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  1. #1
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Posts
    22

    Question Human Pure Paladin TWF DPS

    I am trying out this build and this Online Character Builder.

    http://www.ddochargen.com/home.aspx?build=296

    Paladin 20
    Male Human (Lawful Good)

    HP: 362
    SP: 300
    AC: 14

    SAVES
    FORT: 16
    REFL: 10
    WILL: 7

    BAB: +20/+20/+25/+30

    STR: 24 (+7)
    DEX: 17 (+3)
    CON: 16 (+3)
    INT: 10 (0)
    WIS: 10 (0)
    CHA: 18 (+4)

    Balance: 8
    Bluff: 4
    Concentration: 3
    Diplomacy: 4
    Disable Device: n/a
    Haggle: 14
    Heal: 1
    Hide: 3
    Intimidate: 4
    Jump: 10

    Listen: 0
    Move Silently: 3
    Open Lock: n/a
    Perform: n/a
    Repair: 0
    Search: 0
    Spot: 0
    Swim: 7
    Tumble: n/a
    UMD: 15

    LEVEL 1
    Race Selected: Male Human
    Alignment Selected: Lawful Good
    Class Selected: Paladin (Paladin 1)
    Abilities Raised: STR: 15, DEX: 15, CON: 14, CHA: 16
    Skills Ranks Raised: Balance +2 (2), UMD +2 (2)
    Feats Selected: Toughness, Two Weapon Fighting
    Enhancements Selected: Paladin Toughness I, Follower of the Sovereign Host, Paladin Extra Smite Evil I
    LEVEL 2
    Class Selected: Paladin (Paladin 2)
    Skills Ranks Raised: Balance +0.5 (2.5), UMD +0.5 (2.5)
    Enhancements Selected: Human Improved Recovery I
    LEVEL 3
    Class Selected: Paladin (Paladin 3)
    Skills Ranks Raised: Balance +0.5 (3), UMD +0.5 (3)
    Feats Selected: Oversized Two Weapon Fighting
    Enhancements Selected: Human Versatility I, Paladin Courage of Good I, Paladin Extra Lay on Hands I, Racial Toughness I
    LEVEL 4
    Class Selected: Paladin (Paladin 4)
    Abilities Raised: STR: 16
    Skills Ranks Raised: Balance +0.5 (3.5), UMD +0.5 (3.5)
    Enhancements Selected: Paladin Extra Smite Evil II, Paladin Energy of the Templar I, Paladin Toughness II
    LEVEL 5
    Class Selected: Paladin (Paladin 5)
    Skills Ranks Raised: Balance +0.5 (4), UMD +0.5 (4)
    Enhancements Selected: Human Adaptability Strength I, Paladin Divine Might I, Paladin Divine Sacrifice I
    LEVEL 6
    Class Selected: Paladin (Paladin 6)
    Skills Ranks Raised: Balance +0.5 (4.5), UMD +0.5 (4.5)
    Feats Selected: Exotic Weapons (Khopesh)
    Enhancements Selected: Paladin Knight of the Chalice I, Paladin Divine Righteousness I
    LEVEL 7
    Class Selected: Paladin (Paladin 7)
    Skills Ranks Raised: Balance +0.5 (5), UMD +0.5 (5)
    Tomes Applied: STR: +2, DEX: +2, CON: +2, INT: +2, WIS: +2, CHA: +2
    Enhancements Selected: Paladin Extra Smite Evil III, Paladin Exalted Smite I
    LEVEL 8
    Class Selected: Paladin (Paladin 8)
    Abilities Raised: STR: 20
    Skills Ranks Raised: Jump +1 (1), UMD +0.5 (5.5)
    Enhancements Selected: Unyielding Sovereignty
    LEVEL 9
    Class Selected: Paladin (Paladin 9)
    Skills Ranks Raised: Jump +1 (2), UMD +0.5 (6)
    Feats Selected: Extend Spell
    Enhancements Selected: Paladin Energy of the Templar II, Paladin Courage of Good II
    LEVEL 10
    Class Selected: Paladin (Paladin 10)
    Skills Ranks Raised: Jump +1 (3), UMD +0.5 (6.5)
    Enhancements Selected: Paladin Exalted Smite II, Paladin Extra Lay on Hands II
    LEVEL 11
    Class Selected: Paladin (Paladin 11)
    Skills Ranks Raised: Haggle +1 (1), UMD +0.5 (7)
    Enhancements Selected: Paladin Toughness III
    LEVEL 12
    Class Selected: Paladin (Paladin 12)
    Abilities Raised: STR: 21
    Skills Ranks Raised: Haggle +1 (2), UMD +0.5 (7.5)
    Feats Selected: Improved Two Weapon Fighting
    Enhancements Selected: Paladin Knight of the Chalice II, Racial Toughness II
    LEVEL 13
    Class Selected: Paladin (Paladin 13)
    Skills Ranks Raised: Haggle +1 (3), UMD +0.5 (8)
    Enhancements Selected: Human Greater Adaptability Strength I
    LEVEL 14
    Class Selected: Paladin (Paladin 14)
    Skills Ranks Raised: Haggle +1 (4), UMD +0.5 (8.5)
    Enhancements Selected: Paladin Divine Might II, Paladin Extra Lay on Hands III
    LEVEL 15
    Class Selected: Paladin (Paladin 15)
    Skills Ranks Raised: Haggle +1 (5), UMD +0.5 (9)
    Feats Selected: Greater Two Weapon Fighting
    Enhancements Selected: Paladin Divine Might III
    LEVEL 16
    Class Selected: Paladin (Paladin 16)
    Abilities Raised: STR: 23
    Skills Ranks Raised: Haggle +1 (6), UMD +0.5 (9.5)
    Enhancements Selected: Paladin Toughness IV
    LEVEL 17
    Class Selected: Paladin (Paladin 17)
    Skills Ranks Raised: Haggle +1 (7), UMD +0.5 (10)
    Enhancements Selected: Paladin Extra Smite Evil IV
    LEVEL 18
    Class Selected: Paladin (Paladin 18)
    Skills Ranks Raised: Haggle +1 (8), UMD +0.5 (10.5)
    Feats Selected: Weapon Focus (Slashing)
    Enhancements Selected: Paladin Knight of the Chalice III, Paladin Exalted Smite III
    LEVEL 19
    Class Selected: Paladin (Paladin 19)
    Skills Ranks Raised: Haggle +1 (9), UMD +0.5 (11)
    Enhancements Selected: Paladin Exalted Smite IV
    LEVEL 20
    Class Selected: Paladin (Paladin 20)
    Abilities Raised: STR: 24
    Skills Ranks Raised: Haggle +1 (10), Heal +1 (1)
    Enhancements Selected: Paladin Weapons of Good, Paladin Divine Sacrifice II

    I am not certain if that is optimal feats/order, but from where I am standing it should be okay. It only requires the +2 to all tome you can buy from the store (last ditch). Items will be required for casting. The paladin guide I read suggested something similar (but left out oversized twf). Scimitars will get me by till Khopeshes?

    So, where did I go wrong (I am assuming I have, since this is my first Paladin).

  2. #2
    Community Member eonfreon's Avatar
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    Jan 2007
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    Default

    You want Improved Crit: Slash not Weapon Focus: Slash. And you want it as soon as possible which is at level 9.

    Unfortunately that means you'll have to move Extend to level 18.

    Alternately you could get Khopesh at level 3, Extend at level 6, and Oversized TWF at level 18. This would probably be more optimal. You can make do with a light offhand weapon when you have issues to hit (which is only a -2 difference with an oversized weapon without he feat- not that big a deal until you get to Epics where every point counts).

    Until you get ITWF and GTWF you probably wil be better served using a Two handed weapon anyway, like a great axe, at least until level 8 or so because TWF kinda sucks without those feats (only 40% chance to use the offhand weapon with TWF, 60% with ITWF, and 80% with GTWF).

    Also you probably really want Power Attack. It's arguably one of the most important melee Feats, up their with Improved Crit and the TWF line of Feats. Most would consider it far more important than either Extend or Oversized TWF. Only time I ever turn off PA is in Epics and even then only if I absolutley have to. Most often I'll use a Destruction and Improved Destruction weapon combo to bring the Mob's AC down enough to be able to use PA reliably.

    Good luck.
    Last edited by eonfreon; 04-28-2011 at 02:04 AM.

  3. #3
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Posts
    22

    Default Feat Swap

    So delay Oversized TWF or completely replace it with Power Attack.

    Use a Two Hander even with TWF until I have atleast one of the other feats to increase my chances to 60 to 80%.

    Delay Extend or completely remove it.

    Possibly use light weapon in off hand rather than Khopesh.

    Were the enhancements OK? I focused on KOTC and it's requirements and put the rest in Smiting, Divine Might, Divine Sacrifice, and took every toughness enhancement. I grabbed the cap as well. Thank you for your feedback.

  4. #4
    Build Constructionist unbongwah's Avatar
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    Aug 2009
    Posts
    19,465

    Default

    Stats: if you plan to grind for a +3 CHA tome, you might want to put your final lvl-up pt into CHA so you have 16 + 1 lvl-up + 3 tome = 20 which gets you Divine Might IV. STR will be 15 + 4 lvl-ups + 1 human enh + 2 tome = 22.

    Feat order: I would do something like Toughness (1), TWF (1), khopesh (3), PA (6), Imp Crit Slash (9), ITWF (12), GTWF (15), Extend or OTWF (18). There's room for tweaking that - e.g., bumping back khopesh and using 2H weapons until you have at least ITWF or rearranging IC / ITWF / GTWF - but that's the gist of my approach. It mostly depends on how soon you plan on dual-wielding, which in turn sorta depends on what weapons you have available.

    Enhs: I think you can squeeze in Divine Sacrifice III if you drop, say, Extra LoH III; and Divine Might IV for Toughness IV (if you follow my approach for hitting CHA 20). Not a huge DPS difference, but every little bit helps.
    Semi-retired Build Engineer. Everything was better back in our day. Get off my lawn.

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