Cleric rant

[Aurora_nyx]

Only really venting because I woke up and realized I'm still pretty darn ticked about the whole thing.

I think it is safe to say any who have ran with Auro, Cari or Faye know I play this for fun. It is in each bio saying just that... and even stating I won't join groups that are the serious, epic, uber whatever...I get that some like to play that way, and more power to you..and I know that our play styles would not go together, so I stay away from lfms that I know will be the more serious ones.

Shockingly enough...I'm actually a pretty decent healer. Trust me no one is as shocked as me about the whole thing. I made Cari a heal bot and have a blast playing her.

Last night a friend asked me to give a few tips to a cleric who was struggling on what to do, what gear he needed. So I joined the group, showed him the equip Cari has, saying there are other things you could get, depends what you want out of your healer. Told him what enhancements I took, again saying honestly some of them I had no idea why I took them and then went on to compare stats with him.

At the stat comparison, mr jerk (trust me I have a few colorful names I'd like to say) joins the group. I am going down my list of stats, and get to con.... yes I used it as a dump stat, and even said that to the other cleric. Cari was my 2nd toon, I know now that it was a mistake, but well as a healbot, I really don't get hit. Her con is 22. Mr.jerk hears that and demands to know how many hp she has...I tell him 372. he then proceeds to scream at me that I would not last 30 seconds in ToD with that sort of hp, and how dare I tell this other cleric who will be running ToD how to build, I have a gimp cleric .... I dropped group right then.

I suppose what is really bothering me is having someone yell at me for showing an example of what another person has.I wasn't telling the other cleric what to pick for stats or how he should build his toon...I did tell him he may want to eat a tome to even out his wis...and gave him a +6 necklace to help, that was the most advice he got.

I know Cari isn't the most uber elite cleric out there, and I would never claim her as one... but I do know (most times) what I'm doing. I have solo healed short man shrouds, 6man elite dq2, 90%of the time solo heal elite von...I know, nothing all that spectacular...but since we don't wipe, I can't be all that gimp. I really don't plan on running ToD with her. She was flagged at 16, and yes healed out there. And I don't (until they make me) plan on being in epics. She is fine for what I play.


The tl/dr version.... some people chose not to run epics or worry about their toons being epic ready. Some chose not to run certain quests. Be thankful that I know my toon isn't built "right" to enter the great world of ToD and epic questing and I am not that healer who gets added because they have all the right gear and ends up causing a party wipe. I don't tell you how to build your toon, or say what you should or shouldn't run...and it may be a total pipe dream, but I expect the same in return.

[Bodic]

Her con is 22. Mr.jerk hears that and demands to know how many hp she has...I tell him 372. he then proceeds to scream at me that I would not last 30 seconds in ToD with that sort of hp, and how dare I tell this other cleric who will be running ToD how to build, I have a gimp cleric

So I guess my Rogue must die in 30 seconds every single time he did/does TOD

While not exactly 372(387) it does take a rage for my rogue to break 400 never have gotten around to T3 on his Hp item or a TOD ring for that matter.

[SaisMatters]

So I guess my Rogue must die in 30 seconds every single time he did/does TOD

While not exactly 372(387) it does take a rage for my rogue to break 400 never have gotten around to T3 on his Hp item or a TOD ring for that matter.

A usual guide line for epics is to have 400+ hps if you don't have evasion.

Aurora_nyx your hit points aren't horrible and you can probally boost them with a bit of gs and raid gear. A GS HP item would give you another 45 and a tod belt another 30, etc etc.

Also, every time someone yells at you online just start laughing into the mic everytime he speaks until they drop. Picture them as some pathetic loser 300 lbs+ adult living in his parents basement who can only attempt to bully people online to make themselves fell better. it'll help make the laughing come naturally! lol

I +1 you cause your canadian lol!

[articwarrior]

A usual guide line for epics is to have 400+ hps if you don't have evasion.

Aurora_nyx your hit points aren't horrible and you can probally boost them with a bit of gs and raid gear. A GS HP item would give you another 45 and a tod belt another 30, etc etc.

Also, every time someone yells at you online just start laughing into the mic everytime he speaks until they drop. Picture them as some pathetic loser 300 lbs+ adult living in his parents basement who can only attempt to bully people online to make themselves fell better. it'll help make the laughing come naturally! lol

I +1 you cause your canadian lol!

not everyone is "300 lbs+ adult living in his parents basement"? omg I need to get a life!

[jkm]

So I guess my Rogue must die in 30 seconds every single time he did/does TOD

While not exactly 372(387) it does take a rage for my rogue to break 400 never have gotten around to T3 on his Hp item or a TOD ring for that matter.

You'd be iffy in my epic groups - Not because of you, but because I as a healer need more buffer to deal with my suckitude.

OP
First, how did you dump con with a 22? Starting with a 14 is okay on a cleric, wizzy not so much.

Second, explaining to people how to be a healer is a lesson in futility. Everyone has to learn how to do it through trial and error (and a little my.ddoing for gear when you see a good healer). Some people are insanely good at balancing healing/fighting or healing/evoking and some just concentrate solely on hit point bars.

[SaisMatters]

not everyone is "300 lbs+ adult living in his parents basement"? omg I need to get a life!

I said "Imagine them"

I know alot run at that 280 marker! roflmao

[Aurora_nyx]

A usual guide line for epics is to have 400+ hps if you don't have evasion.

Aurora_nyx your hit points aren't horrible and you can probally boost them with a bit of gs and raid gear. A GS HP item would give you another 45 and a tod belt another 30, etc etc.

Also, every time someone yells at you online just start laughing into the mic everytime he speaks until they drop. Picture them as some pathetic loser 300 lbs+ adult living in his parents basement who can only attempt to bully people online to make themselves fell better. it'll help make the laughing come naturally! lol

I +1 you cause your canadian lol!

I know I need my gs hp item... I just have to figure out where to put it... I have sp goggles, my lorriks set (yes even the dt ruin), glacial braces, that epic cove dagger, minos, the amrath belt with +6 con and greater false life (I have the belt with the ardor clickie that I switch to in raids)and my mabar cloak...finding a spot is proving interesting

[Bodic]

i Know I Need My Gs Hp Item... I Just Have To Figure Out Where To Put It... I Have Sp Goggles, My Lorriks Set (yes Even The Dt Ruin), Glacial Braces, That Epic Cove Dagger, Minos, The Amrath Belt With +6 Con And Greater False Life (i Have The Belt With The Ardor Clickie That I Switch To In Raids)and My Mabar Cloak...finding A Spot Is Proving Interesting

Boots

[Aurora_nyx]

lol never thought of boots... guess I better find a striding ring now

[justagame]

Assuming you're not a dwarf or wf, a con of 22 isn't dumping con. I'm guessing it's starting with 14, a +2 tome, and a +6 item. That's just fine -- in fact, it's ideal. Go past single-point buy range, and you have to sacrifice too much in terms of other stats. If you're a front line tank, ok, maybe a bit more is desirable. I like to put 10 build points into con on most of my front line melees (except paladins, who have to tend to too many other stats).

When an uber-elite is telling you how lame a 22 con is, it's either:

a) a WF or Dwarf with a built-in 4-point advantage (2 starting, 2 enh).
b) someone with the best in equipment bonuses: a +3 or +4 tome, +2 exceptional con shroud weapon, +7 epic item, etc.
c) someone counting buffs: rage, ship buffs, madstone, double madstone, store pots, yugo pots, etc. Fine, but don't compare it to someone's raw build number.
d) someone who is exaggerating, ignorant, or both


Now, having said all that, 372 hp IS a little light for the highest end content, because it leaves little room for errors or bad breaks. But con isn't a problem here. I imagine you could fix that with one or more of the following (I'm guessing that at 372, there are at least a few of these you don't have):

toughness, plus enhancements (+42)
minos legen helm, or other item with toughness (+20)
gfl item (+30)
shroud hp item (+45) [I used bracers for mine, but I don't have glacier bracers, ring of thelis is current wizardry item)

[varusso]

Contrary to popular belief, not every toon needs to be 'epic ready'. And despite popular opinion, what constitutes epic ready is NOT a hard and fast rule. There are about 100 other factors BESIDES HP that determine that. And it ALSO depends on just which epics you plan to run (if you even plan to run them at all!). There are 19 other levels in the game, and many other quests that dont involve the epic setting. If you plan to run easy epics just for the tokens, then you dont need to be uber-twinked; it just makes it easier if you are.

My first TRed toon is one that I liked from the very beginning, and his build was just fine. When it comes to epcis .... mmmm not so much so Which is why I used him to farm anything south of Amarath for as long as I wanted, while using my OTHER toons (which were built later and better designed/geared) to farm the tokens I needed to TR him. Now he is 14 and working his way back up. Eventually he will be epic-lvl again, and this time he will be better built, better geared, and played by a more experienced player. Personally, I wouldnt mind seeing epics made into TR-only settings, to eliminate alot of the BS whining and bossiness that accompanies it. But that wont likely happen.

To the folks that feel the need to dictate how others build and play their toons: fuggem. Its one thing to offer constructive advice. Its entirely another to be an obnoxious jerk, especially when that 'advice' was neither asked for, nor wanted. Whenever I see someone with a build that I think is wonky, I ask about it, and try to find out what it is they are trying to do with it. If they are amenable, I offer advice, and yes, I actually listen to what THEY say about it. Just because there are 1000 cookie-cutter 'best builds' out there, that doesnt mean there arent still better ways to do it. And 'better' or 'best' are relative terms. If a player has 100 HP (or 500 SP) less than you, but they contribute meaningfully, arent a burden on the healers and other players, then who are you (or I) to try and tell them that what they are doing is wrong? Seems to me we should be asking THEM what they are doing RIGHT....

[Hordo]

*snip*
The tl/dr version.... some people chose not to run epics or worry about their toons being epic ready. Some chose not to run certain quests. Be thankful that I know my toon isn't built "right" to enter the great world of ToD and epic questing and I am not that healer who gets added because they have all the right gear and ends up causing a party wipe. I don't tell you how to build your toon, or say what you should or shouldn't run...and it may be a total pipe dream, but I expect the same in return.

Aurora, you are still Kosher...the other dipstick can stand in line at the clone factory. +1

[Diyon]

If 22 con is your static constitution. I don't see how on earth one considers that dumping constitution unless you're a dwarf/wf using the +2 enh, and still using a +6 item, and still +2 tome.

14/16 starting con is not dumping con. You can get away with 12 con and be light on constitution without quite being gimp. I mean, my acrobat has starting con 12 and manages 457 hp without a toughness item. (provided I did use a few extra feats for toughness, but point being that you can easily get away with a starting con of 12 and have no one ever notice.

As others said, sub 400 hp is a little light on some of the end game content, but you're still 350+ which can be perfectly workable for almost everything, especially since this is a caster we're talking about, and not a front line one.

In any case, you'd be welcome in any of my groups.

[Kalari]

Aurora hope ya dont mind me using your forum name instead of OP but girl I feel ya though no one has yet to berate me about epics and elite raids because I know I can and have gone in with characters under 400 and not dropped at a blink of an eye. Before working on Kamari my elven cleric her hp sat at 302 and I thought it was something. I finally wanted to see how far I could get her hp and now with buffs I think im at 472 but I did not do that for others nor would I have tolerated anyone belittling me especially on a healer. I am glad you left that group too many damned experts who maybe great at beating up things in a video game but lack the common social graces that separate us humans from animals. Sorry you had to go threw that and trust me that player will be hurting if they dont learn how to shut the hell up and not **** off the divine classes.

[katana_one]

At the stat comparison, mr jerk (trust me I have a few colorful names I'd like to say) joins the group. I am going down my list of stats, and get to con.... yes I used it as a dump stat, and even said that to the other cleric. Cari was my 2nd toon, I know now that it was a mistake, but well as a healbot, I really don't get hit. Her con is 22. Mr.jerk hears that and demands to know how many hp she has...I tell him 372. he then proceeds to scream at me that I would not last 30 seconds in ToD with that sort of hp, and how dare I tell this other cleric who will be running ToD how to build, I have a gimp cleric .... I dropped group right then.

You should have just squelched him and continued your conversation instead of letting him bully you into dropping group.

[Emili]

Your cleric is fine... I'd take that cleric into any Elite ToD or Epic.

[Zogdor]

Auro, you know you rock! As far as clerics go Cari does an excellent job!

[Llewndyn]

You'd be iffy in my epic groups - Not because of you, but because I as a healer need more buffer to deal with my suckitude.

OP
First, how did you dump con with a 22? Starting with a 14 is okay on a cleric, wizzy not so much.

Second, explaining to people how to be a healer is a lesson in futility. Everyone has to learn how to do it through trial and error (and a little my.ddoing for gear when you see a good healer). Some people are insanely good at balancing healing/fighting or healing/evoking and some just concentrate solely on hit point bars.

My first life cleric had **** stats ALL the way down. **** gear, I think I was using 2 gs items that did the exact same thing. Name 2 people who pugged with me who would not feel comfortable taking Llewndyn on his first life on ANY mission. EPICS? Yawn. VoD with first timers? Done it. Kobold Assault? Tough but I slogged through...

The INSTANT anyone starts going on about my stats I do one of a few things:

1. Make a mental note of their name and make sure I heal them last if I am fealing Chaotic Evil.

2. Heal them just like I do everyone else and then listen to them sputter about how I managed to outlast the other healer with 27 WIS (yes we have a ship; Yes 99% of the time I was too lazy to bother going there. Ur problem, not mine)

3. Heal everyone awesome and then inform that person to never contact me again and add them to my "friends" list

4. Start a Top 10 list

You will find if you just ignore those who do that you will have a better DDO career on the whole without them, with little to nothing lost. I have made a new resolution to be a LOT more liberal with my squelch list and it's made me more excited to log on every night. And for the record I weigh 265 unbuffed and my mother's basement is being fumigated so I am sleeping on the couch and playing on a laptop balanced on a mini ironing board, which is awesome because I don't have to get up when she brings me my Cocoa Puffs(tm)

I mean.... a friend... a friend is all that stuff....

[Aurora_nyx]

Thanks guys =) and Zog <3 *muwah*

after a mile run and an hour that I am sure was my trainers ultimate fantasy (I told her she could work me as hard as she wanted) I think I'm back to my normal non grouchy self... tho pretty sure my trainer would love whatever it was that ticked me off to happen again and often (quite sure I will be hurting tomorrow too)

I know a few asked me to pm a name... and I won't be. This was me venting, not trying to have x# of people never group with the person again. My guildies and friends know not to ask me into groups if he is there and that's enough for me

and again, thanks for letting me vent and realize I'm not too bad actually

[FlyingTurtle]

dump Con = 10 or below.

Clerics have MAD (multi-attribute dependency) right out the gate. High Str, Con, Wis, Cha are all useful to any cleric build. 14 Con is absolutely fine on a cleric, that dude had no idea what he was talking about.