36 Point build Challenge

[Bigrtt]

With the upcoming update and changes to helpless mobs, epic mobs and such, I'm finding it hard to justify a reason in keeping my monk as he is now. I've taken him through one TR before (monk past life) and done about 5 LRs after that just messing about with Ninja Spy and eventually back to Shintao and built with epic in mind, now that's essentially changed again completely I'm done with LRing and messing about.

So now I want to do another TR, and a fairly specific one at that.

The goals in mind are

High AC (Need to achieve 80+)
A high/respectable DPS (not mind blowing, but not something to ignore either)
UMD
Intimidate
Evasion and Trap Skills
TWF (Scimitars preferred)

AC note - I see alot of AC breakdowns on builds include everything, even down to 1 minute buffs. That's great for finding out the max potential AC but lets face it, 1 minute of extra AC just isn't going to be viable when I'm running through elite Sins smashing up trash, I don't have time to pull out a wand and rebuff myself. So for the purpose of working out a viable AC, lets say it needs to be lasting for at least 5 minutes please.


I'm not great with designing builds, especially when it's something as specific as I'm aiming for. But straight away I'm thinking it's a 12/6/2 split, Ranger for Tempest II, 2 levels of rogue and the 6 I'm unsure of.

Having had some advice and tips from a guild mate, an 18 ranger 1 monk 1 rogue half elf was suggested, taking the cleric dillantae for healing scrolls. 2 Passive monk past lives is giving me +2 to damage rolls etc etc.

I know there's some very nice toon builders out there, and I honestly would try a build or 2 myself but I just frankly do not know where to start. So here I am, asking you guys to give me some tips or even design a build for me.

Thanks in advance for any advice or builds you guys come up with!

[zhanruiqi]

OK, I will take a stab at trying to help you..do keep in mind it's my first time uploading one of these hehe

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 3.8.1
DDO Character Planner Home Page

Level 20 Lawful Good Halfling Male
(2 Paladin \ 6 Monk \ 12 Rogue) 
Hit Points: 262
Spell Points: 0 
BAB: 15\15\20\25\25
Fortitude: 19
Reflex: 26
Will: 16

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
Abilities        Base Stats          Modified Stats
(36 Point)       (Level 1)             (Level 20)
Strength             12                    14
Dexterity            16                    28
Constitution         14                    16
Intelligence         16                    18
Wisdom               12                    16
Charisma             12                    15

Tomes Used
+2 Tome of Strength used at level 7
+2 Tome of Dexterity used at level 7
+2 Tome of Constitution used at level 7
+2 Tome of Intelligence used at level 7
+2 Tome of Wisdom used at level 7
+2 Tome of Charisma used at level 7

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
                 Base Skills         Modified Skills
Skills           (Level 1)            (Level 20)
Balance               7                    25
Bluff                 4                    24
Concentration         2                    15
Diplomacy             5                    20
Disable Device        7                    27
Haggle                1                     3
Heal                  1                     3
Hide                  7                    31
Intimidate            5                    25
Jump                  1                    22
Listen                1                     5
Move Silently         7                    30
Open Lock             7                    27
Perform               n/a                   n/a
Repair                3                     4
Search                7                    27
Spot                  5                    22
Swim                  1                     2
Tumble                4                    12
Use Magic Device      5                    25

Level 1 (Rogue)
Feat: (Selected) Dodge
Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Monk
Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Monk


Level 2 (Monk)
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Two Weapon Fighting


Level 3 (Monk)
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Toughness
Feat: (Selected) Weapon Finesse


Level 4 (Monk)
Feat: (Monk Path) Path of Inevitable Dominion: Fists of Darkness


Level 5 (Monk)


Level 6 (Monk)
Feat: (Selected) Two Weapon Defense


Level 7 (Rogue)


Level 8 (Paladin)


Level 9 (Paladin)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Two Weapon Fighting


Level 10 (Rogue)


Level 11 (Rogue)


Level 12 (Rogue)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Piercing Weapons


Level 13 (Rogue)


Level 14 (Monk)
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Mobility


Level 15 (Rogue)
Feat: (Selected) Greater Two Weapon Fighting


Level 16 (Rogue)


Level 17 (Rogue)


Level 18 (Rogue)
Feat: (Selected) Combat Expertise
Feat: (Rogue Bonus) Opportunist


Level 19 (Rogue)


Level 20 (Rogue)
Enhancement: Rogue Damage Boost I
Enhancement: Rogue Damage Boost II
Enhancement: Rogue Skill Boost I
Enhancement: Rogue Skill Boost II
Enhancement: Halfling Dexterity I
Enhancement: Halfling Dexterity II
Enhancement: Halfling Cunning I
Enhancement: Halfling Guile I
Enhancement: Rogue Item Defense I
Enhancement: Rogue Subtle Backstabbing I
Enhancement: Way of the Clever Monkey I
Enhancement: Porous Soul
Enhancement: Monk Improved Recovery I
Enhancement: Monk Ninja Spy I
Enhancement: Adept of Wind
Enhancement: Paladin Extra Smite Evil I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Rogue Assassin I
Enhancement: Rogue Assassin II
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Accuracy I
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Accuracy II
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Accuracy III
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training I
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training II
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training III
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training IV
Enhancement: Improved Hide I
Enhancement: Improved Hide II
Enhancement: Improved Jump I
Enhancement: Improved Jump II
Enhancement: Improved Move Silently I
Enhancement: Improved Move Silently II
Enhancement: Improved Tumble I
Enhancement: Improved Tumble II
Enhancement: Paladin Charisma I
Enhancement: Rogue Dexterity I
Enhancement: Rogue Dexterity II
Enhancement: Rogue Dexterity III
Enhancement: Monk Wisdom I
Enhancement: Monk Wisdom II
Enhancement: Paladin Toughness I

UMD = 25 base
intimidate 25 + 15 = 40, and more if you add +6 item

Superb skills for traps and high int for assassination
+ nice sneak attack dmg with shortswords as ki weapons and better crit than kama.

2 levels of paladin for elite lvl saves: with +5 resistance and +6 cha item = 33, 40 and 30
add +4 if you have a paladin in your party for a ridiculous 37, 44 and 34...

high AC potential:
10 base
12 dex bonus (with +6 item)
1 size
8 armor bracers
6 wis bonus (from monk lvls)
5 protection item
4 insight bonus
4 barkskin potion
1 dodge feat
4 icy raiments dodge
1 two-weapon defence
1 haste
4 pally aura
4 bard buff
4 shield spell buff
2 recitation luck bonus
1 (dex) from wind stance
6 uncanny dodge
5 combat expertise
=83 AC

I think that should satisfy your request?

Dmg: should be pretty high with good weapons, like a green steel + the crystal cove 20 short sword...

HP: should be OK as well with minos legen and +6 con item

Other ppl, feel free to comment and help me out if I did any mistakes here

[voxson5]

high AC potential:
10 base
12 dex bonus (with +6 item)
1 size
8 armor bracers
6 wis bonus (from monk lvls)
5 protection item
4 insight bonus
4 barkskin potion
1 dodge feat
4 icy raiments dodge
1 two-weapon defence
1 haste
4 pally aura
4 bard buff
4 shield spell buff
2 recitation luck bonus
1 (dex) from wind stance
6 uncanny dodge
5 combat expertise
=83 AC

could umd a lv 10 shield wand

bard AC song & icy rainments Dodge bonus dont stack
uncannydodge is an unrealistic way to boost your AC, you dont have enough uses & it doesnt last long enough


You could go +2 dodge from the lv 20 mabar cloak +1 from full pally aura & extra +1 from a real ranger

[Bigrtt]

Thanks for posting that, unfortunately it's far from what I want. At a glance I notice a few things about it that I don't want, the HP is far too low for a start, AC is good but I'm ideally wanting more than that. What you've posted seems (at least to me) to be built around sneak damage and versatility more than a AC/Intimi/Hate tanking type build I'm after, and as said with the AC breakdown I don't want -1 Minute buffs included in it...I won't have time to get out a shield wand and hitmyself with it when I have 10 devils on my back.

[CrosisBlackwing]

Are you particulary Atached to Ranger levels? I made a build for this that is Primarily Fighter- 12/7/1 Ftr, Rogue, Mnk that should fit the criteria.
Secondly, what kind of equipment are you talking about? Can I use +3 Tomes? What about Yugoloth Potions or Epic Items?

[Blank_Zero]

Take a look at the HElves Angel build. Modify it to be Elf rather than HElf and you're golden.

[bahubun]

Try http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=198820

Seems to fit your criteria for ac, dps, trap, umd, intimidate, evasion and twf.

[wax_on_wax_off]

18 paladin (Defender of Siberys) / 2 monk all the way. Just add gear. The hate enhancements and moves that a paladin can do are optimal for putting that AC to use and you have general all round survivability to boot (not just AC but saves, self healing, HP as well). On this post a poster shows having 107 AC which I'm sure represents over 80 that is very sustainable.

The setup is reasonably simple, race is flexible, stats are flexible, feats are flexible. Mostly it just depends on current gear and current goals.

Suggestions:
Human, Drow or Half-elf. Healing amp is useful for a tanking build but so is the useful distribution of a drows stats. Rogue dilettante would be a good choice to avoid taking rogue levels and would improve DPS when not tanking. The extra feat from human is always going to be useful.

Halfling has a penalty to intimidate but is otherwise a good choice. Half-orc, Dwarf and WF all have penalties to Charisma so are bad choices (Divine Might is very strong on this TWF build).

Stats are as mad as they can be, strength for damage, dexterity and wisdom for AC, constitution for HP, intelligence for skills and combat expertise and charisma for divine might. This is a build that benefits greatly from 36 point builds (you have), +3/+4 tomes (not sure if you have) and something like completionist (you don't have). I would suggest to be mostly dexterity based until all gear is acquired and then either TR again (for paladin PL feats) or LR to be strength based. Getting the gear will take a long time and between now and then it's more fun to be able to tank and it's easier on the leveling, imo.

36 point build, 6 in all except intelligence (low as can be to qualify for Combat Expertise), extra in dexterity (for AC and to qualify for GTWF). Expect to put a level up or two into charisma to qualify for DMIII unless you want to wait until a +4 tome turns up.

Feats:
7 base, 2 monk, maybe 1 human: TWF, ITWF, GTWF, PA, IC:S, Combat Expertise, Extend, toughness, exotic weapon proficiency: khopesh maybe (dodge, two weapon defence are other options). With rage and other temporary strength buffs it shouldn't be necessary to take weapon finesse.

Skills: intimidate, UMD, some balance, done.

Anything else? Oh, gear. That.
Important ones:
Icy Raiments (subterrane)
Epic Bracers that give a high armour bonus (Jidz Tet'ka, Scorched Bracers etc).
Chattering Ring (Titan Raid)
Mabar Cloak
Nimble Trinket (not sure where else to get +1 dodge AC)

Lots of epic gear that give +7 to stats ... fun!

Good luck

[voxson5]

36 points hmmm?... ok

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 3.7.2
DDO Character Planner Home Page

Mr Bigshot 
Level 20 Lawful Good Warforged Male
(7 Monk \ 1 Rogue \ 12 Ranger) 
Hit Points: 374
Spell Points: 199 
BAB: 17\17\22\27\27
Fortitude: 18
Reflex: 20
Will: 13

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
Abilities        Base Stats          Modified Stats
(36 Point)       (Level 1)             (Level 20)
Strength             15                    23
Dexterity            15                    21
Constitution         15                    20
Intelligence         13                    15
Wisdom               14                    19
Charisma              6                     8

Tomes Used
+1 Tome of Strength used at level 4
+1 Tome of Dexterity used at level 4
+1 Tome of Constitution used at level 4
+1 Tome of Intelligence used at level 4
+1 Tome of Wisdom used at level 4
+1 Tome of Charisma used at level 4
+2 Tome of Strength used at level 7
+2 Tome of Dexterity used at level 7
+2 Tome of Constitution used at level 7
+2 Tome of Intelligence used at level 7
+2 Tome of Wisdom used at level 7
+2 Tome of Charisma used at level 7
+3 Tome of Strength used at level 13
+3 Tome of Constitution used at level 13
+3 Tome of Dexterity used at level 20
+3 Tome of Wisdom used at level 20

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
                 Base Skills         Modified Skills
Skills           (Level 1)            (Level 20)
Balance               2                     7
Bluff                -2                    -1
Concentration         2                     5
Diplomacy            -2                    -1
Disable Device        n/a                   n/a
Haggle               -2                     0
Heal                  2                     4
Hide                  2                     5
Intimidate           -2                    -1
Jump                  2                     6
Listen                2                     4
Move Silently         2                     5
Open Lock             n/a                   n/a
Perform              n/a                   n/a
Repair                1                     2
Search                1                     3
Spot                  2                     4
Swim                  2                     6
Tumble                n/a                   n/a
Use Magic Device     n/a                   n/a

Level 1 (Rogue)
Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Monk
Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Monk
Feat: (Selected) Toughness


Level 2 (Monk)
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Combat Expertise


Level 3 (Monk)
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Dodge
Feat: (Selected) Toughness


Level 4 (Monk)
Feat: (Monk Path) Path of Harmonious Balance: Fists of Light


Level 5 (Monk)


Level 6 (Monk)
Feat: (Selected) Mobility


Level 7 (Monk)
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Toughness


Level 8 (Monk)


Level 9 (Ranger)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Evil Outsider
Feat: (Selected) Power Attack


Level 10 (Ranger)


Level 11 (Ranger)


Level 12 (Ranger)
Feat: (Selected) Spring Attack


Level 13 (Ranger)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Construct


Level 14 (Ranger)


Level 15 (Ranger)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Slashing Weapons


Level 16 (Ranger)


Level 17 (Ranger)


Level 18 (Ranger)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Aberration
Feat: (Selected) Two Weapon Defense


Level 19 (Ranger)


Level 20 (Ranger)
Enhancement: Rogue Haste Boost I
Enhancement: Ranger Skill Boost I
Enhancement: Ranger Item Defense I
Enhancement: Ranger Item Defense II
Enhancement: Way of the Clever Monkey I
Enhancement: Monk Improved Recovery I
Enhancement: Monk Improved Recovery II
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness II
Enhancement: Racial Toughness III
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Attack I
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Attack II
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Damage I
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Damage II
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Damage III
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Defense I
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Defense II
Enhancement: Ranger Tempest I
Enhancement: Ranger Tempest II
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training I
Enhancement: Improved Balance I
Enhancement: Improved Balance II
Enhancement: Improved Disable Device I
Enhancement: Improved Open Lock I
Enhancement: Improved Search I
Enhancement: Ranger Dexterity I
Enhancement: Ranger Dexterity II
Enhancement: Ranger Dexterity III
Enhancement: Monk Wisdom I
Enhancement: Monk Wisdom II
Enhancement: Rogue Improved Trap Sense I
Enhancement: Warforged Constitution I
Enhancement: Warforged Constitution II
Enhancement: Warforged Healer's Friend I
Enhancement: Warforged Healer's Friend II
Enhancement: Warforged Power Attack I
Enhancement: Warforged Power Attack II

Alignment in planner is irrelivant

Have not done skills in planner, but easily enough points for max balance, umd, search & disable + jump to 10 (14 int & ranger levels gives 8 skill points, you need 6 per level. Monk with 14 int gives 6)

stats in planner + 6 items + 3 execptional str/dex/wis/con +2 yugo pots

+3 tomes used on 4 stats (makes str uneven with profane, so not needed)

** assumed you'll have these as a 3x tr **
** does not include guildship buffs in stat breakdown**

STR 34 (+2 rams, +2 rage, +3 profane = 41).... +madstone +titan gloves + cookies + blah blah
DEX 32
CON 31 (+2 rage, +3 profane = 36)
INT 21 ( +6 item only counted here)
WIS 30
CHA 14 (again, only +6 item)

HP - 669 with rage & yugo pot (689 with guildship +2 con)

AC: 95!

10 Base
9 DT docent
3 chattering ring
2 chaosguard
1 dodge feat
1 Two Weapon Defense
5 Combat Expertise
3 Tempest II
11 Dex mod
10 Wis mod
4 Insight GS weapon
3 Monk AC bonus
1 Alchemical Armor Ritual
1 Nimble Trinket from Crystal Cove
---------------------
64 Beholder AC
---------------------
5 Barkskin (self cast)
3 Shield of Faith Pot
1 Shield lv 10 Wand (umd)
1 Haste (gs clickie, pot)
---------------------
73 Self Buffed AC
---------------------
4 Bard
2 Actual Cleric/FvS/Human DM (Shield of Faith +5)
5 Paladin Aura
2 Recitation (cleric/FvS)
----------------------
87 Party buffed
----------------------
1 Guildship Dex +2
1 Guildship Wis +2
1 Guildship Deneith Defender
1 Guildship Kundarak Warder
1 Guidship Profane (Kobold)
----------------------
92 Realistic Quest AC
----------------------
3 Halfling Hero's Compainion
----------------------
95 Unrealistic to have always on AC


** note, this value does not include AC bonus vs favored enemy**
** note, this assumes not wearing protection/natural armor items if lieu of better equipment **


Saves:
Fort: 18 -> 38
Reflex: 20 -> 36
Will: 13 -> 31

(base + Greater Hero from gird/Amrath + recitation + Alchemical + Protection item)
** does not include guildship buffs **

easy to boost saves, pally aura, holy aura spell, insight bonus, guildship (potentially +13 & higher to existing values)


Skills:
UMD : 23 ranks +4 GH +2 luck +6 GS item +3 cartouche/spyglass + 2 CHA mod = 40
Disable: 23 ranks +4 GH +2 luck + 3 cartouche/spyglass +5 INT mod +15 item = 52 (+7 tools +enhancements etc etc)
Search: 23 ranks +4 GH +2 luck +3 cartouche/spyglass +5 INT mod +15 item = 52 (+enhancements)
Balance: 23 ranks +4 GH +2 luck +11 DEX mod +15 item = 55
Jump: with no ranks & only STR mod it is greater than 10, but you have spare points

** +3 to skills for using cartouche + tier 3 spyglass, + more for guildship buffs **

Pros:
Evasion
Good HP
High AC
Awesome saves with potential for more
WF power attack
WF immunities
Full TWF chain
100% offhand procurement
High Self buffed AC
Full trapskills
Hate tanking!! enhancements and tier 2 & 3 of DT docent (10%+15%+20%) no need for intimidate
- but you can hit rank 16 with 14 base INT in addition to trapskills & UMD
85% divine healer friendly with just enhancements
Self healing
- healing curse (if you have ki, unlikely using scimitars),
- healing ki (again unlikely, & only 3d4..oooo)
- Ranger Divine spells
- umd Heal scrolls/whatever you like
- wholeness of body

Cons:
Ummm......BAB 17 with non monk weapons


Points to note:
-In planner only racial toughness 3 had been taken (potential for +10 Hp)
-Also, only Healers Friend 2 had been taken (potential for 90% divine healer friendly with just enhancements)

** edited to put in things I missed: healing amp, hate tanking, alchemical armor ritual, favored enemy, Guildship buffs, skills, wrong hp allocation for yugo pot (should have been 40, not 20), missed profane AC guildship bonus, superior false life item instead of GFL (+10 Hp), nimble trinket, recitation moved to party buffs as OP wanted 5+minute buffs only, haste kept in self buffing section due to ease of use (no item swap+activation with potential concentration check fail+swap weapon back)**

[Therigar]

Edited to respond to build challenge. Edited to add new AC info from other posts in thread.

It seems to me that you have no real choice concerning character classes as monk is absolutely required for sustainable high AC and rogue is absolutely required for trap skills. The only place where there is room for any debate is on the primary combat class. Ranger seems the logical choice because it offers Tempest with its shield bonus but UMD could be used to produce the same effect. Paladin is attractive because of the aura bonus to AC but suffers from a lack of feats and skill points. Barbarian is out completely because it cannot combine with monk. Monk is arguably as good a choice as ranger and if UMD works to proc the shield effects can be better because of the centered bonus to AC -- but it does have challenges with skill points. Fighter really brings nothing special to the discussion even though Kensai and an abundance of feats makes it look good on the surface -- it also has issues with a lack of skill points.

So, the only real options are rogue/monk/ranger, rogue/monk/paladin or rogue/monk.

Racially halfling makes the best sense because it gives an extra +1 AC due to size. But, because of the other elements of the build requirement it might be better to go with half-elf if a useful dilettante can be found.

Keep in mind that hitting high AC means very large investments in DEX and WIS. This leaves little for STR and CON -- virtually nothing for INT. To get good damage output means that a non-STR boost has to be found to increase damage. This means sneak damage. That is best achieved by having high rogue levels. This works against AC by dropping shield, aura or centered bonuses as the main class loses levels.

What I suggest is that you go for a half-elf rogue 1/monk 15/paladin 3 with the rogue dilettante.

Note that this does not seem intuitive because the rogue SA won't stack with the dilettante SA. However, the 3d6 SA from the dilettante is 7 points more damage on average than you'd get with the rogue class so extra damage is extra damage.

You'll also note that there are only 19 levels indicated on the suggestion. This is to permit you some adjustment based on personal preferences. You could add another rogue level to back fill any skill that seems short. Or, you could add another paladin level to open up L1 spells and the elf/half-elf arcane archer PrE.

One thing that you will notice is that you will need to be very careful in feat selections. You're going to commit 3 feats to the TWF line giving you only 4 to play with. Monk does give you 3 more but they are relatively limited.

Another thing you'll notice is that you won't be generating Ki because of your choice to use scimitars. You can either embrace this and ignore the special attacks that monk offers or you can move back and forth between weapons based on what your role is at the moment. If intimi/hate tanking you go with the scimitars. If only intimi tanking you go with wraps. If not tanking you go with wraps.

AC breakdown is:

10 base AC
08 26 modified DEX
09 28 modified WIS
04 monk centered bonus (L15)
02 paladin aura (L3 w enhancement)
08 armored bracer
01 dodge feat (uses one of your feats)
05 combat expertise (requires minimum 13 INT)
04 insight bonus (easiest on Shroud crafted weapon)
05 deflection (does not stack with cleric shield of faith, maybe on Ring of the Buccaneer)
04 Icy Raiment (dodge bonus)
02 Mabar cloak (dodge bonus)
01 armor ritual (dodge bonus, stacks with dodge feat)
03 chattering ring (dodge bonus)
05 natural armor (birthday celebration hat, does not stack with barkskin)
01 two weapon defense (uses another of your feats)
--
72 beholder proof AC

01 +2 ship DEX buff
01 +2 ship WIS buff
01 increase DEX thru +2 exceptional DEX item
01 increase WIS thru +2 exceptional WIS item
03 full paladin aura
04 bard song
04 shield spell (UMD from wand)
01 haste
02 natural armor (stacking AC buffs from ship)
02 recitation spell (can this be UMD'd from some source?)
--
20 situational AC some of which may be beholder proof

This lets you hit 92 AC if you have the gear.

A word on stats. This assumes starting stats of 16, 14, 14, 16, 12, 8 with 3 WIS enhancements, 2 DEX enhancements, +2 tomes in all stats, 4 stat increases in DES and 1 stat increase in WIS giving a final 18, 20, 16, 22, 14, 10. It also assumes +6 stat items for DEX and WIS. +7 stat items for DEX and WIS with +3 exceptional stats would get you to 88 AC. I also did not include monk stances which can change WIS or DEX numbers.

The problem area I see is in the to hit area as you don't have enough STR to get into the miss only on 2 area. I downgraded DEX to increase STR because scimitars are not finesse weapons. That actually creates the biggest issue in trying to come up with a build.

[voxson5]

Just wanted to say i'll be modifying this a little and posting it as a build, tell me what you think

[karl_k0ch]

I'd do something along the lines of the Prodigy: http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=258272

Sustainable AC in AC mode: 82, without using CE.

Top DPS. This one is unarmed, as using weapons will decrease attack speed and off-hand str-Mod. I guess it would still work to take any other race, losing some SA damage, but gaining possible racial weapons.
How's your +3 tome situation, btw?

One could go Drow, with 16/16/14/11/15/11, taking CE as a feat. I know, Rapiers are no Scimis, but that's my frist idea.

[Therigar]

I did not include a dodge bonus from the Mabar cloak. Good point.

Another intriguing thought is to use the monk dilettante for a +5 WIS bonus to AC. That lets you drop build points from WIS and skip some enhancements. I actually am interested in that alternative because you now do not need the monk class as a splash.

That could open barbarian as the main combat class with an 18/2 split with rogue. Seems like the monk dilettante doesn't require a lawful alignment.

A build like that becomes more dependent on buffs and probably wouldn't meet the challenges set out but is still interesting if looking for a relatively high AC build as it should still come out in the high 70's or maybe low 80's if the stars are all aligned.

[voxson5]

6 build points to get 16 str on a halfling seems like a lot for only +1 to hit & damage

Could go elf with your build, +2 str & racial + to scimitars at the cost of 20hp, racial +1 to hit & +1 ac (so net, +2 to hit, +3 damage, -1AC, -20 hp)



I like the Helf idea - nice planning, but i'm thinking you'ld have to pump dex to compensate for the wis bonus ceiling

what about 2/18 rogue pally helf with monk dilentee? thats gotta be good for self buffed ac, + all the various smites & the PrE's (thinking defender of siberious stance to add to the hate/intimi tanking).

Does the monk Dilly work with shields?

** edit, wouldn't work actually, you'ld need 18 starting INT for the trapskills & UMD alone **

[Therigar]

Yeah, the problem with fighter or paladin is that your INT simply has to be too high. I think that a person could get away with not pushing DD, search and UMD to the maximum but it is still tricky enough trying to keep them close to maxed.

That is the main reason to consider a second rogue level as you get a pool of skill points late (when your stats are at the highest) to top off where really needed.

[sephiroth1084]

bard AC song & icy rainments Dodge bonus dont stack

Are you sure? Been a while since I bothered asking for an AC song on my monk, but typically spell/effect bonuses stack with item bonuses for stuff like this (Haste's +1 Dodge stacks with the Dodge feat and I believe with a +1 Dodge item). If you've checked your character sheet before and after the buff, I'd accept that, but simply looking at their both being +4 Dodge bonuses isn't going to cut it on this one.

[theboatman]

Bard AC song does stack with Dodge Bonus from gear, either Icy Raiments or the new Pirate leathers;

Identical magnitude dodge bonuses from treasure do not stack in DDO. But Bard song is not from treasure. Dodge bonuses were always supposed to stack, the very same way you can get +1 AC from haste and +1 AC from an air guard proc. It was the advent of the +3 dodge rune on Dragontouched armor that mucked things up, as it is coded identically as the chattering ring, which also will not stack with itself.

If you use that as the exception instead of the rule, you will find that dodge bonuses do indeed stack in almost all cases.

[voxson5]

Well bugger me, it does stack (just tested it)

Apologies for the assumption

[Therigar]

Updated my first post to incorporate the Mabar cloak's dodge bonus and bard song.

[CrosisBlackwing]

12 Fighter, 7 Rogue, 1 Monk ELF
Str: 16 10 build points
Dex: 18 10 build points
Con: 12 6 build points
Int: 12 4 build points
Wis: 14 6 build points
Cha: 8 0 build points

Str 16+3 Tome+2 Fighter+7 Item+1 Exceptional+2 Exceptional+2 Ship+2 Yugo+3 Defender Stance= 38
Dex 18+5 Levels+2 Tome+2 Racial+2 Rogue+6 Item+1 Exceptional+2 Exceptional+2 Ship+2 Yugo= 42
Con 12+2 Tome+6 Item+1 Exceptional+2 Ship+3 Defender Stance= 26
Int 12+2 Tome+6 Item+2 Ship= 22 (Trapping ofc)
Wis 14+3 Tome+6 Item+1 Exceptional+2Exceptional+2 Ship+2 Yugo= 30
Cha 8+2 Tome+6 Item+2 Ship= 18

Feats
Monk 1: Toughness
Fighter 1: Oversized TWF
Fighter 2: Weapon Focus: Slashing
Fighter 4: Weapon Specialization
Fighter 6: Dodge
Fighter 8: Greater Weapon Focus: Slashing
Fighter 10: Combat Expertise
Fighter 12: Greater Weapon Specialization: Slashing
Level 1: Two Weapon Figthing
Level 3: Toughness
Level 6: Two Weapon Defense
Level 9: Improved Two Weapon Fighting
Level 12: Improved Critical: Slashing
Level 15: Greater Two Weapon Fighting
Level 18: Power Attack

AC Breakdown
10 base
15 Dex
9 Wis
1 Dodge Feat
1 Two Weapon Defense
1 Nimble Trinket
2 Dodge eMabar Cloak
3 Dodge Chattering
3 Dodge Defender Stance
4 Dodge Icy Rainments
1 Dodge Alchemical Bonus (Icys)
8 Armor eScorched Bracers
5 Protection
4 Insight T3 Shroud
1 Insight Lorinthors
1 Monk AC bonus (No need to be centered)
5 Combat Expertise
1 Profane Natural (Kobold)
1 Untyped (Deneith Defender)
1 Natural Untyped (Dwarven Battlemaster)
1 Untyped Stalwart Defender I
1 Untyped Stalwart Defender II
-----------------------------
79 Beholder AC
-----
4 barkskin (Yugo)
1 Wis (Yugo)
1 Dex (Yugo)
85 Self Buffed
-----
1 Ranger Bark
1 Haste (Good Assumption I hope)
-----
87 Easy Buffs
-----
4 Bard Inspire Heroics
2 Recitation (Divines Normally Cast it)
-----
93 Raid Buffed
-----
4 Shield Wand (1 Min)
4 Uncanny Dodge (15 Secs)
3 Fighter Action Boost (20 Secs)
-----
104 OH SH!T mode (15 Seconds)

Hit Points
20 Base
120 Fighter
42 Rogue
8 Monk
44 Toughness x2
20 Racial
40 Class (Fighter)
160 Con
20 Toughness Item
40 Superior False Life
10 Argonessen Favor
45 Shroud HP Item
569 In Stance (529 Without)
40 Yugo Potion
609 HP

Gear: By all means not Perfect
Goggles: Tharnes Non-Tanking
Helm: SFL +15 Intimidate Pirate Hat
Neck: 45 HP Min 2 (+5 Protection and heavy Fort)
Trinket: Nimble Trinket +1 Atk, +1 AC
Cloak: Epic Cloak of Night (Dodge+2, Nightmare Guard, Invis Guard, Deathblock)
Belt: Lorinthors Belt (+1 Insight, +6 Con)
Ring: Chattering Ring (+3 Dodge)
Ring: +6 Dex+1 Ex Dex, Upgraded +2 Ex Dex ToD Ring
Boots: ToD/ 30% Striders/ Boots of the Innocent/ Firestorm Greaves/ Madstone
Gloves: Epic Brawling Gloves +7 Str (+6 Wisdom Slotted)
Bracers: Epic Scorched Bracers w/ +1 Ex Str OR +8 Armored Bracers
Armor: Icy Rainments w/ +1 Alchemical Dodge

Weapons:
Min 2 Scimitars: Only Used for Tanking
Main: Holy, +1 Ex Con, +2 Ex Wis
Off: Holy, +1 Ex Wis, +4 Insight
W/e else you want

Enhancements:
Armor Class Boost II
Rogue Damage Boost II
Rogue Haste Boost III
Rogue Skill Boost I
Fighter Stalwart Defender II
Fighter Scimitar Specialization
Elf Dexterity II
Elf Melee Attack II
Elf Melee Damage I
Fighter Item Defense I
Rogue Subtle backstabbing II
Racial Toughness II
Rogue Assassin I
Rogue Sneak Attack Accuracy I
Rogue Sneak Attack Training II
Improved Hide II
Improved Intimidate IV
Improved Move Silently II
Rogue Dexterity II
Fighter Str II
Fighter Toughness IV
Rogue Improved Trap Sense I
Total 80 AP

Intimidate
23 Ranks
15 Item
4 Enhancement
4 Stalwart II
4 GH
4 Cha
6 Greensteel/ Dragontouched
2 HoGF
------
62 (Wish I could get Higher More Easily) (2 bard, 2 Monk- 66)




UMD
23
6 Greensteel/ Dragontouched
4 GH
4 Cha
3 Epic Treasure Hunters Spyglass T3
----
40 UMD


Comments? Concerns?


EDIT: Changed Race to Elf. Fixed Beholder AC (Potions don't count ofc xD) Fixed Enhancments to Elven