A good character

[CircleK]

Hi

I just thought I'd talk about my best character I made: Staticshock. He's a drow paladin with a strong solo ability.

Stats
17 str (needed points for other stats; would be 20 otherwise)
10 dex (dump stat)
12-13 con (being drow does this)
15 wis (helps with spellcasting)
10 int (dump stat)
18 cha (important for lay on hands ability and other stuff)
He's lvl 6 right now. He uses a +2 flaming icy burst greataxe and does constant crit hits. His smite evil, on crits, makes him do 140+ dmg on hit. He can heal himself whenever needed and has a balance of stats to keep him strong. He has many form of DR like 3/Slash, Bludgeon, 3/-, and something else. He has drow benefits like sleep immunity, spell resist, and keen senses, plus paladin benefits like remove disease, disease immunity, boosted saves, and fear immunity. Pretty much the only drawback is his low con, but I'm gonna fix that. Because of his strong solo ability and super high heal skill, he's a valuable comrade to have in a group. Send him an invite sometime.


Good hunting

[Karell]

I'd keep the DR/- if you really need the DR, but that should be the only one you need. The other DR's aren't going to stop anymore damage, sine DR goes by the highest number. And since you have one that can't be bypassed by anything, trade the other DR's for some different gear.

[AndyD47]

First,I'm happy you enjoy your drow paladin.
I made one myself,and while not my cup of tea I can see the appeal.

That said I'd like to point out that for paladins (and rangers I guess) wisdom isn't exactly the best place to put stat points into.
You can cast all of your spells just fine with a +6 item starting with an 8 wisdom not to mention being able to cast resists off of owl's wisdom potions and such.

That would have freed up some points for a higher con which believe me is handy for a front line melee.

As far as damage reduction,try to find armor with invulnerability on it:makes leveling to 10 or so alot easier,check it out here http://ddowiki.com/page/Invulnerability
You can find ml:6 armor (or ml:4 robes) with that suffix if you get a bit lucky at the AH.

Taking Heal as a skill doesn't do you any good considering you could put points into balance/jump or maybe UMD, especially considering the high charisma you have.


Just some observations,nothing too rough as long as you are having fun.

[Raithe]

That said I'd like to point out that for paladins (and rangers I guess) wisdom isn't exactly the best place to put stat points into.

On my rogue (with levels of ranger), the counter for deaths caused by an inability to spot DDO's ridiculous traps (elite/epic) would need to have several more digits than the counter for deaths caused by simple hit point loss.

On my caster, the counter for deaths caused by an inability to spot incoming mobs would need to have several more digits than the counter for deaths caused by simple hit point loss.

On my ranger who has ample spotting ability, reducing his wisdom by 6 would decrease his spell point pool by 20%. Since I actually am able to use my ranger's spell point pool for better-than-trivial buffs like freedom, resistance, protection, barkskin (on actual melee), and healing, a 20% reduction in spell points is far from acceptable. Add to that the fact that there are several will-based effects in the game that are quite annoying and/or dangerous and you have a perfectly valid reason to spend points on wisdom as a ranger or paladin.

Wisdom is only a dump stat for players who don't know any better.

[CircleK]

The heal skill actually helps me with rest shrines and gettin people up when I'm out of sp. Jump, balance, and UMD aren't important right now.

And Karell, you're right about the dr. I will change it if possible.

I guess I could've invested a little more into constitution but having good wis has its perks. And I will do my best to fix the con anyway.

[stille_nacht]

The heal skill actually helps me with rest shrines and gettin people up when I'm out of sp. Jump, balance, and UMD aren't important right now.

And Karell, you're right about the dr. I will change it if possible.

I guess I could've invested a little more into constitution but having good wis has its perks. And I will do my best to fix the con anyway.

jump is never important (see the spell: jump), balance is sort of important (getting knockdown is pretty bad in some quests with wolves/ lions), UMD is very important if you can get a high enough skill level (20).

do NOT put points into heal as a palidan. mostly because you can simply buy a wand and use that to get ppl at -10 up, and health at shrines is a non-issue

[Adarro]

The heal skill actually helps me with rest shrines and gettin people up when I'm out of sp. Jump, balance, and UMD aren't important right now.

And Karell, you're right about the dr. I will change it if possible.

I guess I could've invested a little more into constitution but having good wis has its perks. And I will do my best to fix the con anyway.

Just want to say I hope you enjoy your Drow paladin, I'm not an uber builder, but pallies are one of my favorite classes.

I just thought I'd throw in my 2 cents as a casual-esque player.
My play-style:

• Tactics trump gear.
• Tactics trump build.

While there are obviously niche exceptions, it has seldom proved untrue. I've seen melee's with silver weapons fail vs vampires and a spam fest of eternal wand of healing prevail. People with "Harry beaters" and poor tactics fare little better than the under-geared.
That said, your choices are more about convenience and / or bragging rights IMO. Better gear = quicker, better build = more efficient. Do a few 'nekid guild runs' and you'll see what I mean.

SKILL:
Pallies get almost nothing for skill points, and with INT as a dump stat, that becomes even more evident. Much like feats, they take a bit of consideration because you'll be hard pressed to have more than 1 or 2 skills raised to a decent level.

Jump - can make the difference between escaping or attacking the targets of your choice verses being pinned-in by trash while the caster strikes unchallenged. If you've not bothered with AC and joined the pajama wearing crowd, you may be fine. Wearing full plate however, I have noticed a difference and tend to carry a stack of 'jump pots' for an extra boost in addition to having some points in the skill.

Balance - I never seem able to put as many points as I'd like to in this one. Being a cross class skill that costs double the points doesn't help much. As this is also affected by the ACP (armor check penalty), it may be less of an issue to the non-full plate wearers. However, if you're trying to keep the attention on you, it's hard to be intimidating and dangerous while lying flat on your back. Just remember to hold 'shift' and block while you're prone until you get a better roll.

UMD - Some people swear by UMD and have it on every class / build / race. As a pally, you already have a lot of options to wand, so I'm not as adamant for this skill over some of the others. If I can pick it up 'too', then I will. However, it is a cross-class skill, so that doubles the cost when pallies are already starved for skill points.

Heal - The issue with the skill Heal is that it's only really relevant at shrines or at the side of a fallen comrade.

At shrines: While a stack of 'Cure Serious' pots can cost some plat when you're starting out, it's very reasonable to have some cure wands either cheap from a vendor or from collectable turn-ins (I sometimes even have that eternal cure wand from catacombs). So, while it may cost a little more, those points in Heal amount to a few charges from a wand you can get from a market place turn in.

In battle: As for aiding a fallen comrade, there are 2 circumstances... still in battle or after-the-fact.
The heal skill takes time, and you must be literally kneeling beside them, and can be easily interrupted. So in the heat of battle, our own cure spell, Lay on Hands or a wand whip will be better since you can do any of those from much further away with less chance of interruption.
If the battles over, then the skill makes some sense resource wise, but as the heal kits would take up the same inventory slot a wand would, why not keep it for a cure light / mod / critical / serious wand which can help in more situations? Alternately, keeping a set of recharging bracers of 'aid' or similar is also a solution.

I do appreciate someone trying to help the group by having this skill. One of the few times I get close to disgusted is when I see 4 players standing around an incapacitated cleric and not one of them can heal 3 points to get the cleric on her feat. I just find it's better to use items that cost very little plat than a skill that costs utility.

I haven't really looked for higher level items, but I'm fairly sure you can get some + Heal skill items to wear when you rest if you really want to get a passive boost for all your sleep-overs. Also, my pally shrines with a 'Magi' item to get some bonus spell points to buff at shrines.

Intimidate: Not for the squishy at heart I've waited a long time to have a pally with intimidate. With the U9 intim / hate / threat re-working its pretty interesting when combined with Divine Righteousness + incite weapon. If you're planning on tanking, this is a no-brainer. If you're on the squishy side, then you become a melee version of that low hit point ranger guy that multi-shots all the attention on himself but has nothing in reserve and dies a piteous and un-mourned death. (If you're doing an AC intim-tank, then some favor INT 13 for CE over WIS for the +5 AC feat: Combat Expertise.)

Concentration: Not mentioned in your quote, but my pallies almost never have the room for 'extend' and tend to be clicky intensive anyway, so having to recast Divine Favor / Zeal or failing that heal is... irksome to me. I'm sure many others just time their jump / cast better than I do.

STAT:
A note on the much-discussed WIS stat. I tend to view most things in moderation, and while dumping WIS to 8 is possible, it can be really annoying if you don't already have the at-level +WIS equipment / Tomes when trying to swap spells at a shrine instead of a Tavern or if you get dispelled etc.

Save-wise, most will saves have spell-resistance (SR), so as a Drow with innate, un-dispel-able SR, most holds / other will-based spells will slide right off you and never even make it to the will-save check.

So somewhere between 9 and up to 12 is where I put my WIS (usually 9). Again, I'm not talking about Epic - Raiding short-manned, just what I found really annoying during the leveling process. I can find 10 ML 6 +3 stat items vendored but on some servers, I'm lucky to find one +4 at some obnoxious price on AH.

Anyway, didn't mean to make this quite so long, but I hope that gives you a bit of perspective of some of the options out there. Paladin stat allocation will always be up for some debate because depending on the desired build / effect, any assumed 'dump' stat can go from relatively useless to absolutely critical for some threshold. (i.e. INT 13 for CE, DEX 15/17 for TWF / gTWF, CHA 14/16/18/20 for Divine Might).

Also, you may want to add which server you play on next to that cordial invite.

[yawumpus]

I do appreciate someone trying to help the group by having this skill. One of the few times I get close to disgusted is when I see 4 players standing around an incapacitated cleric and not one of them can heal 3 points to get the cleric on her feat. I just find it's better to use items that cost very little plat than a skill that costs utility.

Note that you can "heal" a fallen comrade faster with a bracelet of aid from the Korthos cannith crystal quest without the failure chance that an item of sustenance (or worse, skill points) has. Wonderfully useful items.

[Adarro]

Note that you can "heal" a fallen comrade faster with a bracelet of aid from the Korthos cannith crystal quest without the failure chance that an item of sustenance (or worse, skill points) has. Wonderfully useful items.

Very true, I mentioned "Alternately, keeping a set of recharging bracers of 'aid' or similar is also a solution." in the sentence above that quote. I didn't specifically name the korthos bracers because they have only one charge as opposed to the 3/3 or 5/5 charges I think you can find on others, but along with the curative cloak also available from Korthos it is certainly a beneficial item to have.

[Gnorbert]

Enjoy your paladin. You are playing the game the way it was originally intended to be played (aside from solo ability ). There will be helpful comments and there will be some comments aimed at the math of "making the best character". Just keep going, your logic is fine and will end up with a good character.

[ProdigalGuru]

Talk to me more about your soling ability once you are doing Gianthold quests.

[lord_of_rage]

Talk to me more about your soling ability once you are doing Gianthold quests.

You are one of the last people to talk to others about bad paladin builds.

[English_Warrior]

On my rogue (with levels of ranger), the counter for deaths caused by an inability to spot DDO's ridiculous traps (elite/epic) would need to have several more digits than the counter for deaths caused by simple hit point loss.

On my caster, the counter for deaths caused by an inability to spot incoming mobs would need to have several more digits than the counter for deaths caused by simple hit point loss.

On my ranger who has ample spotting ability, reducing his wisdom by 6 would decrease his spell point pool by 20%. Since I actually am able to use my ranger's spell point pool for better-than-trivial buffs like freedom, resistance, protection, barkskin (on actual melee), and healing, a 20% reduction in spell points is far from acceptable. Add to that the fact that there are several will-based effects in the game that are quite annoying and/or dangerous and you have a perfectly valid reason to spend points on wisdom as a ranger or paladin.

Wisdom is only a dump stat for players who don't know any better.

These are not good reasons to invest in wisdom...sorry but they are just not.

A couple of levels of Rogue will get your spot high enough to see any trap that is remotely level appropriate even with Wis dumped....if you are having trouble in this regard I suggest you invest in a +Spot item that it suitable for your level.

A few points of WIS on a caster is not going to make you spot mobs that you otherwise wouldn't so I am not sure what you are even talking about here.

The only buff that you mentioned that is not available as a pot, wand or scroll is Freedom. And with dumped WIS you will have plenty of sp to cast a few resists, rams, and fom plus maybe the odd non-wanded heal.

The will save thing can be mitigated with SR or even something like Force of Personality if you feel you need it...or just ignored in most content. Taking down the casters quick helps too.

Much better to put those points into STR or CON.

[Raithe]

These are not good reasons to invest in wisdom...sorry but they are just not.

Sorry, but they are. They just are.

A couple of levels of Rogue will get your spot high enough to see any trap that is remotely level appropriate even with Wis dumped....if you are having trouble in this regard I suggest you invest in a +Spot item that it suitable for your level.

A spot item that takes up a slot? You have any idea how gimpifying that is? Granted particular epic items like the Treasure Hunter's Spyglass can make spot a non-issue for anyone with the ability to use the other aspects of the item and have maxed out ranks...but even then you have to consider the cost of maxing the ranks in the first place. Rogues in particular have a lot more they could be doing with their skill points.

A few points of WIS on a caster is not going to make you spot mobs that you otherwise wouldn't so I am not sure what you are even talking about here.

My caster can spot most stealthed mobs in the game. Elves get a bonus to spot and listen checks, and she actually has some ranks put into spot. The difference between spotting mobs and not is often the difference between wearing a wisdom item (she uses a tiara) and using something else. Since she has no feats to spare as a sorc, force of personality is not an option and as a caster her will save is quite decent (especially because she has a level of bard and has elven enchantment resistance).

Like I said, her deaths due to lack of spot (wisdom) far exceed her deaths due to simply not having enough hit points to cover incoming damage. She can refill her hit point container with the flick of a heal scroll (and has the concentration, stoneskin, displacement, haste, and jump to make it work just about every time).

The only buff that you mentioned that is not available as a pot, wand or scroll is Freedom. And with dumped WIS you will have plenty of sp to cast a few resists, rams, and fom plus maybe the odd non-wanded heal.

Uh-huh. You realize that your healing speed doubles with wand-cast-wand or cast-wand-cast, right? You also realize that there are no ram's might pots, resist 30 pots, or protect 120 pots, right? And you also realize that if you die, all those buffs disappear and you have to recast them, right? Just checking to make sure you've played a ranger or paladin...

The will save thing can be mitigated with SR or even something like Force of Personality if you feel you need it...or just ignored in most content.

Things rangers are good for: killing casters (the process often generates caster aggro), killing beholders (there's a good chance you just got debuffed), and the occasional kiting of mini-bosses in the Shroud (one of which has a mean greater command). As for force of personality on a ranger... what? That is likely to do your will save absolutely no good at all.

Much better to put those points into STR or CON.

Uh-huh . Like I said, wisdom is a dump stat only for those who don't know any better.

[jwdaniels]

A spot item that takes up a slot? You have any idea how gimpifying that is? Granted particular epic items like the Treasure Hunter's Spyglass can make spot a non-issue for anyone with the ability to use the other aspects of the item and have maxed out ranks...but even then you have to consider the cost of maxing the ranks in the first place. Rogues in particular have a lot more they could be doing with their skill points.

If you're playing a rogue, having difficulty spotting traps, and decide that raising your wisdom is a better idea than equipping a spot item, you're doing it wrong. Also, if you're low on skill points as a rogue, you're doing it even more wrong.

Wisdom is pretty much the first stat to dump, always, unless you're playing a cleric or an evoker-build favored soul.

[English_Warrior]

If you're playing a rogue, having difficulty spotting traps, and decide that raising your wisdom is a better idea than equipping a spot item, you're doing it wrong. Also, if you're low on skill points as a rogue, you're doing it even more wrong.

Wisdom is pretty much the first stat to dump, always, unless you're playing a cleric or an evoker-build favored soul.

This

[Raithe]

If you're playing a rogue, having difficulty spotting traps, and decide that raising your wisdom is a better idea than equipping a spot item, you're doing it wrong. Also, if you're low on skill points as a rogue, you're doing it even more wrong.

Interesting reply, because its dead wrong. An equipment slot in DDO is more powerful than six points of stat development. Some very mundane items actually provide six points of stat development... plus something else.

As for equiping a spot item, that presupposes that you know the trap is coming opposed to something else that the spot item is gimping you for. Many of us don't die on content we've already conquered.

As for skill points on a rogue, you can't max them all... balance, bluff (probably even more useful in U9), diplomacy, disable, haggle, hide, jump, move silently, search, spot, open locks, and UMD. That's 12 skills. Not including intimidate, listen, tumble, or concentration (cross-class).

Wisdom is pretty much the first stat to dump, always, unless you're playing a cleric or an evoker-build favored soul.

I'm aware that many of the forumites simply don't know much about how the game works. I am aware of this widespread belief. I'm merely making a bid here at attempting to make a few people understand that it is an extremely faulty position. But keep it if you want. I'll be collecting your soul stone when hold person increases damage taken by 25% despite your fortification.

[Gobbothegreen]

I'll be collecting your soul stone when hold person increases damage taken by 25% despite your fortification.

Which makes it even less dangerous in the only content where you will really get hit by it (Harbor)....

[xSeverinax]

If you're playing a rogue, having difficulty spotting traps, and decide that raising your wisdom is a better idea than equipping a spot item, you're doing it wrong. Also, if you're low on skill points as a rogue, you're doing it even more wrong.

Wisdom is pretty much the first stat to dump, always, unless you're playing a cleric or an evoker-build favored soul.

Wisdom was my only dump stat, started at 8, got a +2 tome at lvl 7 (no neg penalty to spot). Throw in a suitable wisdom bonus item and you are laughing. My char is doing Epic Von5 traps with a base wisdom of 10 and a +6 wisdom item, maxed out spot skill and spot enhancements.

[English_Warrior]

Sorry, but they are. They just are.

While I admire your gumption...you are just wrong.

A spot item that takes up a slot? You have any idea how gimpifying that is? Granted particular epic items like the Treasure Hunter's Spyglass can make spot a non-issue for anyone with the ability to use the other aspects of the item and have maxed out ranks...but even then you have to consider the cost of maxing the ranks in the first place. Rogues in particular have a lot more they could be doing with their skill points.

Tips for noobs 1: You can swap items at will...you don't need to put an item into a slot and leave it there.
Tips for noobs 2: Rogue have more skill points than they know what to do with...plenty for spot if you want it.
Tips for noobs 3: After you get a bit more game experience you realise you start to know where all the traps are and you don't even need spot at all.

Like I said, her deaths due to lack of spot (wisdom) far exceed her deaths due to simply not having enough hit points to cover incoming damage.

This is utter nonsense.... if you really are dying becuase of a lack of spot skill then I am not sure there is much help for you.

Uh-huh. You realize that your healing speed doubles with wand-cast-wand or cast-wand-cast, right? You also realize that there are no ram's might pots, resist 30 pots, or protect 120 pots, right? And you also realize that if you die, all those buffs disappear and you have to recast them, right? Just checking to make sure you've played a ranger or paladin...

Tips for noobs 4: You can get resist 30 pots.
Tips for noobs 5: If you had invested in more CON you wouldn't die so often and rebuffing wouldn't be such a problem

And I did say that you would cast a lot of those yourself when required and still have plenty of sp...maybe if you weren't barking all the 12AC barbs and camoing everyone you wouldn't have sp problems. The FACT is that Rangers and Paladins have plenty of sp if you know what you are doing.

Things rangers are good for: killing casters (the process often generates caster aggro), killing beholders (there's a good chance you just got debuffed), and the occasional kiting of mini-bosses in the Shroud (one of which has a mean greater command). As for force of personality on a ranger... what? That is likely to do your will save absolutely no good at all.

Tips for noobs 6: Rangers get the TWF feats for free...just because you have a bow in your class icon does not mean that is all you can do.

Uh-huh . Like I said, wisdom is a dump stat only for those who don't know any better.

No....Wisdom is a dump stat...and if you still don't get that after everything I have written then that tells us everything we need to know.

Play how you like but don't come in here touting your gimp toons to all the new players it does us all no good in the long run.