charisma or constitution

[erikbozelie]

thinking of TR-ing. so i got 4 more points to spare. (pulling 2 off strength).
what would you choose?
+2 turns (+140 sp±) and +2 umd / intimidate.
or
40 hp +2 fort? my cleric got 400(10 con based).

[Malison]

I choose con.

More turns are nice, but staying alive a little longer to use them is nicer.

[cdemeritt]

CON, always choose CON... your primary stat, CON, whatever else.

[erikbozelie]

with an 45 hp gs boots, i should be able to reach 500hp.
will this suffice as an tank?

[der_kluge]

I doubt a cleric could ever really tank, since they'll never get their AC up high enough to make it worthwhile.

Having high hit points is admirable, but I would never recommend a player sacrifice clerical power over more hit points. Its just too much to sacrifice, IMHO.

Higher charisma gives you more bursts, more turns, and more Divine Vitality. At least two of which can really make a huge difference at end game. While there are items and feats that can increase the number, you may find yourself clamoring for more if you run out.

Having a ton of hit points on a cleric is also kind of unnecessary. With enough mana, you can nearly heal yourself indefinitely. So why do you need 500 hit points?

I say - why choose? +2 to con and +2 to charisma.

BTW, I noticed you put +140sp in parenthesis around the +cha option. Charisma doesn't add to a cleric's mana. You're thinking of Favored Souls. +wisdom adds to mana (and the DC of offensive spells, so don't sacrifice wisdom if you plan on killing stuff with Slay Living, for example).

[EKKM]

500 will suffice for most quests/raids given your self healing. You one issue may be Tower of Despair where Horoth's diintigrate can do 500+ points on a failed save.

Edit - How are you going to tank with starting strength fo 10-12?

[erikbozelie]

I doubt a cleric could ever really tank, since they'll never get their AC up high enough to make it worthwhile.

Having high hit points is admirable, but I would never recommend a player sacrifice clerical power over more hit points. Its just too much to sacrifice, IMHO.

Higher charisma gives you more bursts, more turns, and more Divine Vitality. At least two of which can really make a huge difference at end game. While there are items and feats that can increase the number, you may find yourself clamoring for more if you run out.

Having a ton of hit points on a cleric is also kind of unnecessary. With enough mana, you can nearly heal yourself indefinitely. So why do you need 500 hit points?

I say - why choose? +2 to con and +2 to charisma.

max ac i have reached on my current cleric is 101.
so tanking wont be an problem, getting aggro from intimidate(i know u9 ruins).

just,... will 500 hp be able to survive rolling an 1 on horoth disentigrate?

[Pape_27]

thinking of TR-ing. so i got 4 more points to spare. (pulling 2 off strength).
what would you choose?
+2 turns (+140 sp±) and +2 umd / intimidate.
or
40 hp +2 fort? my cleric got 400(10 con based).

TR'ing into a Cleric i would imagine?

Go Con.

and btw, if i am reading what you wrote correctly, Clerics do not get bonus sp based on thier charisma score. They do get additional turns based on cha, but not additional sp.


_

[Pape_27]

Having high hit points is admirable, but I would never recommend a player sacrifice clerical power over more hit points. Its just too much to sacrifice, IMHO.

Higher charisma gives you more bursts, more turns, and more Divine Vitality. At least two of which can really make a huge difference at end game. While there are items and feats that can increase the number, you may find yourself clamoring for more if you run out.

Disagree with this. Charisma is nice, but not necessary.

Con is the better option, as it is impossible to cast/use turns for whatever when you are dead due to a lack of hp.



_

[Cardtrick]

and btw, if i am reading what you wrote correctly, Clerics do not get bonus sp based on thier charisma score. They do get additional turns based on cha, but not additional sp.

Maybe he means that 2 additional radiant servant bursts will save him roughly 140SP in healing costs?

Also . . . how on earth did you get 100+ AC on a pure cleric? Or is this a clonk?

[erikbozelie]

TR'ing into a Cleric i would imagine?

Go Con.

and btw, if i am reading what you wrote correctly, Clerics do not get bonus sp based on thier charisma score. They do get additional turns based on cha, but not additional sp.


_

2 turns is basicly 2 mass heals, which is 70 sp each casting.

so how much hp will suffice to survive horoth spells?

[Maegin]

Con.

[Pape_27]

his disintegrate can do over 500 hp of damage on a failed save.

seriously, if your plan is to tank, go Con. You will need as much HP as possible.


http://ddowiki.com/page/Horoth

_

[Pape_27]

Maybe he means that 2 additional radiant servant bursts will save him roughly 140SP in healing costs?

the rs will indeed save him the sp, but from what the op wrote, it seemed to me he thought he would get bonus sp from improving his charisma. Bards, FvS and Sorcs do, not clerics.

_

[jwdaniels]

Go Con, no question. Radiant Servant bursts aren't as useful as the aura, and the aura lasts long enough that, considering regenerates, 2 more uses would probalby just result in 2 extra turn attempts when you hit the shrine.

[erikbozelie]

his disintegrate can do over 500 hp of damage on a failed save.

seriously, if your plan is to tank, go Con. You will need as much HP as possible.


http://ddowiki.com/page/Horoth

_

okay, so need over 500 hp(i know this is close, but what am i going to do against it).

158 base hp.
14 +6 enh, 2 tome, 2 shrine +2 yugo = 26 con = 160 con bonus
20 starter feat
23 tougnness
10 favor
25 enhancements
20 minos legends
45 greensteel
20 yugo
30 greater false life

-------------
508 hp +temps

i doubt i will be able to tank horoth with this toon.
anyone got any simple idea how to ramp my hp abit higher?

or should i go for charisma dropping the tank idea all together?

[diamabel]

thinking of TR-ing. so i got 4 more points to spare. (pulling 2 off strength).
what would you choose?
+2 turns (+140 sp±) and +2 umd / intimidate.
or
40 hp +2 fort? my cleric got 400(10 con based).

Out of curiosity. About what final numbers are we talking here? Is it 10 constitution vs. 14 charisma or 14 constitution vs. 10 charisma?

On the other hand if it's about boosting one of these ability scores beyond 14, then you have to consider higher point buy costs. That would mean 20 hp vs. +1 turn/+1 umd. Even with only 28 pts build you could start with 14+ points in charisma, wisdom and constitution.

It would be interesting to elaborate more on the specific build, though (e.g. battlecleric, nanny, offensive caster, etc.).

[erikbozelie]

if i lower strength by 2(dump stat idem), i get 4 points to spare in my build.
10 con, 8 charisma atm, as it stands.
to
14 con or 12 charisma.

[licho]

Very little is know about other stats, but generally go with con 14.
If you run out of turns you can still cast, use pots, use scoll, do something.
If you run out of HP your options are limited.

[EKKM]

okay, so need over 500 hp(i know this is close, but what am i going to do against it).

158 base hp.
14 +6 enh, 2 tome, 2 shrine +2 yugo = 26 con = 160 con bonus
20 starter feat
23 tougnness
10 favor
25 enhancements
20 minos legends
45 greensteel
20 yugo
30 greater false life

-------------
508 hp +temps

i doubt i will be able to tank horoth with this toon.
anyone got any simple idea how to ramp my hp abit higher?

or should i go for charisma dropping the tank idea all together?

Rage is 20 more.

Most characters really want 650 to tank Horoth, the disintegrate itself isn't the issue, it's the disintegrate right after being hit with melee attacks, DBFed and badged. If you are stunned, it's just that much worse.

Having an evasion character with an aura going will be a huge asset though, still wouldn't go less than 600.

Hard to do on your character without going Dwarf or WF. Dwarf would get you 80 more for 2 chr.