Where Does my DPS Come From?

[cforce]

Since this is a barbarian the Op should add the claw set since every barbarian in game wants that and it upgrades the dps over the titans grip. I would suggest adding the epic red dragon scale on non fire resist mobs. There are more rare gear items that the OP could add, but chooses not to. Whether those rare dps items make a significant difference is another question.

Agreed (and edited in the OP) on the Claw set.

Other interesting gear loadouts are possible, sure -- but trying to break down the numbers into a simple "rule of thumb" chart get complicated pretty fast, and is a bit more work than I'll likely tackle. In general, 4 points of STR = ~2.1%, and 2 points of damage = ~1.4% -- extrapolating from there is left as an exercise for the reader .

[cforce]

* Both the FB set and ravager set are ring/belt sets, so you can't have both equipped at the same time. A more likely scenario is FB + shintao or ravager + shintao; I personally prefer FB + shintao for a barbarian because the +2 damage and +2 str is worth +3.5 base damage that gets multiplied by crits and is added to glancing blow base damage, and I think that plus the additional rage, 30 HP (slot consolidation), and +2 con for a pure barb will outweigh the benefits of the ravager set, but that's a personal opinion. Some prefer the ravager for the marginal DPS increase on a barbarian (even though depending on your str score the FB set may end up with a higher DPS) despite missing out on the other benefits of the FB set.

Oops, good point. In the grand scheme of things, though, they still have the same relative value compared to everything else -- I probably won't go back and adjust for this, since it won't really change any of the percentages...

* The greater weapon aptitude enhancements seem to be worth a lot more than expected. The full line is only 6% more magical procs on glancing blows. It would seem like getting force ritual + ravager damage on 6% more glancing blows should only come out to 0.1%-0.2% of your overall DPS (closer to 0.1%). Check to see if you're giving the frenzy/death frenzy damage on all glancing blows, since they proc on all (successful) glancing blows and are not affected by the magical proc rate for glancing blows. Similar to this, the contribution of death frenzy and frenzy seem to be a bit low; I get about a 14% contribution from death frenzy (extra 4d6 damage on main hits and glancing blows, +4 str, +1 critical multiplier on rolls of 19-20) and about a 6% contribution from frenzy (extra 2d6 damage on main hits and glancing blows, +2 str), but I'm using more a "general DPS" model than a "max DPS" model.

Huh -- funny, I thought this was "fixed" in a recent module, no? I may be hallucinating that, so I'll go double check with my Barb.

[sirgog]

Rage grants survivability as well as DPS. As dying is one of the most disruptive things to your DPS, that extra 20hp can sometimes matter a lot. Similarly, Greater Heroism is a very powerful defensive buff. They aren't worth having just for the DPS increase.

One major missing factor in your analysis is To-Hit. Whilst missing on a 2 doesn't happen from level 12 or so through to 19, a LOT of people miss and miss often in epics, especially when no bard is in the group. Malicia in particular is killed much faster in groups where you are successful in convincing the ungeared players to turn off Power Attack.

[redgod]

I think there are some VERY important things to take away from this:

Bards are extremely impactful on DPS. ~6% you say? That's for the WHOLE party. That's a lot more valuable than a barb with eSoS, or even maybe 2 depending on their play style in a raid.

Epic Sos remains too powerful, and makes the game boring since there's really just one sword everyone should go after. Bland. It's literally more important than any other equipment choice you could make.

Epic bloodstones, +4 str tomes, and even super upgraded ToD sets to an extent make a pretty minimally impactful difference on the game.

I think these numbers in response to Maddmatt's questions make it pretty clearly that build and player are FAR FAR FAR more important than equipment in this game to what I think is frankly a staggering extent.

/agreed and [/QUOTE] I think these numbers in response to Maddmatt's questions make it pretty clearly that build and player are FAR FAR FAR more important than equipment in this game to what I think is frankly a staggering extent.[/QUOTE]

this is as it should be

[Kinerd]

THF feats individually would each be 1/3 of the contribution of all of them together. (I should also mention that I use a benchmark of an average of 1.25 targets in glancing blow range for that part of the contribution.)

Thanks! Doesn't GTHF add glancing blows on the third animation, though? Or were you using twitch?

[BlackSteel]

interesting read.

just a small note, all these %'s are going to look drastically different on a TWF character as compared to the THF one listed.

+4 damage set bonus is a huge increase for a TWF, while really only of small benefit to the THF eSOS weilding halforc.

+4 damage on 130 + 6d6 is fairly small.

+4 damage on 80 and another +4 on 60 is a bit more significant.

[timetorun177]

+4 damage on 80 and another +4 on 60 is a bit more significant.

You're not +80 on youre twf? :P

But awesome post.

[Kinerd]

Thanks! Doesn't GTHF add glancing blows on the third animation, though? Or were you using twitch?

Of course, with twitch there would be no glancing blows, so that's out. Let's pretend I just asked "Doesn't GTHF add glancing blows on the third animation, though?"

[Ereshkigal]

so what you're saying is add that icy burst to your epic sos?

[cforce]

Of course, with twitch there would be no glancing blows, so that's out. Let's pretend I just asked "Doesn't GTHF add glancing blows on the third animation, though?"

Ah, good point! I screwed up and left 3 out of 4 glancing blows in when I took away the THF feats, in fact. I'll have to go back and correct that as well, when I have the chance.

[bbqzor]

My own testing showed a few things.
- Glancing blows always have the same frequency now, the feats just increase their damage.
- Madstone haste is 15% same as the spell.
- Frenzy damage doesnt require the aptitude line.
- Many effects change in their value in epic quests, where attack and auto crit mobs come into play frequently.
All of this has been tested since the latest patch. YMMV, but its a few things to consider when going over the numbers. Perhaps it will help.