I want to make an Intimitank but I have no idea where to start

[Failedlegend]

Hey guys with u9 looming and some as before unknown boosts to S&B fighting getting slipped in I wanted to take a look at Stalwart defender fighter (who is likely going to duo with an offensive caster cleric or maybe a WF or H-Elf Sorc w/Pally Dilly) anyways the only issue is I don't know where to start and there doesn't seem to be much discussion about it on the boards (or my search-fu just sucks)

Note: I don't really care is this isn't 100% uber-haxxorz optimized nor do I expect it be its mostly just for screwing around with a friend...on the other hand i do want to make it as good as possible within the build parameters

Anyways I have a few things I'd like to obtain with this build.

- High AC
- Decent (maybe a couple feats devoted to it) to High saves (Pally 2 Splash or H-Elf Pally Dilly?)
- Uses a Bastard Sword or D-Axes with the THF Line (preferably B-Sword)
- Must take Improved shield Bash & Shield Mastery to obtain below bonuses
- Intimidate (of course)
- UMD if possible (Thinking H-Elf 18FIghter/2Rogue w/ Pally Dilly)
- Must wield tower shield (for the U9 20% damage reduction)
- All three tiers of Stalwart defender

Would be nice

- Stunning Blow



Now my questions

- Which race I don't really see any that stands out...human maybe for the improved healing, the dragonmarks that boost intim and the denieth intim line (also no points in Int needed for UMD & Intimidate) or Half-Elf to get both UMD/Evasion from Rogue and saves from pally dilly (I have purchased every race excvept h-elf so avoid that one if you can)

- What starting stats...with all the Max Dex Bonus boots how high can you crank that dex fro AC...does light armor end up exceeding heavy armor if you have enough dex (would be nice to have High Saves+Evasion & High AC)...really it seems this build would be max Str with Con/DEx secondary while ignoring wis,int and cha (maybe a 10 starting score in Cha for no negatives to intim)

- Feats...wow lots of feats...i'm thinking most feats taken are to increase HP, AC & Saves beyond your standard melee package (PA, IC: X, THF,etc.) and the various shield feats

- Splashes...Rogue, Paladin, Something Else...Pure?


Here's the changes:

- When using a shield, intimidate will get a longer lasting and more effective threat multiplier applied.

- Improved Shield Bash now grants a 20% chance to make a secondary shield bash while attacking with a melee weapon.

- Shield Mastery's feat benefit has been changed to, "You are now skilled with the use of a shield, and your physical damage vulnerability is decreased by 10% when using a buckler or small shield, 15% when using a large shield, or 20% when using a tower shield."

-Intimidate Change: A successful use of the intimidate skill now sets a player's threat with a monster equal to the highest threat opponent, plus a small buffer based on a player's (size-modified) intimidate skill. Players also gain a +50% threat multiplier to all attacks (melee, ranged, and spells) for a short period after successful intimidation. Intimidate now has a 15 second cooldown, but players will no longer automatically lose the monster's aggro after six seconds.

- AN older one but just in case: B-Swords and D-Axes now benefit from the THF feats when weilding a sheild or nothing in your off-hand and also produce glancing blows.





Note: Dunno if its Helps at all but my other Characters are a WF Wiz15/Rogue2 (18/2), Halfling Rogue9 Mechanic (Pure 20 Rogue repeater build), A Half-Orc Bard1/Fighter1/Barb2 (Bard16/F2/Barb2)

[krisz93]

You shouldn't underestimate INT for a tank. With 13 INT you can get Combat Expertise, higher balance and distribute more skill points. This way you can get 5AC for either 4 stat points and a +1 tome or 2 points if you can get a +3 one. You could even do some traps in emergency.

[theboatman]

Two levels of rogue spash for evasion/umd works, except for one minor detail. The light armor you must be wearing to benefit from evasion doesn't play nice with the max dex increase from stalwart defender. From Stalward Defender III, you get +3MDB on tower, +2 on heavy, and+1 on light. And if you are going the glancing blow direction w/THF chain, you don't need as many build points in dex for the TWF feats, and will cap out eventually. You also lose the capstone, which is really nice for sword and boarding.

With a base Dex/Int of 12 each, you can qualify for dodge and combat expertise w/ +1 tomes, and get skill points enough for umd. Granted they will only get you to 11 base, but with enough late game (note, not end game) gear you can get enough to umd most rr items you need to/etc.

If you are speaking of self heal scrolling, Helf with cleric Dilly and enhancements will get you no fail heal scroll, but you probably wont have the concentration to use them when in combat.

Saves can be boosted with feats, and have good synergy with the stalwart stance boost to saves. I personally like Luck of Hero + Lit Reflex + Iron Will.

Human really seems to be the way to go unless you want that helf/cleric dilly.

Starting stats would be around:
16/12/16/12/8/8 for a 28 point build, all levels into Str.
With a 32 point you can dump the last four into Wis to boost your Will saves, or Cha if you plan on taking Force of Personality (good umd synergy, lets you dump wis, but requires 13 cha to get the feat, so one more tome.)
You could also pull a point from con to bump wis/cha for the 28 build, but hp's are very nice to have on a defender;

Feats will fall thusly:
B. Sword/THF/ITHF/GTHF/IC:Slash/Dodge/Combat Expertise/Power Attack/Shield Mastery/Imp. Shield Bash/Stunning Blow.
I would reserve judgement as to how useful Stunning will be on a less than max strength character when the update comes, but Imp. Shield mastery may have a place in the 11 Fighter feats.

That leaves you 7 more feats (+1 more if human.) I really recommend Weapon Focus/Specialization, for the extra damage and enhancement it unlocks. You can also take Greater Weapon Specialization for 2 more damage, without needing focus, if you have the feat room. Saving Throw feats are nice, as are Intim booster feats; More toughness is always good as well (I like at least three on a pure fighter20.) As you can see, those lots of feats get eaten up rather rapidly, so there are some choices to be made.



If you decide you do want evasion (and especially if you friend chooses to make that wf sorc) there is a nice warforged defender with two levels of rogue for evasion/umd that utilizes Mithril Body feat for synergy. Hone up your search-fu and check on the bigrockcandymountain build; It's a TWF as listed if i remember correctly, but I'm sure it can be easily converted to THF w/ B.Swords.

[sephiroth1084]

I think you've got a lot of options as far as race goes. Dwarf gets a lot of good, relevant bonuses, but their enhancements are expensive. Human gets an extra feat, which is actually useful on a defender fighter for getting all your defensive and offensive feats in, along with healing amp and more flexible stats. Half-elf lets you either get scroll usage or a semi-paladin splash to saves, as well as an additional intimidate you can toss while your main version is on cooldown.

I think those are the top 3 choices for this sort of build.

Honestly, I'd consider Fighter 18/Pal 2 over the Rog 2 version, simply because you're often going to want to be in non-light armor.

Your max Dex can go up to +8 for regular full plate on a dwarf, or +9 on mithral full plate on a dwarf. I think that's probably excessive, and costs a ton of AP, but is worth shooting in that direction.

Are you going to be 28 pts? 32? 34? 36?

Remember to pick up offense as well (GTHF or GTWF, PA, Greater Weapon Specialization, Haster Boost, etc...).

[Thuriaz]

My advice, for what limited worth it is, go Dwarf, Stalwart Defender. Awesome armor boosts so you can get up to a +10 dex bonus in heavy armor (once you gear out your dex assuming a starting 16dex you should be able to JUST reach +8/9/10 depending on tomes and some other things). At the very least it allows you to take the Dwarven Armor Mastery cheaper than Fighter Armor 3 if need be.

The bonuses to hit/damage with an axe + Dwarven Axe as a weapon are very nice. I've got a Dwarven Stalwart at lvl 8 now and he's a joy to play, only spells hit him and even then those don't keep him down long with a good healer. The trick is to know WHEN to go into your stalwart stance, when to use things like cleave/great cleave/whirlwind (if at all) and when to turtle up behind that shield. Balancing the use of abilities can keep your threat HIGH and your damage incoming LOW while making you a decent damage dealer.

[Failedlegend]

You shouldn't underestimate INT for a tank. With 13 INT you can get Combat Expertise, higher balance and distribute more skill points. This way you can get 5AC for either 4 stat points and a +1 tome or 2 points if you can get a +3 one. You could even do some traps in emergency.

Hmmm...I didn't even think about that feat thanks

Half-elf has to get heavy consideration for race of choice for most builds.

Yeah as the only race I dsn't have purchased most of the new builds I've been trying have the Half-Elf "Buy Now" button laughing at me....just cant afford to buy points right now.

Lots of good stuff

Thanks that really helps

I think you've got a lot of options as far as race goes. Dwarf gets a lot of good, relevant bonuses, but their enhancements are expensive. Human gets an extra feat, which is actually useful on a defender fighter for getting all your defensive and offensive feats in, along with healing amp and more flexible stats. Half-elf lets you either get scroll usage or a semi-paladin splash to saves, as well as an additional intimidate you can toss while your main version is on cooldown.

I think those are the top 3 choices for this sort of build.

Honestly, I'd consider Fighter 18/Pal 2 over the Rog 2 version, simply because you're often going to want to be in non-light armor.

Your max Dex can go up to +8 for regular full plate on a dwarf, or +9 on mithral full plate on a dwarf. I think that's probably excessive, and costs a ton of AP, but is worth shooting in that direction.

Are you going to be 28 pts? 32? 34? 36?

Remember to pick up offense as well (GTHF or GTWF, PA, Greater Weapon Specialization, Haster Boost, etc...).

Yeah I definitely agree with Dwarf, Human or H-Elf and I really wish I had H-Elf or the points to buy it (the annoying part is if i didnt buy have orc i could have bought the half-blood pack still) because I really like being able to get UMD from Rogue + Saves frpm H-Elf Dilly but really the ability to double up on intimidate seems like it would be a HUGE help. On the other hand It would be fun and feel thematically right to play a Dwarf

Oh and yeah I don't plan on forgetting my offensive stuff that's what I meant by "Standard Melee Package"

Oh and I have 32pts and if it matters I start at lvl 4....at least on Thelanis I do

My advice, for what limited worth it is, go Dwarf, Stalwart Defender. Awesome armor boosts so you can get up to a +10 dex bonus in heavy armor (once you gear out your dex assuming a starting 16dex you should be able to JUST reach +8/9/10 depending on tomes and some other things). At the very least it allows you to take the Dwarven Armor Mastery cheaper than Fighter Armor 3 if need be.

The bonuses to hit/damage with an axe + Dwarven Axe as a weapon are very nice. I've got a Dwarven Stalwart at lvl 8 now and he's a joy to play, only spells hit him and even then those don't keep him down long with a good healer. The trick is to know WHEN to go into your stalwart stance, when to use things like cleave/great cleave/whirlwind (if at all) and when to turtle up behind that shield. Balancing the use of abilities can keep your threat HIGH and your damage incoming LOW while making you a decent damage dealer.

Yeah and the U9 stuff will hopefully help with Threat gen too



Anyways thanks for all the suggestions guys I didn't expect to get such a good response....I'll have a look at the Links Ilkir gave me in just a sec but I'm gonna post my first four levels and my planned feat list first....not sure what order to take them in and if I missed anything hugely important.


Note: My Main Kraite is lvl 17 and will be supplying this character with tomes etc.

Regular Feats

1 Toughness
2 Power Attack
3 SF: Intim
4 Weapon Focus: Slashing
5 Weapon Spec: Slashing
6 Force of Personality
7 SF:UMD

Fighter Feats

1 Bull-Headed (B. Sword if I go another race)
2 Combat Expertise
3 Dodge
4 THF
5 ITHF
6 GTHF
7 IC:Slashing
8 Improved Shield Bash
9 Shield Mastery
10 Improved Shield Mastery


Other Feats I Was considering

Iron Will
Greater Weapon Spec
Luck of Heroes
Lightning Reflexes

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 3.8.1
DDO Character Planner Home Page

Level 4 Lawful Good Dwarf Male
(2 Fighter \ 2 Paladin) 
Hit Points: 72
Spell Points: 0 
BAB: 4\4
Fortitude: 11
Reflex: 4
Will: 1

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
Abilities        Base Stats          Modified Stats
(32 Point)       (Level 1)             (Level 4)
Strength             16                    17
Dexterity            14                    14
Constitution         16                    16
Intelligence         12                    13
Wisdom                8                     8
Charisma             12                    13

Tomes Used
+1 Tome of Intelligence used at level 3
+1 Tome of Charisma used at level 3

Level 1 (Fighter)
Skill: Balance (+2)
Skill: Intimidate (+4)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+2)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Exotic Weapon Proficiency: Bastard Sword
Feat: (Selected) Two Handed Fighting


Level 2 (Paladin)
Skill: Balance (+0.5)
Skill: Intimidate (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+0.5)


Level 3 (Paladin)
Skill: Balance (+0.5)
Skill: Intimidate (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+0.5)
Feat: (Selected) Shield Mastery


Level 4 (Fighter)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Balance (+0.5)
Skill: Intimidate (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+0.5)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Combat Expertise

Alternatively how well would a Fighter(SD2)12/Paladin(DoS1)6/Rogue2 work?

[Ilklr]

I have purchased every race excvept h-elf so avoid that one if you can

Well, that was what I was going to recommend. I'm sure some would disagree, but imo Half-elf has to get heavy consideration for race of choice for most builds.

Anyway, I'm sure people will post a bunch of build ideas for you, so I'm going to abstain from that. What I can do is point you toward some good resources for build searching (Thanks for the awesome new forum layout ).

SigTrent
Impaqt
Anthios
Stormarcher

There are of course many other great indexes, but this should give you a good starting point.