Update 9 and Sorcs

[broolthebeast]

Sorry Sorcs, you're not going to get it...

When Paladin's got Intimidate, we had 2 options, either TR, or LR, and we paid for it... and that was skill points... You can at least swap out spells for Plat... Much easier...

1 spell per 3 days is not much easier, its a pain in the a$$. Personally, i dont care either way because ill probably just TR into an archmage.

[Saravis]

The most you're going to get is a DDO store sale, don't expect any more than that. Turbine is a business after all.

[psymun]

1 spell per 3 days is not much easier, its a pain in the a$$. Personally, i dont care either way because ill probably just TR into an archmage.

My point is... if Paladins wanted Intimidate, we had no choice. Either TR or LR... We COULD NOT spend money to swap out skill points. Sorcs at least have the option.

My thought was "Thank you turbine for giving Paladins intimidate. It was greatly appreciated." In all seriousness, why complain?

Turbine could always just say "If you're going to complain about us making new spells, would you rather us not add new spells? that way you don't have to spend in game platinum swapping anything out."

[Zachski]

My point is... if Paladins wanted Intimidate, we had no choice. Either TR or LR... We COULD NOT spend money to swap out skill points. Sorcs at least have the option.

My thought was "Thank you turbine for giving Paladins intimidate. It was greatly appreciated." In all seriousness, why complain?

Turbine could always just say "If you're going to complain about us making new spells, would you rather us not add new spells? that way you don't have to spend in game platinum swapping anything out."

It's not about the plat, it's about the 3 day timer for changing one spell.

It would probably take somewhere close to a month, maybe more to change out a Sorcerer's spells in any sort of depth. So, an LR was the only way to change a Paladin's skills, but you didn't have to wait a month to complete it.

I agree with the spell change token.

[KillEveryone]

I doubt they would.

They didn't when they changed the THF to remove those glancing blows while moving. I'm sure plenty of players found those feats to now be lacking because of their play style.

It would be nice from a PR standpoint. It would show that they value their customers when they make a game design change.

I do think that ALL scrolls up to lvl 7 should be available for purchase. This would fix the problem when they add new spells.

[Rakian_Knight]

Considering that the new PrE forces you to take feats that most sorcs will not have currently in order to qualify, I think that a lesser heart would be fair.

When other PrE's came out or changed they didn't give them hearts of woods so why should they do that with sorcerers?

Pale Masters: Required Spell focus and Greater Spell focus (Necromancy)
Archmages: Required Spell focus and Greater Spell focus of whatever school you wanted. How many wizards took spell focus (evocation) or spell focus (conjuration) before archmage came out?
Rogue Mechanic: Added bonuses to crossbows and repeater prof. to the PrE and how many Mechanics at that time were ranged specialized?

Spell tokens to reset only your spells once wouldn't be that much of a problem in my opinion.

[Cyr]

No we didnt get a heart for wizards when pm came out

Just because my wizard got shafted along with everyone else's does not mean I wish to spread that pain around each time they change systems on us...

Any new PrE for a class OR signifigant change to a system that effects a class should result in a BtC Lesser Heart with + level if the change was large enough that people would be strongly tempted to change out a level or more.

[Memnir]

What I think would be fair is if they blanked the spell list of every Sorc, and you had to go to the trainer for a one-time free do-over of your whole list.

I mean, you will be going to the trainer anyway to pick up the PrE...

[yodino]

*whine, whine, whine*

Seriously, after turbine giving you what you wanted and actually making beneficial changes - your gonna QQ about this?

how about this: BUY THE **** TR/LR WOOD. Show Turbine that you appreciate the work they're doing and you'd like to treat them to lunch. Oh wait, the money your gonna spend for a LR doesn't even cost the price of a decent lunch.

Wow guys. just wow.

[Missing_Minds]

((oberon131313, I'm doing junky today in my c/p. I think this first part is in response to what you started to say.))

As a vet with plat to blow, I could agree to that. But that hurts new players and that is something I'd not want.

Not to mention that NPC would..

1. must be coded.
2. would probably have a time duration.

I think Memirs suggestion of just blanking all spells, and changing the NPC trainers to be able to fill in empty slots would be better as there would be no time bases for that.

In case, an additional function must be added to the trainer. Aka check for blank spell slot. I'd hope that would be less of a hassle to add in.

My issue with the hearts is where is the cutoff? Does anyone that has a single level of sorc get to completely change their stats and feats and spells and everything else? Does my level 4 sorc get a heart, because if so that means that I can bank it and use it for a later respec.

And I would also argue that giving hearts to anyone with a sorc class also requires a code change, or at the very least a high customer service cost if they have to assign them by hand.

I can not argue either of these, but I pull less weight on the latter. They have done script to give items before, so it is nothing new. Nothing to be done by hand there.

But the issue of the cut off. I can agree with the concern. But as stated, the suggestion was made with the limitations player known with the game as is.

[Missing_Minds]

*whine, whine, whine*

Oh, really?

it would be a very nice gesture...

If that is whining, I'd hate to see what your normal life is like.

[oberon131313]

As a vet with plat to blow, I could agree to that. But that hurts new players and that is something I'd not want.

Not to mention that NPC would..

1. must be coded.
2. would probably have a time duration.

I think Memirs suggestion of just blanking all spells, and changing the NPC trainers to be able to fill in empty slots would be better as there would be no time bases for that.

In case, an additional function must be added to the trainer. Aka check for blank spell slot. I'd hope that would be less of a hassle to add in.

Yeah, that's fairly in line with my original post, just didn't articulate it particularly well.

[yodino]

Oh, really?



If that is whining, I'd hate to see what your normal life is like.

Oh my normal life? My normal life is fine.

When I find a $20 bill, I don't whine that it should've been a $100.
When I get promoted, I don't whine because I didn't get a parking space with it.
When a terrible disaster happens and me and my loved ones are still alive, I don't whine about waiting in line for 4-6 hours for food and gas.

You guys should learn from the Japanese. They have learned to be content with the good fortune they have, instead of whining about not having more.

[KillEveryone]

*whine, whine, whine*

Seriously, after turbine giving you what you wanted and actually making beneficial changes - your gonna QQ about this?

how about this: BUY THE **** TR/LR WOOD. Show Turbine that you appreciate the work they're doing and you'd like to treat them to lunch. Oh wait, the money your gonna spend for a LR doesn't even cost the price of a decent lunch.

Wow guys. just wow.

Soooooo....all the money I already paid doesn't show enough appreciation to the work they have done and now I need to show more love by spending more money?

You are just wrong.

[lugoman]

Plat isn't the real problem, it's the timer between spell swaps.

Yes the timer is the problem. With the pre you need to get your spec'ed line spells AND drop (maybe) the opposite line spells.

Just remove the timer for a few weeks.

[Montrose]

Oh my normal life? My normal life is fine.

When I find a $20 bill, I don't whine that it should've been a $100.
When I get promoted, I don't whine because I didn't get a parking space with it.
When a terrible disaster happens and me and my loved ones are still alive, I don't whine about waiting in line for 4-6 hours for food and gas.

Why is it whining to request a convenience? The OP wasn't throwing a tantrum, threatening to quit, berating Turbine, or otherwise acting "whiny". They made a suggestion/request that due to changes within the game they feel there is justification for a free respec.

While you may disagree (and I'm on the fence), they brought their suggestion in a rational manner on the official forums for such matters. That seems entirely reasonable to me.

You guys should learn from the Japanese. They have learned to be content with the good fortune they have, instead of whining about not having more.

This is just not appropriate. Comparing the tragedy in Japan to needing to respec one's character is an insult, and I strongly disapprove of this.

Donate to the relief effort and send good karma to those who are still missing, but please don't use them as a stick in your argument.

[yodino]

Soooooo....all the money I already paid doesn't show enough appreciation to the work they have done and now I need to show more love by spending more money?

You are just wrong.

Yes, you do. Thinking that your a special case compared to other classes and deserve special treatment is wrong. We sucked it up and bit the bullet, I see no reason for sorcs not to do the same thing as well. Hell, I'll be LRing my sorc with either a heart from the AH or a heart from the DDO store and I'll be happy doing it.

[Synthetic]

Soooooo....all the money I already paid doesn't show enough appreciation to the work they have done and now I need to show more love by spending more money?

You are just wrong.

That's how capitalism works it's not what have you done for me it's what are you doing for me.

Seriously wizards pay plat for every single spell besides the 2 they get per level. So complaining you need to spend money to respec is ridiculous. Wizards will have to find the scrolls or buy them off the AH. Which means they certainly won't have them with in a couple of days - if ever - why should sorcs have access to every new spell immediately just because new spells were added.

[KillEveryone]

Yes, you do. Thinking that your a special case compared to other classes and deserve special treatment is wrong. We sucked it up and bit the bullet, I see no reason for sorcs not to do the same thing as well. Hell, I'll be LRing my sorc with either a heart from the AH or a heart from the DDO store and I'll be happy doing it.

No I don't.

I don't have a sorcerer so I don't really have much of a stake in this current change but I have been impacted by other changes.

I don't agree that I should fork out money just because Turbine changes how things work. There may be other in game options but there should still be a reset on the characters when features are changed.

If you want to waste your money, go right ahead.

I already paid Turbine for my product. Now they are changing the product that I've already paid for. I shouldn't have to pay to have my product work when I already bought it.

Would you really want to have to pay a car company to fix your car when they updated the computer but the update changed your car and now to have it run you have to pay to have it fixed even though they changed it? I think you need to show your car company some love by forking out more cash.

[KillEveryone]

That's how capitalism works it's not what have you done for me it's what are you doing for me.

Seriously wizards pay plat for every single spell besides the 2 they get per level. So complaining you need to spend money to respec is ridiculous. Wizards will have to find the scrolls or buy them off the AH. Which means they certainly won't have them with in a couple of days - if ever - why should sorcs have access to every new spell immediately just because new spells were added.

I feel that new spells should be available in scroll form right away and actually would rather have all scrolls in available for purchase.