Dark Monk (Human) Build

[Mordayn]

I posted to my personal page my main's build. Works really well so far, and I wanted to share it as I keep getting asked about it. I also wanted to let everyone know that I intend to go deeper with the topic of Dark Monks as time moves along. This is just the first post.

http://my.ddo.com/mordayn/

Any thoughts?

Mordayn

[SensaiRyu]

Ye I got a thought... Why are you using Proof against poison on your gear? Is there something I'm missing? Did you opt out of the auto-proof against poison feat at lvl 11?

And your link's broken.

I love it when people post items useful to monks - I've seen Oremi's necklace but never looked at it. Very nice to have. I'll have to plan for it.

Looks like a nice build. Great AC. I had someone ask me how I was getting low 40's for AC back when I was around lvl 11. I didn't understand how, as a monk, they weren't.

[Codect]

1. You almost completely dump con despite listing it as one of the most important stats.
2. After your LR you have a starting strength of 8. Yes, it's a finesse build but I really can't see you pumping out much damage especially combined with the next point. Also, you say with buffs you boost from 19 str to 36 which is higher than your previous str-based score.. but really how reliable is it to assume you can maintain double madstone, triple scourge choker and titans grip. Especially since you're using your neck slot for oremi's and your boot slot for your GS HP item (looked at myddo). Even if you could, it's hardly fair attributing those to your finesse build and not your str version which would i assume reach 51 str in the same situation.
3. Your only stance enhancements are the wind stance line, while the line itself is great it leaves you without a second set of high dps strikes such as the earth line that a lot of monks take. You could drop monk wisdom II and III for a full stance line with an AP left over (is two points of wisdom worth 10 AP?)
4. The main feature of your LR'd build is stunning (DC 40?), and AC (49-84). Neither of which will be reliable in epics or elite amrath. Well, the 84 AC might but I'm doubtful you'll have the right party make up to reach that most of the time.
5. Your to hit will be much harder to boost when it is based off dex which depending on your gear could mean another big drop in dps.

Of course, I am biased towards strength builds as I went strength based my current life and will be even more so next life so hopefully you can respond and counter the issues that I've seen.

[Mordayn]

1. You almost completely dump con despite listing it as one of the most important stats.

That's a pretty fair assessment looking at it to begin with. In fact I was told that I was being suicidal with having that low an amount when I first started. In both (before and after LR) I maxed out the primary stat (STR 1-18 / and DEX 19-20) first, then maxed out WIS. After my primary and secondary's were taken care of I put everything else into CON. As the TR's happen, the intent is past life feats for extra HP and extra points to CON. As it stands right now, I just broke the 600 hp barrier on my first life. Since I had barely over 350 when I made it to level 20, I'm not hurting for HP at this time.

2. After your LR you have a starting strength of 8. Yes, it's a finesse build but I really can't see you pumping out much damage especially combined with the next point. Also, you say with buffs you boost from 19 str to 36 which is higher than your previous str-based score.. but really how reliable is it to assume you can maintain double madstone, triple scourge choker and titans grip. Especially since you're using your neck slot for oremi's and your boot slot for your GS HP item (looked at myddo). Even if you could, it's hardly fair attributing those to your finesse build and not your str version which would i assume reach 51 str in the same situation.

Actually double madstone, rage and other procs during a boss fight happens fully ~85% ish. That's the only time I need anything above my normal 19 STR. With Madstone, I normally don't need the Oremi's to perform constant Touch of Death attacks due to its own weapon speed buff.

3. Your only stance enhancements are the wind stance line, while the line itself is great it leaves you without a second set of high dps strikes such as the earth line that a lot of monks take. You could drop monk wisdom II and III for a full stance line with an AP left over (is two points of wisdom worth 10 AP?)

This is where we'll have to agree to disagree. I've spoken with monks of both mindsets and up to this point, I haven't had need of any of the other stances beyond the basic. As for the attacks I've only met two sets of monsters immune to Electric damage. For those that are I know them from a distance and you'll have to see my lineup of weapons. Also, when I'm hitting 10 times per another melee's 6, the damage makes up for itself. (I'll explain this later on in one of the posts I'm writing now) In the end, at final life, earth stance might become a more viable option. Might be of interest to post HOW we use the stances rather than saying "Hey, man you're cutting yourself short." I actually do use Earth and Flame Stance (when I have a bad pug fighting in shroud, TOD, VOD, etc.) to keep myself alive when others are dying off. I also use them for when hate tanking Sully and Horoth.

4. The main feature of your LR'd build is stunning (DC 40?), and AC (49-84). Neither of which will be reliable in epics or elite amrath. Well, the 84 AC might but I'm doubtful you'll have the right party make up to reach that most of the time.

Might need to clear up some stuff here. I do run Elite Amrath and I do run Epics. I don't use my AC gear in epic runs. Thats where Evasion, Madstone and Stunning fist come to play. Stunning fist will hit the epic mobs and stun them regularly (higher than 65% of the time after Update 9.1) with a DC 35. At my current DC 42, I rarely have trouble connecting with it. (Sometimes I forget to put the wraps on) Since I haven't finished building everything for the AC top yet, its hard to say. With full AC gear on, I reach 72 without party buffs. I have friends of mine (read: Monk Mentors) who reach 95 unbuffed. As I TR, that number will increase upwards. But I doubt I'll take it much higher since I will be losing DPS in its place.

5. Your to hit will be much harder to boost when it is based off dex which depending on your gear could mean another big drop in dps.

I don't boost my to hit at all. 59's not enough to hit Malicia? Maybe I should lower her AC with all those nifty tools I listed earlier? ((okay that was a bit of a smart arse answer.)) Honestly, don't have to boost my to hit at all. I'm also not affected by this handwraps debacle either. (Yes DEVs, even I AM PEEVED at that.) The damage I deal (regularly 120-130 total per hit) amounts to about 20-25 from my fists. This toon currently deals about 11-15 different block types of damage per hit. Its taken a long time to build that up (basically one block at a time).

Back when I was a Flame Stance monk, I could regularly count on Touch of Death to proc 2-3 times of the 4 possible times. When I added the Windstance I see 3-4 times per proc now. So 500-1500 dmg vs. 750-2000 avg dmg now. Not a bad hangup. I've seen it proc 6x with windstance about 15 times. And 5 times about 30% of the time I use it.

Keep these observations coming. There's a reason for everything.

Mordayn

[Mordayn]

Ye I got a thought... Why are you using Proof against poison on your gear? Is there something I'm missing? Did you opt out of the auto-proof against poison feat at lvl 11?

And your link's broken.

I love it when people post items useful to monks - I've seen Oremi's necklace but never looked at it. Very nice to have. I'll have to plan for it.

Looks like a nice build. Great AC. I had someone ask me how I was getting low 40's for AC back when I was around lvl 11. I didn't understand how, as a monk, they weren't.

Ooops changed a couple things and it broke the link.

**scratches head** Poison... poison... I think I put that as a place holder in hopes the devs would increase that list to have something really worthwhile to put in.

[Codect]

Actually double madstone, rage and other procs during a boss fight happens fully ~85% ish. That's the only time I need anything above my normal 19 STR. With Madstone, I normally don't need the Oremi's to perform constant Touch of Death attacks due to its own weapon speed buff.

A single use clicky lasts you entire boss fights?

This is where we'll have to agree to disagree. I've spoken with monks of both mindsets and up to this point, I haven't had need of any of the other stances beyond the basic. As for the attacks I've only met two sets of monsters immune to Electric damage. For those that are I know them from a distance and you'll have to see my lineup of weapons. Also, when I'm hitting 10 times per another melee's 6, the damage makes up for itself. (I'll explain this later on in one of the posts I'm writing now) In the end, at final life, earth stance might become a more viable option. Might be of interest to post HOW we use the stances rather than saying "Hey, man you're cutting yourself short." I actually do use Earth and Flame Stance (when I have a bad pug fighting in shroud, TOD, VOD, etc.) to keep myself alive when others are dying off. I also use them for when hate tanking Sully and Horoth.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying use earth stance at all, I'm saying use the earth strikes. You should be able to cycle earth strikes, finisher and your wind strikes before any of them come off timer again. By only using wind strikes you're not maximising your ki usage (which I assumed was your goal since you use oremi's).

Stunning fist will hit the epic mobs and stun them regularly (higher than 65% of the time after Update 9.1) with a DC 35.

Well, that's not my experience at all.. except on the kobold shamans in von1 of course. Still, if you say it works consistently for you, great.

I don't boost my to hit at all. 59's not enough to hit Malicia? This toon currently deals about 11-15 different block types of damage per hit. Its taken a long time to build that up (basically one block at a time).

I'm actually curious how you get +59, and 11-15 damage blocks on non crits. I'd love to see that broken down so I can see where I can make improvements.

Back when I was a Flame Stance monk, I could regularly count on Touch of Death to proc 2-3 times of the 4 possible times. When I added the Windstance I see 3-4 times per proc now. So 500-1500 dmg vs. 750-2000 avg dmg now. Not a bad hangup. I've seen it proc 6x with windstance about 15 times. And 5 times about 30% of the time I use it.

Again our experiences differ here, I use wind stance (it's clearly higher dps than sun in my personal opinion) and have been for a long time, I've never seen a 6x proc. 5x procs are very rare, 4x are uncommon. The average is between two and three (as it should be from the way the devs designed the doublestrike mechanics). You must be getting very luck with those.

To clarify, I'm not trying to change your build at all, if it works for you then thats great. I'm just trying to clear up my thoughts.

[Blank_Zero]

I might have to post up my dark monk (HOrc) as a comparison sometimes...and his gearset lol.

We differ in a few places from what I see, firstly being I went str and you went dex.

I'll post more when I'm not sick and exhausted

[Mordayn]

That's a consideration I'm actually interested in. I do switch through attacks, but I typically cycle, Dark, Element (or vice versa) then Touch of Death, and the back to Dark, element. Which element I chose is based on the target. As for putting a set of points to raise another stance up to IV I'd be hard pressed to consider it based on what I have going right now. Gimmie a couple days to go through the numbers to see if I can pull that off and how much it affects the toon's build.

And Wisdom is off the table right now. I'm not using any +3's or +4 tomes yet on the toon, so the amount I have in the build has to stay. Might be available later on with the TR points.

The only mobs I have trouble hitting with stunning fist are the drow for some reason, (could it be their spell resist?)

As for how the +59 and 11-15 blocks of dmg.. I'll list those on my site later. (PROMISE!)

[Blank_Zero]

I might have to post up my dark monk (HOrc) as a comparison sometimes...and his gearset lol.

We differ in a few places from what I see, firstly being I went str and you went dex.

I'll post more when I'm not sick and exhausted

Basics:
18 STR *all lvl ups*
15 DEX
14 CON
15 WIS

INT/CHA = dumped

Skills:
Max Balance/Concentrate
1 Point in tumble
rest in Jump

Feats: *I don't remember the order I took them in anymore
TWF
iTWF
GTWF
iCrit: Bludgeon
Power Attack
Stunning Fist *thinking of changing this since I don't use it at all anymore*
Toughness x 3

Enhancements: *Generalized*
ToD and prerequisites
Void4
Path of the Tortoise (2nd rank)
Monk iRecovery 2
Fire 4
Water/Earth/Wind 3
Ninja Spy 2 and Prerequisites


Gearlisting:*Current -> Dream Gear*
Minos Helm -> Epic Frost Helm
Oremi's Neck -> Shintao Cord
Tharne's Goggles -> Epic Raven's Sight/Tharne's (Change as needed for to-hit/decreasing threat)
Equilibrium Garments -> Red Scale Robe
Dusk Heart -> Epic Gem of Many Facets/Litany of the Dead (Switch as needed for To-Hit/DPS)
Stormsingers Cloak -> Epic Envenomed Cloak
Tharne's Bracers -> No Change
Charged Gauntlets -> Epic Version
Knost Belt/Morgana's Belt ->
Encrusted Ring/Morgana's Ring -> No Change (switch as needed for to-hit/DPS)
Kyosho's Ring -> No Change
Rad2 HP GS Boots -> No Change

Wraps:
+3 Force Burst of Pure Good (Trash)
+3 Holy of EOB (Boss Beaters on Normal)
+1 Metalline (Boss Beaters on Hard/elite)

*When I can upgrade these or Craft better ones, I will*

[Mordayn]

Looks solid, are you taking any enhancements to up the Orc's side? I looked into it myself and found a lot of STR based enhancements which would rock with this build. Still not a believer in the void strike (outside of its finishers). Maybe you can give a description of how you see it working for ya?

[Blank_Zero]

Looks solid, are you taking any enhancements to up the Orc's side? I looked into it myself and found a lot of STR based enhancements which would rock with this build. Still not a believer in the void strike (outside of its finishers). Maybe you can give a description of how you see it working for ya?

Well, since U9 nerfed my stuns, I've gone straight DPS spec. Void4 adds DPS, plus has a good shot of insta-kill.

I did take 2 ranks into HOrc Strength AP. 6 AP wasn't too bad. Only took 1 rank into Monk Wisdom though, since I'm not Stunning based anymore.

I'm actually looking into TRing him into an unarmed Rogue soon to see if it's worth it. Just trying to figure out if I'm going HOrc for the extra Action Boosts and STR, or if I'm gonna go Halfling for the massive boosts to SA dmg, to-hit, and Threat Reduction, since atm, even with Tharne's Set on, I can pull Aggro in VoD/ToD in most pugs, and sometimes even i guild/channel runs.

[Mordayn]

Try this for DPS: Stun the Mob, use the Darkx3 finisher, then Touch of death. I need to get a screen shot of it, its friggen huge.