All Caster (PM preferred) ToD! 2/12 @ 7 PM EST

[sephiroth1084]

You can add me with Beldagarde Dwarf PM (if I can get her to level and flagged) or Buckhalter WF Sorc.

What level is Beldagarde now?

[Elyanna]

What level is Beldagarde now?

*cough* 4 *cough*

[sephiroth1084]

*cough* 4 *cough*

Oh yeah? Ferrumblood is as well! When are you going to be in game?

[sephiroth1084]

1 spot open still, and probably in need of an alternate or two as a few people are maybes.

[Shade]

Can I ask why is it you think you have to be evocation spec'd to do dps with a caster lol?


Btw count me in on Lacer. (Minor spec'd in nothing / Major spec'd in everything ) jk

Never said that. Just noting that my spec at lvl19 would of done significantly better sustainable dps then my spec at 20.

Mostly because evocation spec unlocks archmage magic missiles, chains missles, etc SLAs. Which are the highest possible sustainable DPS a caster could currently manage, well beyond what you silly palemasters could hope to deal ;p

Now the group is looking solid enough tho, so my 3000+ SP does sound like I might be able to sustain some decent dps using polar ray. all depends on how fast he dies tho.

Either way, sounds like were going in on noob mode, in which case he has so little hitpoints that evne if I do run out of sp, I could poke him with a wet noodle and crush into the ground in a split second.

[sephiroth1084]

Never said that. Just noting that my spec at lvl19 would of done significantly better sustainable dps then my spec at 20.

Mostly because evocation spec unlocks archmage magic missiles, chains missles, etc SLAs. Which are the highest possible sustainable DPS a caster could currently manage, well beyond what you silly palemasters could hope to deal ;p

How much are the AM SLAs doing per shot/mana?

It may be more but, the PMs can be doing aura damage while doing other stuff and our SLAs don't run out when our mana does, nor do they contribute to being unable to cast other spells, even if slowly (Chain Missiles are, what? 10 SP each?).

AM Evoker likely does more, and it should in this kind of situation, but, really, it's weaker in every other context.

[Shade]

How much are the AM SLAs doing per shot/mana?

It may be more but, the PMs can be doing aura damage while doing other stuff and our SLAs don't run out when our mana does, nor do they contribute to being unable to cast other spells, even if slowly (Chain Missiles are, what? 10 SP each?).

AM Evoker likely does more, and it should in this kind of situation, but, really, it's weaker in every other context.

The difference is pretty massive.

Max chain missle is about 900 crit, then the aoe does 700ish to everything around (even ignores shield protection). It's 6SP, sustainable forever if you got lots of spell regen clickies like me. (well forever being well over an hour)
Magic missle, (1sp) cant remember, 300-400ish?
Big thing with those, is that you can max emp and quicken them, spam them ultra fast with minimal cooldowns (6s) and no additional sp cost.
Arcanebolt, no metas but can still get some huge crits (similar to the necrotic bolt SLA, but you can have a higher force crit multi then neg energy, so slightly superior.)
Arcaneblast, same as bolt, but AOE. (similar to necrotic blast, but you can have a higher force crit multi then neg energy, so slightly superior.)
Put em all together and the sustainable dps is beyond your average pug melee, but below a well geared dps melee.
The lvl4/5 ones aren't worth it (fireshield, cyclonic blast)

Don't wanna total derail your PM pimping raid, so just watch the video and enjoy:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NiCbewTiElg@hd=1
(vids at lvl16, so not quite max dmg)

[sephiroth1084]

Arcaneblast, same as bolt, but AOE. (similar to necrotic blast, but you can have a higher force crit multi then neg energy, so slightly superior.)

Uh...how do you figure? Pretty sure that's wrong.

Don't wanna total derail your PM pimping raid, so just watch the video and enjoy:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NiCbewTiElg@hd=1
(vids at lvl16, so not quite max dmg)

If that is your video of killing stuff in Mount Reisalon, I've watched it already, and found it to be...well...pretty boring. Nothing to do with you, but just not all that impressive.

[hityawithastick]

D: Curses, I can't make it. Good luck!

[Shade]

If that is your video of killing stuff in Mount Reisalon, I've watched it already, and found it to be...well...pretty boring. Nothing to do with you, but just not all that impressive.

You asked about what kind dmg evocation archmags do, and I showed you in a video, It's just intended to be a simple demonstration, not a super entertaining video, but rather something ppl can watch to help them decide if they wanna play a build similar to that.

Sorry you found it boring. Some people liked it and thats good enough for me. I think it serves it purpose just fine.

[sephiroth1084]

You asked about what kind dmg evocation archmags do, and I showed you in a video, It's just intended to be a simple demonstration, not a super entertaining video, but rather something ppl can watch to help them decide if they wanna play a build similar to that.

Sorry you found it boring. Some people liked it and thats good enough for me. I think it serves it purpose just fine.

I just mean that I could gather up all the mobs that didn't leash and shieldblock and get pretty close to the same kill-speed, with a net gain of SP. Or could nuke like a good caster should.

I think the AM Evoker stuff is nice for filling in damage between other stuff, or for contributing to a long fight/dungeon, but not something to stand on its own.

[Phalcon]

The difference is pretty massive.

Max chain missle is about 900 crit, then the aoe does 700ish to everything around (even ignores shield protection). It's 6SP, sustainable forever if you got lots of spell regen clickies like me. (well forever being well over an hour)
Magic missle, (1sp) cant remember, 300-400ish?
Big thing with those, is that you can max emp and quicken them, spam them ultra fast with minimal cooldowns (6s) and no additional sp cost.
Arcanebolt, no metas but can still get some huge crits (similar to the necrotic bolt SLA, but you can have a higher force crit multi then neg energy, so slightly superior.)
Arcaneblast, same as bolt, but AOE. (similar to necrotic blast, but you can have a higher force crit multi then neg energy, so slightly superior.)
Put em all together and the sustainable dps is beyond your average pug melee, but below a well geared dps melee.
The lvl4/5 ones aren't worth it (fireshield, cyclonic blast)

Don't wanna total derail your PM pimping raid, so just watch the video and enjoy:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NiCbewTiElg@hd=1
(vids at lvl16, so not quite max dmg)

Honestly I was intrigued by the song in the video, but I wasn't impressed by what I saw. I know I could gather all the mobs you had and kill them all with my PM for about 1/50th of the sp you used. While I will completely agree with you that the AM's missiles and low sp spells do more dps then a pale master its irrelevant, because it's basically only decent on non-epic quests. Ive played the AM wiz many times and I'm over it. It's a lot of wasted AP to get some spell dps imo, and I much prefer the PM's version of free'bee spells, that unlike the AM won't run out ever due to SP. You should try the PM again Axer I think you'd like it a lot more then you realize.

[Shade]

Honestly I was intrigued by the song in the video, but I wasn't impressed by what I saw. I know I could gather all the mobs you had and kill them all with my PM for about 1/50th of the sp you used. While I will completely agree with you that the AM's missiles and low sp spells do more dps then a pale master its irrelevant, because it's basically only decent on non-epic quests. Ive played the AM wiz many times and I'm over it. It's a lot of wasted AP to get some spell dps imo, and I much prefer the PM's version of free'bee spells, that unlike the AM won't run out ever due to SP. You should try the PM again Axer I think you'd like it a lot more then you realize.

If you watch more closely youd notice i made no attempt to conserve sp. I used a lot more spells then just the SLA, one of which was a 80+ SP force missiles i spamed a bit.

As I said, I can sustain the SLA dps for well over an hour of play if I only use those.

Archmage is also extremely effective in epics. Yea not evocation, tho why im not anymore.. But enchantment and conjuration for sure.

As I alreayd told you, I've played as a palemaster a ton already and know all about it. It's good, but to dismiss archmage as inferior just shows a lack of knowledge of the wizard class. They are both great PrEs and fairly well balanced.

[Shade]

I just mean that I could gather up all the mobs that didn't leash and shieldblock and get pretty close to the same kill-speed, with a net gain of SP. Or could nuke like a good caster should.

Do a video of your lvl16 caster checking for the 3 named killing all on the way in a faster time instead of just talk.. so much talk , so little videos to watch.

Hell do one at lvl20. But with only negative energy and FW on the red named WF like i used.. Using full nuke abilities at 20 vs 16 wouldnt be much of a comparison.

The point of evocation archmage is to level up fast and effeciently anyways, and for that purpose.. Imo it's unmatched.

[sephiroth1084]

Do a video of your lvl16 caster checking for the 3 named killing all on the way in a faster time instead of just talk.. so much talk , so little videos to watch.

Hell do one at lvl20. But with only negative energy and FW on the red named WF like i used.. Using full nuke abilities at 20 vs 16 wouldnt be much of a comparison.

The point of evocation archmage is to level up fast and effeciently anyways, and for that purpose.. Imo it's unmatched.

I haven't any inclination to make videos. Hell, I doubt I have enough free space on my HD to fit a video and the software at this point.

As for leveling, from 6-11, I'm sure AM is faster, but I don't know about 12+. For one, I played my wizard completely differently once I got undead form. Through all caution to the wind, threw out my cure pots, and basically stopped caring about what I was fighting, dungeon alert or how many monsters I had around entirely.

Plus, a higher Finger and Wail DC ends up being much faster, once you acquire them, than anything the Evocation spec'ed AM is getting.

It may be worthwhile, but AM is expensive, and requires a big shift as you transition from free MMs being useful to useless.

[Phalcon]

If you watch more closely youd notice i made no attempt to conserve sp. I used a lot more spells then just the SLA, one of which was a 80+ SP force missiles i spamed a bit.

As I said, I can sustain the SLA dps for well over an hour of play if I only use those.

Archmage is also extremely effective in epics. Yea not evocation, tho why im not anymore.. But enchantment and conjuration for sure.

As I alreayd told you, I've played as a palemaster a ton already and know all about it. It's good, but to dismiss archmage as inferior just shows a lack of knowledge of the wizard class. They are both great PrEs and fairly well balanced.

Point taken. Let's clear this confusion up lol haha. Mainly I'm just bustin your B*lls cuz I get a kick outta it but enough about that back to business:

I do not think AM wizzy's are bad. I don't think the difference between an optimized PM vs an Optimized AM is huge but it is a bit noticeable. Will that make any quest worse off for the AM? Probably not.

I agree that the AM's SLA dps is better, there I said it, but I do also think its irrelevant since as a caster I'm not usually nuking. I think its fun while leveling up, fun on red names from vale quests etc where you can notice a huge difference. When in an Epic raid or in a TOD it's not so noticeable and usually you'd be doing other things anyway.

Final Point is I know how you like casters, You want them to run as fast as they can to try and catch up to your fat dwarf and throw buff after buff until their fingers bleed, which isn't even possible as you are always in sprint boost.... So with that said I think you should just change this long ongoing argument to promoting Pure buff spec'd casters with barbarian levels so they can sprint. Wouldn't you agree?


p.s. I'm still trying to figure out this video stuff but I'm pretty sure I could blow away mount reysalon or any quest/instance for the matter just as fast or faster. hehe

[articwarrior]

sounds like a 3 way cat fight, duke it out in teh pvps wills yah?!

[Phalcon]

sounds like a 3 way cat fight, duke it out in teh pvps wills yah?!

Pvp is about as broken as shades caster build... Jk hahahha

[sephiroth1084]

Pvp is about as broken as shades caster build... Jk hahahha

No you're not.

[Shade]

to promoting Pure buff spec'd casters with barbarian levels so they can sprint.

They'd be great if wizards had a better buff spec pre.. Going like transmutation archmage is pretty ****:
Jump and a bit cheaper hastes.. meh.

Maybe wild mage could have some cool buffs. Like super +6 str rage spells or faster then haste-haste (like say 25% melee, 50% run).. But have them casts a ton of sp, and be random so youd have to like use your whole mana bar buffing me just to get it to go off finally once. That would be the best PrE for sure
EG:
Wildmage casts haste, and each cast has a 5% chance of being epic haste instead of haste.. So theyd have to spam haste over and over evn tho they alreayd did it, until it becomes epic haste!

Right now spec'ing for buffs still leaves tons of room and sp for doing other things too.. Which i think causes hasters to get too distracted and forget to haste. Its bad