Another U9 intimidate complaint

[sirgog]

As with many other parts of DDO, as time has gone on, and especially with Update 9, "Thinking Players", that is players and groups that use actual tactics are rewarded. The game has become more complicated in that sue of some skills and spells take a bit more thought, skill, and gear. The flailing attempts by the Devs to make shields actually useful have been a complete failure. The only use for shields in the last 2 years has been Sheild Block intimidate type situations. Which obviously are now useless...... It's nto all tha thard to repec that type of S&B timi into a 2W type hate generation tank that with proper game play can easily hold agro in MOST cases, that is until you get another really dumb thoughtless, or I'm so awesome player who doesn't know how to control their own toon, and it's hate generation/DPS in such situations.

If a shield is the difference between 80 and 89 AC, well that is the difference between Elite Horoth's melee swings doing ~60 damage per second, and doing ~20 (mostly grazing hits). That's the difference between a 2 mana pot run and having 1500sp left over when Suulo dies.

Likewise for most epic rednameds (although only if you debuff them with all the usual -To-Hit effects that work on rednameds - Bestow Curse, Exhaustion, Strength Sapping and the like).

Heh, check out my new mediocre intimidate build. Specifically built to not be very good at it.

Remove the Circle of Hatred (or whatever you use for +15 Intim) and the eClaw gloves and your Cha item. -23 to Intim. Goes from 'works on a 1 on elite Horoth' to 'fails on a 20 on Horoth'.

Gear swaps take you 3 seconds, but you can heal a tank through elite Horoth and 4-6 Orthons for that time just fine if you really have to.

[etelan]

Remove the Circle of Hatred (or whatever you use for +15 Intim) and the eClaw gloves and your Cha item. -23 to Intim. Goes from 'works on a 1 on elite Horoth' to 'fails on a 20 on Horoth'.

Gear swaps take you 3 seconds, but you can heal a tank through elite Horoth and 4-6 Orthons for that time just fine if you really have to.

Unfortunately, when specced for no fail epic DQ -23 is not enough :/ Having to remove your intimidate gear is hardly a compelling reason to call it a worthwhile skill.

[smatt]

If a shield is the difference between 80 and 89 AC, well that is the difference between Elite Horoth's melee swings doing ~60 damage per second, and doing ~20 (mostly grazing hits). That's the difference between a 2 mana pot run and having 1500sp left over when Suulo dies.

Indeed.... But how many groups will actualyl be patient AND smart enough to let a S&B keep Intimi/agro on an Elite ToD.... Sure there will be a few...

Likewise for most epic rednameds (although only if you debuff them with all the usual -To-Hit effects that work on rednameds - Bestow Curse, Exhaustion, Strength Sapping and the like).

I admittedly haven't played enough post update 9 to do any epics to be honest...

[sirgog]

Unfortunately, when specced for no fail epic DQ -23 is not enough :/ Having to remove your intimidate gear is hardly a compelling reason to call it a worthwhile skill.

Yeah in that case it doesn't work. I've not seen an Intim strategy used on eLailat since the stealth nerfs to her damage output ages ago, and so I've not seen people shoot for Intim scores that are nofail on eDQ2 or elite HoX.

The skill could be improved to have a 'taunt just this mob' mode, or a 'taunt everything BUT this mob' mode to prevent the silly gearchanges, but it is useful as-is.

Indeed.... But how many groups will actualyl be patient AND smart enough to let a S&B keep Intimi/agro on an Elite ToD.... Sure there will be a few...

Those groups that don't have a good strategy for controlling Horoth's aggro don't attempt Elite+Suulo often. They are even less likely to succeed.

S&B hate, enhanced by the new Intim, is easily enough to lock Horoth in elite ToD; even against ultra-geared melees.

[etelan]

Indeed.... But how many groups will actualyl be patient AND smart enough to let a S&B keep Intimi/agro on an Elite ToD.... Sure there will be a few...

This is how we roll ToD in our guild. Easier to do without bothering with intimidate IMO.

[grodon9999]

Indeed.... But how many groups will actualyl be patient AND smart enough to let a S&B keep Intimi/agro on an Elite ToD.... Sure there will be a few...

If they aren't smart or patient enough they have no business doing Elite.

[etelan]

Yeah in that case it doesn't work. I've not seen an Intim strategy used on eLailat since the stealth nerfs to her damage output ages ago, and so I've not seen people shoot for Intim scores that are nofail on eDQ2 or elite HoX.

With a little bit of practice it worked wonderfully just before U9. Since the update I have not found a single situation where having the skill has been any help to my hate/AC tank. I did intimidate the Orthons once on my wizard which was useful...

EDIT: I might use it in ToD if I rolled a new tank that wasn't geared out yet? Even so, I think everyone can agree that shield blocking is dead.

[Zharfie]

blah blah blah, I didn't bother reading it all but to all of you who are whining that intimidate is useless or whatnot, here's my input:

YOU'RE DOING IT WRONG.

this update brought my timitank back to life from being bored to death.

sidenotes:

- orthons in vod do minimal damage at best, you don't really need a tank for them, if you really do still, there's lots of ways to do it
- there's no need to build aggro, really.. (or maybe you need to reroll if you do need this )
- shield blocking is still useful when the group is fighting something else and the healers are busy, you won't lose aggro if no one is hitting the target (also, you could just intimidate the orthons, have the group pick up one of them and leave the rest to you, they won't leave if no one is hitting them)

[Darkrok]

This really hurt healing amp tanks in being able to tank DQ/VoD.

In DQ I used to be able to easily tank it simply by 'shield' blocking (while twf), intim'ing, and having every mass cure basically fill my bar. That's just not an option anymore as you wouldn't be able to hold agro.

In VoD I could actually tank Sully and self-heal by timing the heals in between his swings, intim'ing, and 'shield' blocking. Now I would have to swing to hold the agro which means I'd get cursed all the time. I could tank that way but I'd have to have someone dedicated to my curses otherwise I'd likely end up losing agro.

I'm not really complaining on this. My toon that was affected was slated for a TR anyway (I didn't like being a melee toon with terrible dps). I'm just pointing out that those two raids took a big hit for the low ac healing amp-based intimitanks. Any raids that didn't have special benefits to shield-blocking he'd be fine - he just attacked and could hold agro intim or no - but when shield-blocking prevented curses/knockdowns it really hurt to lose that ability.