Aussie evening group?

[Stillwaters]

@ WAX - no need to rob yourself and others of an asset, or deny yourself enjoyment of the game in regards to char building advice... Just direct it at those who see its value and want it, rather than full machine-gunning a room of players with it... Not having a dig (cause i respect you are a mechanic of builds) just dont want to put you offside as i can tell that you really enjoy the THEORY of the game just as much as the game itself..

What you said about PLAYER > CHARACTER BUILD is so **** true- my char is going to have maximised the stealth avenue as i did with rogues previous to this one, but up till now my sneaking was only for short scouting runs - ive been playing DDO for over 5 years now and STILL only just learning stealth do's and dont's, art of the bluff-pull etc

One of the main reasons i applied for this group was the possibility that i might actually learn a GAME skill i lacked - my CHARACTERS all knew how to sneak, but i sure as heck didnt, and the ADVICE and KNOWLEDGE i gain in this group i couldnt get if ppl are too afraid to voice their opinions, some SAVANT types have no clue about builds but can see straight away how things like bluff-pull or kiting can be done effectively.

In game as in life no matter how dumb you THINK you are, you might just figure out SOMETHING the genius next to you hasn't.

[Octavi]

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 3.8.2
DDO Character Planner Home Page

Level 1 Lawful Good Human Male
(1 Cleric) 
Hit Points: 28
Spell Points: 190 
BAB: 0
Fortitude: 2
Reflex: 2
Will: 5

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
Abilities        Base Stats          Modified Stats
(32 Point)       (Level 1)             (Level 1)
Strength             10                    10
Dexterity            14                    14
Constitution         10                    10
Intelligence         14                    14
Wisdom               16                    16
Charisma             14                    14

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
                 Base Skills         Modified Skills
Skills           (Level 1)            (Level 1)
Balance               2                     2
Bluff                 2                     2
Concentration         1                     1
Diplomacy             2                     2
Disable Device        n/a                   n/a
Haggle                3                     3
Heal                  7                     8
Hide                  4                     6
Intimidate            2                     2
Jump                  0                     0
Listen                4                     4
Move Silently         4                     6
Open Lock             n/a                   n/a
Perform               n/a                   n/a
Repair                2                     2
Search                2                     2
Spot                  4                     4
Swim                  0                     0
Tumble                2.5                   2.5
Use Magic Device      n/a                   n/a

Level 1 (Cleric)
Feat: (Selected) Mental Toughness
Feat: (Human Bonus) Stealthy
Enhancement: Improved Heal I
Enhancement: Cleric Life Magic I
Enhancement: Cleric Energy of the Zealot I
Enhancement: Cleric Divine Vitality I

How does this look? Be gentle Wax lol.

Looks great for level 1! You need to click on level 20 before you export to get everything.

[wax_on_wax_off]

Thanks for the input Wax

You know more about Helves & monks than me - thats for sure. But I still dont think Helf w/rogue is always the best (situationally, but also my ignorance on the race showing thru).

I'm leaning towards elf with the abonination with the input, purely for the slayer arrows & thinking we'll get to end game. But i'm still enclined to try to get a decent AC, for those 'just in case' situations (that, and i've never done that on a toon before)

In any case - it should be fun!


P.S. we could probably get leveled pretty quick, Llithic has a guild for her TR runs if we wanted to knock out the first few levels in a hurry.

Its going to be a refreshing change from running at full tilt.


Actually, in the quests that we can easily blitz (Korthos, harbor quests like New Ringleader etc), are we sticking to the stealth only approach?

I can kind of see a few quests where someone heads out & pulls a few mobs into a rather nasty ambush

Stealth is just a tool We'll do the quests however we want, the trick is to find the quests that are so tough than stealth is the only (or at least most efficient) option.

I think I'm a bit OCD but I can't resist pointing out that a half-elf will have slayer arrows too. Also, I definitely agree that half-elf with rogue dilettante is not always the best as sneak attack is very situational but then we are comparing half-elves who have something that is useful some (most) of the time vs elves who don't have anything. Melee damage will take a big hit as an elf having 2 points lower strength (before stat choices are made courtesy of fighter + adaptability), no sneak attack, no haste boost and no tier 3 strikes/stances. The only thing to make up for it is the extra spells you get as a ranger (but still won't have a +5 barkskin spell). AC wise, my suggestion can have very decent AC especially considering that you'll have a full array of buffs available to you. Even strength based you will be untouchable 95% of the time once we buff you up (paladin AC aura, bard AC song, Shield of Faith, haste etc etc). As an example, my dex/wis monk could self buff to 60 AC at level 13, which was crazy and overkill. With appropriate party members 70 AC wouldn't have been out of the question. Strength based you could still hit 60 with party buffs, more is not necessary.

Mick, I only see level 1, hard to be hard or soft

Check out the build that I linked, it might be relevant to you.

[wax_on_wax_off]

5. I would prefer no supreme tomes as when we loot a +2 it will be really AWESOME! This will make fitting some builds a bit harder but this is not designed to be a twinked out totally min/maxed group. Think PermaDeath without the Death part .

This boat has sailed my friend, the demands of building have made it a foregone conclusion that some tomes will be used to qualify for feats and give extra skill points.

Please don't make the paladin/monk (king build of over-the-top MADness) go without his supreme tome. Especially with the stealth goal in mind, tomes = more build possibilities = more options for us which is more fun for all

[wax_on_wax_off]

@ WAX - no need to rob yourself and others of an asset, or deny yourself enjoyment of the game in regards to char building advice... Just direct it at those who see its value and want it, rather than full machine-gunning a room of players with it... Not having a dig (cause i respect you are a mechanic of builds) just dont want to put you offside as i can tell that you really enjoy the THEORY of the game just as much as the game itself..

What you said about PLAYER > CHARACTER BUILD is so **** true- my char is going to have maximised the stealth avenue as i did with rogues previous to this one, but up till now my sneaking was only for short scouting runs - ive been playing DDO for over 5 years now and STILL only just learning stealth do's and dont's, art of the bluff-pull etc

One of the main reasons i applied for this group was the possibility that i might actually learn a GAME skill i lacked - my CHARACTERS all knew how to sneak, but i sure as heck didnt, and the ADVICE and KNOWLEDGE i gain in this group i couldnt get if ppl are too afraid to voice their opinions, some SAVANT types have no clue about builds but can see straight away how things like bluff-pull or kiting can be done effectively.

In game as in life no matter how dumb you THINK you are, you might just figure out SOMETHING the genius next to you hasn't.

This made me laugh out loud, thank you. Stealthing for me is pretty new too. I only really started to explore it in my recent race to level 20 on my pure wizard WF archmage. I tried to do specific quests like framework and blockade buster to get the stealth optionals which is HARD. Possibly I spent as much time in each of those quests trying to get the optional as I did on some entire levels. With the right tools I'm hoping we can do it with ease. Mostly, I'm looking for company, stealthing is a bit frustrating when you don't have anyone to exclaim to when you get 40 minutes into a quest without being seen and then someone rings the alarm bell.

[Octavi]

This boat has sailed my friend, the demands of building have made it a foregone conclusion that some tomes will be used to qualify for feats and give extra skill points.

Please don't make the paladin/monk (king build of over-the-top MADness) go without his supreme tome. Especially with the stealth goal in mind, tomes = more build possibilities = more options for us which is more fun for all

Just made my way through the wall of build text and it looks that way. Feel free to use a supreme tome if you need.

[Octavi]

No worries!

The original set as written by Octavi:
3. This will not be a perma death group but I would like to make things challenging.
a. Everyone starting at level 1
b. No trading of any sort with anyone outside the group (inc alts - so no hand me downs)
c. No auction house (vendors ok)
d. This will be a stealth/assasin focused group, all characters must have move silently
e. Only playing this character within the group (exception to catch up with exp if a session missed - solo only)
f. Quests on hard and elite only

Anyway, to clarify some points and add some more:
f. No doing quests on normal difficulty except for specific exceptions with exceptional reasons, try to do every quest once and done on elite where possible.
c. No buying from the AH (maybe agree on some exceptions sometime in the future if we hit roadblocks for particular items such as +move silently/search/disable skill items).
c. Selling on the AH is permitted (maybe?)

1. No reentering a quest unless the quest is completed.
2. Avoid doing quests overlevel.

Anything else?

Looks good Wax, would still prefer to avoid the AH completey. Any particular reason you would like to sell?

[voxson5]

This boat has sailed my friend, the demands of building have made it a foregone conclusion that some tomes will be used to qualify for feats and give extra skill points.

Please don't make the paladin/monk (king build of over-the-top MADness) go without his supreme tome. Especially with the stealth goal in mind, tomes = more build possibilities = more options for us which is more fun for all

This is where the overbuilding comes apart - kinda goes against non-twinking dont ya think

[voxson5]

But saying that

who's donating the supreme tomes for us all?

[wax_on_wax_off]

Looks good Wax, would still prefer to avoid the AH completey. Any particular reason you would like to sell?

I think the main reason is that selling loot to vendors won't give its true value. The outcome if we sell appropriate items at the AH is that we are richer (so can buy consumables more easily) and the server is richer (more good items in circulation).

I'm not sure what the outcome will be for our experience if we sell items at the AH but I don't think it would be overly dramatic. I think working up some capital for the eventuality of buying some AH items will be worthwhile. Examples of things we may make allowances for include DR breakers for raid bosses with double requirements and if we hit a wall with the content that we can run with the equipment that we have (as a possible alternative to running on normal).

But saying that

who's donating the supreme tomes for us all?

I think it'll be the case that if we want a tome then we buy it ourselves from the DDO store. Everyone will have different capabilities and desires when it comes to things like that. Personally, I don't have any particular wealth on Orien, I unlocked 32 point builds running a character up but haven't even got them to level 20 yet.

Additional rule for the group:
No buying store bought items (with tomes being the exception).

I agree that using tomes is outside of some of the spirit of the group but I think that is balanced with the possibility it opens to have a greater versatility in the builds that we choose. Either way, it won't be an issue until we get to level ~7.

I probably have enough plat on Sehrr to spring for a single +1 tome for everybody, depending on the prices on the server of course so make that subject to availability.

[Mick.P]

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 3.8.2
DDO Character Planner Home Page

Level 20 Lawful Good Human Male
(1 Monk \ 19 Cleric) 
Hit Points: 222
Spell Points: 1591 
BAB: 14\14\19\24
Fortitude: 13
Reflex: 10
Will: 20

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
Abilities        Base Stats          Modified Stats
(32 Point)       (Level 1)             (Level 20)
Strength             10                    10
Dexterity            14                    14
Constitution         10                    10
Intelligence         14                    14
Wisdom               16                    24
Charisma             14                    18

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
                 Base Skills         Modified Skills
Skills           (Level 1)            (Level 20)
Balance               2                     3
Bluff                 2                     4
Concentration         2                     3
Diplomacy             6                    25
Disable Device        n/a                   n/a
Haggle                2                     4
Heal                  7                    28
Hide                  4                    24
Intimidate            2                     4
Jump                  0                     0
Listen                3                     7
Move Silently         4                    25
Open Lock             n/a                   n/a
Perform               n/a                   n/a
Repair                2                     2
Search                2                     2
Spot                  3                     8
Swim                  0                     0
Tumble                n/a                   n/a
Use Magic Device      3                     5

Level 1 (Cleric)
Feat: (Selected) Mental Toughness
Feat: (Human Bonus) Stealthy
Enhancement: Improved Diplomacy I
Enhancement: Cleric Life Magic I
Enhancement: Cleric Energy of the Zealot I
Enhancement: Cleric Divine Vitality I


Level 2 (Monk)
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Toughness


Level 3 (Cleric)
Feat: (Selected) Empower Healing Spell
Enhancement: Improved Heal I
Enhancement: Improved Hide I
Enhancement: Improved Move Silently I
Enhancement: Cleric Wisdom I
Enhancement: Cleric Divine Cleansing I


Level 4 (Cleric)
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Cleric Prayer of Life I
Enhancement: Cleric Divine Healing I
Enhancement: Cleric Extra Turning I
Enhancement: Cleric Wand and Scroll Mastery I


Level 5 (Cleric)
Enhancement: Improved Concentration I
Enhancement: Improved Heal II
Enhancement: Cleric Life Magic II


Level 6 (Cleric)
Feat: (Selected) Extend Spell
Enhancement: Human Adaptability Wisdom I
Enhancement: Cleric Energy of the Zealot II
Enhancement: Cleric Improved Turning I


Level 7 (Cleric)
Enhancement: Follower of the Sovereign Host
Enhancement: Cleric Charisma I


Level 8 (Cleric)
Enhancement: Unyielding Sovereignty


Level 9 (Cleric)
Feat: (Selected) Dodge
Enhancement: Cleric Wisdom II


Level 10 (Cleric)
Enhancement: Cleric Life Magic III


Level 11 (Cleric)
Enhancement: Cleric Prayer of Life II
Enhancement: Cleric Prayer of Incredible Life I
Enhancement: Cleric Prayer of Incredible Life II


Level 12 (Cleric)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Turning
Enhancement: Cleric Life Magic IV


Level 13 (Cleric)
Enhancement: Cleric Prayer of Life III


Level 14 (Cleric)
Enhancement: Cleric Charisma II


Level 15 (Cleric)
Feat: (Selected) Maximize Spell
Enhancement: Human Greater Adaptability Charisma I


Level 16 (Cleric)
Enhancement: Racial Toughness II
Enhancement: Cleric Improved Spell Penetration I


Level 17 (Cleric)
Enhancement: Cleric Improved Spell Penetration II


Level 18 (Cleric)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Mental Toughness
Enhancement: Cleric Energy of the Zealot III


Level 19 (Cleric)
Enhancement: Cleric Prayer of Incredible Life III


Level 20 (Cleric)
Enhancement: Improved Diplomacy II
Enhancement: Cleric Wisdom III

Ok go for it Wax . I could also help with the purchase of some +1 tomes.

[wax_on_wax_off]

Level 20 Lawful Good Human Male
(1 Monk \ 19 Cleric)
10, 14, 10, 14, 16, 14

Concentration 2 3
Diplomacy 6 25
Heal 7 28
Hide 4 24
Move Silently 4 25
Tumble n/a n/a
Use Magic Device 3 5

Mental Toughness, Stealthy, Toughness, Empower Healing Spell, Extend Spell, Dodge, Improved Turning, Maximize Spell, Improved Mental Toughness.

Ok go for it Wax . I could also help with the purchase of some +1 tomes.

Ok, where do I start ...
Firstly, I cut out all the clutter to leave the skeleton of the build. The stuff that you choose at level 1 and when you level up that can't be easily changed.
Secondly, Enhancements can be reset every 3 days as I'm sure you know, it's hard to know what the perfect enhancement layout would be on any given build and your experience, gear and play style will all play a part.

Ok, to get into the build.

Race: Human is a very strong choice for a caster cleric, I thoroughly support it. Alternatively, if you have access to it, Half-elf will bring more to the build with paladin dilettante which will give +5 to saves which is more valuable in our context.

Class: Tying in with the +5 to saves, if you take 1 more monk level then you can have evasion which is a very strong ability. With your 12-14 base dexterity, buffs and the paladin dilettante your evasion will let you ignore a majority of harmful spells. The cost of this is 1 more cleric level but I think it is definitely worth it.

Alignment: Quite a few enemies in the game have attacks that will do damage based on your alignment. Epic Lailat in particularly will do 5d6 bonus alignment damage to a lawful/good character from unholy burst, anarchic burst and true chaos scimitars (and another +8d6 on criticals). In contrast, if you are lawful neutral you won't take the unholy burst portion of the damage. This is just one example but it is true for many spells and monsters. Additionally, one of the best items in the game, Litany of the Dead, gives +1 stacking bonus to all stats among other things but gives a penalty to good characters who wear it. The cost to being neutral is that you need UMD to equip items that are pure good aligned, a UMD of 20 is enough to succeed in this which with group buffs we can likely get you up to by level 5. Not that you need to equip those weapon types anyway being a caster.

Stats: well, firstly and most importantly, constitution is never a dump stat. We always try to put 6 build points into constitution for a divine. For a particularly survivable build like what you will have with evasion and paladin dilettante can be comfortable with just 12 constitution. Regarding other stats, even though its nice not to have that ugly -1 modifier for an 8 in a stat it doesn't have a significant impact on play, it's generally much better to keep something at minimum unless you have a reason to raise it. I'd suggest: 8 strength, 10 dexterity, 12 constitution, 12 intelligence, 18 wisdom, 14 charisma. Starting with 10 dexterity is a little bit annoying but 18 wisdom is the priority to be a good caster first, stealth comes second. 12 intelligence as a half-elf is enough to get the skills that are crucial.

Skills: Heal is not a skill that should be invested in. What it provides is more hit points regained when resting a shrine but healing is unlimited in DDO so there is no reason to ever shrine without already being at full HP. Diplomacy shouldn't be so important for you as you are not generating aggro and you will be survivable enough that should a stray mob attack you it will have a very hard time taking you down before help arrives. The simplest way to deal with aggro is to be mobile which is also important for maximising your ability to heal the group and use your offensive spells. Concentration is your most important skill. Having it will let you cast spells even while taking damage, it should be maxed at every level before any other. Hide is nice for our theme but I think it is too expensive on your build and that there are better options, I wouldn't worry about this (besides a few extra points you get on monk levels). Move Silently at maximum is very good to be nice and stealthy, we'll cast invisibility on you so they don't see you Tumble should be at 1 on every character, it allows you to commando roll which is cool. UMD is the last skill that I would suggest that you take, it will allow you to use fireshield scrolls (half damage from fire or cold), invisibility scrolls (so no need for hide) and many other awesome things. Having a 12 int as a half-elf will mean that you'll have to use the second monk level you take to catch up with your move silently skill once you've eaten a +2 tome. If you don't have a +2 int tome available then you'll have to drop charisma to 12 and put intelligence up (but it'll hurt).

Feats: Mental Toughness and Improved Mental Toughness will add 105 SP each at level 20. A level 20 cleric should manage over 2000 SPs anyway so each of those feats comprises a less than 5% bonus to SP. There are other, more effective feats. Stealthy is a nice feat, I'd support taking it early if you like and then swapping it later for something that will be useful, swapping it around level 6 would be the idea. Dodge is not enough bang for buck, hopefully you won't get hit that much. Boosting turning level is nice but it is too expensive for a whole feat. Extend is probably not worthwhile in Update 9, lots of changes are coming in to make it not worth taking as a feat. So, we have 9 feats available on an 18 cleric, 2 monk. 2 monk bonus feats are pretty simple, toughness for extra hit points and either another toughness or lightning reflexes; I'd go with lightning reflexes. 7 normal feats, maximise and empower healing are the 2 biggest ones to get early, by level 6 specifically. Quicken is important to have by level 12. Heighten, Spell Penetration, Greater Spell Penetration round it out nicely. I'd suggest: 1: maximise, 3: empower, 6: empower healing, 9: heighten, 12: quicken, 15: spell penetration, 18: greater spell penetration. I think that's about right though there are many opinions and flavours for a few of those options and the order that you take them in.

Ok, that about does it. I'd suggest to have a look at that cleric build that I linked in an earlier thread, it is quite similar to what I've described here and the conclusions are built on 3 divine characters that I've played to end game. I'm sorry if some of the response is a bit verbose I just wanted to share the incites that I was drawing on rather than just telling you what to do as learning is just as important as doing, or something corny like that.

Hope this helps
Wowo

[Stillwaters]

Im quite happy with being able to buy a +2 tome..

but selling on the AH??

I suggest that AH selling allows someone to post a item with over the top pricing and get an alt to buy it would unbalance income.. Brokers can work the same way (get an alt in to place an item in the brokers then quick switch to your party toon and nab the item for its base value... (happened before in a static group with my mates here in adelaide)

A fair mid ground would be to have a party stash - i.e. any item with much higher value than its base price (port hole for eg) may be sold in the AH with proceeds kept aside somehow for the party to use.. or even divided amongst the party.

[wax_on_wax_off]

Im quite happy with being able to buy a +2 tome..

but selling on the AH??

I suggest that AH selling allows someone to post a item with over the top pricing and get an alt to buy it would unbalance income.. Brokers can work the same way (get an alt in to place an item in the brokers then quick switch to your party toon and nab the item for its base value... (happened before in a static group with my mates here in adelaide)

A fair mid ground would be to have a party stash - i.e. any item with much higher value than its base price (port hole for eg) may be sold in the AH with proceeds kept aside somehow for the party to use.. or even divided amongst the party.

Good thinking, I totally agree, are you volunteering to be the treasurer?

[Mick.P]

Hi Wax, thank you for your expertise. I read through your post and enjoyed your thoughts. I'm glad we have people in this group that take the time to guide some of us that haven't played for long. I'll will be re planning another toon with your ideas above. Cheers mate

[wax_on_wax_off]

Hi Wax, thank you for your expertise. I read through your post and enjoyed your thoughts. I'm glad we have people in this group that take the time to guide some of us that haven't played for long. I'll will be re planning another toon with your ideas above. Cheers mate

Hey thanks, no worries.

Jason, just saw this new build on the forums which might have been closer to what you originally intended. I don't mind the build i just think in its case that going pure paladin for the capstone would be a vastly superior choice for a sword and board build (drop bastard sword and tower shield proficiency).

[Mick.P]

Hey thanks, no worries.

Jason, just saw this new build on the forums which might have been closer to what you originally intended. I don't mind the build i just think in its case that going pure paladin for the capstone would be a vastly superior choice for a sword and board build (drop bastard sword and tower shield proficiency).

I agree, it is more of a Pal/front liner build. I was attempting to go pure support with heal spells, light spells, and spell boosts. I have never played an epic char before so your in site is very handy.

I like your suggestions as it is more along the lines of what i was aiming for.

Ok makes more sense now lol

[wax_on_wax_off]

I agree, it is more of a Pal/front liner build. I was attempting to go pure support with heal spells, light spells, and spell boosts. I have never played an epic char before so your in site is very handy.

I like your suggestions as it is more along the lines of what i was aiming for.

Cheers Jason.

That was for Jason

So far we have:
Octavi: WF Wiz/rog (can I convince you to check out the fleshy wiz/monk or pure wiz option?)
Jason: pal/monk w/intimidate
Stillwaters: rogue monk with traps/diplomacy/assassinate/hide/MS/spot/open lock
Voxson: ranger/monk arcane archer w/ hide/ms/spot?
Mick: monk/cleric full casting spec
Wowo: bard w/ haggle/bluff/open lock/listen

Cool as

[Stillwaters]

WOWO - No other skill you can raise? OpenLock SUCKZ
OL i took as a flavor thing - there's only about 5 locked items in the game that cannot be done with a knock spell - for speed running my wiz/rog pops an extended detect doors and used Knock - its saves more time than you think

However without access to tons of SP pots for the 3 main spellthrowers i was thinking OL as a semi viable skill. not saying you shouldnt have it (just in case i go pop and the shrine is other side of a locked door) just it isn't a great choice if you haven't got some of the nicer ones.

I know you probably have reason(s) i just cant see it - please enlighten me.

octavi- has made warforged (sure palemaster gives most of the bonuses anyway but only mid game, but a wf wiz can switch to/from palemaster to archmage and continue to self heal : one trick ponies often get nerfed to death)

[wax_on_wax_off]

WOWO - No other skill you can raise? OpenLock SUCKZ
OL i took as a flavor thing - there's only about 5 locked items in the game that cannot be done with a knock spell - for speed running my wiz/rog pops an extended detect doors and used Knock - its saves more time than you think

However without access to tons of SP pots for the 3 main spellthrowers i was thinking OL as a semi viable skill. not saying you shouldnt have it (just in case i go pop and the shrine is other side of a locked door) just it isn't a great choice if you haven't got some of the nicer ones.

I know you probably have reason(s) i just cant see it - please enlighten me.

First level as rogue, get 4 ranks of open lock which is enough to open every lock in the game, afaik. I'm not making a big investment in it, rather, it is just something the character will be capable of doing.

octavi- has made warforged (sure palemaster gives most of the bonuses anyway but only mid game, but a wf wiz can switch to/from palemaster to archmage and continue to self heal : one trick ponies often get nerfed to death)

Not even mid game soon, as of Update 9 pale masters will be able to self heal from level 6 with zombie form. It's a pro/con argument:
HP, high as warforged, high as pale master, super high as wf pm (overkill)
Immunities, high as WF, high as PM, high as WF PM (no benefit)
Self healing, high as WF, high as PM, slightly higher than high as WF PM (can drop out of form to reconstruct)
DCs, high as WF PM, higher as human/helf/drow PM
Skill points, high as WF PM, higher as human/drow PM
Skill bonuses, penalties for charisma and wisdom for WF, human/helf/drow all get nice bonuses (human versatility, higher natural charisma)

Regarding self healing, the higher charisma and guaranteed investment into UMD means that fleshy PMs will be able to self heal in form better than WF (harm scrolls/inflict wands) and still somewhat in fleshy form (heal scrolls/cure wands). Human versatility helps with this.

Some more thoughts:
Splashed wizard loses 2 spell penetration. Elf in U9 can get a bonus 4 points to spell penetration. However, elves are squishy; pale master makes up for it nicely though.
Half-elf could let you possibly skip insightful reflexes if you have a 14 starting dexterity anyway by taking paladin dilettante.
Wizard / Rogue costs a feat and pale master is actually a bit feat starved (SP/GSP, SF/GSF: necro, SF/GSF: enchant, maximise, empower, toughness, mental toughness, insightful reflexes). Quicken can be skipped on a fleshy caster, not on a WF though. Extend is rubbish in U9 anyway so that can happily be skipped. Monk lets you take toughness with a monk bonus level (and maybe toughness again on the second level or lightning reflexes or something maybe).