Lower the cool-down on Stunning Blow

[lugoman]

50 shouldn't be too much of an issue I wouldn't think, I land most of mine with less than that. Of course I have to use a terribly inferior weighted weapon (to my ESOS) and swap just to make it land so I lose a lot of the DPS I'd otherwise gain swapping weapons and I have to take the quick draw feat to boot.

THat said I am 100% in agreement that 15 seconds is too long. With the number of mobs I can instantly kill in 15 seconds on my caster being what it is I don't think it's too much to give an 8 or 10 second cooldown to a melee who used a feat for the ability.

The problem if you make the cooldown shorter is you will need to swap weapons much more thus losing more dps. When it was insta crits this made sense, not sure it does now. Maybe a better idea would be either lower the stun dc's so you have less of a chance of 'wasting' a weapon swap or slightly increase the stun duration.

Now, I only find it useful on casters as taking them out of a fight for even a short time can be useful.

[count_spicoli]

Don't be silly, APs is not a resource cost. He is correct that it's free to use SB.
Anyways, I agree with your suggestion.

Yes it is a unrenewable rescource cost not like spell points you shrine and they recharge. The cooldown timers on all melee skiklls and tactics is ridiculous. Don't get me started on intim

[grodon9999]

Now, I only find it useful on casters as taking them out of a fight for even a short time can be useful.

They are the first targets that are fingered or PWK'd as soon as the door opens, except for drow of course who have that utterly absurd SR but **** HP anyway. I'll have to test but if my fighter can trip them SB's going bye-bye.

[dingal]

The problem if you make the cooldown shorter is you will need to swap weapons much more thus losing more dps. When it was insta crits this made sense, not sure it does now. Maybe a better idea would be either lower the stun dc's so you have less of a chance of 'wasting' a weapon swap or slightly increase the stun duration.

Now, I only find it useful on casters as taking them out of a fight for even a short time can be useful.

for the most part I agree, depends on the level of chaos. Stopping even 1 rampaging devil in Epic DA can be useful.

I don't even bother 99% of the time. Most of the time I land my stun and then the FOD icon appears above the mobs head before I've got my esos back out. Then I go sulk in the corner until the red name comes out to play.

[dingal]

They are the first targets that are fingered or PWK'd as soon as the door opens, except for drow of course who have that utterly absurd SR but **** HP anyway. I'll have to test but if my fighter can trip them SB's going bye-bye.

I'm dropping stunning blow and going back to pure barb today as soon as the server comes up. Until I get the items I need to get myself back to a sustained 74 str with the fighter levels I'm staying pure barb. At 74 I never miss anything, silver flame pots or otherwise (Except stupid Malicia) but with the fighter levels I can only maintain 74 and I miss when I'm self healing.

I may not drop SB but I'm definitely going back to pure barb.

[Soleran]

Ki is a renewable resource, come on.

SB's resource cost is a bunch of APs.

SF requires the boosting of a noncambat stat that doesn't get boosted to insane lvls.

SB is a freebie with high str builds and all the buffs available.

SF uses ki.

SB uses none.

Monks can't boost SF with enhancements.

Fighters get an enhancement line to boost their SB.

SB doesn't need a much shorter cd.

[grodon9999]

SF requires the boosting of a noncambat stat that doesn't get boosted to insane lvls.

SB is a freebie with high str builds and all the buffs available.

SF uses ki.

SB uses none.

Monks can't boost SF with enhancements.

Fighters get an enhancement line to boost their SB.

SB doesn't need a much shorter cd.

SB sucks.

SF doesn't suck as much.

Anyone long for the good ole days of weighted weapons with no saving throws? No minion debuffs either.

[Krag]

Not signed. I don't want to spend TP to restore my barb to pre U9 setup.

[Chai]

SB sucks.

SF doesn't suck as much.

Anyone long for the good ole days of weighted weapons with no saving throws? No minion debuffs either.

Only took a couple weeks and now we are longing for the mind numbingly boring grind epics used to be, heh. Stunning 10 wraps were godmode. Everything else was not worth speccing into. No - Im not trying to go back there.

I think 10 seconds is the answer to my previous question.

[maha0201]

SB sucks.

SF doesn't suck as much.

Anyone long for the good ole days of weighted weapons with no saving throws? No minion debuffs either.

I had both sb and sf on mine shintao human monk, i got to 36 ish dcs and i had 40 dc on the kukan-do, so basicly i was able to CC alot. That was pre u9 so we had auto crits and we had massholds... Mine blow was alot help on casters (drow casters pass U7) since they have high SR and will saves ( no hold on them).

Stunning is valid, only thing is you wont get as much as you used to get from it. Is it worth to not take toughness for it , in u9 NO, is it worth to take it instead of 2nd,3rd... toughness YES.

IMHO only thing they should change is DC of weightne wepons to about 40 so they have chance in epics, 33 these days is low....

[dingal]

Only took a couple weeks and now we are longing for the mind numbingly boring grind epics used to be, heh. Stunning 10 wraps were godmode. Everything else was not worth speccing into. No - Im not trying to go back there.

I think 10 seconds is the answer to my previous question.

I doubt many of us want to go back to what it was but I think many of us who enjoy our melee classes more than our casters are suffering a little bit of shock at the sudden massive change in gameplay that renders our characters somewhat useful but no longer required for a substantial portion of most quests.

and yes, 10 seconds is the answer.

[grodon9999]

Only took a couple weeks and now we are longing for the mind numbingly boring grind epics used to be, heh. Stunning 10 wraps were godmode. Everything else was not worth speccing into. No - Im not trying to go back there.

I think 10 seconds is the answer to my previous question.

I LIKE the fact that casters are gods, they are SUPPOSED to be. It's more D&D the way it is now than what we had before U9. Just need a few tweaks to increase melee viability.

[Nick_RC]

Drop the cooldown to 10.

Im guessing you are running alot of fens grodon. The scrags have pretty high fort saves. I run at the moment with 50 no weighted. I still stun70-80% of most mobs (as opposed to 90%).If stunning blow were reduced to 10 seconds it would be great as it would offer another stun in say 30 seconds which helps compensate for the raised saves in a roundabout way. Honestly if I was much less than 50 WITHOUT weighted - say 45 without weighted or 45-50 WITH weighted I'd drop the feat completely at this point in time for epics - talking stunnig blow not stunning fist. Only exception is monk splashed kensai. I have a 32p gimp who hits 50ish on his stuns and just being able to cycle through so many its just godly. The mobs really dont have alot of hp anymore. Id just invest in more HP and slug it out. Which sucks.

N

[Chai]

I LIKE the fact that casters are gods, they are SUPPOSED to be. It's more D&D the way it is now than what we had before U9. Just need a few tweaks to increase melee viability.

I agree. For the longest time casters were the "we will only take one or two of you in each raid" class. Now some melee are shaking in their madstone boots. I still dont understand the "we arent needed anymore" mentality though. That holds true for every class.

10 second stunning blows, and mother of god, give me a reason to be 18 levels of ranger or greater.

[oradafu]

I agree that Stunning Blow needs a shorter cooldown with the increase to mobs saves. For me, Stunning Blow has become almost unreliable in Epics. I'd say somewhere between 10 to 12 seconds seems reasonable to me.

[grodon9999]

Drop the cooldown to 10.

Im guessing you are running alot of fens grodon. The scrags have pretty high fort saves. I run at the moment with 50 no weighted. I still stun70-80% of most mobs (as opposed to 90%).If stunning blow were reduced to 10 seconds it would be great as it would offer another stun in say 30 seconds which helps compensate for the raised saves in a roundabout way. Honestly if I was much less than 50 WITHOUT weighted - say 45 without weighted or 45-50 WITH weighted I'd drop the feat completely at this point in time for epics - talking stunnig blow not stunning fist. Only exception is monk splashed kensai. I have a 32p gimp who hits 50ish on his stuns and just being able to cycle through so many its just godly. The mobs really dont have alot of hp anymore. Id just invest in more HP and slug it out. Which sucks.

N

I got two more mooks who need claw-set (3 counting my clonk . . .) I live in the Fens Do OoB a few times a week, and the Devil stuff in the marketplace whenever I'm off timer. What really caught me by surprise was not being able to reliably nail the Scorrow in OoB as they were never even tough before.

The HP thing is EXACTLY what I'm looking at, 40 more HP on my fighter in Kensai-mode if I drop then APs as I can afford all my toughness ENH. 60 more if I take another toughness but I'm sure I can find a better use for the feat.

[Nick_RC]

I got two more mooks who need claw-set (3 counting my clonk . . .) I live in the Fens Do OoB a few times a week, and the Devil stuff in the marketplace whenever I'm off timer. What really caught me by surprise was not being able to reliably nail the Scorrow in OoB as they were never even tough before.

The HP thing is EXACTLY what I'm looking at, 40 more HP on my fighter in Kensai-mode if I drop then APs as I can afford all my toughness ENH. 60 more if I take another toughness but I'm sure I can find a better use for the feat.

Yeah had the sneaking suspicion you were fighting those scrags. They are hit or miss at 50DC. Guessing ur casters are instakilling the less hardy mobs and leave the big boys for the melee clean up crew.

Im still happy with my stuns in OOB on the scorrow. Few more misses but I think its probably the combination of being greater dispelled (Yugo + rage is 2 to your dc right there) + the saves bump that is hurting. Casters continually throwing rage are a thing of the past. They may as well be up front bringing the pain.And the drow are horrendously easy to kill on melees now. In fact any quest with drow in it are fun for me at the moment. Had my first really fun experience as a melee this mod in von 3 the other day. The casters who had been rip snorting through all the other quests were frustrated when they had probs with SR and evasion. Time for melees to shine!

N

[voodoogroves]

And the drow are horrendously easy to kill on melees now. In fact any quest with drow in it are fun for me at the moment. Had my first really fun experience as a melee this mod in von 3 the other day. The casters who had been rip snorting through all the other quests were frustrated when they had probs with SR and evasion. Time for melees to shine!

N

And this is what we need ... more CONTENT (quests and monsters) that require a variety of tactics.

Espescialy in epics, I'd like to see things like "the area where SR is a pig", "the area where FORT saves are stupid high", "the area where you're dispelled constantly" mixed up a bit more.

[grodon9999]

Yeah had the sneaking suspicion you were fighting those scrags. They are hit or miss at 50DC. Guessing ur casters are instakilling the less hardy mobs and leave the big boys for the melee clean up crew.

Yup, but I usually bring my ranger for Into the Deep because triple-earth and redscale fouls up those scrags as they still have **** reflex saves. My Tempest III's Earth-grab Khopeshes are more useful than my fighter's DC50 stunning blow as most mobs have reflex as their weak save. I guess that'll get nerfed next

Im still happy with my stuns in OOB on the scorrow. Few more misses but I think its probably the combination of being greater dispelled (Yugo + rage is 2 to your dc right there) + the saves bump that is hurting. Casters continually throwing rage are a thing of the past. They may as well be up front bringing the pain.And the drow are horrendously easy to kill on melees now. In fact any quest with drow in it are fun for me at the moment. Had my first really fun experience as a melee this mod in von 3 the other day. The casters who had been rip snorting through all the other quests were frustrated when they had probs with SR and evasion. Time for melees to shine!

N

EVoN3 is a great quest where everyone can shine but I don't know a lot of people who run it often any more.