Are elves just a flavour race now?

[k1ngp1n]

Elven Wizards will have an advantage at penetrating high spell resistance in Update 9. We're upgrading Elven Arcanum a little bit:

Elven Arcanum I
Benefit: Grants elven wizards a 20 point increase to spell points and +1 Spell Penetration. This enhancement requires at least one level of wizard.

Elven Arcanum II
Benefit: Grants elven wizards an additional 20 spell points, bringing the total increase to 40, and an additional +1 to Spell Penetration, bringing the total bonus to +2. This enhancement requires at least two levels of wizard.

Elven Arcanum III
Benefit: Grants elven wizards an additional 20 spell points, bringing the total increase to 60, and an additional +1 to Spell Penetration, bringing the total bonus to +3. This enhancement requires at least four levels of wizard.

Elven Arcanum IV
Benefit: Grants elven wizards an additional 20 spell points, bringing the total increase to 80, and an additional +1 to Spell Penetration, bringing the total bonus to +4. This enhancement requires at least eight levels of wizard.

Elven Arcanum III actually always required four levels of wizard (the current description claimed it was two), and we're bumping up the requirements of IV.

Spent the day thinking it over. At first I was happy to see a change, but I'm quite positive now that this changes very little at all, simply because it is limited to Wizards. Given to all three arcane classes (Sorc and Bard, of course) this would be a significant bump in increasing elf effectiveness.

For it to matter, of course, you'd also need to make Spell Pen matter. Unbreak Mass Hold. It saddens me that the Compendium was changed.

[CaptGrim]

a drow/human/wf will spend 2 feats and 12ap +7 spell pen
a 20 elf wizard will spend 16 ap for +6 spell pen or 22ap for +7

From this they gain 2 feats and 80 sp, this is not a small trade off it is a good boost to the race.

They are on par with WF for DCs. The change to add +1 to DCs may be ok but the idea of +2 would be too much.

If it needs a buff I would think change arcanium 4(if it is only going to apply to wizards) to a +20sp and +1 int.

This would bring the SP down by +1 and the elf on par with human for DC progression.

This would make you still have to take 1 feat to keep your spell pen on par with other casters. and give something to boost the DC.

If you add +2 to the DCs of elven wizards I'm TRing mine the minute U9 comes out, its a no brainer, they would be the half-orcs of wizards and we need more choices not less.


TL/DR good as is, +2 DC is OP, +1 DC would be strong, +1 int would be better

[FuzzyDuck81]

I only have 1 elf.. a fighter12/monk7/wiz 1, its a shortsword kensai2/ninja spy1 build, and the wiz level plus plenty of feats means i get 7 extended displacement dragonmarks per rest which is a very nice boost to survivability. Other races would be tougher, or have better saves (dont try and sell me on UMD, too much hassle to pump it high enough & only a 35sec displace vs. 3.5min?) but i find it fun & effective to play.

For most characters though.. yeah i think most things are better than elves unless you're after flavour.

[k1ngp1n]

Negative. They have the same 'smite power' as khopeshes.

I am curious as to why this earned a neg rep... :| Anyone have an idea? Of all the things I post, this?

[dkyle]

Negative. They have the same 'smite power' as khopeshes.

I am curious as to why this earned a neg rep... :| Anyone have an idea? Of all the things I post, this?

Probably because it's false: Scimis are better Banishers and Smiters than Khopeshes.

This is because Banishing and Smiting both trigger on crits, and Scimis crit more often. Khopeshes are better for DPS because of the crit multiplier, but the multiplier has no effect on Banishing and Smiting.

That said, whoever negged you would have been more productive replying to you and telling you this instead.

[k1ngp1n]

Probably because it's false: Scimis are better Banishers and Smiters than Khopeshes.

This is because Banishing and Smiting both trigger on crits, and Scimis crit more often. Khopeshes are better for DPS because of the crit multiplier, but the multiplier has no effect on Banishing and Smiting.

That said, whoever negged you would have been more productive replying to you and telling you this instead.

Unfortunately, that post was in reference to Paladin's smite ability, not 'of smiting' weapons.

[dkyle]

Unfortunately, that post was in reference to Paladin's smite ability, not 'of smiting' weapons.

Ah, I see. Well then perhaps the person who negged you made the same misinterpretation I did. Based on that post itself, I don't think I'm the only one who would think you and elujin were talking about Smiting weapons. It takes quite a bit of backtracking to see you were talking about Palis.

[Solmage]

Hmmm, I'm working from the assumption that mass hold not checking SR is a bug that is being fixed with the standard expediency for such bugs. (Basically, it'll get fixed once people are certain it will remain like that for another few years and plan entire builds around it =)

So with that in mind, once that is fixed, I think +4 to spell pen is actually rather nice, when you consider that you have to TR twice as a wizard to get the same benefit, a plain elven wizard would have the same spell pen as a 2x TR'd wizard.

That alone might make me give up on +1 DCs by switching the human or drow palemaster into an elf. As for the archmage, yeah he's staying warforged, and yeah, he'll just have to live with 2x TRing, and I'll happily eat the -1 DC vs human or drow in exchange for the self healing.

Making these enhancements add to DC would make palemasters happy, but would also make humans and drow completely obsolete choices for a race, and frankly while it might overpower them to the point I might change my WF into an elf, is this actually a good thing? No race should be so overpowered that it's just the only real choice.

However, this doesn't address elves for other professions: I'm wondering, would tweaking the dragon marks have some effect? Tier1 dragonmark: Permanent Blur (we can call it Shadow Cloak to be themed), tier 2 Displacement (longer duration) and tier3: Shadow Self: 20% Incorporeal miss chance that should work vs bosses?

(The basic idea would be to compensate for lack of hitpoints by making the elf take less melee damage)

[Alexkawasaki7]

http://my.ddo.com/character/argonnessen/alekkx/

[noinfo]

They are on par with WF for DCs. The change to add +1 to DCs may be ok but the idea of +2 would be too much.

A +2 of DC over WF is not really too much at all really, WF you get a substantial HP bonus compared to elves penalty, A host of immunities and massive burst self healing.

[Jahmin]

Elven Wizards will have an advantage at penetrating high spell resistance in Update 9. We're upgrading Elven Arcanum a little bit:

Elven Arcanum I
Benefit: Grants elven wizards a 20 point increase to spell points and +1 Spell Penetration. This enhancement requires at least one level of wizard.

Elven Arcanum II
Benefit: Grants elven wizards an additional 20 spell points, bringing the total increase to 40, and an additional +1 to Spell Penetration, bringing the total bonus to +2. This enhancement requires at least two levels of wizard.

Elven Arcanum III
Benefit: Grants elven wizards an additional 20 spell points, bringing the total increase to 60, and an additional +1 to Spell Penetration, bringing the total bonus to +3. This enhancement requires at least four levels of wizard.

Elven Arcanum IV
Benefit: Grants elven wizards an additional 20 spell points, bringing the total increase to 80, and an additional +1 to Spell Penetration, bringing the total bonus to +4. This enhancement requires at least eight levels of wizard.

Elven Arcanum III actually always required four levels of wizard (the current description claimed it was two), and we're bumping up the requirements of IV.

Will Helves finally get the first two?