Change Epic Wizard King

[lugoman]

Epic wiz king is a pretty horrible quest and needs to change. It is to long, boring and to repetitious. The effort to finish this quest compared to the raid is out of balance. I think there are a few problems that need fixing.

The first is time. Takes way to long to finish since you need to do all three towers to get the epic chest. You should only have to kill the wiz king to finish. Optionals should be, well optional. If you want all three end chest, kill all three else only kill the wiz king. You still have to find the correct tower.

The second problem is repetition. Skeletons, mummies, skeletons, mummies. The golems dont really break the monotony. Halt Undead makes the quest way to easy. Replace a few skeletons and mummies in the towers with some gnolls and ghouls. Give a random chance to the skeleton wizards to be immune to halt undead to spice things up. The skeletons are also to hard on your weapons. I used a maul with 2 tiers of adamantine ritual and it was broken 2/3 of the way through. Also make the optional bosses harder.

Bump the scroll drop rate. I guess this is true of most epics. I see maybe 2 scrolls per wiz king and that is with around 170ish kills per quest.

[sirgog]

When it came out, Wiz-King was the easy but long token, OOB was the fast (but difficult) token, and Chains and DQ1 were seldom run.

Now, however, there's much easier tokens than WK, and they are quicker too.

IMO there could be an epic chest for Raiyum (50-70 fragments, shards that currently drop in treasure room) and a second one in the treasure room (50-70 more fragments, no shards, but a moderate chance to drop scrolls for any desert item).

[DragoonPenguin]

Stop using halt undead if it makes the quest too easy.

Bring multiple weapons if yours keep breaking.

Try to complete the quest faster.

Skellies, mummies, more skellies and then... A LICH!!! What would you expect to fight in a tomb.

Sounds like you aren't a fan of the quest and are stricken with inconsolable grief when you enter the tomb. Just don't play the quest.

[lugoman]

Stop using halt undead if it makes the quest too easy.

Bring multiple weapons if yours keep breaking.

Try to complete the quest faster.

Skellies, mummies, more skellies and then... A LICH!!! What would you expect to fight in a tomb.

Sounds like you aren't a fan of the quest and are stricken with inconsolable grief when you enter the tomb. Just don't play the quest.

I would but where else am I going to get a scroll? How many times can you run OOB before your head explodes? Chains is to far to run to.

[donfilibuster]

Don't see the problem, many people still do raiyum for scrolls and regard everything but the lich itself as trash mobs.
Sure it's long and a pain when starting with epics but once you get the hang of it it goes faster and can focus on the fight with raiyum.

Shouldn't really change the quest as that's how it is for the lower difficulties, gotta kill the guardians first.
A long quest is only repetition when you can't handle the monsters, you gotta be able to fight undead.
The chamber is a very good quest, with backstory and all.

Neither can't compare this quest to the raid, the quest the first part of a chain and the raid is the final big battle.
Most raids with flagging are like this.

[Shade]

Another new player crying about a quest being to hard and asking for nerfs, what a surpise.

Did you miss the big warning when you entered:


Best of the best? Is that you?
Before this quest was nerfed down to be easier, we were completing it in about 40minutes - all bosses and chests.
After the nerf these days, it takes about 30 min. That is not "too long" imo.

Epic is not for you. Don't ask the devs to nerf it for you. Learn better tactics and complete it faster yourself.
Or:
Ask them to make an "epic casual" mode for yourself to enjoy. Don't make such negative suggestions to nerf the game for others who enjoy a challenge.

[Lord_WC]

Another new player crying about a quest being to hard and asking for nerfs, what a surpise.

Did you miss the big warning when you entered:


Best of the best? Is that you?
Before this quest was nerfed down to be easier, we were completing it in about 40minutes - all bosses and chests.
After the nerf these days, it takes about 30 min. That is not "too long" imo.

Epic is not for you. Don't ask the devs to nerf it for you. Learn better tactics and complete it faster yourself.
Or:
Ask them to make an "epic casual" mode for yourself to enjoy. Don't make such negative suggestions to nerf the game for others who enjoy a challenge.

We all know you are uber and all, but the OP asked for a change because 'It is to long, boring and to repetitious.'. Noone ever said it is hard.

Which btw I don't agree with as probably this is the only epic quest I tend to enjoy. But yeah, epic in general is long, boring and too repetitious.

[Shade]

'It is to long, boring and to repetitious.'. Noone ever said it is hard.

Then why did he specificly call out the epic version?

The quest is pretty much the same on all difficulties. On non-epic youre very much encouraged to do all wings by virtue of the XP they grant.

All difficulties are very long and somewhat repititive. Just lower ones are much easier, and thus faster if you have a character that can kill the enemies fast.

You can beat very hard quests that you otherwise are not expected to win, like this one in a very slow way by virtue of attrition on underpowered characters.

He obviously is taking too long as he doesn't have the characters or equipment to do it faster.

It may not be the best way to create difficulty, but length of adventure is part of the balance.

And he is asking it to be easier, if only by virtue of getting himself a way to get the shards and scrolls faster. There meant to take a long time to get.

The scroll drop rate is insanely low, but a straight increase is not a good solution.

It should remain at 1%, but be fixed by virtue of changing what scrolls can drop where to a smaller list.

My suggesiton: Wiz King, only scrolls for wiz king items + 1-2 rare very desired outdoor scrolls such as bloodstone.
OOBE: Same, only oobe items +1/2 outdoor rares
Chains: ditto.
DQ1: Remaining outdoor item scrolls + raid scrolls
DQ2: Raid scrolls only.

That way you can ar least narrow down your search to 1 quest.

[Lord_WC]

Then why did he specificly call out the epic version?

WK on n/h/e is a joke. Mummies die (again) from one tick, golems can be devastated with CB. On epic they have like 10k hp (well, not the golems), and if you want to kill them, it takes ages. And I wholeheartedly agree that perching on sarchophagi and standing there while you whittle away mob hp is not fun.

But again, while I agree with the suggestion to have specific quests drop specific scrolls, we all know epic is long, repetitive and boring. EWK isn't any different.

I miss the challenge factor personally from epic, but probably that would mean a full AI rewrite.

[sephiroth1084]

I will agree that it seemed odd to me that the epic version of Wiz King suddenly required all three towers to be cleared for completion (ditto for Epic Into the Deep requiring you to do the Hezrou fight for any reward).

Killing Raiyum should get you the Epic Chest for the quest. The treasure room chests should have some special benefits, such as Numot suggested.

Personally, I also think that taking down enough traps for Ingenious Debilitation should get you a bonus chest with maybe scrolls in it.

Other than that, the quest isn't especially long or difficult, although it can get a bit monotonous. Trying to speed run it tends to stave off this problem, but that's difficult for most groups. Cutting the required portion of the quest down to just Raiyum, with bonuses for doing the rest, would solve much of this.

[krackythehoodedone]

I think this quest is spot on at Epic difficulty.
The best of the best carve through it like a hot knife through butter.
The nearly but not quite their yet complete with major trouble and lots of deaths/resources used
The new to Epics and not ready yet get wrapped up in lots of bandages and posted home to mommy.
Great test of wether you and your toon is Epic ready. This also means geared because this quest has specific gearing requirements.
GL

[Undone1]

No, this quest is one of the only quests that is somewhat challenging in the game largely due to a serious fight and wraiths which are, gasp, actually tough. Only thing that annoys me is that the mephit patrolling the basement does nothing.

Only changes I would do would make the quest more difficult but to be fair I would double the shard drop rate from .5%/1% to 1%/2% the quest is too long to get skunked 10 times in a row.

[Lord_WC]

I think this quest is spot on at Epic difficulty.
The best of the best carve through it like a hot knife through butter.

Sorry, that is not true. People regularly solo it, this quest is easy. Long and boring yeah, but probably the most danger you will face is falling asleep while waiting on skeles to roast.

[Talon_Moonshadow]

If you changed out the skellies for something else, this would turn a long quest into a whole day event.

I kinda like the fact that this Epic quest can still make use of the low lvl Halt Undead spell.

Undead are a special kind of monster in D&D. Both powerful and vulnerable.

I think that even with Halt Undead those archers get in a lot of shots against most groups. People really are not careful.

And the Mummies are dangerous enough. Plus other things.

I actually think that this is one of the more interesting epics. Since at least you are using different tactics than all of the other ones.

[Bodic]

you can farm the front room for scrolls seriously a JOKE farm quick and easy.

Now I do agree that the WIZkings chest should be an EPIC with token and not the optional room.

The WORD is OPTIONAL and does not impede the quest completion.

Completion=Token its not like its XP @20 :P

[lugoman]

Another new player crying about a quest being to hard and asking for nerfs, what a surpise.

Curious - are you a troll or do you just not know how to read? I specifically said the quest was easy on epic. Beating on a held mob isnt hard no matter how much hp it has. Maybe for you that is challenging. It always surprise's me when people equate long boring grinds with difficulty.

[stoolcannon]

Another new player crying about a quest being to hard and asking for nerfs, what a surpise.

Did you miss the big warning when you entered:


Best of the best? Is that you?
Before this quest was nerfed down to be easier, we were completing it in about 40minutes - all bosses and chests.
After the nerf these days, it takes about 30 min. That is not "too long" imo.

Epic is not for you. Don't ask the devs to nerf it for you. Learn better tactics and complete it faster yourself.
Or:
Ask them to make an "epic casual" mode for yourself to enjoy. Don't make such negative suggestions to nerf the game for others who enjoy a challenge.

30 mins would be nice. I run it pretty regularly and can't seem to beat about 80-90 minutes. I'm sure there must be a trick I'm missing somewhere.

I'm in agreement with the OP about getting the epic chest for killing Raiyum and optional chests for the well, options.

However, if I knew I could get the epic chest in 30 mins with the right strategy I'd completely rethink my position.

Also, the quest is in no way difficult, just time consuming. I think it's actually one of the easier epics, it just takes awhile.

[Saravis]

I think Epic in general needs reworked, not just Raiyum. Epic at this time isn't about being the best of the best, its about knowing the cheap tricks to make it through the dungeon. Its an absurd notion to me that the strategy for beating Raiyum is to lure him into a trap and plant him there, no need for quality gear or awesome DPS.

[grodon9999]

I think Epic in general needs reworked, not just Raiyum. Epic at this time isn't about being the best of the best, its about knowing the cheap tricks to make it through the dungeon. Its an absurd notion to me that the strategy for beating Raiyum is to lure him into a trap and plant him there, no need for quality gear or awesome DPS.

If you chose to, it's more fun to just beat his ass down.

[Loromir]

Another new player crying about a quest being to hard and asking for nerfs, what a surpise.

Did you miss the big warning when you entered:


Best of the best? Is that you?
Before this quest was nerfed down to be easier, we were completing it in about 40minutes - all bosses and chests.
After the nerf these days, it takes about 30 min. That is not "too long" imo.

Epic is not for you. Don't ask the devs to nerf it for you. Learn better tactics and complete it faster yourself.
Or:
Ask them to make an "epic casual" mode for yourself to enjoy. Don't make such negative suggestions to nerf the game for others who enjoy a challenge.

I don't think he asked for a Nerf....he asked for some variety. He asked to make it interesting. Read the OP again and see if you agree.