Spell Damage Modifiers

[articwarrior]

Are spell damage modifiers cumulative or additive? ex: max then emp maxxed spell or max + emp

[shagath]

x2 for maximize and x1.5 for empower. Together x2.5 so the latter.

[Habreno]

Not to thread hijack, but as it's a related question:

What about enhancements and potency/clickies/eardweller? I have heard that they stack additively with each other. Is this true?

Do they stack multiplitively with metamagics?

[Arctigis]

BASE * (enhancements + potency) * (feats)

e.g. For a L20 Sorcerer with Capstone, maximise, empower, 50% enhancement and eardweller:

BASE * ( 1.0 + 0.5 + 1.0) * (1.0 + 1.0 + 0.5 + 0.2)

Bloodline of Power stacks in with feats (as it affects all spells which can be empowered)

[Habreno]

Thank you.

[articwarrior]

BASE * (enhancements + potency) * (feats)

e.g. For a L20 Sorcerer with Capstone, maximise, empower, 50% enhancement and eardweller:

BASE * ( 1.0 + 0.5 + 1.0) * (1.0 + 1.0 + 0.5 + 0.2)

Bloodline of Power stacks in with feats (as it affects all spells which can be empowered)

cool thanks

EDIT: oh.. I believe it would be like this:

(2 + 1.5 + 2) * (2 + 2 + 1.5 + 1.2) because you must multiply the base as well so the base is 1, doing that equation that way would actually make it less than actual damage

[articwarrior]

ok... so I worked out the damage for my magic missiles specced to the max, tell me what you think...

BASE * (enhancements + potency) * (feats)

Therefore, my magic missile damage will be... (1d2+3) * (1.55 + 1.75 + 2) * (2 + 1.5) = (1d2+3) * (5.3) * (3.5) = (1d2+3) * (18.55) = Average of (4.5) * (18.55) = 83.475

That is one missile

Here is the boat load:
83.475 * 5 (full amount of missiles) = 417.375. I will have 2250 sp at level 20, 2250/2 (sp cost) = 1125... 417.375 * 1125 = 469 546.875

Those are 2 sp magic missiles specced out to max... oh yea, I didn't factor crits into the equation, so it's moar!

Modifiers: Maximize, Empower, Full spec into force damage, a 75% damage item, and eardweller

[Kinerd]

cool thanks

EDIT: oh.. I believe it would be like this:

(2 + 1.5 + 2) * (2 + 2 + 1.5 + 1.2) because you must multiply the base as well so the base is 1, doing that equation that way would actually make it less than actual damage

It's 1. Think of it this way:

(2 + 2 + 1.5 + 1.2)

Turn off Maximize:

(2 + 1.5 + 1.2)

Turn off Empower:

(2 + 1.2)

Spec out of Capstone:

(2)

With nothing on, your formula gives double damage when you should get unmodified damage. Therefore, the 1 is correct.

[articwarrior]

It's 1. Think of it this way:

(2 + 2 + 1.5 + 1.2)

Turn off Maximize:

(2 + 1.5 + 1.2)

Turn off Empower:

(2 + 1.2)

Spec out of Capstone:

(2)

With nothing on, your formula gives double damage when you should get unmodified damage. Therefore, the 1 is correct.

true, but that 1 should not be there in the first place

[Arctigis]

cool thanks

EDIT: oh.. I believe it would be like this:

(2 + 1.5 + 2) * (2 + 2 + 1.5 + 1.2) because you must multiply the base as well so the base is 1, doing that equation that way would actually make it less than actual damage

No, what I posted is correct (verified empirically)

To clarify, the one is added in to represent no-modifier (otherwise you end up making the number smaller)

BASE * (unity + potency + enhancements) * (unity + maximise + empower + BoP)

As Kinerd said, when you take out all modifiers, BASE must end up being unaltered. It is in the above
equation, not in yours.

[Arctigis]

ok... so I worked out the damage for my magic missiles specced to the max, tell me what you think...

BASE * (enhancements + potency) * (feats)

Therefore, my magic missile damage will be... (1d2+3) * (1.55 + 1.75 + 2) * (2 + 1.5) = (1d2+3) * (5.3) * (3.5) = (1d2+3) * (18.55) = Average of (4.5) * (18.55) = 83.475

That is one missile

Here is the boat load:
83.475 * 5 (full amount of missiles) = 417.375. I will have 2250 sp at level 20, 2250/2 (sp cost) = 1125... 417.375 * 1125 = 469 546.875

Those are 2 sp magic missiles specced out to max... oh yea, I didn't factor crits into the equation, so it's moar!

Modifiers: Maximize, Empower, Full spec into force damage, a 75% damage item, and eardweller

Erm, no.

It would be:

BASE * (1.0 + 1.0 (eardweller) + 0.5 (Full force enhancements) ) * (1.0 + 1.0 (max) + 0.5 (emp))

= 4.5 * (2.5) * (2.5) = 28 per missile average(excluding crits)

Notes:
I haven't included BoP as the thread title is Wizard Spell Damage Modifiers
Eardweller does not stack with potency or clickies - regardless of what the description says.

[articwarrior]

eardweller doesn't stack? too bad, I tough it was an alternative bonus modifier than random loot gen items

[sweez]

eardweller doesn't stack? too bad, I tough it was an alternative bonus modifier than random loot gen items

Nope, it's the same bonus type as potency/clickies.

[Havok.cry]

Nope, it's the same bonus type as potency/clickies.

Is that WAI, or will it get fixed to match the description sometime in the future?

[shagath]

Is that WAI, or will it get fixed to match the description sometime in the future?

If you compare actual effect(boost) to description, it's not WAI but perhaps description is just wrong and boost itself is WAI. +100% boost that stacks would be too much, that couldn't be WAI. Just my 2 cents.

[Symar-FangofLloth]

Description is wrong. They've fixed it a couple times and it keeps reverting.

[Habreno]

Stupid Devs. Can't fix a description xD

Not really, if it was multiplicative it would most certainly not be WAI and would be OP.

[sephiroth1084]

eardweller doesn't stack? too bad, I tough it was an alternative bonus modifier than random loot gen items

Still worth using for an extra 25% damage (75% from a clicky vs. 100% from Eardweller).