Lost-Need Guidance

[TrinaLeFleur]

You should pick a thing that you want to do MOST, and concentrate on that, while putting as much as you can into the other things you want AFTER.

THIS has been the recurring advice that I've been getting. I chose to max search not only for the traps, but also for hidden doors, which often lead to things like extra xp, treasure, and even rest shrines. I chose to max Open Locks because I keep encountering locked chests and doors which can be picked.

2. Most traps are avoidable through elemental resist/protect/absorb, Evasion, or good twitch skills.

I figure if I can't max disable traps, if I can at least find them, I can either avoid them, or buff up before I spring them. (in theory)

Without disable device it's all for naught. Anyone who's done the quest more than once knows where the traps are, and hence search is pointless unless you can disable the resultant box. Because of this most traps are made to be more or less unavoidable if you cannot disarm them.

I think I tried a build similar to your Healing Marked Ranger/Fighter, may give it a try, though.

The basic problem with rogue / clerics is not enough skill pts to maintain your trap skills, unless you put a lot of pts into INT, which ends up potentially gimping your other stats, or take extra rogue lvls, which waters down your spellcasting. It sounds like what you really want is a rogue / bard who has a good mix of melee, spells, and trap skills.

As I've never tried a Bard build before, and I have an empty character slot, I've gotta try that build!
Looking at your lvl 20 skills, I am confused... Isn't SPOT the skill that finds, or detects, traps prior to searching for them? Or does Trap Sense do that by itself?

If you plan perfectly you'll be fine.

THAT's why I'm here!

Thank You to everyone for posting! Lottsa great info!

Edit:
I might add that I have 32pt builds, now.

[GuntherBovine]

I've seen dozens of youtube videos of builds, and have noted that most folks who solo simply run through quests to get through as fast as possible without exploring, looting, or doing anything that makes dungeon crawling in PnP (or single player computer games) really fun.
I've also noted that many player goups also enjoy rushing through quests, trying to complete as fast as possible, with their main goal to simply gain the quest's loot or favor.

How much do you intend to solo? It looks like you primarily want to solo, but then you talk about grouping. Do you plan to primarily solo up to a certain point and then group from there?

What is appealing to you about playing a cleric to you? Why not a wizard? Wizards are much more compatible with a Rogue splash.

When you are doing quests, do you want to be clicking a lot and varying your tactics to make things more interesting? Do you want to just whack on stuff?

Do you twink your toons? If so, what are your best twink items?

[unbongwah]

Looking at your lvl 20 skills, I am confused... Isn't SPOT the skill that finds, or detects, traps prior to searching for them? Or does Trap Sense do that by itself?

Spot is your early-warning detector; a message will pop up about "Danger!" or "Secret door!" if your Spot score is high enough when you get close to a trap or hidden door. But Search is the skill you use to find traps & their control panels, as well as hidden doors (although a Detect Secret Doors clickie or wand works just as well for a bard). Spot is nice but not necessary; Search is essential to a trapmonkey - can't disarm a trap if you can't find its control panel.

Fortunately, Spot DCs are generally lower than Search DCs, so you do not need as high of a Spot score as Search. Unfortunately, skill pts get kinda tight on my build with all the skills I wanted to maintain; it came down to putting extra pts into Open Lock or Spot and I chose OL. If you did a THF build instead, you could dump DEX and put a couple more pts into INT for extra skill pts. A +2 INT tome at lvl 7 would also help; gives you 13 extra skill pts.

[ProdigalGuru]

-Search without disable is pointless.
-Unavoidable in the sense that just being able to see it doesn't help you in the slightest.

I never said ONLY get Search, I said get BOTH, you need them both.

Many traps are elemental, and damage can be mitigated through normal means, allowing you to pass through them unharmed.

Non-elemental traps are usually easy to jump over, or carefully move through, or go around without ever getting hurt.

Also, there are plenty of traps that are one-time, or are on timers that eventually wind down.

[TrinaLeFleur]

How much do you intend to solo? It looks like you primarily want to solo, but then you talk about grouping. Do you plan to primarily solo up to a certain point and then group from there?

I prefer to solo, but I foresee a time when doing so will become impossible, or improbable. I've heard that soloing gets harder above level 12, so I'd like to have the ability to contribute to a party.

What is appealing to you about playing a cleric to you? Why not a wizard? Wizards are much more compatible with a Rogue splash.

I like the self-healing, heavy armor, and buffs of the Cleric. If I played a Rogue/Wizard, I'd probably go Warforged for the self-heal. The Cleric & Wizard self-heals are gained faster than most of the othe class self-heals, and that is probably my number one concern. (I hate clickies for self healing.)

When you are doing quests, do you want to be clicking a lot and varying your tactics to make things more interesting? Do you want to just whack on stuff?

I've enjoyed D&D over the years for the "more interesting" part, but the "Hack 'n' Slash" mindset has taken over the industry. Show me an option, I'm open.

Do you twink your toons? If so, what are your best twink items?

I had to look up that term, and found two possible definitions:1) Power Leveling-no I don't. 2) Max'd items/level-I have blindness & disease immunity items, +10 Haggle no ML, +2 Str no ML, +3 Con ML5, +4 Wis ML7.

Spot is your early-warning detector; a message will pop up about "Danger!" or "Secret door!" if your Spot score is high enough when you get close to a trap or hidden door. But Search is the skill you use to find traps & their control panels, as well as hidden doors (although a Detect Secret Doors clickie or wand works just as well for a bard). Spot is nice but not necessary; Search is essential to a trapmonkey - can't disarm a trap if you can't find its control panel.

Fortunately, Spot DCs are generally lower than Search DCs, so you do not need as high of a Spot score as Search. Unfortunately, skill pts get kinda tight on my build with all the skills I wanted to maintain; it came down to putting extra pts into Open Lock or Spot and I chose OL. If you did a THF build instead, you could dump DEX and put a couple more pts into INT for extra skill pts. A +2 INT tome at lvl 7 would also help; gives you 13 extra skill pts.

Helpful info. The THF version might be the way to go. Thanks!

[GuntherBovine]

I prefer to solo, but I foresee a time when doing so will become impossible, or improbable. I've heard that soloing gets harder above level 12, so I'd like to have the ability to contribute to a party.

I haven't soloed above level 10. The main thing I found about the quests in the level 8-10 range is that they took a long, long time to solo, like 1-2 hours. Some of that was my newness to the quests. But some quests like Hiding in Plain Sight have huge maps and a steady stream of battles.

I like the self-healing, heavy armor, and buffs of the Cleric. If I played a Rogue/Wizard, I'd probably go Warforged for the self-heal. The Cleric & Wizard self-heals are gained faster than most of the othe class self-heals, and that is probably my number one concern. (I hate clickies for self healing.)

Look at going Paladin. You can read about the Paladin toon I am currently playing here. Heavy armor and a lot of self-healing. For buffs, he has a high UMD for using Wizard and Cleric wands. At some point, the heavy armor stops being helpful. For my toon, he will pick up his second Rogue level at level 11 and then switch to robes or light armor so he can use evasion.

I've enjoyed D&D over the years for the "more interesting" part, but the "Hack 'n' Slash" mindset has taken over the industry. Show me an option, I'm open.

I played an Axesinger (a Bard build with a Rogue and Fighter splashes) and it was a buff-and-then-go-whack build. I found it boring. On the other extreme is a monk, where I was constantly clicking finishing moves. My current Paladin toon for me is a good compromise where I have some clicks, but not constant.

Also, I find it good to have some bow capabilities, but not a heavy investment in bow skills. Then I always have the tactical option of pulling out the bow and shooting. To solo well, I think you have to have ranged capability in some form.

I had to look up that term [twink], and found two possible definitions:1) Power Leveling-no I don't. 2) Max'd items/level-I have poison & disease immunity items, +10 Haggle no ML, +2 Str no ML, +3 Con ML5, +4 Wis ML7.

Twinking in games like DDO means handing down gear to new toons. I always play my toons untwinked - I play them as if I don't have any other characters. You don't have much in the way of twinking gear. From the discussions I have seen, the Exploiter build really depends on twinking your toon with awesome equipment. Other builds benefit from particular twink items such as a Carnifex.

[spartin]

I think a favoured soul or bard will play how you want.

A fvs would have problems having enough points to keep search/disable and other nessicary skills maxed out, without a deep rogues splash. But the at fvs can deffinatly be played like a barb with spells.

The bard can have enough skill points to do most traps with minimal rogue levels and has enough healing and ways to mitigate damage to be played aggressively especally with dungeon scaleing

[TrinaLeFleur]

Look at going Paladin. You can read about the Paladin toon I am currently playing here. Heavy armor and a lot of self-healing. For buffs, he has a high UMD for using Wizard and Cleric wands. At some point, the heavy armor stops being helpful. For my toon, he will pick up his second Rogue level at level 11 and then switch to robes or light armor so he can use evasion.

Read through and I find our playstyle to be quite similar. I am curious as to why no Power Attack, and whether or not you use the Rogue Haste enhancement? I find both to be invaluable in soloing.

I think a favoured soul or bard will play how you want.

I don't have Favored Soul unlocked, and it's dependency on Charisma does limit it's access to Rogue skills.

[GuntherBovine]

Read through and I find our playstyle to be quite similar. I am curious as to why no Power Attack, and whether or not you use the Rogue Haste enhancement? I find both to be invaluable in soloing.

At the end of level 8, I will swap Augment Summoning for Power Attack. Right now, the augmented Steel Defender is more useful than Power Attack. I use the Rogue Haste enhancement all the time. It is one of my tactical decisions which make the quests more interesting - is this fight worth one of my haste boosts or should I save it for later?

[TrinaLeFleur]

At the end of level 8, I will swap Augment Summoning for Power Attack. Right now, the augmented Steel Defender is more useful than Power Attack. I use the Rogue Haste enhancement all the time. It is one of my tactical decisions which make the quests more interesting - is this fight worth one of my haste boosts or should I save it for later?

I don't think I could hold off 'til level 8 to get Power Attack, 'course, I do have summoned monsters to replace the Steel Defender.

[TrinaLeFleur]

For those who are interested...
After doing 20-30 builds a day, trying every combo I could think of, or find, a few things became VERY apparent:
1) I love playing a Rogue, not something that has Rogue skills, but a ROGUE!
2) The main problems my old level 6 Rogue had, besides eating cure pots like mad, were low damage, low hit points, and to few good feats.

To that end, I created:

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 3.8.2
DDO Character Planner Home Page

Slysen Dice
Level 4 True Neutral Drow Female
(2 Fighter \ 2 Rogue) 
Hit Points: 91
Spell Points: 0 
BAB: 3\3
Fortitude: 7
Reflex: 6
Will: 3

                  Starting         Feat/Enhance/Equip
Abilities        Base Stats          Modified Stats
(28 Point)       (Level 1)             (Level 4)
Strength             15                    18
Dexterity            15                    17
Constitution         14                    15
Intelligence         13                    14
Wisdom               10                    12
Charisma             10                    10

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
                 Base Skills         Modified Skills
Skills           (Level 1)             (Level 4)
Balance               7                     7
Bluff                 0                     0
Concentration         2                     2
Diplomacy             0                     0
Disable Device        3                     10
Haggle                0                     10
Heal                  0                     1
Hide                  7                     7
Intimidate            0                     0
Jump                  5                     5
Listen                7                     7
Move Silently         7                     7
Open Lock             7                     10
Perform               n/a                   n/a
Repair                2                     2
Search                8                     8
Spot                  7                     10
Swim                  3                     4
Tumble                4                     5
Use Magic Device      4                     7
Level 1 (Rogue)
Feat: (Selected) Toughness
Level 2 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Two Handed Fighting
Level 3 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Oversized Two Handed Fighting
Feat: (Selected) Power Attack
Level 4 (Rogue)
Enhancement: Elven Dexterity I
Enhancement: Fighter Item Defense I
Enhancement: Fighter Strength I
Enhancement: Fighter Toughness I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Rogue Dexterity I
Enhancement: Rogue Haste Boost I
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Accuracy I
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training I

She's currently wielding duel long swords, but that will be swapped for kopesh's when she gets the feat at level 6.
I have that +3 Con item I'll use at level 5, and may eat a +1 Dex tome to boost that attribute, and it's related skills.
Overall, her hit points are much higher than my old level six's were, she hits a constant 30 +/- 5, compared to the low 20's before, and her UMD has her using an Eternal Cure Light Wounds wand fairly regularly.
Combined with the 100+ cure pots I got from all of the builds I tried, she's good to go, for now.

As to her future...
She will continue on as a Rogue, ending at Rogue 18 / Fighter 2.
She's going to work on getting the Assassin Prestige line.
And, She's going to switch to Kopesh's A.S.A.P.

I might add:
It's helpful to remember that potions only need to keep you alive, not at max hp.
(Scrolls and wands can top you off between encounters.)

[GuntherBovine]

And, She's going to switch to Kopesh's A.S.A.P.

Khopeshes? You are a Drow. Take the Drow Weapon Damage I enhancement and you do as damage with a rapier as you would with a khopesh but without using a feat. Drow Weapon Attack I & II and Drow Weapon Damage II are options to make your rapier do more damage than a khopesh.

[TrinaLeFleur]

Khopeshes? You are a Drow. Take the Drow Weapon Damage I enhancement and you do as damage with a rapier as you would with a khopesh but without using a feat. Drow Weapon Attack I & II and Drow Weapon Damage II are options to make your rapier do more damage than a khopesh.

Thank You very much for the advice.
I was unaware that doing that could provide such an increase in damage.
I've always been dismayed by Rapier performance, and have only heard about how great Khopeshes were.
And, as those are all enhancements, I can always change them if I'm not happy with them.
So, again, THANKs for the information!

[Mastercard]

From one reroller to another. The way your character plays at level 4 will not always reflect what it'll play like later in levels. Some of the more powerful builds suck at level 4 and really start to shine later, I've found.


You said you wanna "skills of a Rogue, the spells of a Cleric, and plays like a Barbarian, PLEASE let me know."

Human
16,12,16,12,12,8
Rogue2, Barb2 or Fighter2, Cleric16

Evasion, Trap Skills, Plenty of Skill Points, Rage if Barb, 2 extra feats if Fighter, all the useful cleric spells since you want to play like a barbarian, and make sure to get Radiant Servant 2. You pop that with an Ardor clickie and win games.

Feats would be Toughness, Power Attack, Cleave, Great Cleave, Empower Healing, Improved Critical, Maximize, Extend or Empower

More feats if you went 2 fighter you could fit in the THF Feats or 2 more toughness feats for 40 more hp, or something like stunning blow and improved trip.

[TrinaLeFleur]

Mastercard: thanx for the build, straight, simple, and not laden down.