To heal or not to heal...

[NaturalHazard]

in a low level quest the warforged barb starts smashing explosive barrels forcing the frustrated cleric to was sp healing him, "*** you doing that for?" says the cleric."sorry I cant help it" replies the barb "ive been hit with a feeble mind spell and my inteligence score is now 1".

[Tusuki]

Well... After a couple years as a cleric i can say: They wont get better just have more hps and get harder to heal!

You can just keep telling them what to do and if they dont listen let them die, not much else to do ... Well leave the group usually works too!

Been running epics with "nice" WF barbs that doesnt have any Healers Friend ench. no heal amp and sometimes i wonder if they even have any fort...

[FuzzyDuck81]

Been running epics with "nice" WF barbs that doesnt have any Healers Friend ench. no heal amp and sometimes i wonder if they even have any fort...

WF always have fort.. they get a whole 25% built-in!

luckily i've never ran into any WF with the improved fortification feat - it appears even the most "special" player is capable of reading THAT much into a feat description anyway.

[Malison]

Clerics and FvS(to a certain extent) are the only class in the game where people expect things from them constantly during a quest. Yeah we ask Bards for new songs and haste and rage.....as we ask casters for haste and rage.

and firewalls. It shocks me sometimes how many people don't understand that there are arcane spells in the game other than firewall as much as it shocks me when people don't understand there are divine spells other than cures.

...it means they are PUGGING as a healer still and that right there earns them the right.I wonder do you PUG your healer often?

To apply a thought from another recent thread,
If you build a cleric that doesn't make healing a priority, you are building a cleric that is only half a cleric.
Along with its corollary,
If you build a cleric that doesn't make cc a priority, you are building a cleric that is only half a cleric.

At best, I'll use Divine Healing on them, the idea being that they will get in less trouble as their health bar is slowly bumped up 3 pts at a time.

The trouble with not healing someone is that they won't learn unless you also tell them why they aren't getting heals. This, though, is an awesome idea for what you might term a trial period after you've told the fool to stop blowing up barrels with his red bar.

[Yeza]

When I read the OP about the ringleader quest, it reminds me of my last run through this quest:
I entered the quest with my lvl4 Wizard and my Hireling Kurik Forgewarden (lvl4, Fighter). He got "Bull's Strength" and "Blur" and I made him agressive and then I piked the whole quest.
I ... err ... he got the "Onslaught Bonus", too.

[DrenglisEU]

some people have a great a statement in their bios on their healers

... "I don't/can't heal stupid"

This is a extremly good statement!!!

[bryanmeerkat]

Its usually more mana efficient from level 6 casting ability on wards to drop a bladebarrier , let everyone who isnt moving the mobs through the bladebarrier die then kite everything til its dead . Pick up any stones and carry them with you to the nearest shrine .

However this isnt a very popular method with the rest of the party

[djaffi]

[QUOTE=QuantumFX;3519334][COLOR="Cyan"]To hjeal, or not to hjeal: that is the question.
Whether ‘tis nobler for the caster to suffer the mana and consumable loss caused by outrageous PuG member,
Or to take arms against the troublemaker, and by opposing end them?
To let them die: to sleep; no more; and by a sleep to say we let them become soulstones and the XP bonus lost.

+1 for adapting hamlet to DDO

[Arachidamya]

Is this where a spellsinger can help? I like the dvs as well scratch my back i scratch yours.

Oh hells yes. Bards are the only class that gets higher DV priority than another cleric in the party, in my book.

[Chette]

I don't pug very much on my healers, but when I do, I tend to zerg and expect that if people want me to heal them they will have to keep up. I never top people up, but if they get down to 25% or so I'll toss them something (assuming I have the spell points). I find that this quickly lets people know that I'm not their babysitter, but that they can count on me in an emergency.

Sometimes people are new and don't understand the game very well. Sometimes people also don't speak english very well and aren't sure what you're asking of them. In the situation you described you may have had some combination of the above, or you may have had an idiot. I would have healed him once, and typed out in party chat, please don't break exploding barrels unless you're prepared to repair yourself afterwards. If he did it again I would have typed out to Mr Barb that you're not going to waste your spell points healing him for exploding barrels and continued on. If he died, he learns a lesson. It's not going to get the quest done any faster to have to keep running over to him to heal him, keep moving, grab his stone if it's convenient, if it's not, make him release, or go back after the quest is over. Generally, if you're looking for speedy pugs, you have to be the one driving it. Know the quests, run ahead and people will follow you. This is a great power you have as a devine

[QuantumFX]

To hjeal, or not to hjeal: that is the question.
Whether ‘tis nobler for the caster to suffer the mana and consumable loss caused by outrageous PuG member,
Or to take arms against the troublemaker, and by opposing end them?
To let them die: to sleep; no more; and by a sleep to say we let them become soulstones and the XP bonus lost.

+1 for adapting hamlet to DDO

I borrowed the idea.

[JasonJi72]

I love these threads I really do. Having played a few clerics and fvs', I can give advice from the perspective of being a non-noob / non-vet. I almost always PUG. You can meet some interesting people this way, and if makes for some fun times. One instance comes to mind. Gweylans on elite. The mediocre rogue left. They wanted to get the extra traped chest. I told them they couldnt get it without a rogue, but I would go watch them die. One by one, they all died trying to get the chest. I laughed, and commented about how funny that was. Somebody got upset with me, but I was too busy laughing to care.

Recently I have made the switch to other types of characters since I can only take incremental doses of playing a "healer", but I do love the class', and I'm sure I will still play them again. I do have many stories, but I won't go into them.

Some of the things I do while playing a cleric/fvs:

1. cc as much as possible WITH party coordination if possible. cc and zerg if cooperation is not likely.
2. If I am having issues with a mana sponge who is not worth the trouble, I give 2 warnings and direction. When that doesn't work, I only heal them to about 10-30% of their red bar, if/when I get around to them. After that, it is somebody elses job to carry their stone, not mine.
3. Sometimes I will just duo the quest with a strong player if the others are falling short. I do this mainly to prevent them from dying, not to be mean.
4. I do carry all the necessary resources to use if need be, and I will use them, BUT I do set a limit to how much I will use directly proportional to the difficulty of the quest and the EFFORTS of the group to complete it. If a group is honestly trying and using resources of their own, I will give everything I can to help them.
5. Sometimes it is better to let somebody die, and not raise them until after the battle. (Sometimes it is better to not raise them at all, but if you are a cleric/fvs you have a heart lol.)
6. Realization that some quests will require more resources than others, and to prepare for them and not do too many in sequence was also a good thing for me to learn.

Things I do when playing a non-cleric/fvs:

1. Heal myself and take care of my own ailments.
2. Heal myself and take care of my own ailments.
3. Heal myself and take care of my own ailments. (Gee I really hope somebody reads this.)
4. Help heal the party between and during battles situationally.
5. Heal the cleric/fvs.
6. Manage my own aggro, and take out the casters first.
7. Do my best to not be a burden to the party, and help out the best I can.
8. Try not to do anything unusually dumb.
9. When I die, I blame only myself.

Whenever a new player asks me which character is best/easiest for learning the game, I always give the same response. "Every player should learn to play a cleric effectively first and foremost. You will be able to get into any quest, see all kinds of builds and playstyles, learn how to single handedly ensure the success of the party, and know what is expected of your other characters from the 'healer'."

Anyway... as I always say... Good Times!

[PNellesen]

Some of the things I do while playing a cleric/fvs:

1. cc as much as possible WITH party coordination if possible. cc and zerg if cooperation is not likely.
2. If I am having issues with a mana sponge who is not worth the trouble, I give 2 warnings and direction. When that doesn't work, I only heal them to about 10-30% of their red bar, if/when I get around to them. After that, it is somebody elses job to carry their stone, not mine.
3. Sometimes I will just duo the quest with a strong player if the others are falling short. I do this mainly to prevent them from dying, not to be mean.
4. I do carry all the necessary resources to use if need be, and I will use them, BUT I do set a limit to how much I will use directly proportional to the difficulty of the quest and the EFFORTS of the group to complete it. If a group is honestly trying and using resources of their own, I will give everything I can to help them.
5. Sometimes it is better to let somebody die, and not raise them until after the battle. (Sometimes it is better to not raise them at all, but if you are a cleric/fvs you have a heart lol.)
6. Realization that some quests will require more resources than others, and to prepare for them and not do too many in sequence was also a good thing for me to learn.

Pretty much exactly how I play, especially point 4.

Things I do when playing a non-cleric/fvs:

1. Heal myself and take care of my own ailments.
2. Heal myself and take care of my own ailments.
3. Heal myself and take care of my own ailments. (Gee I really hope somebody reads this.)
4. Help heal the party between and during battles situationally.
5. Heal the cleric/fvs.
6. Manage my own aggro, and take out the casters first.
7. Do my best to not be a burden to the party, and help out the best I can.
8. Try not to do anything unusually dumb.
9. When I die, I blame only myself.

Same for me here as well. I've actually had to become "healer" with my Ranger a couple times when the cleric ran out of SP, didn't have any wands, and died before I could give him mine. I now make it a point to carry 2 or 3 wands and give one to the cleric at the beginning of the quest.

Whenever a new player asks me which character is best/easiest for learning the game, I always give the same response. "Every player should learn to play a cleric effectively first and foremost. You will be able to get into any quest, see all kinds of builds and playstyles, learn how to single handedly ensure the success of the party, and know what is expected of your other characters from the 'healer'."

I agree in principle with that, but you should also mention that you need a thick skin to play a cleric. My first character was a cleric, and I almost quit the game because of a couple of the comments made in party chat when I was first learning how to play. It didn't happen very often, but enough to make me consider whether I wanted to keep playing or not.

[JasonJi72]

I agree in principle with that, but you should also mention that you need a thick skin to play a cleric. My first character was a cleric, and I almost quit the game because of a couple of the comments made in party chat when I was first learning how to play. It didn't happen very often, but enough to make me consider whether I wanted to keep playing or not.

True, very true.

[Arachidamya]

Pretty much exactly how I play, especially point 4.


Same for me here as well. I've actually had to become "healer" with my Ranger a couple times when the cleric ran out of SP, didn't have any wands, and died before I could give him mine. I now make it a point to carry 2 or 3 wands and give one to the cleric at the beginning of the quest.

I have no compunctions about leaning on those who can heal to do so. My bio includes the line, "9 of the 48 spells I have set are healing." I do not hesitate to DV backup healers who have spent SP to help heal themselves / the party (it's sp I didn't have to spend, considering it's not like I can DV myself.)

I throw healing wands at any backup healer - Rangers, Pallys and anybody else who can use them. The entire point of me zerging and spreading the burden of healing is so I don't have to spend the entire time shooting heal spells at their backsides (or waiting to shoot heal spells at their backsides, as the case may be.) That's just deathly boring. Whether or not I'm using my SP or a wand doesn't change the boringness of it.

Tbh, it's a bit annoying to have every character throw heal wands, scrolls, etc at me. For one thing, Radiant. For another, my inventory slots are as finite as everybody else's and I have fifteen hundred spell points, fifteen turns and fifty different ways to heal you before I need an item. YOU, on the other hand, are limited to the following choices: wands, potions, and me. And I get crabby about saving your bacon.

I agree in principle with that, but you should also mention that you need a thick skin to play a cleric. My first character was a cleric, and I almost quit the game because of a couple of the comments made in party chat when I was first learning how to play. It didn't happen very often, but enough to make me consider whether I wanted to keep playing or not.

I, probably like many hardcore cleric players, wrote my bio because of the comments. The first time I got called a pocket cleric was by an arcane in the middle of the Necro 2 chain. So I just quit turning undead. ^_^

[Funkijazz420]

Two words.... Veteran Status. Then look for groups that actually have semi intelligent group descriptions. If none exist create your own.

[bccorrupt817]

The best tip I can give is on my bards or cleric I normally heal others to 75-95% after a fight, but stupid I only heal to 25-50%. Just this one thing seems to completely change how most people play.

Also in the low-mid levels on my cleric if the pug felt iffy immediately after zoning in I would type something to the effect of "I mostly heal with radiant servant bursts, so if you wander off you'll get a lot less heals than the rest of the party". A simple statement like that never set a bad tone, but seemed to work really well at getting people to be more aware of not taking abnormal damage or zerging ahead into mobs/traps they couldn't handle.

[SaneDitto]

WF always have fort.. they get a whole 25% built-in!

luckily i've never ran into any WF with the improved fortification feat - it appears even the most "special" player is capable of reading THAT much into a feat description anyway.

I actually ran into one that had the feat. You have no idea how flabbergasted I was to see the "Immune" text pop up when I waved a Cure Critical wand at him.

[Entelech]

WF always have fort.. they get a whole 25% built-in!

luckily i've never ran into any WF with the improved fortification feat - it appears even the most "special" player is capable of reading THAT much into a feat description anyway.

I have.

It got REAL obvious in the Shroud, where I ran into this guy. Let's just say he had time to ponder his decisions in parts 4 and 5.

[SaneDitto]

Ten bucks it's the same guy.