Which race should a pure rogue be?

[Outlandman]

I am considering a new rogue toon, my first pure rogue. I am debating which race to use. (got drow but no 32pt builds)

Halfling has nice enhancements, but a penalty on str, so less DPS.
Elf gets +2 spot/search/listen, but -2 con and fewer racial toughness enhancements means more squishy.
Drow gets that plus +2 int for more skill pts, +2 cha for better umd/diplo.
WF has more con and more toughness enhancements, many immunities, unlimited time underwater, but nothing really rogue-specific. Also harder to heal.
Human gets Versatility, extra feat and +1 skill pt per level (wait, does DDO give the +1 skill pt? must check.)
Half-elf gets the dilly, HV and +1 spot/search, plus extra uses of diplomacy.

Some help from a more experienced player?

[Quarterling]

IMHO, there are only three races you would want to look at playing for a rogue.

Halfling: Don't be tricked into going dex-build as str-builds are far better, even on halflings. Halflings are iconic, gain bonuses to hit, saves, skills, extra sneak attack bonus, and are simply awesome.
Half Orc: Half Orcs are a good choice because everybody knows more strength equals more damage, though sadly, they are not as adorable as the halflings.
Human: Rogues are horribly feat starved, so the extra human bonus feat is a big help. Plus, the extra four skill points are a nice bonus.

[Lorien_the_First_One]

IMHO, there are only three races you would want to look at playing for a rogue.

Halfling: Don't be tricked into going dex-build as str-builds are far better, even on halflings. Halflings are iconic, gain bonuses to hit, saves, skills, extra sneak attack bonus, and are simply awesome.
Half Orc: Half Orcs are a good choice because everybody knows more strength equals more damage, though sadly, they are not as adorable as the halflings.
Human: Rogues are horribly feat starved, so the extra human bonus feat is a big help. Plus, the extra four skill points are a nice bonus.

If you go the rapier route, Drow are also an option as you pick up some bonus rapier damage. I have played 2 drow rogues to cap, very pleased with them, the main trick is you MUST have at least 14 con, I don't care what anyone tells you. Do do however think when my next rogue TRs I'll leave drow for one of the options above.

[cardmj1]

For your first rogue, I would go Human for the extra feats or Half-elf (dilly cleric). The 13 wisdom will improve your spot anyways and you don't need to worry about umd for heal scrolls.

[Therigar]

What type of rogue do you want to be?

That is a key part of figuring out what race you should choose.

If you are a pure DPS rogue that might sometimes blow up a trap or two then you go half-orc with maxed STR, enough DEX to qualify the TWF line with a +2 DEX tome and the rest CON.

If you are most any other type of rogue then you go halfling. The point about humans is well made but the halfling enhancements more than compensate for the one lost feat.

[Fenrisulven6]

I still prefer the versatility of the Human Boosts.

[Zenako]

The wee ones is the most tricksie ones around....

nasty tricksie "halflings" trying to fool ..... TM name ....

[Goldeneye]

STR-Based Halfling or Half Orc.

Halflings for extra sneak attack damage.

Half orcs are a little un-traditional, but +4 STR, +3 PA damage is very nice. Allows you to be less reliant on Sneak Attack for DPS.

[AylinIsAwesome]

If you go the rapier route, Drow are also an option as you pick up some bonus rapier damage. I have played 2 drow rogues to cap, very pleased with them, the main trick is you MUST have at least 14 con, I don't care what anyone tells you. Do do however think when my next rogue TRs I'll leave drow for one of the options above.

I think Elf is a little better here, as long as 32-point is available. Being forced into the +2 CHA and +2 INT isn't that great, since I'd prefer to focus on STR, DEX, and CON in that situation.

[clkpacker]

For your first rogue, I would go Human for the extra feats or Half-elf (dilly cleric). The 13 wisdom will improve your spot anyways and you don't need to worry about umd for heal scrolls.

I would personally suggest against the cleric dilettante. 13 wis is a lot to invest for skills you're going to get via UMD anyway, especially on a 28-pt build. For a helf build, I'd personally tend toward Barbarian for the extra Toughness enhancements, unless you use Stunning Blow, in which case the extra 2 DC from the Fighter Dilettante is nice.

I might consider a THF build for a 28-pt build. I assume you don't have the tomes to up Dexterity for TWF?

[Feithlin]

Dwarves have nothing specific to bring but have good HP. +2 starting Con, +2 Con from enhancements, up to +40 HP from toughness enhancements really do a big difference for a rogue.
Many mentionned the benefit of a free feat and +1 skill from human. Their adaptability makes it easier to adapt your attributes to your equipment. Damage boost versatility can be used at the same time as Haste boost, thus giving a nice increase to dps.

[Sirea]

What about Half-elf with Fighter Dilettante? That would open up your selection of weapons quite a bit.

[Anneliese]

What about Half-elf with Fighter Dilettante? That would open up your selection of weapons quite a bit.

While that is an interesting option, you can also use masters touch scrolls as long as the weapons are 1H

[QuantumFX]

The correct answer is: Any. All the racial bonuses are do is provide situational DPS perks that don’t matter most of the time. Build to the strengths of the race and observe the rules to playing a good rogue.

[Thaxlsillyia]

all races bring something to the table for a rogue. Contrary to popular belief I do not think a 28 point rogue is 'too gimpy' for high lvl quests. It all comes down to how you play your toon. A smart rogue with 28 point build can outshine even a 40 point (if ever allowed) rogue played badly. Remember... a rogue will peform any roll only as well as the guy controlling him does it.

And i suggest a look into this http://compendium.ddo.com/wiki/Notes..._Dancing_Rogue Not uptodate but the old master was seen sneaking around the forum and a newer version might come out soon... hopefully I will try to list the pros nd cons of each race... most of them have been talked abt is previous posts.

1. human-extra feat and +1 skill point. Ability to add 2 points to an ability of your choice with adaptability enchancements and healing amp... never discount the healing amp...

2. halflings - make great rogues... dext or str build. Nice boosts to sneaky skills, to hit and are in general cute and fluffy I will not agree with the concept of halflings lacking dps. A rogues dps comes from back stabbing and not much from direct damage. But this is a matter of opinion and is based on play style. (ps. opinion tilted in favor of halflings due to my pint sized dragon knee cap cutting rogue )

3. elf - Nice dext allows for easy access to 2 weapon fighting and not str loss. So will make a nice 2 weapon spec rogue with wider selection of weapons to pick from and bonus when using scimi or long sword. Nice rogue class as long as you get constitution to 14... any less and the cleric will be scrapping you off the floor after facing a troll.

4. drow - Intel is something you need to take anyway. The 2 compulsary points spent in charisma is ok as it gives you +1 to UMD... and still leaves you with 2 points more than a regular elf. Probably a great choice for somebody who does not have a 32 point build. Also remember the spell resistance you get helps add another layer of protection for your feeble will saves. Bonus to rapiers offers a nice boost for dext rogues.

5. Dwarf - Many don't like the stubby dwarf runnign around looking for traps... but they do make nice rogues. esp for a 28 point build. Bonus to con is always welcome for a hp starved class. The loss in charisma is not a big deal breaker to me. You can invest it in str/dext/con. Racial enhancements to search helps. Also some situational bonus against various enemies. The enhancement bonus to save vs spells is another nice feature. Will also allow you to improve dext bonus of armors but at a relatively high cost of enhancement points. But can be handy if you don't like the idea of switching to a robe but want to keep dext bonus. Add a fighter lvl for access to D-axe without feat use and get an extra feat in the process. Its no khopesh but nice all the same. The most under appreciated race in my opinion.

6. h-orc - Best class to go acrobat rogue on. But skill points could take a bit of a hit. Access to upgrades to strength and 2handed weapons blends well with a rogue acrobat using a Q-staff . In my planned H-orc acrobat i did not put points in sneaking skills. Could still max rogue trap skills, umd and haggle with intel 12 and can not imagine too many trap failures if you invest in gear. If it comes down to it make a green stell item with intel bonus and slap it on for dealing with traps. but expect a few more umd failures with heal/res scrolls.
With the lack of tier 3 acrobat i suggest some lvls of monk splashed in. lvl 2 wind stance+acrobat Q-staff attack speed competence+haste+rogue haste boost anybody? Or switch to sun stance for no-backstab opponents to get straight up damage. And a light monk path for monky buffs and get some loving from whole party But you will have to splash monk lvls between rogue lvls and hence slower access to the prestige classes.
Alternately add a few fighter lvls to get more feat options and extra hp and may be even str bonus from enhancements. Makes the rogue more solid in fighting upfront even if you aggro the enemy and you will have the hp to back it up.

7. H-elf - Never tried one to be honest. But the ability to splash is another class is real cool. The most direct options without diverting any ability points i can think of for this are fighter dilly for weapon selection or wiz dilly for self buffing wand use if you are a bit short on umd gear. The only major drawback i can think of - terrible graphics X(

8. Warforged - Never played one (turned off by the undead floating tincans). So can't comment much on them. The various WF immunities are nice for a rogue. The improved PA can be handly. But I see some difficulties due to the reduced healing capacity and some divines refusing to heal WF. sadly at lower lvls you just can't UMD a scroll to repair. Will need to pick up some healing amps on the way. The mechanics ability to repair is nice at low-mid lvl quests but wonder if its sustainable at higher lvls. A friendly arcane or a regular group will help a lot.

bottom line - love your rogue... even if he is a WF

[karl_k0ch]

5. Dwarf - Many don't like the stubby dwarf runnign around looking for traps... but they do make nice rogues. esp for a 28 point build. Bonus to con is always welcome for a hp starved class. The loss in charisma is not a big deal breaker to me. Racial enhancements to search helps. Access to d-axe without a feat slot waste and bonus to attack and damage with axes if you want to go strength rogue. Its no khopesh but nice all the same. The most under appreciated race in my opinion.

On a pure rogue, Dwarves do not contribute much, as the DAxe counts as a martial weapon, but Rogues do not have general access to those.
However, especially for beginners, with low plat, 28 build points and/or few GS mats, a Dwarf is the only class where a 19/1 splash for fighter or barbarian actually gives a substantial amount of benefit.

nb: For elves, there is also a line for rapiers. To essentially, it does boil down to Scimis vs. Rapiers and not puny longswords.

[RandomKeypress]

On a pure rogue, Dwarves do not contribute much, as the DAxe counts as a martial weapon, but Rogues do not have general access to those.
However, especially for beginners, with low plat, 28 build points and/or few GS mats, a Dwarf is the only class where a 19/1 splash for fighter or barbarian actually gives a substantial amount of benefit.

nb: For elves, there is also a line for rapiers. To essentially, it does boil down to Scimis vs. Rapiers and not puny longswords.

Master's touch. Cast it from scroll when you enter dungeon and after every rest and you're golden. The scrolls aren't that expensive...

[Feithlin]

Master's touch. Cast it from scroll when you enter dungeon and after every rest and you're golden. The scrolls aren't that expensive...

This would work for any martial weapon, but can dwarves get daxe proficiency this way? I never tried tbh. Could be interesting if it works, but I doubt it.

[destiny4405]

no Love for the WF? was thinking of TR'ing into one. +3 damage from PA and i could take SoS instead of toughness because of the extra CON.

[Jonny_D]

6 levels human, 6 levels half orc, and 7 levels halfling and throw in 1level of half elf for Dilettante