Shield Toting Tosser: 18 Fighter/2 Rogue (Throwing Axes+Shield+Traps+Evasion+Stealth)

[nolaureltree000]

let me start off by saying that this is not a min/max build; not by a long shot. this is the kind of build that ends up on alot of squelch lists because of its unconventional nature. lets face it, a fighter showing up in a PUG with a tower shield and standing back pew-pewing with throwers is going to generate alot of auto-squelches. i dont have delusions of this being a DPS powerhouse, rather i see it as a niche build that can be fairly successful via a play style that plays into its strengths (sneaking to avoid encounters when possible and pulling one or two targets from a mob to split up the kills. in groups pew-pewing, debuffing, and doing traps.). mostly its just for something new and different.

anyways, with the implementation of the new crafting system decent throwing weapons seem to be much more obtainable without waiting for a rare drop or dumping a bunch of GS components into crafting one. so it led to me to consider how you would go about creating a toon that used throwing weapons as its primary offensive means. seeing as throwing weapons are a one-handed affair, the build might as well go after tower shields for some nice damage mitigation.

then throw in 2 rogue levels so i have atleast one top rate thing to bring to the table for grouping in trap skills. plus the 2 rogue levels gives me evasion, UMD for self-healing via scrolls, and a little bit of sneak attack damage.

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 3.8.0
DDO Character Planner Home Page

Level 20 Neutral Good Halfling Male
(18 Fighter \ 2 Rogue) 
Hit Points: 272
Spell Points: 0 
BAB: 19\19\24\29\29
Fortitude: 15
Reflex: 11
Will: 6

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
Abilities        Base Stats          Modified Stats
(32 Point)       (Level 1)             (Level 20)
Strength             16                    26
Dexterity            11                    13
Constitution         14                    16
Intelligence         14                    16
Wisdom                8                     8
Charisma             11                    13

Tomes Used
+2 Tome of Strength used at level 7
+2 Tome of Dexterity used at level 7
+2 Tome of Constitution used at level 7
+2 Tome of Intelligence used at level 7
+2 Tome of Charisma used at level 7

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
                 Base Skills         Modified Skills
Skills           (Level 1)            (Level 20)
Balance               4                     5
Bluff                 0                     7
Concentration         2                     6
Diplomacy             0                     4
Disable Device        6                    16
Haggle                0                     1
Heal                 -1                    -1
Hide                  4                    17
Intimidate            0                     4
Jump                  7                    15
Listen               -1                     1
Move Silently         4                    14
Open Lock             4                     5
Perform               n/a                   n/a
Repair                2                     3
Search                6                    16
Spot                  3                     3
Swim                  3                     8
Tumble                4                     5
Use Magic Device      4                    14

Level 1 (Rogue)
Feat: (Selected) Point Blank Shot


Level 2 (Rogue)


Level 3 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Brutal Throw
Feat: (Selected) Quick Draw


Level 4 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Shield Mastery


Level 5 (Fighter)


Level 6 (Fighter)
Feat: (Selected) Weapon Focus: Thrown Weapons
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Weapon Specialization: Thrown Weapons


Level 7 (Fighter)


Level 8 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Rapid Shot


Level 9 (Fighter)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Shield Mastery


Level 10 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Improved Critical: Thrown Weapons


Level 11 (Fighter)


Level 12 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Greater Weapon Focus: Thrown Weapons
Feat: (Selected) Precise Shot


Level 13 (Fighter)


Level 14 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Dodge


Level 15 (Fighter)
Feat: (Selected) Mobility


Level 16 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Shot on the Run


Level 17 (Fighter)


Level 18 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Greater Weapon Specialization: Thrown Weapons
Feat: (Selected) Superior Weapon Focus: Thrown Weapons


Level 19 (Fighter)


Level 20 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Power Attack
Enhancement: Fighter Attack Boost I
Enhancement: Fighter Attack Boost II
Enhancement: Fighter Attack Boost III
Enhancement: Rogue Damage Boost I
Enhancement: Fighter Haste Boost I
Enhancement: Rogue Skill Boost I
Enhancement: Kensei Throwing Axe Mastery I
Enhancement: Kensei Throwing Axe Mastery II
Enhancement: Kensei Throwing Axe Mastery III
Enhancement: Fighter Critical Accuracy I
Enhancement: Fighter Critical Accuracy II
Enhancement: Fighter Critical Accuracy III
Enhancement: Fighter Kensei I
Enhancement: Fighter Kensei II
Enhancement: Fighter Kensei III
Enhancement: Fighter Throwing Axe Specialization I
Enhancement: Fighter Throwing Axe Specialization II
Enhancement: Fighter Throwing Hammer Specialization I
Enhancement: Fighter Throwing Hammer Specialization II
Enhancement: Fighter Flanking Mastery I
Enhancement: Halfling Cunning I
Enhancement: Halfling Cunning II
Enhancement: Halfling Cunning III
Enhancement: Halfling Guile I
Enhancement: Halfling Guile II
Enhancement: Halfling Guile III
Enhancement: Halfling Thrown Weapon Attack I
Enhancement: Halfling Thrown Weapon Attack II
Enhancement: Halfling Thrown Weapon Damage I
Enhancement: Halfling Thrown Weapon Damage II
Enhancement: Halfling Thrown Weapon Damage III
Enhancement: Rogue Faster Sneaking I
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Accuracy I
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training I
Enhancement: Fighter Strength I
Enhancement: Fighter Strength II
Enhancement: Fighter Strength III
Enhancement: Rogue Improved Trap Sense I

thoughts, critiques, suggestions?

this is only a first pass at this build. i still need to wait a bit to get my crafting levels up a bit higher and compile some craftable returning throwers as id like to have a nice set of debuffing throwers to go along with damagers. there is probably a better feat order to go with, but everything listed is what id like to include.

im also not sure about the stealth skills as ive never made a build with them before. is what i have going to give me reasonable levels of stealth ability once i get some stealth gear on? im not necessarily looking to be able to sneak through whole levels, mostly just avoid some encounters within levels or for use with aggro/pulling small numbers of mobs out of larger encounters.

[Trillea]

Get quick draw - it's like rapid reload for throwers.

That said... throwers? Really? REALLY??

Edit: Now I see your quick draw at lev 3.

My 2nd point still stands..

[Maxallu]

Too bad throwing axes dont count as slashing and throwing if you were to make say an LIT II throwing axe.

[nolaureltree000]

Get quick draw - it's like rapid reload for throwers.

That said... throwers? Really? REALLY??

Edit: Now I see your quick draw at lev 3.

My 2nd point still stands..

throwers need love too!

ive always liked having nice throwers on my toons (usually make some tier II GS throwers for them) so ive always wanted a build like this that really goes after throwers. pre-crafting it seemed to be more of a cool idea rather than anything workable due to the poor range of throwers available.

[Trillea]

throwers need love too!

ive always liked having nice throwers on my toons (usually make some tier II GS throwers for them) so ive always wanted a build like this that really goes after throwers. pre-crafting it seemed to be more of a cool idea rather than anything workable due to the poor range of throwers available.

I understand, I like the weird build here and there too. I had a repeating-crossbow kiter back when the level cap was like 12 that was named Run n Gun on Thelanis.

I just hope you have fun, my quick draw suggestion was meant to be helpful then I really did find it later..

[ThePrincipal]

halfing get +2/+2 to throw attacks but drow seem to be the better dps thrower due to Shuriken Expertise which increases the rate of fire but youd have to loose the shield

[nolaureltree000]

halfing get +2/+2 to throw attacks but drow seem to be the better dps thrower due to Shuriken Expertise which increases the rate of fire but youd have to loose the shield

i messed around with some monk splashes to try to go for wind stance and shuriken expertise. that was my first thought too. but then i realized that shuriken expertise only had a percentage chance of double throwing. so then id have to go from a STR to a DEX build to take advantage of that. ultimately i thought that going that way would lower my overall dps. ive never been a dps calculations kind of guy, so thats just an assumption.

but as you said, id have to give up the shield and thats more or less what tipped the scale for me. throwers are only a one handed job so id like to get some utility from the off hand with shields. plus with a low dps build, i like the idea of damage mitigation which helps to make me a bit more survivable.

[Balkas]

If you are really going to be doing a throwing build, I would highly suggest being bard-based just for the sole reason that most groups don't care what a bard is doing as long as he's Singing and Hasting.

Just trying to save you future grief :-)

[drsmooth]

You could also fit in 6 ranger for deepwood sniper. The sniper shot works with bows and crossbows, and I think thrown weapons(haven't tested this in ages)

[karnokvolrath]

Someday this will be the gold standard of true dps.

[unbongwah]

Any ranged-focused build w/out Imp Precise Shot just makes me sad. See? <- that's how you know I'm sincere.

[Junts]

This is an impressive min/min build.

[nolaureltree000]

If you are really going to be doing a throwing build, I would highly suggest being bard-based just for the sole reason that most groups don't care what a bard is doing as long as he's Singing and Hasting.

Just trying to save you future grief :-)

this build is partially an experiment to see how far the 'play what you like, dont tell me how to build my toons' rule goes when pugging

i did play around with a 12fighter/6bard/2rouge that took tier 1 of warchanter. while my skills came out better with the bard levels, i wasnt pleased with the feats. i felt like it would lower my already meager dps and the only thing i really got out of it was some bard songs.

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 3.8.0
DDO Character Planner Home Page

Level 20 Chaotic Good Halfling Male
(12 Fighter \ 2 Rogue \ 6 Bard) 
Hit Points: 258
Spell Points: 205 
BAB: 17\17\22\27\27
Fortitude: 14
Reflex: 14
Will: 9

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
Abilities        Base Stats          Modified Stats
(32 Point)       (Level 1)             (Level 20)
Strength             16                    26
Dexterity            11                    13
Constitution         14                    16
Intelligence         14                    16
Wisdom                8                     8
Charisma             11                    15

Tomes Used
+1 Tome of Charisma used at level 3
+2 Tome of Strength used at level 7
+2 Tome of Dexterity used at level 7
+2 Tome of Constitution used at level 7
+2 Tome of Intelligence used at level 7
+3 Tome of Charisma used at level 7

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
                 Base Skills         Modified Skills
Skills           (Level 1)            (Level 20)
Balance               4                     6
Bluff                 0                     7
Concentration         2                     5
Diplomacy             0                     4
Disable Device        6                    20
Haggle                0                     2
Heal                 -1                    -1
Hide                  4                    22
Intimidate            0                     6
Jump                  7                    15
Listen               -1                     1
Move Silently         4                    20
Open Lock             4                     6
Perform               n/a                   9
Repair                2                     3
Search                6                    20
Spot                  3                     4
Swim                  3                     8
Tumble                4                     6
Use Magic Device      4                    19

Level 1 (Rogue)
Feat: (Selected) Power Attack


Level 2 (Rogue)


Level 3 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Quick Draw


Level 4 (Bard)


Level 5 (Bard)


Level 6 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Brutal Throw


Level 7 (Bard)


Level 8 (Bard)


Level 9 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Point Blank Shot
Feat: (Selected) Rapid Shot


Level 10 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Shield Mastery


Level 11 (Fighter)


Level 12 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Improved Critical: Thrown Weapons
Feat: (Selected) Improved Shield Mastery


Level 13 (Fighter)


Level 14 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Weapon Focus: Slashing Weapons


Level 15 (Fighter)
Feat: (Selected) Precise Shot


Level 16 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Weapon Focus: Thrown Weapons


Level 17 (Fighter)


Level 18 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Greater Weapon Focus: Thrown Weapons
Feat: (Selected) Weapon Specialization: Thrown Weapons


Level 19 (Fighter)


Level 20 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Greater Weapon Specialization: Thrown Weapons
Enhancement: Fighter Attack Boost I
Enhancement: Fighter Attack Boost II
Enhancement: Fighter Haste Boost I
Enhancement: Rogue Skill Boost I
Enhancement: Bard Extra Song I
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Attack I
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Bravery I
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Bravery II
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Damage I
Enhancement: Bard Lingering Song I
Enhancement: Bard Lingering Song II
Enhancement: Bard Warchanter I
Enhancement: Kensei Throwing Axe Mastery I
Enhancement: Kensei Throwing Axe Mastery II
Enhancement: Fighter Critical Accuracy I
Enhancement: Fighter Critical Accuracy II
Enhancement: Fighter Kensei I
Enhancement: Fighter Kensei II
Enhancement: Fighter Throwing Axe Specialization I
Enhancement: Fighter Throwing Hammer Specialization I
Enhancement: Fighter Flanking Mastery I
Enhancement: Halfling Cunning I
Enhancement: Halfling Cunning II
Enhancement: Halfling Cunning III
Enhancement: Halfling Guile I
Enhancement: Halfling Guile II
Enhancement: Halfling Guile III
Enhancement: Halfling Thrown Weapon Attack I
Enhancement: Halfling Thrown Weapon Attack II
Enhancement: Halfling Thrown Weapon Damage I
Enhancement: Halfling Thrown Weapon Damage II
Enhancement: Rogue Faster Sneaking I
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Accuracy I
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training I
Enhancement: Bard Charisma I
Enhancement: Fighter Strength I
Enhancement: Fighter Strength II
Enhancement: Fighter Strength III
Enhancement: Rogue Improved Trap Sense I
Enhancement: Bard Wand and Scroll Mastery I
Enhancement: Bard Wand and Scroll Mastery II
Enhancement: Bard Wand Heightening I

Any ranged-focused build w/out Imp Precise Shot just makes me sad. See? <- that's how you know I'm sincere.

im not sure that a DEX of 19 is feasible on this build to qualify for improved precise shot. id have to dump some CHA and/or STR which would kill my self-healing from UMD or lower my already meager DPS. i dont think that periodic multiple hits on lined up targets is a good enough of a trade off.

This is an impressive min/min build.

one for two is good right? thats 50%.

[Maelodic]

Wouldn't this build be better as a pure or splashed rouge for sneak attack damage?

That's how them repeater rouges get away with it.

[nolaureltree000]

with a pure rogue, i wouldnt have enough feats. to go with a deeper rogue splash id have to either give up the shield mastery or the shot on the run feat line which i dont think im willing to do.

[mournbladereigns]

You could also fit in 6 ranger for deepwood sniper. The sniper shot works with bows and crossbows, and I think thrown weapons(haven't tested this in ages)

sniper shot works with Ranged weapons, not thrown. That said, DWS sniper shot works with crossbows too.

Also, Precise shot/IPS specify ranged weapons, so probably wouldn't work with thrown weapons either.

http://ddowiki.com/page/Deepwood_Sniper_enhancements

I also second the bard suggestion, warchanter thrower! you can call him David

[DragonTroy]

this build would be awesome if you could dual wield throwers(not to mention it would be just plain funny to see a halfling with a throwing axe in each hand)

[izzyboy]

this build is partially an experiment to see how far the 'play what you like, dont tell me how to build my toons' rule goes when pugging

Since when was that a rule when pugging? The question is are you going to tell your group right away that you won't be doing any melee or tanking or are you going to break it to them later when you aren't filling the role they expect you to because you don't want to get dropped from the party? You're intentionally making a gimped character. If you aren't holding agro for other players in your group nobody cares about your tower shield, and your ranged DPS will be insignificant compared to other ranged DPS builds that are common like a nuker sorceror.

[nolaureltree000]

Since when was that a rule when pugging? The question is are you going to tell your group right away that you won't be doing any melee or tanking or are you going to break it to them later when you aren't filling the role they expect you to because you don't want to get dropped from the party? You're intentionally making a gimped character. If you aren't holding agro for other players in your group nobody cares about your tower shield, and your ranged DPS will be insignificant compared to other ranged DPS builds that are common like a nuker sorceror.

'are you telling me how to play my toon? i handle traps and do ranged dps.'

party balance is a myth in this game. we dont need to constantly be worried about building toons to fill cookie cutter roles. flavor builds are for fun, not min/maxing >.<

[izzyboy]

'are you telling me how to play my toon? i handle traps and do ranged dps.'

party balance is a myth in this game. we dont need to constantly be worried about building toons to fill cookie cutter roles. flavor builds are for fun, not min/maxing >.<

You didn't answer the question though, and party balance is not a myth. Would you be upfront with a group and tell them you're playing a gimped character and have no intention of melee or tanking or would you wait until you were in an instance so they can't kick you from the group?