starting stats and questions for a monk

[LuKaSu]

I've been trying to put together an idea for a self-healing melee (http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=306485), and one option that came up was a monk with a cleric dilletante (sp?). This is all well and good, but I'm having troubles with the starting stats.

The best I could come up with is as follows (32 point stats, half elf):

str:16
dex: 15 (+2 tome by 8 to get improved two weapon fighting at 9 and greater twf at 12)
con: 14
int: 10 (four skills: balance, concentration, jump, and spot)
wis: 14
cha: dump

a couple questions come up, however, for me, as I'm not terribly familiar with monks.

1) Is it right that the twf chain also helps a monks unarmed attack?

2) if so, it seems that you'd need dex starting at least 15 and as much as you can in strength to melee. But Whenever I run VON 5, it always seems that on the part where we split into two groups with all the runes and switches, I end up on the right side with a monk doing the wis rune (needs 25). My FvS does the Str lever, and the only reason he can pull it is because he started out with an 18 strength with all level ups in Str. Do monks put level ups in wis? I would have presumed Str, since they're melee.

Do you suggest any alternative starting stats?

[Impatiens]

Don't bother with putting points in int. You don't need to put points in jump, with decent strength and a jump clicky you'll easily have the 40 cap without investing any points in it. I'd also take UMD over spot, but that's just me, you mileage may vary. If you really want to invest in four skills just eat a +2 tome at 7 and start doing it after that point. If you don't put any points in int, put the extra in Wisdom.

Yes, TWF is absolutely the most important set of feats for a monk to take. So definitely start with at least 15 Dex. You may want to consider starting with 16 dex so you can get grand master wind stance. It depends on whether you want to use wind stance or fire stance at cap. Both have their pros and cons. I like using wind stance in epics because fire stance lowers your wisdom, which lowers stunning fist DCs.

Whether you put points in strength or wisdom on level ups depends on what you want your monk to do. Do you want to be able to reliably use stunning fist on epic content? Put level ups in wisdom. Nearly all your DCs are wisdom based so it's a very important stat. There are monks who do not put much of any focus on DC based abilities though and put level ups in strength and take stunning blow instead of stunning fist for stunning in epics. I have never played a monk this way so I can't comment much on that.

My monk's starting stas (36 point build half elf) were:

Str: 16
Dex: 16
Con: 14
Int: 8
Wis: 16
Char: 8

You are definitely on the right track as far as knowing what stats are important!

[hu-flung-pu]

There's a couple of stat distributions you can do.

My favorite is:

STR 15
DEX 16
CON 14
INT 8
WIS 15

This let's you use your human versatility for one in WIS, one in STR.

Another I like is the four stats all go to 15, but requires a lot of farming and shopping for +3 tomes. So not really recommended unless you're prepared to put in time for the grind.

As for skills, go with what Impatiens said. Ignore Jump. I put at least one skill point at creation in to tumble, just so I can get the tumble spell in the market place. And your slow fall will make it obsolete. And put some in to Balance. That helps you recover from being knocked down faster. And of course, maximize your Concentration.

As for self healing, if you went Miyagi-do (light side), just get a superior potency 1 item, and watch your triple positive finisher hit for big numbers with your Half-Elf and Monk healing amp plus 50% enhancement from the potency item.

[Impatiens]

There's a couple of stat distributions you can do.
My favorite is:

STR 15
DEX 16
CON 14
INT 8
WIS 15

This let's you use your human versatility for one in WIS, one in STR.

Since you obviously can't do the exact stat distribution I went with as a 32 point build, this is a really good option. The key is to have pretty well balanced stats among the four important ones. For example, if you want Void Strike IV you need Master in every stance and Grand Master in one. This means that you'll need 16 base (after tomes) in all four stats and one at base 18 after tomes. With this distribution that will be really easy to accomplish with just +2s. Put enhancement points in wis and strength, probably level ups in wisdom, and another wisdom point from monk wisdom to even it out.

[t0r012]

You have 3 options going with starting stats with a monk.
1. Strength heavy build going for big melée damage like the metaru Build. Max starting str just enough dex for twf chain and the rest con. A classic melée bruiser build all level ups go in to str.
2. A balanced build which is what you proposed build is. Kind of middle of the road on everything.
3. Dex wis finesse build. This build sacrafices strength to get more defense from dexterity and wisdom and the high wisdom benifits almost all of your monk DC abilites. Str just high enough to get power attack con as low as you are comfortable with 12 being as low as I would start.

Str/con based or dex/wis based both have their advantages and disadvantages. The balance build isn't the best at any one thing but it also isn't the worst at any one thing.

------_______
FYI wis runes in VoN are 20 only the str require 25

[SetofBs]

You can also go finesse and dex based, putting some or all level ups in dex (I am planning all in dex on my monk)

Something like:

Str: 14
Dex: 16
Con: 14
Int: 8
Wis: 16
Char: 8

This allows you to have amazing reflex saves, good AC as you level and high to-hit. High to-hit allows you to leave power attack on in more situations. Honestly I don't see how a monk with all levels in wisdom can use power attack that often, unless they are fully buffed up by a bard. My layout is also a perfect fit for wind stance, and doesn't require the use of any tomes at all if you can't afford them. With items/enhancements you can still get the wis runes in VON 5, Tear, etc.

[ulticleo]

Whether you put points in strength or wisdom on level ups depends on what you want your monk to do. Do you want to be able to reliably use stunning fist on epic content? Put level ups in wisdom. Nearly all your DCs are wisdom based so it's a very important stat. There are monks who do not put much of any focus on DC based abilities though and put level ups in strength and take stunning blow instead of stunning fist for stunning in epics. I have never played a monk this way so I can't comment much on that.

My monk's starting stas (36 point build half elf) were:

Str: 16
Dex: 16
Con: 14
Int: 8
Wis: 16
Char: 8

You are definitely on the right track as far as knowing what stats are important!

As impatiens said, it heavily depends on what you want out of your monk.

The two main builds tend to be str/con (see metaru for a WF version) and a dex/wis (see rockan robin for halfling version). I prefer dex/wis myself as I am not going for max dps, but rather for versatility, and I am only about 5-10% TOPS below what a max str can dish out, and I feel that the 41-42 stunning fist DC, 70+ AC, and speed+double strikes (wind stance) are worth it to lose a bit of dps.

Regardless of which way you go, I'd like to point out that if you don't start with 16 con, you'll have a hard time getting grandmaster earth stance (requires 18 after tomes). I rarely go into earth stance, but earth strike 4 is the best dps strike other than ToD. I think it is well worth it.

For what it's worth, my stats are (34 build):
str 14
dex 16
con 16
int 10
wis 14
chr 8

wis = 14+2tome + +3 monk + 5lvlup + 6item + 1 exceptional + 1 littany = 32 +2 yugo + 2ship = 36 <- 43 DC stunning fist
(btw, int is 10 for combat expertise, not the skills. I picked up a +3 tome in the first life).

For comparison, my str is 24. a max str horc will sit at around 40-42 (depending on gear/tomes, maybe as much as 44). I am not counting rage, madstone, pots etc, as those are available regardless. that's another 9 points of damage per hit, 18 on crit. However, with the burst rings, a good set of HW, and strikes, those 9 points of damage end up being equivalent to 10% or so per hit (less when you consider the faster hits/double strike from windstance). And at that point you basically have a medium dps fighter with abundant step that require button mashing. I have a max dps fighter (still working on that esos), and if max dps is what I need, I bring him instead. But I like my monk better.

[ulticleo]

You can also go finesse and dex based, putting some or all level ups in dex (I am planning all in dex on my monk)

Something like:

Str: 14
Dex: 16
Con: 14
Int: 8
Wis: 16
Char: 8

This allows you to have amazing reflex saves, good AC as you level and high to-hit. High to-hit allows you to leave power attack on in more situations. Honestly I don't see how a monk with all levels in wisdom can use power attack that often, unless they are fully buffed up by a bard. My layout is also a perfect fit for wind stance, and doesn't require the use of any tomes at all if you can't afford them. With items/enhancements you can still get the wis runes in VON 5, Tear, etc.

1) von5 wis rune requires 20, not 25 wis
2) 16 dex + 2 tome + 2 helf + 6 item + 4 stance = 30. lowish, but outside of a few epic bosses, you won't have issues hitting with power attack on (may want to pick up a decent +5 wraps or the mabar ones if you find that you do). +1 yugo + 1exceptional + 1 littany = 34. +4 tome (I can wish) =36. plenty.

[Impatiens]

Regardless of which way you go, I'd like to point out that if you don't start with 16 con, you'll have a hard time getting grandmaster earth stance (requires 18 after tomes). I rarely go into earth stance, but earth strike 4 is the best dps strike other than ToD. I think it is well worth it.

The problem with trying for GM Earth, and it is true that Earth IV is the best dps strike, is that if you want to get Void IV, GM in another stance that you will actually be using for the stance, and a PrE line, AP are really tight. I know that the OP also wants the Cleric Dilly on a half elf. I found with my half elf it was impossible to get the full cleric dilly line, a PrE line, Void IV, and two GM stances, so I had to drop a GM stance.

[SetofBs]

1) von5 wis rune requires 20, not 25 wis
2) 16 dex + 2 tome + 2 helf + 6 item + 4 stance = 30. lowish, but outside of a few epic bosses, you won't have issues hitting with power attack on (may want to pick up a decent +5 wraps or the mabar ones if you find that you do). +1 yugo + 1exceptional + 1 littany = 34. +4 tome (I can wish) =36. plenty.

1) I am aware of that, it was OP that stated otherwise.
2) I'm not sure what you are trying to say. Are you saying that levels in dex are not needed and they should be in wis? That is an option for sure but in my experience so far, without a bard around it is going to be difficult to leave power attack on, especially without high to-hit wraps, which a new monk won't have.