Spell Pass Preview - Chaaannggeee!

[Soul-Shaker]

Nope, they will have a 30 sec duration, unextendable, like every DoT here. Asinine IMO.

BB isn't a DoT though. It's damage is determined by how well you know the spells radius and knowing how to kite it in and out of that radius efficiently.

In most cases BB, doesn't work to efficiently on ranged mobs(casters, archers) so its only useful for melee units. Nerfing BB to 30 secs wont be to bad (but cast time better be changed and Cool down untouched as a result) as I say its how efficiently you can kite and will still be more efficient them most of you other spells. If they change the save or something else on BB then most Caster Clr/FvS just become healers with lots of wasted feats.

[yodino]

I keep play DDO because I thought it was loyal to D&D. Now it couldn't be farther from it. Gygax would be turning in his grave right now (and probably come back as an archlich and slaughter most of Turbine's staff).

I suggest Star Wars: The Old Republic. link: http://www.swtor.com/

If I'm gonna play a new system, I'll play something that's entirely different like SWTOR.

Yes turbine, your hardcore VIP customers who are loyal to D&D are going bye bye. Have fun entertaining 12 year old kids who can only play on the weekends.

[maddmatt70]

BB isn't a DoT though. It's damage is determined by how well you know the spells radius and knowing how to kite it in and out of that radius efficiently.

In most cases BB, doesn't work to efficiently on ranged mobs(casters, archers) so its only useful for melee units. Nerfing BB to 30 secs wont be to bad (but cast time better be changed and Cool down untouched as a result) as I say its how efficiently you can kite and will still be more efficient them most of you other spells. If they change the save or something else on BB then most Caster Clr/FvS just become healers with lots of wasted feats.

Oh could it happen could they make flame strike and firestorm viable in DDO? I have posted twice on the subject once 3 years ago and once 1.5 years ago. Flame strike is the best divine damage spell for the first 5 levels in pnp and all around great spell. Give divines a real fire enhancement line and shorten the casting time. Pretty please with sprinkles on top.. Maybe they make the light damage such as searing light good. I can not wait to read the reviews on lammania...

[Xenus_Paradox]

I keep play DDO because I thought it was loyal to D&D. Now it couldn't be farther from it. Gygax would be turning in his grave right now (and probably come back as an archlich and slaughter most of Turbine's staff).

I suggest Star Wars: The Old Republic. link: http://www.swtor.com/

If I'm gonna play a new system, I'll play something that's entirely different like SWTOR.

Yes turbine, your hardcore VIP customers who are loyal to D&D are going bye bye. Have fun entertaining 12 year old kids who can only play on the weekends.

Uhhh... This coming from someone who joined after the game went F2P?

LOL.

[Absolute-Omniscience]

<snip>

Don't let the door hit you on the way out.

[Artos_Fabril]

To all the people whining about how the changes to Wall of Fire are "taking us further and further from PnP"

You're absolutely right, we should take wall of fire back to the PnP version, where it didn't discriminate between friendly and enemy.

[learst]

To all the people whining about how the changes to Wall of Fire are "taking us further and further from PnP"

You're absolutely right, we should take wall of fire back to the PnP version, where it didn't discriminate between friendly and enemy.

Don't forget fireball and the majority of other AoE spells!

*ooh.. Horrid Wilting

[wolflordnexus]

To all the people whining about how the changes to Wall of Fire are "taking us further and further from PnP"

You're absolutely right, we should take wall of fire back to the PnP version, where it didn't discriminate between friendly and enemy.

I agree it should be that way for every aoe spell so wizards and sorcs can totally grief everyone and never be allowed in any party /roll eyes

[yodino]

Uhhh... This coming from someone who joined after the game went F2P?

LOL.

Joining the game and the forum join date are completely different things. I was here when DDO went Beta. Back then it was loyal to D&D's source material and groundbreaking in what you could do in the dungeons. I've watched it drift slowly away from what it once was, until it's arrived to the state it is in now.

I ask you, are you defending D&D or Turbine? Because Turbine's marred what D&D stands for, so thinking that your trying to defend the game system we've all grown up with might have your loyalties in the wrong place.

At least with SWTOR, it's by LucasArts and Bioware, the same studio that came out with Neverwinter Nights and Baldur's Gate. They have a track record for staying loyal to the core material, while introducing groundbreaking mechanics and technology. If you were at PAX 2011, you'd see that the real star at the convention was SWTOR.

[Absolute-Omniscience]

Joining the game and the forum join date are completely different things. I was here when DDO went Beta. Back then it was loyal to D&D's source material and groundbreaking in what you could do in the dungeons. I've watched it drift slowly away from what it once was, until it's arrived to the state it is in now.

I ask you, are you defending D&D or Turbine? Because Turbine's marred what D&D stands for, so thinking that your trying to defend the game system we've all grown up with might have your loyalties in the wrong place.

At least with SWTOR, it's by LucasArts and Bioware, the same studio that came out with Neverwinter Nights and Baldur's Gate. They have a track record for staying loyal to the core material, while introducing groundbreaking mechanics and technology. If you were at PAX 2011, you'd see that the real star at the convention was SWTOR.

You're just one player, sure they'll be more of you. But looking at the big picture this change will pull so many more players.

And for players who actually like DDO for a GAME and not for some fantasy, this change is just great! Finally some balance, and finally some choices!

[Xenus_Paradox]

Joining the game and the forum join date are completely different things. I was here when DDO went Beta. Back then it was loyal to D&D's source material and groundbreaking in what you could do in the dungeons. I've watched it drift slowly away from what it once was, until it's arrived to the state it is in now.

I ask you, are you defending D&D or Turbine? Because Turbine's marred what D&D stands for, so thinking that your trying to defend the game system we've all grown up with might have your loyalties in the wrong place.

At least with SWTOR, it's by LucasArts and Bioware, the same studio that came out with Neverwinter Nights and Baldur's Gate. They have a track record for staying loyal to the core material, while introducing groundbreaking mechanics and technology. If you were at PAX 2011, you'd see that the real star at the convention was SWTOR.

No friendly fire.
AP enhancements.
Spell points.
Auction house.
No polearms.
Casters aren't Gods.

...yep, this game's ALWAYS been 100% faithful to PnP.

BTW how much is Bioware paying you to shill for them?

[yodino]

To all the people whining about how the changes to Wall of Fire are "taking us further and further from PnP"

You're absolutely right, we should take wall of fire back to the PnP version, where it didn't discriminate between friendly and enemy.

That would actually be something I can get behind with. Staying true to the source material, and it would introduce new ways of team tactics. That would be much preferable to arbitrarily making metamagics not work because they simply can't, or introducing so many "house rules" that all the game is now is a permutation of EQ or WoW.

[vVAnjilaVv]

I doubt very much Turbine is going to commit suicide and make the game unplayable.....


I see the same thing here that has happened since I have started playing this game...which was over four years ago.....

Things change.....

The great players stand back, adjust, and often times become even better players.

The average players complain and whine at first because they don't like to do extra work and now they are hamstrung a little but eventually overcome.

The bad players were gimps to begin with and it doesn't matter.

So what's the big deal?

[Seventh]

Got a lot of folks saying the SP regen thing should scale- no guys, just no. That's just to help newbies out in the harbor, and maybe let you get your SLA's off if you burned through your SP. At higher levels you just need to conserve your SP, no need to easy button that, especially now that SP costs have been reduced to that point that endgame blasting is viable. We're good as is.

[broolthebeast]

Joining the game and the forum join date are completely different things. I was here when DDO went Beta. Back then it was loyal to D&D's source material and groundbreaking in what you could do in the dungeons. I've watched it drift slowly away from what it once was, until it's arrived to the state it is in now.

I ask you, are you defending D&D or Turbine? Because Turbine's marred what D&D stands for, so thinking that your trying to defend the game system we've all grown up with might have your loyalties in the wrong place.

At least with SWTOR, it's by LucasArts and Bioware, the same studio that came out with Neverwinter Nights and Baldur's Gate. They have a track record for staying loyal to the core material, while introducing groundbreaking mechanics and technology. If you were at PAX 2011, you'd see that the real star at the convention was SWTOR.

Ive been preaching about how bioware > turbine for a long time.... Infact, i've always voted for them over turbine in the escapists poll

[learst]

Joining the game and the forum join date are completely different things. I was here when DDO went Beta. Back then it was loyal to D&D's source material and groundbreaking in what you could do in the dungeons. I've watched it drift slowly away from what it once was, until it's arrived to the state it is in now.

I ask you, are you defending D&D or Turbine? Because Turbine's marred what D&D stands for, so thinking that your trying to defend the game system we've all grown up with might have your loyalties in the wrong place.

At least with SWTOR, it's by LucasArts and Bioware, the same studio that came out with Neverwinter Nights and Baldur's Gate. They have a track record for staying loyal to the core material, while introducing groundbreaking mechanics and technology. If you were at PAX 2011, you'd see that the real star at the convention was SWTOR.

I only came onboard with F2P, and this is just my 2cp.

I've never played P&P, my experiences with D&D has been BG, IWD, NWN etc. Back when BG introduced a spacebar-pause system, at that time many said it's step away from the traditional turn-based. But it made it work for a PC game.

There are many things that DDO does is which is different, particularly a spellpoint sysem. In the older games, a lvl 1 wizard can only cast 2 lvl 1 spells day, at Int 18. How would that fare in fast-paced MMORPG? The whole SP system is distinction away from the P&P, and it's an ongoing gradual process where Turbine is continually fine-tweaking. And this is something I accept, that while this game was based on D&D, it by no ways is a complete reconstruction of traditional P&P D&D.

[yodino]

No friendly fire.
AP enhancements.
Spell points.
Auction house.
No polearms.
Casters aren't Gods.

...yep, this game's ALWAYS been 100% faithful to PnP.

BTW how much is Bioware paying you to shill for them?

Those were born out of necessity, because of the limits of technology at the time. Did I ever say it was 100%? No, but it was sure a helluva lot closer to PnP than it is now.

And Bioware doesn't need to pay me to endorse their MMO. All the existing MMO's are feeling threatened by SWTOR. Look at PAX, at G4, and what well-known critics and fans are saying about it. Don't take my word for it. I'm just trying to spread the word that there are better alternatives out there.

[Rawel_San]

So, 200+ posts and not one complaint about the 'Easy Button' that is 15sp Polar Rays?

Bad form, DDO forums. Very bad form.

If they really were 15sp polar rays there might be more people complaning. In reality as someone pointed out
once you max and empower them they have gone down to 50 from 75 or so.

The thing I really dislike is that it feels that instead of making dps less of a be-all end-all, we have yet another let's
nuke the **** out of stuff and bring as much dps as possible situation. In other words in epics at the moment
casters were actually sort of useful as CC+level drain or kiters. With saves going up, damage to cc'd creatures
going waaaay down the only CC spells that will become at all useful will be web and maybe disco on non drow.

Even if saves went up only a few points with the reccurring saves the fact that you won't be getting them with
hold on a 20 will make it a huge sp drain (don't forget going from a save on 20 to save on 19 means halving of
expected hold time). Couple that with no more level drain and a very conservative estimate gives you durations
of one third of what they are now. Which just means we need more dps faster.

At the same time my ranger that felt bad about going into epics since I reaize he's far from top dps (as he actually
has ac and so is not full out strength (only 33 pre madstone)), has become even more useless as not only won't
he hit hard enough he won't even hit often enough anymore.

Now don't get me wrong considering how trivial most of the new epics are now I'm sure we can still run sentinels
and carnival with pugs if not quite first 5 to hit lfm anymore, the thing I dislike is if DPS was the king before it's
the uber king now since it went from nescessary against bosses to nescessary against everything.

And don't get me started on 100-300 dam on failed save of fod or wail with monster hp's around 3-4k for most trash
that is still just a joke, even my no dps light monk gets that in the same amount of time and without spending sp
or going on a 30sec timer.

Last but not least we went from wizards being weakish at low levels ok-great at middle levels and pretty nice
at end game with very nice gear(multiple raid and epic items), to ok at low levels, ok at middle levels and middling to
weak at end game unless you're talking lancer type wizards with 5-6 tr's and full time abishai cookies running.

Lancer might actually get a tiny bit better with 50ish save on wail and no more death immunity in epics.

Anyhow that's just my 2 copper,
Rawel

PS.: I'm not saying this is doom we have yet to actually see it on live and I might be proved wrong. If as I suspect I'm not though
chances are my play time will either hugely decrease or I will just take a leave of absence.

[wolflordnexus]

Joining the game and the forum join date are completely different things. I was here when DDO went Beta. Back then it was loyal to D&D's source material and groundbreaking in what you could do in the dungeons. I've watched it drift slowly away from what it once was, until it's arrived to the state it is in now.

I ask you, are you defending D&D or Turbine? Because Turbine's marred what D&D stands for, so thinking that your trying to defend the game system we've all grown up with might have your loyalties in the wrong place.

At least with SWTOR, it's by LucasArts and Bioware, the same studio that came out with Neverwinter Nights and Baldur's Gate. They have a track record for staying loyal to the core material, while introducing groundbreaking mechanics and technology. If you were at PAX 2011, you'd see that the real star at the convention was SWTOR.

Are you seriously trying to say NWN was loyal to D&D as I hear Kobolds say...REALLY!!!...REALLY!!!
Honestly D&D 3.5 is not the game I grew up with and since your bandying around Garry's name like you Know how he'd feel I doubt it was yours. I mean there's no speed factor in DDO and AC is in Positive numbers OMG!!!!11oneelventyone! Turbine has marred nothing the game you grew up with was changed dramatically by WOTC before Turbine ever got a hold of it it was streamlined and made a better game Turbine is trying to make it a better MMORPG I'm not a fan of all the spell changes either but it has nothing to do with the source material. I have concerns about the viability of anything but nuking now. but I'm willing to see how it plays out.

on a less serious note http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C6cxNR9ML8k

[Artos_Fabril]

Don't forget fireball and the majority of other AoE spells!

*ooh.. Horrid Wilting

I agree it should be that way for every aoe spell so wizards and sorcs can totally grief everyone and never be allowed in any party /roll eyes

Exactly. If you wanted DDO to "remain true to D&D" you'd be whining about how differently spells work in general, and that casters all just wade in lobbing spells left and right without regard for the tactical situation.

Instead, we see people whining because an easy button is being taken away. Sure there was skill involved in kiting, but it's not a terribly difficult skill, and once you mastered it, there was rarely, if ever, any need to change tactics.

Those people complaining that nuke damage is insufficient compared to monster HP have rather more traction in their arguments. In PnP a CL5 fireball did an average on 18 damage, and enemies had an average of 30 HP.... but you only got 1, and you couldn't apply any metamagics to it because they would have raised it to a level you couldn't cast.