casting nighshield on yourself, a 1st level fvs spell which will last for (level) minutes.

You also give up the benefits of the 20th level as a favoured soul:
DR10 (this is MASSIVE)
An 8th and 9th level spell. This is MASSIVE
+2 Cha (minor)
You also delay gaining your fvs spells by another level all the way (i.e. 2 levels after a cleric would get the same spells).

Statistics:
I assume you are an elf or a drow from those statistics planning on using 2 weapons?
if not, then your DEX is way too high.

Your CON is too low and your CHA is too high.
At 20th level every 2 points of CHA is worth 29 spell points. You only need to have 19 CHA in order to cast all your spells.
Here's the important maths:
+2 CHA (Capstone FVS ability)
+2CHA (Tome @ 7th level)
+6 CHA (an item)
That is +10 cha to get you up to 19. If you start with 12 CHA and put the rest of the points spent on CHA into CON you would lose 60sp and gain 60HP. That's a massive difference to your survivability.
If you run out of SP you can still move, hit, use wands, scrolls, mnemonic potions etc. If you run out of HP you are dead and can do nothing, and everyone else who was relying on you to heal will also die.

You have 10 con @ level 5. Reroll now.

[AndyD47]

most important stat for fvs is con, start 18 (20 if wf) and pump con.

Uh,the most important stat for a FvS is either strength or wisdom depending on which way you went with it.

So now firstly increase con, and dex is not needed so high, right? Then maybe some int. And stay pure fvs.
Maybe I'll invest in reicarnation to pun more in con. But ill see later in game.
So, if i wanted to reincarnate, mine stats can look like that? :
Str 14
Dex 10
Con 15
Int 10
Wis 16
Char 14
Or maybe 12 in str and more in con or wis?

Would it be better?
And skill points in balance, concentration, spot and some tumble and maybe UMD? Not bothering with jump and rest?
And ty u all for help.

If you are shooting for an offensive casting FvS I'd suggest 18 wisdom/12 charisma/leftover in con (should be about 14) and maybe a point or two in str just for carrying capacity/help prevent helplessness.

You could go lower with the charisma even,if you don't mind using potions(eagle's splendor) to help cast spells for the first few levels,but it might take some getting use to.

As far as skills go,you don't need spot.
Concentration,balance to an extent,and maybe UMD.
If you can fit a little more INT in for UMD more power to you,but you might be tight on stat points.


As far as splashing is concerned,capstone is really worth it on a FvS not to mention it increases your chance at getting through SR.

[Diib]

While generally I agree wholeheartedly with others that multiclassing wizard on a fvs is a bad idea, there are a few advantages.

I used lesser reincarnation to try out a 16 fvs/2 wiz/2 monk after u9. Again, I DO NOT RECOMMEND THIS for new players that are not very familiar with the tradeoffs.


2 wizard - ignore the spells completely. I didn't even have the int to cast any of my wizard spells, and I didn't care. What I got out of two wizard was 1) a free casting feat, 2) +20% damage to the fire damage in my few fire spells, 3) +20% damage to my untyped spells that stacked with the 30% of the pre (+50% bb damage). The first level of wizard gives you +20% to your fire damage (and all other elemental damage, if, like me, you had past life:sorc). The second level of wizard gives you that super juicy +20% to all untyped damage (its the new force/untyped enhancement)... which is most of what you have that isn't alignment damage.

Yeah, you lose mass heal. And if you want to play a healbot, its a no-go. Its also a very poor choice if you are looking for instakilling, you lose spell pen and don't even get access to implosion. BUT if your build relys on pure dps, mostly from bbs and weapons (as mine did) the extra +20% damage to the bb is noticeable and nice. I also had past life wizard and past life sorc, so all of my free spelllikes were boosted by the wizard enhancements. When you are fitting in multiple past lives, sometimes 3 extra feats is worth losing level 20 abilities, especially if you are planning on tring again, and so your goal is level 19 builds.

So there aren't no advantages. But the advantages are limited to certain specific playstyles, and only with a ton, ton, ton of experience should you even try it. NOT on your first capped toon. NOT even on your first fvs.

Hope that helps.


Edit:
Just to be more clear. I think that the entire level 8 divine spell list is basically garbage. You get fantastic spells at level 7 and level 9 divine, and level 8, well they mostly just take up space on a hotbar. If you tr as soon as you hit 20, you are debating between a 15/2/2 fvs/mnk/wiz and a 17/2 fvs/mnk. The first gets a 20% boost to the most common damaging spells. The second gets wings (fun!). Both will be basically equal healers when called upon in that role. Neither is designed to remotely be a healbot... these are mostly solo dps toons.

Double Edit:
ALSO, if you are thinking about a 15/2/2, both 15 fvs/2 mnk/2 pal and 15 fvs/2 mnk/2 ftr are probably better. The 2 wiz combo is really just to max blade barrier damage.

[Chette]

So now firstly increase con, and dex is not needed so high, right? Then maybe some int. And stay pure fvs.
Maybe I'll invest in reicarnation to pun more in con. But ill see later in game.
So, if i wanted to reincarnate, mine stats can look like that? :
Str 14
Dex 10
Con 15
Int 10
Wis 16
Char 14
Or maybe 12 in str and more in con or wis?

I would recommend:

Str 12
Dex 8
Con 14
Int 10
Wis 18
Cha 12

The stats you have suggested will work also. Put all level up points into wisdom. This will make it so that you can cast spells with a save, like destruction (similar to a wizards finger of death). At low level soundburst is also nice for stunning large groups. Like you said, a dead healer can't heal, so stop those enemies before they can hurt you

And skill points in balance, concentration, spot and some tumble and maybe UMD? Not bothering with jump and rest?

Assuming you are human you will have 3 skill points per level (2 if not human). I would recommend concentration, UMD, and jump until you have a 10 modifier on your jump then switch to concentration, UMD and balance. Put 1 rank into tumble at creation. If you use a +2 intelligence tome at level 7 you will get an extra skill point each level so that you can max out balance.

If you are not very high level yet I would not really waste the money on reincarnation. Just start a new character.

[Pape_27]

INT 10 (Concentration + UMD)

UMD? Iirc, its a charisma based skill, not an Int based skill.

[FunFooFurat]

While generally I agree wholeheartedly with others that multiclassing wizard on a fvs is a bad idea, there are a few advantages.

I used lesser reincarnation to try out a 16 fvs/2 wiz/2 monk after u9. Again, I DO NOT RECOMMEND THIS for new players that are not very familiar with the tradeoffs.


2 wizard - ignore the spells completely. I didn't even have the int to cast any of my wizard spells, and I didn't care. What I got out of two wizard was 1) a free casting feat, 2) +20% damage to the fire damage in my few fire spells, 3) +20% damage to my untyped spells that stacked with the 30% of the pre (+50% bb damage). The first level of wizard gives you +20% to your fire damage (and all other elemental damage, if, like me, you had past life:sorc). The second level of wizard gives you that super juicy +20% to all untyped damage (its the new force/untyped enhancement)... which is most of what you have that isn't alignment damage.

Yeah, you lose mass heal. And if you want to play a healbot, its a no-go. Its also a very poor choice if you are looking for instakilling, you lose spell pen and don't even get access to implosion. BUT if your build relys on pure dps, mostly from bbs and weapons (as mine did) the extra +20% damage to the bb is noticeable and nice. I also had past life wizard and past life sorc, so all of my free spelllikes were boosted by the wizard enhancements. When you are fitting in multiple past lives, sometimes 3 extra feats is worth losing level 20 abilities, especially if you are planning on tring again, and so your goal is level 19 builds.

So there aren't no advantages. But the advantages are limited to certain specific playstyles, and only with a ton, ton, ton of experience should you even try it. NOT on your first capped toon. NOT even on your first fvs.

Hope that helps.


Edit:
Just to be more clear. I think that the entire level 8 divine spell list is basically garbage. You get fantastic spells at level 7 and level 9 divine, and level 8, well they mostly just take up space on a hotbar. If you tr as soon as you hit 20, you are debating between a 15/2/2 fvs/mnk/wiz and a 17/2 fvs/mnk. The first gets a 20% boost to the most common damaging spells. The second gets wings (fun!). Both will be basically equal healers when called upon in that role. Neither is designed to remotely be a healbot... these are mostly solo dps toons.

Double Edit:
ALSO, if you are thinking about a 15/2/2, both 15 fvs/2 mnk/2 pal and 15 fvs/2 mnk/2 ftr are probably better. The 2 wiz combo is really just to max blade barrier damage.

Heya Diib.

Are you absolutely positive that the 20% from Force Manipulation I is stacking with the 30% from AoV II on your Blade Barriers?

Apparently the word from Eladrin was that "only a character's best item and best enhancement apply to spell damage amplification."

I asked whether or not BB worked with FM, and if FM stacked with AoV in an earlier thread:

http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=323084

Also, sorry for the derail OP. B-)

Cheers.

[Diib]

Heya Diib.

Are you absolutely positive that the 20% from Force Manipulation I is stacking with the 30% from AoV II on your Blade Barriers?

Apparently the word from Eladrin was that "only a character's best item and best enhancement apply to spell damage amplification."

I asked whether or not BB worked with FM, and if FM stacked with AoV in an earlier thread:

http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=323084

Also, sorry for the derail OP. B-)

Cheers.

From my testing it absolutely was stacking. I don't have the char anymore (tr'd). Perhaps that was not how it was supposed to work, but thats the way it was working.

[Fejj]

STR 8
DEX 8
CON 16 (14 if elf or drow)
INT 10 (Concentration + UMD, +2 tome at level 7 if you want a point for Jump)
WIS 18
CHA 12 or 14 (whatever points you have left can go here.)

Full disclosure: I have a decided prejudice towards pure caster Evoker FvS.

*This^* ----- The above is a proven build that will play great from 1 - 20 and dominate content as a caster, or healbot as the group allows.


There are 3 types of Favored Souls out there (i'm generalizing just go with it)
Casters - Maxing out Wisdom and keeping it maxed.
Melee - Maxing out Str and Con dumping all the rest.
Healbots - All the ones that did not do one of the above.

Casters and Melee builds can both play a Healbot role flawlessly, as well as be usefull in so many other ways.
Healbots can ONLY heal ... and are not worth a party slot (IMO)

About Multiclassing - Don't (unless you fully understand what you are doing) Coming here and asking is the BEST THING you could have done. Next time, do it before you try out a new build.

What you want to gain from 1 wizard level is all available without the wizard level from clickies, or gear.

About Stats -
Str - 8-10 for caster / 14-18 for melee
Dex - Please no (just dump this)
Con - 14 (please don't take less)
Int - 10-12
Wisdom - 18 for caster / 6-8 for melee
Cha - 10 - 12? I started with 10 cha on my melee FS, and now have over 2,500 SP.

For wisdom there is no "good enough". Its either all or nothing with DC's. Starting with a 14 wisdom is for all practical purposes the same as a 6. I have a 6 wisdom on my melee FS, and my Blade Barrier still tears it up.

[FunFooFurat]

From my testing it absolutely was stacking. I don't have the char anymore (tr'd). Perhaps that was not how it was supposed to work, but thats the way it was working.

Very interesting indeed. I wonder if it's WAI?

Anyway, to the OP; I would say going pure is the safe bet. Multiclassing (especially casters) is generally not a good idea unless you know exactly what you're giving up and plan it out in advance.

That being said, don't be afraid to try stuff out for yourself to see what works with what. Multiclassing is about finding synergies between different classes and enhancements. Also, veteran status (if you have it) is a great way to try out new ideas without having to start from level 1 each time you want to try something new.

My first character was a Dwarven Battlecleric with 1 level of Ranger...Bow Strength ftw!

[jwdaniels]

UMD? Iirc, its a charisma based skill, not an Int based skill.

And concentration is con-based, but you need enough int to have the skill points to raise thjem.

[Candela90]

Thanks u for all advices.
So... I reincarnated and decided to:
Str: 14
Dex: 10
Con: 14
Int: 10
Wis: 16
Char: 12
Wanted to lower the dex to 8, but Im elf so I couldnt. And I think its better to play with no-perfect stats than hate your character. With things I have wisdom 20 and char 14 now, and with buffs +2 to all. I think when i will use tomes at lvl 7 it will be fine. At least - better than earlier. Minimum str i 12, and i wanted to put 2 left points in wis, but 1 stat more in wis costet me 3 skill points. So i gave it to str. I played before with 12 str and didn like it. +2 str does big difference.

And Im going o stay pure fvs, and starting collect scrolls and potions for spell i want. And max wis from now.

How much concentration I need? Now i have 11. What is max?

Dont have veteran yet, and playing to 4 level to try things out is really boring.