Haste, Rage, Displacement, etc. should all be doubled duration

[Asketes]

why is it so hard to just rethrow haste?


it isn't hard, click a button.. done

[KillEveryone]

My warchanter will keep it. Haven't decided about my spellsinger.

Not going to have it on my wiz. Just isn't worth it.

There are very few spells that need extended, everything else lasts long enough between shrines.

[Aaxeyu]

You are greatly over estimating the changes.

No, he isn't.

[shagath]

it isn't hard, click a button.. done

Don't give them any ideas of using mouse clicks to do spells.

[Asketes]

Don't give them any ideas of using mouse clicks to do spells.

is that what their problem is Shag?

lawl

[Cyr]

That may be true for a sorc... My wizard will (probably) still have it... It's certainly not useless... People will be happy when I join a group and they discover I have Extend.

I'm pretty sure most will not care as long as you keep them buffed. Whichever way works for you is best, but extend certainly will not be stocked nearly as much by divines and sorcs after this change.

[shagath]

is that what their problem is Shag?

lawl

Haha, probably.

[Asketes]

Haha, probably.

ahhh.. that answers a lot of questions mate.

[grodon9999]

I think people will get tired of having to refresh buffs as often and take the feat back. I'm keeping on my cleric for divine power/favor.

[Darkrok]

I think people will get tired of having to refresh buffs as often and take the feat back. I'm keeping on my cleric for divine power/favor.

ROFL...as I mentioned earlier in my thread I recently respec'd my pure Warforged Spellsinger to Warchanter. I left Extend out so I could fit in Toughness, PA, THF line, iCrit and WF: Slash. I went to the Vale to give the toon a whirl. Logged out. Came back the next day and dropped iCrit for Extend until I get an eSoS. Would I do more dps if I crafted a lightning II or something? Sure. But my enjoyment is worth more than the extra dps at the margins. If/when I get an eSoS or have extra mats lying around to make a lightning II then I'll begrudgingly give up Extend. But darnit...I like it! And it lets me madstone rage for a bit without having people screaming "HJASTE ME!!!!!!!11!!"

[Shade]

why is it so hard to just rethrow haste?


it isn't hard, click a button.. done

The clicking isn't the problem. (well its part of it, the best players rarely click things manually, they use hotkeys - especially for very frequently accessed spells)

It's the awareness of the fact that 2 minutes have past and it's time to throw a new one thats beyond there capability. They have fun playing the game and tossing there spells and very quickly lose track of exactly what buffs need to be recast.

Most casters will happily toss the haste/rage at the start of the quest.. Then 20 minutes later (without ever recasting) they are thinking, wow im a great caster. They have no idea they forget to cast it again, or even were expected to make some attempt to maintain it.

They never tossed a second haste because they forget.

Most of them will forget.

Most of them, when you remind them to cast a new one, will cast a new one - on themself only. Probably missing most of the group, if not all of them. They seem to think, that by requesting haste, that I mean for them to buff themself..

Or much less: even be alive/in range/have sp/not DC'd to do it... Also very hard things for some players.

Call me elitist for having some basic rational on the average ability of most players? fine.

But imo:
Elitist:
Believing every other player should be as smart as yourself and able to very accurately remember to re-cast the buffs every 2 minutes.

There are very few players on Khyber who can keep me hasted continously without request with 4 minute haste. 2 minute haste? forget it. Not happening.

What we talk about and think as "easy" is not that easy for many.

[Asketes]

ahh see I move slow without haste, so I keep tabs on where my own buffs are.. and i just need to jump in the battle to get all the ones that matter hasted and raged....

then click on names (or F-keys) to give em the individual stuffs.

[Shade]

ahh see I move slow without haste, so I keep tabs on where my own buffs are.. and i just need to jump in the battle to get all the ones that matter hasted and raged....

then click on names (or F-keys) to give em the individual stuffs.

Rarely are all players exactly grouped up every 2 minutes. Some quests because they require spliting up, others because they are zerging, others because there are simply too many targets to be all focused on one.

So multiple individual hastes are often needed. Thats not easy on the SP pool, and not something many players will do automatically.

There are plenty of smart tricks to always get all players I try to remind people of such as :
Haste on chests (everyone wants the loot)
Haste on doorways (everyone waits for the opening animation)
etc.
These basic concepts are beyond the skill level of most players.

[voodoogroves]

The clicking isn't the problem. (well its part of it, the best players rarely click things manually, they use hotkeys - especially for very frequently accessed spells)

It's the awareness of the fact that 2 minutes have past and it's time to throw a new one thats beyond there capability. They have fun playing the game and tossing there spells and very quickly lose track of exactly what buffs need to be recast.

Most casters will happily toss the haste/rage at the start of the quest.. Then 20 minutes later (without ever recasting) they are thinking, wow im a great caster. They have no idea they forget to cast it again, or even were expected to make some attempt to maintain it.

They never tossed a second haste because they forget.

Most of them will forget.

Most of them, when you remind them to cast a new one, will cast a new one - on themself only. Probably missing most of the group, if not all of them. They seem to think, that by requesting haste, that I mean for them to buff themself..

Or much less: even be alive/in range/have sp/not DC'd to do it... Also very hard things for some players.

Call me elitist for having some basic rational on the average ability of most players? fine.

But imo:
Elitist:
Believing every other player should be as smart as yourself and able to very accurately remember to re-cast the buffs every 2 minutes.

There are very few players on Khyber who can keep me hasted continously without request with 4 minute haste. 2 minute haste? forget it. Not happening.

What we talk about and think as "easy" is not that easy for many.

Devil's Advocate - when you play your wizard do you keep the Barbarians hasted? Or do you zerg ahead and just do everything and leave them behind?

;-)

[Asketes]

There are plenty of smart tricks to always get all players I try to remind people of such as :
Haste on chests (everyone wants the loot)
Haste on doorways (everyone waits for the opening animation)
etc.
These basic concepts are beyond the skill level of most players.

we think very similarly in certain areas

sad peoples don't get it eh?

[Shade]

Devil's Advocate - when you play your wizard do you keep the Barbarians hasted? Or do you zerg ahead and just do everything and leave them behind?

;-)

well while leveling.. My wizard had barb lvls and sprint boost, so yea heh.

But hey if they could keep up, I certainly hasted them.

anyone who could maintain a reasonable level of dps/killcount gets there own individual hastes from me. I don't target myself, I target them, and then make sure im close enough to them to get it.

I also cast haste at 4:24 duration and have no plans to drop extend.

Even at 4:24 tho, I'll admit to occoasonally missing a few players in a raid group. Or forgetting to displace someone while im busy performing other tasks. Critical timing awareness while in the midst of a fast paced battle is not as easy as many as you try to make out.

[voodoogroves]

well while leveling.. My wizard had barb lvls and sprint boost, so yea heh.

But hey if they could keep up, I certainly hasted them.

I call BS. I bet you do this in easy epics too and not just while leveling ;-)

anyone who could maintain a reasonably levle of dps/killcount gets there own individual hastes from me. I don't target myself, I target them, and then make sure im close enough to them to get it.

I also cast haste at 4:24 duration and have no plans to drop extend.

Even at 4:24 tho, I'll admit to occoasonally missing a few players in a raid group.

The biggest advantage on a sorc of extend now is going to be memory for players who are too distracted raining down the colorless fire on the boss.

[sephiroth1084]

Rarely are all players exactly grouped up every 2 minutes. Some quests because they require spliting up, others because they are zerging, others because there are simply too many targets to be all focused on one.

So multiple individual hastes are often needed. Thats not easy on the SP pool, and not something many players will do automatically.

There are plenty of smart tricks to always get all players I try to remind people of such as :
Haste on chests (everyone wants the loot)
Haste on doorways (everyone waits for the opening animation)
etc.
These basic concepts are beyond the skill level of most players.

If everyone is fighting in the same area, run over and toss a Haste.
If everyone is scattered, call out, "Haste on <usually me, but could be another character, object or location>," and toss a Haste.

I know this will cut down on your "I got Haste and activated Sprint Boost and am now half a dungeon ahead of the party when my Haste runs out" time, but aside from that it shouldn't make a big difference. Having melees call for Haste isn't a big deal if the caster responds.

Calling for Haste several times is a pain in the ass. Calling for Haste and getting it really isn't.

[maddmatt70]

why is it so hard to just rethrow haste?


it isn't hard, click a button.. done

I find this incredibly trollish or you are one of those bards who never buffs. Those bards are just lousy. The logistical nightmares of throwing 2 min haste, 2 min displacements, 3 min rage, etc. I agree with Shade about the fact that there are so many incompetent buffers out there and now the devs just removed extend basically from many of the arcanes and divines feat list by these changes. No way will those sorc/wiz keep buffing every two minutes haha who the heck are you kidding. Bards will be casting these buffs because they will have extend that is what is going to happen. If they added mass displacement to the game so I just had 3 buffs to cast that might make up for it either that or double the duration and remove extend so I am not the only one who will be casting these buffs on raids etc.

[wiglin]

I find this incredibly trollish or you are one of those bards who never buffs. Those bards are just lousy. The logistical nightmares of throwing 2 min haste, 2 min displacements, 3 min rage, etc. I agree with Shade about the fact that there are so many incompetent buffers out there and now the devs just removed extend basically from many of the arcanes and divines feat list by these changes. No way will those sorc/wiz keep buffing every two minutes haha who the heck are you kidding. Bards will be casting these buffs because they will have extend that is what is going to happen. If they added mass displacement to the game so I just had 3 buffs to cast that might make up for it either that or double the duration and remove extend so I am not the only one who will be casting these buffs on raids etc.

I would expect all PM will keep extend for the aura along, and so will my archmage. Really wizards have the feats that extend is worth it for the buffs alone. Extend was already on the tables in my opinion for FvS, so no real loss. I think this effects sorcerers the most. I can't see ever taking it on a sorcerer. Which of course means now bards will have a heavier load for buffing if a wizard is not in the group.

I don't think bards should have to bare the load though. We have haste clickies, potions, displacement scrolls, rage potions. Sure they don't last long but if you can't cast it yourself cut your bards some slack and use a clicky. I thought the reason we TR'd was to pre-stock the TR bank with 100's of haste potions