Haste, Rage, Displacement, etc. should all be doubled duration

[steelblueskies]

crying for haste? have you been using haste pots? if not then please go hug a vorpalling mob without deathblock/ward on.

same for rage.

shade can safely be ignored on this one. (points to his post about 3 shotting epic von1 mobs on lam) star of the show, mr please link your tod boots/club of the holy flame/dna to join my anything, isn't too bad, but no real loss. right up there with kline, and frankly i've seen more success in raids with kline. he didn't even charge us for healing dq or tanking the reaver.
certainly didn't ask us to gimp ourselves to make him feel better.

as to extend itself. been running with it off on lam so far, with no significant impact. probably wind up being the feat slot to put completionist into eventually.
on top of the ones used for bard and wiz past lives once spell pen, and greater spell pen can be done away with by past lives.

and given enlarge is now trash as well, just have to wait until lamannia is up again and have another eyeball on otto's sphere of dancing. just about the only thing that'd make me debate extend at all at this point, and just for efens and echrono at that.

which is not to say it doesn't have places it *could* still be useful. if a paladin weren't a bit feat starved it would be great there too.(wonders if extend might affect barbarian rages, makes mental note to look it up)
but for most other situations, seriously, when are you taking a level 20 group more then 20 minutes before hitting a shrine, finishing the quest, or wiping already? shroud when some people aren't shrining between part 1 and 2?

frankly it seems like people want someone else to wipe their hind ends for them if they aren't doing their part and ARE expecting others to do it for them religiously.

[azrael4h]

This isn't being closed-minded. This is trying to run something and being able to count on the people you're picking to perform a role that you cannot. I'm sure there are some exceptional casters and healers that don't carry Extend. More power to you if you can pull it off. In my experience, however, there are a lot of casters raiding who can barely manage their SP when they have it, and everyone and their brother deciding they might drop it is creating a bad example for those who aren't ready to run without it.

To shorten it, if I'm on a DPS toon and I take casters or healers for a raid, I expect them to do what I would do, as the leader. While keeping a 12-man group perma-Displaced in Vision is a tall order and not something I'd expect, I will at least keep them perma-Hasted and Raged on a caster or bard, or keep Prayer and Recitation up on my divines and I'll expect people I bring along to do the same as the leader.

If you are so weak as to need an extended everything or else fail, then perhaps the casters and divines not having extend isn't the issue. If you're in such need of extended buffs that you cannot perform your role, then why take YOU in the raid at all? None of my characters need haste, rage, and displacement 24/7 to function, and in fact work out just well without in guild runs, because we don't have a good arcane 90% of the time. More often than not, I'm playing the main offensive caster as well as healer and doing a bit of CC on my Cleric.

They also work out well just using pots when necessary, if I feel I need them. I usually forget my haste pots most of the time, just downing a Heroism and Rage since they actually have a duration other than instant.

BTW, I have yet to run a raid, where Prayer or Recitation was even cast. Very rare that I see more than Blur, Haste and Rage are the only two I see consistently, and that's probably because they're AoE and so darn useful. I've completed raids where the arcanes dropped early, and we finished without Haste or Rage being cast every 5 seconds.

If I see a LFM for a raid saying "have extend", I'll pass. I prefer completions. It'll be added to "Need Healer" and "Link weapons/pots" LFMS as obvious fail groups.

[shagath]

It'll be added to "Need Healer" and "Link weapons/pots" LFMS as obvious fail groups.

As a divine now, I tend to avoid groups looking for a healer. That's fun stuff. When I was pm/sorc, I didn't care.

[mournbladereigns]

The new BYOH = bring your own hastes?

Only GImps can't self-buff and self-heal.

[NaturalHazard]

are people going to be that desperate that raids wont go ahead without a bard or someone who can cast extend buffs?

[Maegin]

No, it's just babies throwing tantrums about not having their extended buffs. There are plenty of lfm's going around to avoid these players. They make pots for a reason.

Extend was wanted for longer firewalls, webs, cloudkill, I.e. offensive spells. Being that it also affected haste and buffs, that was a side benefit.

For all the nay sayers, Technically haflings have hero's companion buff, which adds hella damage, and I don't see everyone taking it, when it would help everyone... So man the **** up and make shroud items and respect others build choices as much as you force yours on us.

[taurean430]

No, it's just babies throwing tantrums about not having their extended buffs. There are plenty of lfm's going around to avoid these players. They make pots for a reason.

Extend was wanted for longer firewalls, webs, cloudkill, I.e. offensive spells. Being that it also affected haste and buffs, that was a side benefit.

For all the nay sayers, Technically haflings have hero's companion buff, which adds hella damage, and I don't see everyone taking it, when it would help everyone... So man the **** up and make shroud items and respect others build choices as much as you force yours on us.

Yes.

Quoted for truth, along with this one here:

This thread is hilarious.

You want more displacements and hastes?

make more shroud clickies, you whiny *****.

My melee and divines have ways to provide themselves with haste. It's far past the time of treating blue bars like personal babysitters. It's also time to take notice that the devs are showing signs that they are listening to the constant stream of complaints from blue bars being relegated to hireling status in quests and raids. The dps potiental for arcane builds just went up quite a bit. Why not embrace that fact as opposed to threatening? Because the way things look at present, a few arcane will make a group of melee look very inefficient.

[Saravis]

Well here's a crazy idea, they could actually make a spell or two actually beneficial to arcanes and not just in the harder to kill aspect of things, but in the improve killing aspect of things. (crazy!) I can think of a few ideas to make haste a nice benefit to casters, shorter cast time, shorter cool down, less movement slow down on casting, I'm sure there's a ton of ideas. You give something to an arcane spell that will benefit them more than a petty 40% run speed (and yes thats petty, considering its only 10% more than my striding) they might actually be encouraged to take extend.

[Sarisa]

My wiz/rogue I made for buffs, support, and CC. If CC is still remotely viable in u9, I will still continue to carry Extend for the buffing aspects. If not, it's retirement. I don't want to be pigeonholed into a DPS role I didn't want when I built the character. I refuse to go pale master.

In addition, I'm a halfling and did take Hero's Companion, though I almost never see anyone comment when I use it on them.

[Aashrym]

My wiz/rogue I made for buffs, support, and CC. If CC is still remotely viable in u9, I will still continue to carry Extend for the buffing aspects. If not, it's retirement. I don't want to be pigeonholed into a DPS role I didn't want when I built the character. I refuse to go pale master.

If you are using the archmage hypno SLA you will find it has changed a lot. It's more of a set up ability to get better front loaded DC's on another spell/SLA.

[grodon9999]

My melee and divines have ways to provide themselves with haste. It's far past the time of treating blue bars like personal babysitters. It's also time to take notice that the devs are showing signs that they are listening to the constant stream of complaints from blue bars being relegated to hireling status in quests and raids. The dps potiental for arcane builds just went up quite a bit. Why not embrace that fact as opposed to threatening? Because the way things look at present, a few arcane will make a group of melee look very inefficient.

There's still certain things that's expected of certain classes in certain quests/raids. The arcanes are expected, and rightfully so, to haste the party. If you don't mind doing this twice as often more then it's fine.

All in all this was a really stupid change on Turbine's part.

[Asketes]

We have to remember, a lof of this generation consists of players who literally think they need ship buffs to complete quests and be good players.

[Thrudh]

Wait, you don't all have at least 2 Shroud haste clickables and 2 displacement clickables on every melee character?

[Claransa]

There's still certain things that's expected of certain classes in certain quests/raids. The arcanes are expected, and rightfully so, to haste the party. If you don't mind doing this twice as often more then it's fine.

All in all this was a really stupid change on Turbine's part.

In update 9 you will have to change your expectations, this nerf will not fall upon the blue bars alone you will all suffer and you can blame turbinei, cause I ain't taking the heat for it. It's ridiculous to think that us blue bars just have suck it up for the rest you.

[Thrudh]

It'll be added to "Need Healer" and "Link weapons/pots" LFMS as obvious fail groups.

This... "Need extend" in an LFM will be as pathetic as "Need Healer"

[Farayon]

My FvS and my Sorc will drop extend. My SS bard will likely drop it too.

If someone's raid success is dependent on 1 person's 1 feat choice then I wouldn't want to be in that raid anyway.

[maddmatt70]

This... "Need extend" in an LFM will be as pathetic as "Need Healer"

Questions for you. What do you think of casters that do not cast haste on the party at the end game? Second question do you think honestly that everybody will be able to keep 2:00 min haste on the party at the end game throughout a quest not to mention displacement or the shorter rages? Will some casters develop a bad reputation because they fail to cast haste or adquately keep the party hasted? Will people want casters that do not cast haste in their group when they apply to join an lfm. Some things to think about.

I can drink haste pots every 30 seconds like the next melee, but after awhile the dps loss for drinking haste every 30 seconds and just the irritation for having to do it all the time starts sucking tell me you do not agree with me. I do have haste clickies on 4 of my characters (shroud or epic time sensing goggles) that can not cast haste, but if I am madstoned or raged can not use them and I also have characters that do not have them. Haste clickies are actually quite expensive so I would put it past the average player to have them.

[Claransa]

Questions for you. What do you think of casters that do not cast haste on the party at the end game? Second question do you think honestly that everybody will be able to keep 2:00 min haste on the party at the end game throughout a quest not to mention displacement or the shorter rages? Will some casters develop a bad reputation because they fail to cast haste or adquately keep the party hasted? Will people want casters that do not cast haste in their group when they apply to join an lfm. Some things to think about.

I can drink haste pots every 30 seconds like the next melee, but after awhile the dps loss for drinking haste every 30 seconds and just the irritation for having to do it all the time starts sucking tell me you do not agree with me. I do have haste clickies on 4 of my characters (shroud or epic time sensing goggles) that can not cast haste, but if I am madstoned or raged can not use them and I also have characters that do not have them. Haste clickies are actually quite expensive so I would put it past the average player to have them.

Question for you, what makes you think I'm gonna waste my mana casting 2 minute haste at all?

I know I have other spells that level, I'll need to look at them again.

[grodon9999]

In update 9 you will have to change your expectations, this nerf will not fall upon the blue bars alone you will all suffer and you can blame turbinei, cause I ain't taking the heat for it. It's ridiculous to think that us blue bars just have suck it up for the rest you.

If you don't haste the party I hope you like soloing.

[Claransa]

If you don't haste the party I hope you like soloing.

Indeed I do