How dumb are monsters

[Emizand]

Grrr, that nasty caster has put shiny thing down and run through it. Must follow. Ah burn, burn, hot, hot. Oh he has gone to the other side must follow. Ah burn, burn, hot, hot. Oh now he has gone back to the first side must follow. Ah burn, burn, hot, hot.

Come on!!!!

When playing if I encounter a FW or BB I act accordingly.

Monsters aren't that stupid surely, ok mindless ones may follow, but anything with a modicum of intelligence would not just burn itself to death. Would it?

Give the monsters a brain please.

[Trillea]

Grrr, that nasty caster has put shiny thing down and run through it. Must follow. Ah burn, burn, hot, hot. Oh he has gone to the other side must follow. Ah burn, burn, hot, hot. Oh now he has gone back to the first side must follow. Ah burn, burn, hot, hot.

Come on!!!!

When playing if I encounter a FW or BB I act accordingly.

Monsters aren't that stupid surely, ok mindless ones may follow, but anything with a modicum of intelligence would not just burn itself to death. Would it?

Give the monsters a brain please.

You say this like it's easy. Try programming AI sometime.

[Zachski]

Unfortunately, the AI HAS to be stupid.

If the AI is stupid, it'll just walk into the flaring death wall of death. This makes this type of damage overpowered.

If the AI is too intelligent, it'll just walk around the extremely localized wall of death. This makes the spell completely useless.

If given a choice between useless and overpowered, overpowered is preferable. You can't have an inbetween because you'd have to program a derp chance into the monster - and those can easily screw over players or monsters at any time, making it too random.

[pHo3nix]

If the AI is too intelligent, it'll just walk around the extremely localized wall of death. This makes the spell completely useless.

False, if it's intelligent and walks around the wall of death you can just run ahead and block the way with fw or box mobs in more firewalls and avoid the fighting, it would be more overpowered than it is now

Oh, and i saw many players stay in enemy firewalls or passing through enemy blade barriers even since they changed the color, so it's just not the AI that is stupid

[Sinni]

not to mention the:
they, the caster there is throwing fireballs at me, but i can't reach him, all those other guys are standing in my way. must... try... to... push... them... away... arghh... doesn't work. i just keep trying to push. **** caster, hurting me, **** guys standing in my way. but let's just ignore those, only the caster counts, argh, i can't get past them!

[Sinni]

False, if it's intelligent and walks around the wall of death you can just run ahead and block the way with fw or box mobs in more firewalls and avoid the fighting, it would be more overpowered than it is now

well, if it was really intelligent it would consider when it's best to run through a firewall and when not. in case they are boxed in and attacked with other spells or ranged attacks, they'd better run through that FW once and counterattack.

the hardest decision would probably be: there is a fw, right behind the FW players are bodyblocking, behind the blockers there are attackers. what should the AI do then? stand in the FW and attack the bodyblockers? not doing anything? use ranged attacks if available? what i'd probably do is hiding somewhere. the players usually want to progress, so sooner or later they have to give up their position

[Anthorin]

Ummmm. Surely if they werent stupid they would be wandering around Stormreach as players rather than NPCs etc ?

[painindaguild]

problem with AI is it requires some power -> lag. its not too hard to make one, although since most quests are not exactly the same it requires alot of work.
also will really make a difference based on the gear and knowledge of the characters. the playerbase blessed with less intelligence then common and less geared, will simply not be able to complete a dungeon at anything above casual. even while 2 players that are able to predict the reaction and are accordingly geared can turn this into a cakewalk.

I've recently spoke with a someone that gave me some insight, and from $$ perspective theirs absolutely no reason to add any AI whatsoever.
Still i hope Turbine once will get a trainee that puts up some dungeons with enhanced mobs, just out of curiosity if the predicted systemstate will really happen. (additional info is first required ofc, like how many, and wich playerbase has acces to the forums, or a really large friendlist and visits them regulary)
anyways, aint gonna happen soon.

[Krag]

Grrr, that nasty caster has put shiny thing down and run through it. Must follow. Ah burn, burn, hot, hot. Oh he has gone to the other side must follow. Ah burn, burn, hot, hot. Oh now he has gone back to the first side must follow. Ah burn, burn, hot, hot.

Come on!!!!

When playing if I encounter a FW or BB I act accordingly.

Monsters aren't that stupid surely, ok mindless ones may follow, but anything with a modicum of intelligence would not just burn itself to death. Would it?

Give the monsters a brain please.

Bastion elite run.
Grrr, that nasty caster has put shiny thing down and run through it. Must follow. More monsters jump on. Must finish wounded enemy. kill, Kill, KILL!!! Orange Alert, more monsters, Red Alert. Can't move, no heals, party wipe.

Sounds familiar, doesn't it?

[doomboy]

yeah, i mean why have them as monsters then?

[pHo3nix]

well, if it was really intelligent it would consider when it's best to run through a firewall and when not. in case they are boxed in and attacked with other spells or ranged attacks, they'd better run through that FW once and counterattack.

Then the players run to the other side of the FW, what would the mobs do? If they continue chasing the players nothing changes from now, if they stop it happens what i said, you can box them and run away..

The only ways to nerf FW are to activate friendly fire, make FW do a ridiculous amount of damage (10 per tick), spam fire immune mobs everywhere, spam some air elementals here and there..the last 2 options are already used

[donfilibuster]

A point different than the AI... monsters will actually fight to death without second tought and fear.
If you want to be realistic then the monsters can return to death with ease just like the toons would do.
And if you want to be *more* realistic, think of all the noobs that run to their deaths all over the harbor.
You'd think they'd have the brains.

[Broldin]

Impossible. Do you know what kind of resources it would take to run an AI routine for each and every mob?

[parvo]

A better fix is for firewall (and all AoE) effect anyone who enters it.

The AI in DDO is quite good.

[Sparky21]

Impossible. Do you know what kind of resources it would take to run an AI routine for each and every mob?

ever play guildwars? enemies have all sorts of responses to different attacks and spells. they will hide if you are ranging them, spread out if you aoe (usually). there are a few exceptions but the enemies are on some sorf of save roll, giving them a chance to react smartly, and a chance to suicide into your attack.

more challenge = less mindless clicking

[Lorien_the_First_One]

Grrr, that nasty caster has put shiny thing down and run through it. Must follow. Ah burn, burn, hot, hot. Oh he has gone to the other side must follow. Ah burn, burn, hot, hot. Oh now he has gone back to the first side must follow. Ah burn, burn, hot, hot.

Come on!!!!

When playing if I encounter a FW or BB I act accordingly.

Monsters aren't that stupid surely, ok mindless ones may follow, but anything with a modicum of intelligence would not just burn itself to death. Would it?

Give the monsters a brain please.

As someone who has levelled a couple clerics and an fvs... players use the same AI as the mobs, espcially before the idiot-colour-coding was added to enemy blades and firewalls. They used to poison themselves to death in cloudkill before that was neutered too.

[Malison]

False, if it's intelligent and walks around the wall of death you can just run ahead and block the way with fw or box mobs in more firewalls and avoid the fighting, it would be more overpowered than it is now

PnP: Enemy caster casts summon monster. PC's take his full round casting time to...leave the area for 2 minutes. Summon wears off. Profit.
DDO: Enemy caster has infinite sp.
Balance requires enemies to be stupid by nature of their bloated hp and unlimited resources.

Oh, and i saw many players stay in enemy firewalls or passing through enemy blade barriers even since they changed the color, so it's just not the AI that is stupid

chuckle, +1

[Ganolyn]

Oh, and i saw many players stay in enemy firewalls or passing through enemy blade barriers even since they changed the color, so it's just not the AI that is stupid

I do it all the time. Of course, when I do it all you see above my head is:

SAVE

SAVE

SAVE

SAVE...

[TheSwamper]

How dumb are they?

True Story: I offered this ogre 1000 plat if he could just answer a simple, skill-testing math question. All he did was growl and swing a big club at me. I was like "Dude! 1000 plat in it for ya!" But no, just a bunch of grunts and more club swinging. So I stabbed him. /shrug

[Zenako]

As someone who has levelled a couple clerics and an fvs... players use the same AI as the mobs, espcially before the idiot-colour-coding was added to enemy blades and firewalls. They used to poison themselves to death in cloudkill before that was neutered too.

No need to up the Mob AI until we get an across the board PLAYER AI boost as well...

second third and quadruple support this observation!!

"Umm dude, that is not our blade barrier...in case you didn't notice there are no clerics in the party!"...."oh, thats why its hurting me..." "duh!"...

You can replace Blade Barrier with any persistent spell...even Disco Balls...and th duh! moments keep on a rolling...

so until then, the mobs can be stupid too...