Petition to keep the bonus from manual with true reincarnation

[steloro]

/signed

i don't want to loose anymore the bonus from manual....a lot of my friend don't want to true reincarnate because lose all the bonus from manual.
this malus hurts us but hurts also turbine because a lot of people don't reincarnate and don't spend turbine point for true reincarnate

[Cairo]

/signed

i don't want to loose anymore the bonus from manual....a lot of my friend don't want to true reincarnate because lose all the bonus from manual.
this malus hurts us but hurts also turbine because a lot of people don't reincarnate and don't spend turbine point for true reincarnate

Just hold off using tomes until you're done TRing, simple as that.

[Missing_Minds]

Just hold off using tomes until you're done TRing, simple as that.

Exactly.

Op, your character is DEAD, your gear has been passed on to the "surviving character" as listed in the dead character's will that you never wrote.

Treat your new body well, and remember the sunscreen.

[dkyle]

Just hold off using tomes until you're done TRing, simple as that.

This is not by any means "simple".

I thought I was done TRing my Bard. Then HOrc came out. Now it's lose two +3 tomes and a +4 to TR HOrc. Guess the option of TRing HOrc is off the table.

Tomes should absolutely be kept over TRs. We should not have to gamble with raid loot to exercise the option of TRing.

Op, your character is DEAD, your gear has been passed on to the "surviving character" as listed in the dead character's will that you never wrote.

This is not how reincarnation works. The body dies, the soul comes back in a new body. Why does it make any more sense for tomes to die with the body, than it does for them to be kept with the soul?

And given the choice between those two options, I choose the one that doesn't produce the needlessly frustrating choice of having to decide between actually using valuable, and hard-won tomes, and leaving open the option of a TR, in the future, that doesn't destroy said tomes.

[Krag]

Just hold off using tomes until you're done TRing, simple as that.

With the TRing being the only endgame alternative to epics there is no such thing as "done TRing".

[AylinIsAwesome]

Scenario 1:

You TR as every class, get completionist, and eat all your +3 and +4 tomes. Happy day.

Druid comes out.

Suddenly, you lose your completionist. You can't get it again without losing your tomes, and if you keep your tomes, then no completionist.


How is that fun?


EDIT:

Scenario 2:

Before TRing comes out, you spend a large amount of time gathering +3 and +4 tomes in every stat to use on your character. You eat them, because there's no reason not to.

TRing comes out.

You go for even a first life, you lose all that work.

How is that fun either?


Tomes should still apply over TRs. There's no reason not to.

[steloro]

a lot of person in my guild have eat a +3 and +4 tome, before the tr....this people don't tr

[Allistair]

Just hold off using tomes until you're done TRing, simple as that.

What about all the toons that have eaten multiple +3 tomes before there was such thing as TR??
Why should you lose loot?

[bobbryan2]

They need to just pop the highest inherent bonus you've eaten for each stat into the reincarnation bank.

Tomes are as much loot as anythink else in DDO. They shouldn't have special treatment.

[efreet5]

If you are a player that is hesitant to TR because you will lose a few tomes, then it's probably not worth it for you to TR anyway. I know with my wiz I TR'd him knowing that even if I didn't have another +3 int tome waiting I wasn't losing anything by TRing due to gaining the +1 dc from the PL feat. My Monk gained an average of 3 damage/hit on the first TR and I knew I couldn't pass that up, but then there's my "main" toon who is an ac twf ranger build and I just can't see losing all the tomes, because none of the benefits will gain me enough to make up for the loss of those stat points. It's quite toon dependent and some players wouldn't be up for the xp grind even if we did keep tomes. Aside from the wings by your name, there's no way for someone to tell whether you've TR'd just by performance in a quest. A 28pt build can succeed in all endgame content just as well as a 36pt build. It is not a requirement to TR your toons and if your guildies can't see the benefits in completing a TR, then that's fine.

In short: /not signed

[Yaga_Nub]

.....
This is not how reincarnation works. The body dies, the soul comes back in a new body. Why does it make any more sense for tomes to die with the body, than it does for them to be kept with the soul?
......

The soul isn't a physical thing so why should a STR, DEX, or CON tome be kept? The soul doesn't remember ALL of the past life so why should an INT tome be kept? The soul doesn't contain your wisdom so why should a WIS tome be kept? The soul can't be seen or felt or influence anyone so why should a CHA tome be kept?

[Xezno]

/signed

You can really newer tell when you are done TRing. The result for me will probably be that any +3 or +4 tomes i get will just sit and rot in the bank. I allways want the TR option to be open to me, but loosing tomes is a big problem.

[bobbryan2]

The soul isn't a physical thing so why should a STR, DEX, or CON tome be kept? The soul doesn't remember ALL of the past life so why should an INT tome be kept? The soul doesn't contain your wisdom so why should a WIS tome be kept? The soul can't be seen or felt or influence anyone so why should a CHA tome be kept?

Never use in game justification to talk about whether a change should or shouldn't happen. It leads to terrible design.

First you should ask, 'is this good for the game?'

Then you should figure out if you can make it work with the lore.

Never the other way around.

[Sarnind]

/signed signed signed signed

[Xezno]

Never use in game justification to talk about whether a change should or shouldn't happen. It leads to terrible design.

First you should ask, 'is this good for the game?'

Then you should figure out if you can make it work with the lore.

Never the other way around.

Second this - I cant find a single good reason why tomes should be removed on TR. It just creates frustration.

[Allistair]

They need to just pop the highest inherent bonus you've eaten for each stat into the reincarnation bank.

Tomes are as much loot as anythink else in DDO. They shouldn't have special treatment.

Problem with that is stats like INT effect your skill points, and now that tomes have level requirements, you'd lose out on those points.

[eonfreon]

The soul isn't a physical thing so why should a STR, DEX, or CON tome be kept? The soul doesn't remember ALL of the past life so why should an INT tome be kept? The soul doesn't contain your wisdom so why should a WIS tome be kept? The soul can't be seen or felt or influence anyone so why should a CHA tome be kept?

Please come up with game reasons, not lore dependent upon what you believe. The fact is that you don't know anything more about a soul then I do.
Because that's a losing and circular game. Here, I'll help you play:
The soul invigorates the body and fills it with life and energy. Producing the effects of Strength, Constitution, Dexterity, Intelligence, Wisdom, and Charisma.
The Magical Tome invigorates the soul and empowers it further. It is such powerful magic that it becomes ingrained in someone's soul, becoming an Inherent bonus that supercedes the body and becomes intrinsic to the soul.

See how simple that was?

Make arguments based on game logic and how it would affect the game. Spare me your metaphysical mumbo-jumbo.

[Tharlak]

Second this - I cant find a single good reason why tomes should be removed on TR. It just creates frustration.

Well actually, it creates new sales (+2 tomes from DDO store) and extends the grind. Both things Turbine values. I think that's the "good" reason.

Having said that, I would like the tomes to TR with you as well.

[bobbryan2]

Problem with that is stats like INT effect your skill points, and now that tomes have level requirements, you'd lose out on those points.

Well, you could turn an eaten +3 tome into a bound +1, 2, and 3.

[Thriand]

They already have a mechanic in place that just automatically applies tomes at the appropriate levels when you lesser reincarnate. I don't think it would be too terribly hard to apply the same mechanic to a true reincarnation.

Although if its about money I would gladly pay for an item that lets me remove a tome from my character so that I can use it in the next life.