I am in a Clunk funk

[MoonRunner]

Getting closer and closer to Friertucks TR and have a few questions. Really just one. If I take monk at level one for better skill point distribution is there a way to get fred to change my feats taken then to some caster based feats? I am getting the human bonus feat. I tried this with a vet build to test and it would not let me select any of the feats I want at level 4. Will following though to a higer level do the trick or an I stuck with those feats? I really want the skill points from going monk level one but even using a char gen I am short one caster feat to set my end game right if I take the monk level at one. Do I just need to make the choice between skill points or the extra feat or am I missing a trick?

[Corpsebride]

You can only take caster feats if you have SP - so as a level 1 monk, you will be locked out of them. Are there any non caster feats you could take at level one? Toughness, twf and Stunning fist maybe? At least in the character planner it looks like you could take all three as a level one human monk (assuming you have enough dex for TWF of course). If you post the complete list of feats you want at cap, it might help to see what can be shuffled where.

[Zaal]

Fred should only give you the option of feats that your current class structure will provide.
So like Corpsebride says, you can't take a feat that your class doesn't have have access to.

Far a I am aware, and especially respecting your monk/arcane selections, there are no lvl 1 bonuses other than to skill points that you get double for.
That said, Monk is prob your better choice for your level 1... although I don't recall if Monk gets more skill points that say a Wiz (at any level)...

[MoonRunner]

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 3.8.2
DDO Character Planner Home Page

FrierTuck Moonrunner
Level 20 Lawful Good Human Male
(3 Monk \ 17 Cleric) 
Hit Points: 284
Spell Points: 1474 
BAB: 14\14\19\24
Fortitude: 19
Reflex: 15
Will: 25

                  Starting          
Abilities        Base Stats         
(34 Point)       (Level 1)          
Strength             14             
Dexterity            12             
Constitution         14             
Intelligence          8             
Wisdom               18             
Charisma             10             

Tomes Used
+1 Tome of Strength used at level 3
+1 Tome of Dexterity used at level 3
+1 Tome of Constitution used at level 3
+1 Tome of Intelligence used at level 3
+1 Tome of Wisdom used at level 3
+1 Tome of Charisma used at level 3
+2 Tome of Strength used at level 7
+2 Tome of Dexterity used at level 7
+2 Tome of Constitution used at level 7
+2 Tome of Intelligence used at level 7
+2 Tome of Wisdom used at level 7
+2 Tome of Charisma used at level 7

Level 1 (Cleric)
Feat: (Selected) Mental Toughness
Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Cleric
Feat: (Human Bonus) Toughness


Level 2 (Monk)
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Lightning Reflexes


Level 3 (Cleric)
Feat: (Selected) Combat Casting


Level 4 (Monk)
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Toughness


Level 5 (Cleric)


Level 6 (Cleric)
Feat: (Selected) Empower Healing Spell


Level 7 (Cleric)


Level 8 (Monk)
Feat: (Monk Path) Path of Harmonious Balance: Fists of Light


Level 9 (Cleric)
Feat: (Selected) Empower Spell


Level 10 (Cleric)


Level 11 (Cleric)


Level 12 (Cleric)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Mental Toughness


Level 13 (Cleric)


Level 14 (Cleric)


Level 15 (Cleric)
Feat: (Selected) Maximize Spell


Level 16 (Cleric)


Level 17 (Cleric)


Level 18 (Cleric)
Feat: (Selected) Heighten Spell


Level 19 (Cleric)


Level 20 (Cleric)
Enhancement: Cleric Radiant Servant I
Enhancement: Cleric Radiant Servant II
Enhancement: Human Adaptability Wisdom I
Enhancement: Human Improved Recovery I
Enhancement: Human Improved Recovery II
Enhancement: Human Improved Recovery III
Enhancement: Human Versatility I
Enhancement: Improved Heal I
Enhancement: Improved Heal II
Enhancement: Cleric Prayer of Smiting I
Enhancement: Cleric Prayer of Smiting II
Enhancement: Cleric Prayer of Life I
Enhancement: Cleric Prayer of Life II
Enhancement: Cleric Prayer of Life III
Enhancement: Cleric Prayer of Incredible Smiting I
Enhancement: Cleric Prayer of Incredible Life I
Enhancement: Cleric Prayer of Incredible Life II
Enhancement: Cleric Prayer of Incredible Life III
Enhancement: Cleric Smiting I
Enhancement: Cleric Life Magic I
Enhancement: Cleric Life Magic II
Enhancement: Cleric Life Magic III
Enhancement: Cleric Life Magic IV
Enhancement: Cleric Energy of the Zealot I
Enhancement: Cleric Energy of the Zealot II
Enhancement: Cleric Energy of the Zealot III
Enhancement: Cleric Energy of the Zealot IV
Enhancement: Cleric Charisma I
Enhancement: Cleric Charisma II
Enhancement: Cleric Wisdom I
Enhancement: Cleric Wisdom II
Enhancement: Cleric Wisdom III
Enhancement: Cleric Divine Light I
Enhancement: Cleric Improved Turning I

[Zaal]

Not sure why you posted that...

However, I don't think past level 3 will your build change... So by level 3, C/M/C should be the same as going M/C/C and you if Monk gets more skill point (i forget) @ lvl 1 , then yeah I'd do that.

[MoonRunner]

This is where I am so far and I like what I see other than wanting a better ballance and jump which I would get if I took monk at level 1. I don't see how I could shuffle it around because if my planner is correct the levels I am taking monk feats I am doing so because that is my only option. Starting monk at level one I took toughness x2 and lightning reflexes which would be fine if my second level of monk wasnt a class feat. I think I am answering my own question I am just hoping I have missed something.

[MoonRunner]

Not sure why you posted that...

Corpsebride asked for a list of feats. And these are the ones I want. I seem to hit fine using twf without the feat in my pure cleric form so that isn't as important to me. I am kinda wondering how much the fact that my curent base stats being 18 str with 2 extra points from leveling going down to 14 base with no level point will effect my to hit (its only+3 isnt it?) I may go with 17 wis so I can add a point to str and one to dex.

My ultimate goal is to get my spell dc up a little from its current form and improve my saves (mainly reflex) since comet fall and like spells seem to be the only thing that are a real threat to me. I took the 3rd level of monk for path of light in hopes that will help compensate for less sp (I really don't loose much sp because of my new 18 base wis) I am also hoping to see a little more melee dps from attack speed however am afraid I may be gimping melee with the Str loss.

[Zaal]

Corpsebride asked for a list of feats.

gotcha

[erikbozelie]

take toughness at level1,
gotta take it somewhere.

[Corpsebride]

Corpsebride asked for a list of feats. And these are the ones I want. I seem to hit fine using twf without the feat in my pure cleric form so that isn't as important to me. I am kinda wondering how much the fact that my curent base stats being 18 str with 2 extra points from leveling going down to 14 base with no level point will effect my to hit (its only+3 isnt it?)

One thing that strikes me is the strength vs dex distribution. Have you considered maybe swapping lightning reflexes for twf and combat casting for weapon finesse? You could then go with a lower strength and push dexterity. Probably could end up with a higher to hit that way and potentially a usable ac while leveling and soloing. I'd also be tempted to go one less toughness and take Stunning fist somehow, now that it is based off character level you could get an excellent DC with high wisdom.

I'd also consider swapping mental toughness and improved mental toughness for either quicken and spell focus or for Imp TWF and Greater TWF, depending on whether or not I needed more caster focus or more melee focus as playing through things levelling and end game.

You could go with 10 str, 16 dex as well. Depending on tomes, gear, etc you might end up with a bit more to hit at a cost of 1 damage - which on this build isn't too big an issue I think.

Something like this with mental toughness in planner, but easily swappable depending:

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 3.8.0
DDO Character Planner Home Page

Level 20 Lawful Good Human Male
(3 Monk \ 17 Cleric) 
Hit Points: 262
Spell Points: 1312 
BAB: 14\14\19\24
Fortitude: 16
Reflex: 11
Will: 20

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
Abilities        Base Stats          Modified Stats
(34 Point)       (Level 1)             (Level 20)
Strength             12                    14
Dexterity            15                    17
Constitution         14                    16
Intelligence          8                    10
Wisdom               18                    25
Charisma              8                    10

Tomes Used
+2 Tome of Strength used at level 7
+2 Tome of Dexterity used at level 7
+2 Tome of Constitution used at level 7
+2 Tome of Intelligence used at level 7
+2 Tome of Wisdom used at level 7
+2 Tome of Charisma used at level 7

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
                 Base Skills         Modified Skills
Skills           (Level 1)            (Level 20)
Balance               2                     3
Bluff                -1                     0
Concentration         2                     3
Diplomacy            -1                     0
Disable Device       n/a                    n/a
Haggle               -1                     0
Heal                  4                     7
Hide                  2                     3
Intimidate           -1                     0
Jump                  1                     2
Listen                4                     7
Move Silently         2                     3
Open Lock             n/a                   n/a
Perform              n/a                    n/a
Repair               -1                     0
Search               -1                     0
Spot                  4                     7
Swim                  1                     2
Tumble                n/a                   n/a
Use Magic Device     n/a                    n/a

Level 1 (Monk)
Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Cleric
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Stunning Fist
Feat: (Human Bonus) Toughness
Feat: (Selected) Two Weapon Fighting


Level 2 (Cleric)


Level 3 (Cleric)
Feat: (Selected) Mental Toughness


Level 4 (Monk)
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Weapon Finesse


Level 5 (Cleric)


Level 6 (Cleric)
Feat: (Selected) Empower Healing Spell


Level 7 (Cleric)


Level 8 (Monk)
Feat: (Monk Path) Path of Harmonious Balance: Fists of Light


Level 9 (Cleric)
Feat: (Selected) Empower Spell


Level 10 (Cleric)


Level 11 (Cleric)


Level 12 (Cleric)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Mental Toughness


Level 13 (Cleric)


Level 14 (Cleric)


Level 15 (Cleric)
Feat: (Selected) Maximize Spell


Level 16 (Cleric)


Level 17 (Cleric)


Level 18 (Cleric)
Feat: (Selected) Heighten Spell


Level 19 (Cleric)


Level 20 (Cleric)

[MoonRunner]

Thats actually not a bad idea. I did build tuck that way when I started with a rogue splash. I changed him because I didn't like the damage. I didn't see as big of an increase from going to strenght as I thought I would So I might give that some thought.I do hate to get rid of the mental toughnes a I assume I will be healing myself a bit more with a more combat oriented build than I have now. I'll toy with it in the planner. thanks

[MoonRunner]

Ok here is what I came up with going with your dex based build. Jumped early on 2nd monk level but with my limited skill points can still put them where i want them this way.

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 3.8.2
DDO Character Planner Home Page

FrierTuckM1 Moonrunner
Level 20 Lawful Good Human Male
(3 Monk \ 17 Cleric) 
Hit Points: 262
Spell Points: 1102 
BAB: 14\14\19\24
Fortitude: 16
Reflex: 14
Will: 20

Level 1 (Monk)
Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Cleric
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Stunning Fist
Feat: (Human Bonus) Toughness
Feat: (Selected) Two Weapon Fighting


Level 2 (Cleric)


Level 3 (Monk)
Feat: (Selected) Lightning Reflexes
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Weapon Finesse


Level 4 (Cleric)


Level 5 (Cleric)


Level 6 (Monk)
Feat: (Selected) Empower Healing Spell
Feat: (Monk Path) Path of Harmonious Balance: Fists of Light


Level 7 (Cleric)


Level 8 (Cleric)


Level 9 (Cleric)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Two Weapon Fighting


Level 10 (Cleric)


Level 11 (Cleric)


Level 12 (Cleric)
Feat: (Selected) Empower Spell


Level 13 (Cleric)


Level 14 (Cleric)


Level 15 (Cleric)
Feat: (Selected) Maximize Spell


Level 16 (Cleric)


Level 17 (Cleric)


Level 18 (Cleric)
Feat: (Selected) Heighten Spell


Level 19 (Cleric)


Level 20 (Cleric)

I'm not going to repost it but since I learned that you still get your wis AC bonus when uncentered as long as you don't wear aremor or a shield I am droping the 3rd level of monk so I can still use my ornamated dager and rapiers. This will also give me an aditional +1 to all saves vs what is posted abouve. I am a little worried about the lesser saves I have this way (20/16/24 str based or 17/14/21 dex based) Other than that I like it. I will also be more dependant on pots in VoD and maybe even shroud.

One more question. How will my DC be compare with my current build with 2 monk levels but 5 more Wis (3 at start and two from leveling that are currently in str?)

[AcesWylde]

If you're going finesse have you considered dumping Str entirely for Cha and taking Divine Might III for damage?

Also have you considered taking 18clr/2mnk? You'd lose Fists of Light and Still mind, but you'd gain +1 saves, more spell points, extra spell slot, and Radiant Servant III if/when it comes out.

[MoonRunner]

Yea my last post before you, I said I would only be doing 2 levels of monk. I hate to dump str more because I don't know how much I need to keep from being over-incumbered. I won't be wearing full plate any more so how much do I need? I would love to see radiantIII or ANY other pre available to the clerics.

Is DC based on caster or cleric level?

[AcesWylde]

Is DC based on caster or cleric level?

Spell level + Stat bonus if I remember correctly (if ddo is the same as pnp)

Wisdom for you, so water stance should add +1 to your DC

[MoonRunner]

Ok sweet. Now I just need figure out if I want to do the Clunk TR or Str based THF FvS Tank.

[phalaeo]

I hate to dump str more because I don't know how much I need to keep from being over-incumbered. I won't be wearing full plate any more so how much do I need? I would love to see radiantIII or ANY other pre available to the clerics.

Is DC based on caster or cleric level?

Dump it. Mine was starting 12 STR, but some of that is due to her being a Halfling, and they have 3/4 carrying capacity. You could do 11 + Human Greater Adaptability: STR or 12. Don't go lower than 10, or you're practically a moving target for anything that can cast Enfeeblement. And wear the highest bonus to STR for your level.

DC is:
10 + the level of the spell + the modifier for the caster's casting ability + Spell Focus feats + Spell Focus gear.

(With Bladebarrier, a level 6 spell and 36 WIS, which is a +13 modifier)
10 + 6 (Spell level) + 13 (WIS mod) + 1 (Evocation item) = 30 DC

I...Other than that I like it. I will also be more dependant on pots in VoD and maybe even shroud.

You will adapt. I went from a pure Cleric with 2K SP to a Clonk with 1840. My melee Cleric has even less at 1650. I do not use pots for either VoD or Shroud, so long as I'm not solo-healing and the group doesn't suck.

Use more scrolls. Use the Radiant Burst... you find ways.