Do Sorc have prestige classes?

[codden]

So then what should my early items for a sorc be?

[Pallol_One-Eye]

If not WF, find and use the highest Fort item you can get your hands on. This will save you more than any other single item.

Having stated the obvious, the next choices would be based upon what you designed the character around. In no particular order:

+x CHA Items
Potency/imp/grtr/superior potency items <-- Increases spell Damage
Wizardry/Power items <-- Increases SP pool
at lower levels Lore items to improve various spells (read firewall, fireball, MM, frost lance, etc) <-- Increases crit ranges
grtr combustion/corrosion/etc items to do the same <-- Increases damage %
pots or clickies of efficacy(sp?), or others to also give you short term damage boosts (usually for end bosses, nameds, etc) <-- acts as short term Potency boosts

Everything else "may" be considered less important. Always good to carry around the max CON/STR/WIS/etc items you can find, buy or steal as saves can be important at lower levels.

Lastly, grab yourself the gnarliest GA you can find and Master's Touch then get swinging when you run out of mana. It does take a bit of time to get a handle on efficient SP usage.

Sorcs are a blast to play, both in groups and solo.

Most important thing to remember......have fun!

**A quick sidebar, if not WF, make sure you constantly add points to UMD every level. Being able to UMD wands and Heal scrolls makes you better able to be self-sufficient.

[Failedlegend]

I would pump str to 12 and put dex down to 8 to prevent being burdened and encumbered easily and do a bit of damage at lower levels by grabbing a greataxe and popping masters touch

Yeah doing that will help up until say lvl 4 if your lucky beyond that you've wasted build points

Warforged are gimped because they have a negative modifier on their MAIN stat. The cheerleaders for this choice always neglect to mention this fact. You are not a caster if you are focused on surviving more than your arcane abilities.

You've never actually played a WF Sorc have you...the difference of ONE dc is barely noticeable (compare an optimized Sorc to a non-optimized Wiz and the wizard would still have a higher DC)...and while your Human , Helf or Drow is running around screaming Hjeal and getting negative levels, maybe even being poisoned,diseased or paralyzed my WF quickly fires off a repair spell while he dances in his WoF and laughs as "Immune" scrolls above his head.

**A quick sidebar, if not WF, make sure you constantly add points to UMD every level. Being able to UMD wands and Heal scrolls makes you better able to be self-sufficient.

ALWAYS put points in UMD :P

[Pallol_One-Eye]

Yeah doing that will help up until say lvl 4 if your lucky beyond that you've wasted build points



You've never actually played a WF Sorc have you...the difference of ONE dc is barely noticeable (compare an optimized Sorc to a non-optimized Wiz and the wizard would still have a higher DC)...and while your Human , Helf or Drow is running around screaming Hjeal and getting negative levels, maybe even being poisoned,diseased or paralyzed my WF quickly fires off a repair spell while he dances in his WoF and laughs as "Immune" scrolls above his head.



ALWAYS put points in UMD :P

Bah....of course ALWAYS put points into UMD, but I was strictly speaking about self-healing here is all.

I must say it is enjoyable as a WF Sorc sitting under a Beholder, watching him move and spamming spells. Pay attention to the direction it is facing/moving and profit.

[Failedlegend]

Bah....of course ALWAYS put points into UMD, but I was strictly speaking about self-healing here is all.

I must say it is enjoyable as a WF Sorc sitting under a Beholder, watching him move and spamming spells. Pay attention to the direction it is facing/moving and profit.

Yeah its quite funny when you, the "Squishy" Sorc (I actually play a Wiz/Rog but strongly considering rolling up a Sorc) is the last one standing, yet the dead Drow is still spouting how great his extra DCs are :P

Mind you the major weakness I see as WF is....our Docents are ugly as hell...why can't caster docents look like...well robes....at least the named ones

[Jaid314]

gear properly, and WF immunities aren't all that big of a deal. i'll grant paralysis immunity is a bit hard to replace without having a friendly divine/bard/ranger nearby, but pretty much every other immunity is easy to fit into an item slot.

i do agree that WF is a perfectly playable race for sorcerers... but i also think human and half-elf have lots going for them as well (not so much drow. i have a drow sorcerer, and would prefer that it be a human or half-elf sorcerer... probably human. i could really use that bonus feat)

[Failedlegend]

gear properly, and WF immunities aren't all that big of a deal. i'll grant paralysis immunity is a bit hard to replace without having a friendly divine/bard/ranger nearby, but pretty much every other immunity is easy to fit into an item slot.

You forgot various forms of energy drain such as negative levels, also the ability to self-heal from your blue bar instead of using actual resources.

As far as the immunities go, well sure you can get SOME of same immunities with a bunch of your item slots but my WF already has that AND now has a bunch of extra slots for other stuff not to mention our natural 25% to fortification allows us to get 100% for with a 75% fort item (see minos legens,HoGF,etc.) which is on several items that people view as must haves for 90% of builds vs. having to get 100% which is far more rare...thus saving another slot add that all up with our natural toughness (both in con stat and racial toughness) were likely gonna be one of, if not the last one standing.

Really the only downside to WF is the reduced healing capacity from divine sources (especially when compared to humans or half-elves with their healing-amp) but since the general consensus nowadays is that Clerics & FvS are either offensive casters or Melee toons and "Healer" is a bad word I find that to be a moot point.

[Jaid314]

You forgot various forms of energy drain such as negative levels, also the ability to self-heal from your blue bar instead of using actual resources.

As far as the immunities go, well sure you can get SOME of same immunities with a bunch of your item slots but my WF already has that AND now has a bunch of extra slots for other stuff not to mention our natural 25% to fortification allows us to get 100% for with a 75% fort item (see minos legens,HoGF,etc.) which is on several items that people view as must haves for 90% of builds vs. having to get 100% which is far more rare...thus saving another slot add that all up with our natural toughness (both in con stat and racial toughness) were likely gonna be one of, if not the last one standing.

Really the only downside to WF is the reduced healing capacity from divine sources (especially when compared to humans or half-elves with their healing-amp) but since the general consensus nowadays is that Clerics & FvS are either offensive casters or Melee toons and "Healer" is a bad word I find that to be a moot point.

with a neck item for it, you are functionally immune to beholder neg levels, and with a clicky from tangleroot you are functionally immune to neg levels from pretty much anywhere else.

and you're acting as if i have a desperate need for more item slots. i'm immune to everything a warforged is, and i'm no longer in need of any slot consolidation. i just need stuff that has higher versions of my current gear. including on my bard, who is still using some korthos gear at level 20 because i haven't bothered to upgrade it.

you're also acting like minos legens is not standard gear for pretty much anyone who doesn't have a min II +45 HP helmet.

simply put, heavy fort is *not* rare at all, it's only "rare" for people who don't make an effort to get it.

self-healing is indeed nice. resources has absolutely nothing to do with it though. if you can't afford heal scrolls (or reconstruct scrolls) to keep you alive, you need to learn to get better at avoiding damage, particularly since your innately superior barter (from high cha) helps with the costs. frankly, i spend a lot more of my heal scrolls on *other* people than i do on myself, same with the restoration and other scrolls i carry.

i could *maybe* see the argument for warforged immunities being highly important to someone who has few adventure packs but for whatever reason has warforged. but ultimately, the immunities are nice but not required, the only major advantage they have is self-healing (and it is a big one), but if you think that's because of resource needs, i couldn't disagree more. it's important because you get quicken with it (which is a feat a normal sorcerer doesn't have to spend), not because it doesn't burn resources (again, if you're burning a ton of resources on healing yourself, you should work on your damage mitigation, because there shouldn't be *that* much incoming damage most of the time).

of course, the drawback there is that not only are you now *two* feats behind a human sorcerer (one for quicken, and one for the human bonus feat), but now you have to leave quicken on all the time if you want to benefit from the main advantage of self-healing with spells instead of scrolls, essentially making you spend more SP to get functionally the same effect.

warforged is a strong race for an arcane, but i find a lot of the arguments in it's favor just aren't as strong as they are claimed to be. the added HP is nice, and certainly i wouldn't object to more HP on my fleshy casters.... but i have enough to get by. more HP is just nice because it's something you can pretty near always derive *some* benefit from having more.

[Madryoch]

You've never actually played a WF Sorc have you...the difference of ONE dc is barely noticeable (compare an optimized Sorc to a non-optimized Wiz and the wizard would still have a higher DC)...and while your Human , Helf or Drow is running around screaming Hjeal and getting negative levels, maybe even being poisoned,diseased or paralyzed my WF quickly fires off a repair spell while he dances in his WoF and laughs as "Immune" scrolls above his head.

As i said earlier it's up to 3 total DC less ... u may say whatever u like but numbers don't lie ...The maximum unbuffed charisma a human can get is 42 then a wf can have 39 (due to 2 less starting and 1 less from human adaptability enhancement) which translates in 2 DC less and if u want to maintain damage and cc capabilities as well as DCs and have bard and wizard past life u have less feats than the 8 required that only human can currently provide thus ditching one of the following feats costing u 1 DC more ...

Greater Spell Focus
Wizard Past Life
Bard Past Life

SO in the end u end up with up to 3 less DC on cc spells ...

Finally as was stated humans and HE and Drow can have UMD of 40 without switching other items other than the main weapon which allows em to self heal with heal scrolls thus being self sufficient and if u play smart u will notice that u have no issue with damage if u get used to avoiding it on epic quests ...I self heal all the time with my scrolls without any trouble and i can solo in epic quests and raids.I never said that high UMD is easy to get but it can be done and that's where the WF will loose ... at least 2 DC...

To the negative lvls i ll remind u that u can use greater restoration scrolls with 40 UMD which returns all lvls lost and heal cures almost every other abnormal status...

I would also like u to remind me how many times have u had the immune thingie scroll over ur head from paralyzation effects from mobs ...U get commanded normally even though in most cases a protection from evil spell will protect u against that. inmy case they rarely cast something that will work on me ... on the other hand i can hold everything and kill it or danceit or hypnotize it ...

[Barumar]

The Savants are Elemental Based.

So... likely, we'll pick an element type.

Some of the things people have suggested might happen are (pure conjecture here):

The ability to transform into an elemental, or take some sort of "form", like Pale Masters do, to grant some elemental abilities.

Thanks, now I have this song in my head:

I am the god of hell fire, and I bring you FIRE!!!

Oh, and now I have my hopes up too...

Barumar

P.S.

Link to You Tube video from 1968:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NOErZ...e_HUR3OEl5_jqg

[Failedlegend]

Thanks, now I have this song in my head:

I am the god of hell fire, and I bring you FIRE!!!

Oh, and now I have my hopes up too...

Barumar

P.S.

Link to You Tube video from 1968:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NOErZ...e_HUR3OEl5_jqg

I see your crazy makeup guy and raise you Big Blue Dress http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2jfJGk2cITg

[painkiller3]

not at the moment however savants prestige line is scheduled for the next update

i may have to roll up a sorc and get him to level 6 just in case

[broolthebeast]

Wf = AMAZING self-healiing, immunities & Con bonus makes you crazy durable

Human = The extra feat and skill points are nice...also has some decent enhancements

Drow = ummm...yeah the extra cha is nothing compared what humans or WF get. (Actually Drow are rarely a good choice due to being capped at 28pts)

Actually drow are a great choice as long as you dont dump your con stat. Secondly, they are not 28points. The 32 point builds were introduced to balance other races with drow, since it is essentially a 32 point character.

Currently my drow sorc sits at 40 cha 28 con. 3k sp and 440 hp, with flawless umd healing.

[Failedlegend]

Actually drow are a great choice as long as you dont dump your con stat. Secondly, they are not 28points. The 32 point builds were introduced to balance other races with drow, since it is essentially a 32 point character.

Currently my drow sorc sits at 40 cha 28 con. 3k sp and 440 hp, with flawless umd healing.

For Sorc its between Human or Half-Elf...with the possibility of WF (Sorc DCs blow anyway) for wizard its the same except no penalties for WF on DCs


human/helf: 18base+5lvl ups+7item+3ench+3exceptional+1human adap+1 litany+2 sorc capstone+4tome = 44 (+17Mod)

drow: 20base+5lvl ups+7item+3ench+3exceptional+1 litany+2 sorc capstone+4tome = 45 (+17mod)

Sure drow is higher BUt it ends up only being by an odd number nullifying their bonus over human/h-elf while humans get a free feat (which could posssibly push their dc even higher) as well as some awesome enhancements (drows enhancements are useless to a caster) not to mention the extra skill points, while Half-elf get their dilettante (Paladin one works awesome) and so cool enhancements (mostly from the human side) so yeah drows advantage nullified with WF being your other option with strong abilities that can outweigh the loss of DC depending on what your going for.

[broolthebeast]

For Sorc its between Human or Half-Elf...with the possibility of WF (Sorc DCs blow anyway) for wizard its the same except no penalties for WF on DCs


human/helf: 18base+5lvl ups+7item+3ench+3exceptional+1human adap+1 litany+2 sorc capstone+4tome = 44 (+17Mod)

drow: 20base+5lvl ups+7item+3ench+3exceptional+1 litany+2 sorc capstone+4tome = 45 (+17mod)

Sure drow is higher BUt it ends up only being by an odd number nullifying their bonus over human/h-elf while humans get a free feat (which could posssibly push their dc even higher) as well as some awesome enhancements (drows enhancements are useless to a caster) not to mention the extra skill points, while Half-elf get their dilettante (Paladin one works awesome) and so cool enhancements (mostly from the human side) so yeah drows advantage nullified with WF being your other option with strong abilities that can outweigh the loss of DC depending on what your going for.

Must of missed the point of my post. I was stating that a) drow are not 28 point builds b) they make just as viable a choice as other races, regardless of the items(epic/+4tome/+7item) which most casual players wont have.

Try drow: 19base+5lvlup+7item+3ench+3exceptional+1litany+2so rc cap+4tome = 44 with extra build points to put as you like it. OR with the airshipbuffs you can just take a +1cha buff and make it 46 for a +18 modifier.

I know full well what the advantages of going human is, I still chose drow for my sorc. Human sorc's are the flavor of the month, just like drow used to be. Just because drow have racial enhancments that suck, doesnt mean you have to put points into them vs putting points into stuff that actually matters.

[Jaid314]

Must of missed the point of my post. I was stating that a) drow are not 28 point builds b) they make just as viable a choice as other races, regardless of the items(epic/+4tome/+7item) which most casual players wont have.

Try drow: 19base+5lvlup+7item+3ench+3exceptional+1litany+2so rc cap+4tome = 44 with extra build points to put as you like it. OR with the airshipbuffs you can just take a +1cha buff and make it 46 for a +18 modifier.

I know full well what the advantages of going human is, I still chose drow for my sorc. Human sorc's are the flavor of the month, just like drow used to be. Just because drow have racial enhancments that suck, doesnt mean you have to put points into them vs putting points into stuff that actually matters.

the problem is finding enough stuff that matters to put enhancement points into.

[shagath]

Anyone else noticed how much less people talk at sorcerer forums nowadays? It's like we sorcerer minded are forgotten. We really need that prestige already.

I'm currently at my last wizard life waiting for prestige to TR back to sorcerer finally.

[wombolombograss]

Just Started a WF Sorc. Digging it. In P&P D&D (say that 3 times fast) I used to say Wizards make better Rogues than Rogues- D. Secret Door, Knock, and Invisibility are pretty much what we use Rogues for. Well, that and crazy damage. Does that translate to D&DO? And would a sorc totaly gimp himself by taking these spells?

[Jaid314]

Just Started a WF Sorc. Digging it. In P&P D&D (say that 3 times fast) I used to say Wizards make better Rogues than Rogues- D. Secret Door, Knock, and Invisibility are pretty much what we use Rogues for. Well, that and crazy damage. Does that translate to D&DO? And would a sorc totaly gimp himself by taking these spells?

detect secret doors... well, i wouldn't make it my first choice. or my second. or third. in fact, i'd just use a clicky.

knock? yeah, i'd suggest learning that.

invisibility? it's a bit of a tossup. level 2 spell slots are hard to come by... and the scrolls work just as well unless you need more than 3 minutes (at higher levels, you can use mass invisibility scrolls, which work just as well unless you need more than 13 minutes... personally, i've never needed more than 13 minutes)

[Solmage]

Just Started a WF Sorc. Digging it. In P&P D&D (say that 3 times fast) I used to say Wizards make better Rogues than Rogues- D. Secret Door, Knock, and Invisibility are pretty much what we use Rogues for. Well, that and crazy damage. Does that translate to D&DO? And would a sorc totaly gimp himself by taking these spells?

Knock is useful, but don't expect it to work on many higher level doors, they have slowly been ramping up the DC check on older dungeons open lock ever since players realized 1 rank + item was all that was required, and newer ones tend to have higher checks to begin with.

(In DDO knock has a save, unlike PnP, and also can't be heightened for whateverdurnreasonthat'spersistedforyears, grumble. If only a 20 were an automatic success...)