the REAL resason for spell nerfs

[quickgrif]

Ummmm.... They made the enchantment spells I specced my wizard for less useful, and made it so the necro spells I also specced for can be used less often, leaving me the nuking that I also specced for as the only one useful all the time, and this makes me no longer a one-trick pony? Error. Does not compute.

Their are more insta death spells to the mix and made them viable in epic. So you need to use them with thought and not spam them like a mad man.

[smatt]

As for he orginal post.... No it's not THE reason but all design decisions most certianly at this point take into account suttle and not so suttle ways to push DDO store items no... Of course you CAN play the game very easily without thsoe items, but the way the game is now being designed it's very easy to blow points like crazy.

Business is business...

[leadhead]

Wait wait wait...get this, imagine a wizard class that casts spells to do the majority of its damage instead. You know like a wizard that doesnt need to take the spell masters touch and lug around a two handed martial weapon to contribute to combat. U9 might be the point where when building an arcane caster, you no longer think to yourself "Is a 14 str going to cut it or should I risk taking away from my 16 con to bump it up."

[Barazon]

No.

(Memnir was talking about how Echoes of Power would make my assessment invalid)

How does always having enough mana regen to have at least TWELVE mana make me not want to drink a mana potion? Because I can cast an unmaximized unempowered magic missile at the epic mob?

Wait wait wait...get this, imagine a wizard class that casts spells to do the majority of its damage instead. You know like a wizard that doesnt need to take the spell masters touch and lug around a two handed martial weapon to contribute to combat. U9 might be the point where when building an arcane caster, you no longer think to yourself "Is a 14 str going to cut it or should I risk taking away from my 16 con to bump it up."

Do you honestly think that having an extra +1 or +2 to hit is more important than enough hitpoints to survive? You're already 10 base attack bonus behind any pure melee class, before you account for feats, enhancements, the difference in strength, etc. Unheld monsters are a bit tough for a caster to hit; you'd be better off carrying around several divine power clickies to give you a temporary +10 to hit (by raising your BAB) than reducing your con to increase strength.

[Thalmor]

Anytime you have a game that is adding new content every few months, there are bound to be tweeks (AKA Nerfs) to try to rebalance the game, and correct implementation errors.

[Memnir]

How does always having enough mana regen to have at least TWELVE mana make me not want to drink a mana potion? Because I can cast an unmaximized unempowered magic missile at the epic mob?

Because you can now use your SLAs to at least get you to the next Shrine. They get free metamagics, too, remember. The new Echoes ability is essentially limitless spell-casting. Yeah, you may not be able to pull the big sexy spells out at will... but you will still contribute - and you will still make it to the next Shrine just fine. In fact, you'll make it there better then you did before.

And, if any of these spell changes radically impacts your ability in getting to that next Shrine without sucking down an SP pot, then I think you were the kind of player who had trouble doing so before the changes too. Being a caster is like spending on a budget - use what you have wisely and to the most impact and you'll be fine. Blow the budget on something stupid and you'll be in trouble. The changes to non-extendable WoF are not that bad. As I said - most things die before a currently extended WoF burns out anyways.


Like the esteemed Mr. Sheen has said... Plan better.

The spell overhaul was a long time coming. It was needed before the Store, and the overhaul has nothing at all to do with selling pots to anyone who didn't need/want to buy them before this.

[ckorik]

(Memnir was talking about how Echoes of Power would make my assessment invalid)

How does always having enough mana regen to have at least TWELVE mana make me not want to drink a mana potion? Because I can cast an unmaximized unempowered magic missile at the epic mob?

Based on your comment you must not play a Wizard.

Sorcs and FvS are getting PRE's - just like Archmage.

12 SP lets me cast 12 maximized - empowered - quickened - magic missiles as an archmage - or a mix of maximized, quickened, empowered, magic missiles and chain missiles, and force fireballs, and hypno's -

The spell costs for PRE spells are all low enough that 12 SP is enough for several casts at a time.

That's why he's pointing it out - because it's a total game changers for any casting class with SLA's.

[Yajerman01]

(Memnir was talking about how Echoes of Power would make my assessment invalid)

How does always having enough mana regen to have at least TWELVE mana ...

Yeah, that is what i was thinking, 12 mana that "regens" over time???? lol it truly is laughable, a token gesture really. The whole paragraph Turbine uses to describe it is really more effort than what the totality of what that mana is worth; I think though they were getting paid by per word on that definition.

I guess it might be enough to cast invisiblility and run away. [please soemone show me the mana cost on that] lol

[Yajerman01]

Based on your comment you must not play a Wizard.

Sorcs and FvS are getting PRE's - just like Archmage.

12 SP lets me cast 12 maximized - empowered - quickened - magic missiles as an archmage - or a mix of maximized, quickened, empowered, magic missiles and chain missiles, and force fireballs, and hypno's -

The spell costs for PRE spells are all low enough that 12 SP is enough for several casts at a time.

That's why he's pointing it out - because it's a total game changers for any casting class with SLA's.

I am pretty i read the notes on it and it is 12 mana regen over time, so its not liek your gonna spam it indefinitely

[Memnir]

I am pretty i read the notes on it and it is 12 mana regen over time, so its not liek your gonna spam it indefinitely

When I tested it on the preview server - it was pretty quick on the regen. Enough to say, "hey, that was fast," and keep on casting my cheap-but-effective SLAs.

[ckorik]

I am pretty i read the notes on it and it is 12 mana regen over time, so its not liek your gonna spam it indefinitely

What I read is that when you are lower than 12 mana you regen mana until you hit 12. Even if this regen is slow - there are quite a few tricks you can pull off with SLA's with 12 mana - no it's not incredible cosmic power - but it means if you have an SLA you are never without *some* kind of option.

[Yajerman01]

When I tested it on the preview server - it was pretty quick on the regen. Enough to say, "hey, that was fast," and keep on casting my cheap-but-effective SLAs.

Well if it regens fast enough to be able to do something then while its not the greatest thing since slice bread i guess at least you can do as you have suggested above.

[elujin]

I felt dirty doing it, but I finally succeeded in thinking like a marketing person, which allowed me to figure out the real reason for spells being nerfed so badly. After update 9, they want casters to have to nuke continuously to contribute to the group like they used to, run out of mana, and go shopping in the DDO store for a stack of 100 majors. 1500 turbine points, darn, I don't have that much, guess I better spend another $20 this week to buy them, then do the same again next week!

The way things are now, I'm glad that we got the change that everyone had the equivalent of a rest shrine after leaving a completed quest; I doubt that would make it in these days.

ddo is one of the most free mmo's out there not to mention well made so you pay for it cous you enjoy it but someone could unlock evrything on a f2p account .

[tin foil hat] and we all know spells are beeing changed becous of shapshifting kobold people from the crystal cove have infiltrated the turbin developers team ... the CIA mossad kgb there all in on it !! [/tin foil hat]

[Memnir]

Well if it regens fast enough to be able to do something then while its not the greatest thing since slice bread i guess at least you can do as you have suggested above.

Oh, I'm not saying it's the greatest thing ever.
But, what I am saying is that the Echoes ability is, if anything, going to take away from SP pot sales since casters will now never be totally out of options.

[Alcamez]

...But Doom is having its SP cost reduced!

Have you been on the test server and seen the reduction and quested with it or solo'd with it?

[Alcamez]

The spell overhaul was a long time coming. It was needed before the Store, and the overhaul has nothing at all to do with selling pots to anyone who didn't need/want to buy them before this.

Is this why they nerfed multiple Conc op items in previous updates?

[Cam_Neely]

I felt dirty doing it, but I finally succeeded in thinking like a marketing person, which allowed me to figure out the real reason for spells being nerfed so badly. After update 9, they want casters to have to nuke continuously to contribute to the group like they used to, run out of mana, and go shopping in the DDO store for a stack of 100 majors. 1500 turbine points, darn, I don't have that much, guess I better spend another $20 this week to buy them, then do the same again next week!

I was thinking of starting a similar post, but I have a more rosy outlook on the nerfs.

The fact is a large amount of cash has been put into the DDO economy. Heal scroll, recon scrolls and all consumables are now a drop in the bucket for a huge majority of player. No one has any reason to complain about having to use in game buyable consumables. More over a huge amount of powerful items were injected into the game.

Those things combined make the current game much easier and the 'nerf' (if you want to call it that. Feel free to tell the people rolling up Sorc) along with the hold change, is just a way to get the games difficulty back in line.

[erikst]

didnt they say that when you get your PRE, the echo mana regen will vanish?

[Alcamez]

didnt they say that when you get your PRE, the echo mana regen will vanish?

You still get the echo when below that threshold no matter what level you are. It is about 4sp every six seconds, till ya get back to 12sp

[Memnir]

didnt they say that when you get your PRE, the echo mana regen will vanish?

Nope. Quite the opposite, in fact.

SPELL POINT REGEN – Echoes of Power:

We’ll be introducing a limited form of spell point regen for players who have “magical training” (as in the feat). This is to avoid a true “out of gas” situation for our casters. The concept is that when a caster drops below a certain spell point threshold a spell point regen effect known as “echoes of power” applies itself until the caster reaches that threshold again. The goal is to allow low level players continue to cast level 1 spells at a diminished rate when their “out of gas” while high level players will be able to continue to use their PRE-s with the meta magics they normally require for high level play.

It is supposed to benefit those with PrEs as much (if not interpretively more) then those without.