LF 28pt Human Wiz/Rog

[azmodeus1]

searched for about an hour now and couldn't find a basic 28 pt human wiz/rog with trap capabilities. self healing isn't an issue. my wife wants to try out a wizard, i've never played one, so if anyone could link to a template that has a full plan to lv20 it would be great appreciated.

thanks.

[TheDearLeader]

If I may:

While it certainly can be done, using 28-point builds to multiclass is normally detrimental.
If I were to make a constructive suggestion, I would say get 400 Favor on one server to unlock Drow. Its still 28-point-build, but it has some additional niceties that a Wiz/Rogue may find beneficial.

Exploring this a bit further, if you're looking for strictly spells + traps:
Stats come pre-modified to fit the Drow's natural bonuses and penalties :
Str - 8
Dex - 12
Con - 14
Int - 20
Wis - 8
Cha - 10

This Build would have 7 feats, and 4 Bonus metamagic feats (assuming Wiz 18/Rogue 2)
Some to consider are: Toughness, Insightful Reflexes, Extend/Empower/Maximize Spell. Those are a bare minimum baseline. Other feats, such as Spell Focuses, and Spell Penetration, will be more necessary as the game goes on. For Archmage, Mental Toughness is also required.

Sorry if this isn't a cookie cutter 1-20 here's what you do, but its what I can think of while sitting here. Hope it helps.

[Parody]

Human wiz 18/rogue 2: Palemaster

Str 14 Con 14 Int 18 (this is so you can melee with this build up till firewall)

Rogue 1. Insightful Reflex
H. Toughness
Wiz1: Extend Spell
3. SF: Enchantment
Wiz5: SF: Necromancy
6. Maximize Spell
9. Empower Spell
Rogue lvl 2 at 10 or 9. (in preparation of Gianthold)
Wiz 10: Heighten Spell
12: Greater Spell Focus: Necromancy
15: Greater Spell Focus: Enchantment
Wiz 15: Spell Pentration
18: Greater Spell Penetration

Possible paths: At the end of this build, you may consider a lesser heart of wood +3 to get rid of the rogue trap skills and become a pure wizard 20 and rearrange the stats to more con instead of strength. Though I personally like the survivability you gain via palemaster as well as the DCs being roughly the same with lich form = +2 int. You can also consider archmage, which means, mental toughness by lvl 6 instead of spell focus necromancy.

Low lvl equipment: Guard robes and mithral guard shield + fireshield + cold shield = enemies die when they hit you. Supposedly, if self healing is not an issue, this mage would be able to "tank" whilst dealing great damage as they get hit... Not to mention, they still have firewall they can jump around in.

Mid level: +Superior? (or was it greater?) Inferno clicky of IV or higher for firewall. The +50% dmg boost is all you'll need instead of turning on maximize/empower (but its nice the option is there if needed).

Feats: They were taken at the levels they'd be most useful at with the mindset melee rules until you have enough spell points or palemaster ability to spam spells, and even then, its a nice secondary/sneak attackable thing to do.

Race: This build is even tougher while leveling as a warforged, though if self healing isn't an issue and you can wait till palemaster, then by all means, the extra 1 int and feat humans provide over warforged can be handy.

[azmodeus1]

thanks that actually helps with the feats listed and such. niether of us played a wiz yet. as far as drow goes, we're on server 5/7 getting up to 500 favor, so still trying out classes to decide what we want to stick with, so drow will be an option when we're done the once per server bonus favor farming.

[mindlessdrone1991]

/snip

What he said. Remember to take first level as rogue for the x4 skills.

[TheDearLeader]

Ah. See? There ya go. Someone gave you the hookup that I was only fumbling with.

I'm surprised about the Str, but I suppose with Insightful Reflexes, Dex isn't helping you much anyway.

Only thing I'd note as a *possible* alternative is Swap out SF and GSF: Necromancy for Mental Toughness and GSF: Enchantment, and pick up Archmage. Not saying one's better than the other, just mentioning what would have to change to get Archmage into the build and have it be useful.

[Feithlin]

Here are the attributes of the 18 wiz / 2 rogue build I'm leveling (level 18 atm): Con 14 Int 18 and Cha 10 or Str 10, can't remember. Personnaly, I took mental toughness feat to increase a bit the sp pool and I fought it was quite helpful. Additionnaly, it's a requisite for Archmage PrE, which is handy for the additionnal sp you can get from it. At higher level, you could switch to pale master if you like. Mental toughness would replace GSF: enchant in the list of Parody (you should change the order of the feats too if you plan on getting Archmage instead of Palemaster as he probably did).

[tjaysteno]

I suggest avoiding Drow; end game they end up with about 40 or so less hp compared to human. On a class that's already short on hp, that's a large chunk. In exchange they get +1 DC and a few more sp. I rolled a WF wiz/rog a while back and love the self-heals. Humans, however, get more skill points which is pretty big for the build. If you have WF consider using one, otherwise humans are a very close second IMO.



Here's a quick build I came up with. Emphasis on quick though so take it with a grain of salt. I went PM with this one even though I went AM with mine. The nice thing about choosing SF:Necro and GSF:Necro is that you can switch easily between both PrE's, but of course it's up to you.

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 3.7.2
DDO Character Planner Home Page

Level 20 True Neutral Human Male
(2 Rogue \ 18 Wizard) 
Hit Points: 226
Spell Points: 1438 
BAB: 10\10\15\20
Fortitude: 9
Reflex: 18
Will: 11

                  Starting            Ending          Feat/Enhancement
Abilities        Base Stats         Base Stats         Modified Stats
(28 Point)       (Level 1)          (Level 20)           (Level 20)
Strength             14                 16                   16
Dexterity             8                 10                   10
Constitution         14                 16                   17
Intelligence         18                 25                   28
Wisdom                8                 10                   10
Charisma              8                 10                   10

Tomes Used
+1 Tome of Intelligence used at level 3
+2 Tome of Intelligence used at level 7
+2 Tome of Strength used at level 20
+2 Tome of Dexterity used at level 20
+2 Tome of Constitution used at level 20
+2 Tome of Wisdom used at level 20
+2 Tome of Charisma used at level 20

                  Starting            Ending          Feat/Enhancement
                 Base Skills        Base Skills        Modified Skills
Skills           (Level 1)          (Level 20)          (Level 20)
Balance               3                 10                   10
Bluff                -1                  0                    0
Concentration         4                 26                   26
Diplomacy            -1                  0                    0
Disable Device        8                 32                   33
Haggle                3                  4                    4
Heal                  1                  2                    2
Hide                 -1                  0                    0
Intimidate           -1                  0                    0
Jump                  6                  7                    7
Listen                3                  4                    4
Move Silently        -1                  0                    0
Open Lock             3                  6                    6
Perform              n/a                n/a                   n/a
Repair                4                  9                    9
Search                8                 32                   33
Spot                  3                 23                   24
Swim                  6                  7                    7
Tumble                3                  4                    4
Use Magic Device      3                 23                   23

Level 1 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+4)
Skill: Concentration (+2)
Skill: Disable Device (+4)
Skill: Haggle (+4)
Skill: Heal (+2)
Skill: Jump (+4)
Skill: Listen (+4)
Skill: Open Lock (+4)
Skill: Search (+4)
Skill: Spot (+4)
Skill: Swim (+4)
Skill: Tumble (+4)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+4)
Feat: (Selected) Insightful Reflexes
Feat: (Human Bonus) Toughness


Level 2 (Wizard)
Skill: Concentration (+3)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Feat: (Wizard Bonus) Extend Spell


Level 3 (Wizard)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Mental Toughness


Level 4 (Wizard)
Ability Raise: INT
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1.5)


Level 5 (Wizard)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1.5)


Level 6 (Wizard)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+0.5)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Augment Summoning
Feat: (Wizard Bonus) Spell Focus: Necromancy


Level 7 (Wizard)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+0.5)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 8 (Wizard)
Ability Raise: INT
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 9 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+6)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+6)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Maximize Spell


Level 10 (Wizard)
Skill: Concentration (+2)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+0.5)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 11 (Wizard)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 12 (Wizard)
Ability Raise: INT
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Wizard Bonus) Empower Spell
Feat: (Selected) Greater Spell Focus: Necromancy


Level 13 (Wizard)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 14 (Wizard)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 15 (Wizard)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Heighten Spell


Level 16 (Wizard)
Ability Raise: INT
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1.5)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 17 (Wizard)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+0.5)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Wizard Bonus) Quicken Spell


Level 18 (Wizard)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+0.5)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Spell Penetration


Level 19 (Wizard)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+0.5)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 20 (Wizard)
Ability Raise: INT
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+0.5)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Enhancement: Rogue Haste Boost I
Enhancement: Human Adaptability Constitution I
Enhancement: Human Versatility I
Enhancement: Wizard Improved Empowering I
Enhancement: Wizard Improved Empowering II
Enhancement: Wizard Improved Maximizing I
Enhancement: Wizard Improved Maximizing II
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness II
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training I
Enhancement: Improved Disable Device I
Enhancement: Improved Search I
Enhancement: Improved Spot I
Enhancement: Wizard Lineage of Elements I
Enhancement: Wizard Lineage of Elements II
Enhancement: Wizard Lineage of Elements III
Enhancement: Wizard Lineage of Deadly Elements I
Enhancement: Wizard Lineage of Deadly Elements II
Enhancement: Wizard Lineage of Deadly Elements III
Enhancement: Wizard Elemental Manipulation I
Enhancement: Wizard Elemental Manipulation II
Enhancement: Wizard Elemental Manipulation III
Enhancement: Wizard Elemental Manipulation IV
Enhancement: Wizard Spell Penetration I
Enhancement: Wizard Energy of the Scholar I
Enhancement: Wizard Energy of the Scholar II
Enhancement: Wizard Energy of the Scholar III
Enhancement: Wizard Intelligence I
Enhancement: Wizard Intelligence II
Enhancement: Wizard Intelligence III
Enhancement: Shroud of the Lich
Enhancement: Wizard Pale Master I
Enhancement: Wizard Pale Master II
Enhancement: Wizard Pale Master III
Enhancement: Summon Blackbone Knight
Enhancement: Summon Frostmarrow Knight
Enhancement: Summon Skeletal Knight

For a 28 point build I would recommend the following on a human:
Str 14 - This helps lets you jump into melee during the early levels before casters come into their own.
Dex 8 - AC isn't big on a wiz and Insightful Reflexes feat uses Int for Reflex anyway
Con 14 - You probably already know but it's worth mentioning; Con is not a dump stat.
Int 18 - max this out, of course
Wis 8 - Dump stat
Cha 8 - Dump stat

Tier 1 skills - Max out Concentration, Search, and Disable device
Tier 2 skills - Choose between UMD and Spot. Max one, get the other as high as possible.
Tier 3 - Get a mod of 10 in jump by lvl 20. Get a mod in the low teens in balance. Open Lock is nice to boost if you have spare skill points, but Knock or minimum ranks work well enough since you can't critically fail a lock.

Other feats to consider instead of the ones I chose:
Lightning Reflexes for more evaded AoE's.
Skill Focus UMD since you can never have too much UMD.
Greater Spell Penetration.
Spell Focus Ench so you can try out AM (Hypno SLA is awesome!)



Hope this helps.

[Parody]

Thanks for the replies TheDearLeader, mindlessdrone1991, good advice from both of you.

Also, this build has no issues keeping UMD, Search, Disable Maxed, which I found the most handy to get groups at the mid levels. Just remember to lag them for a little bit before you take the 2nd rogue lvl at 9th or 10th, that way you can buy them cheaply again. Otherwise, keep everything maxed skill wise is very easy even on a warforged, and with lvl ups into INT, should be easy for human (yay max haggle now too!).

Playstyle wise... Cast jump spell + featherfall + then cast if you're in a melee bind by jumping. One feat I forgot about is quicken, as you can use a quickened negative energy burst with palemaster later to burst heal yourself, I'd probably drop greater spell focus enchantment then to squeeze it in.