Petition to keep the bonus from manual with true reincarnation

[eonfreon]

Buying your instant gratification is not a solution.

And still does not replace the downside to TR.

How is it instant gratification/ I had to play the game to get those +3 Tomes in the first place. My +3 Con Tome and my +3 Wis Tome were Rewards from my 20th list of Raid completions. I got them as rewards for playing the game.

Then along came the TR mechanic and suddenly that reward becomes worthless if I TR.

Why do you consider losing tomes as an appropriate "downside" to the "decades" old tradition of True Reincarnation?

So is your problem that you had to lose your tomes so everyone else should?

[Tobril]

Buying your instant gratification is not a solution.

And still does not replace the downside to TR.

I don't see how this is "instant gratification".

Looks like we'll just have to disagree on why you think TRing should be painful.

[Tobril]

So is your problem that you had to lose your tomes so everyone else should?

Probably.

[Hendrik]

These rules have been established for decades?

I don't remember True Reincarnating back when I played AD&D. No one wanted to reincarnate under those old rules. You could wind up as a Badger!!

Even the 3.5 rules on the Druidic spell is very different from True Reincarnation as created by Turbine.

I've just read the 3.5 version online. Says nothing about keeping or losing your tomes. However if you roll a 01 you get to come back as a Bugbear!

You're right about one thing at least. I don't want to deal with the downside of losing by few +3 Tomes. So I simply won't TR until I at least find replacements for the Tomes I already used. Or the Devs put in some new magical item to store our tomes, or the rules change and they let us keep our tomes.

I don't even see the point of the xp increase. Especially with so little quests at the high end where you need the most xp. You can blast through without doing all that much of the low level content and then are stuck doing the same handful of quests over and over at the high end.

Why is this a needed downside? Because you had to do so everyone else should? Because you had to lose your tomes everyone else should?

When dealing with Tome use, yep. After you ate the +2 Tome and was Reincarnated as your example Badger, you didn't get to keep the stat.


Why a downside? Balance would be first thing to come to mind. People here want the bonus to stats from a TR and keep the Tomes they ate. Yea, that won't harm the game in any way.

[Hendrik]

Probably.

Try again.

[Hendrik]

How is it instant gratification/ I had to play the game to get those +3 Tomes in the first place. My +3 Con Tome and my +3 Wis Tome were Rewards from my 20th list of Raid completions. I got them as rewards for playing the game.

Then along came the TR mechanic and suddenly that reward becomes worthless if I TR.

Why do you consider losing tomes as an appropriate "downside" to the "decades" old tradition of True Reincarnation?

So is your problem that you had to lose your tomes so everyone else should?

Ok, I'll say it again, maybe read it this time;

Loss of Tome is the downside to TR. The 'hard decision' one has to make when considering a TR. Remember the wonderful 'respec' threads and discussion you yourself were in? Had to be a cost to it and this is it. Much 'cheaper' cost then what some were willing to do to have a full respec.

You can;

A. Deal with it like you have and waited to TR until you had backup Tomes.
B. Suck it up and jump into your TR.
C. Find an alternate 'cost' to replace the loss of Tomes for a TR.


With this thread, I should be able to claim that I have earned the Xp from 1-20 prior to my TR and it should be applied to my next Life.

[Tobril]

With this thread, I should be able to claim that I have earned the Xp from 1-20 prior to my TR and it should be applied to my next Life.

No one is suggesting this.

There is no reason besides lack of coding why tomes cannot be kept via some mechanism.

[Missing_Minds]

Why Turbine would want to cause "pain" in a game that is supposed to be fun is entirely beyond me, but I have absolutely no doubt that it is job #1 to them.

*laughs* You'd have to know the history of some of the Turbine developers.

Look up the credentials of J.W. Barry at some point. I know when I stumbled upon them, I just stopped, stared, then Doh'd! Little hint, his background is in psychology.

[Missing_Minds]

Buying your instant gratification is not a solution.

And still does not replace the downside to TR.

After 4 years of playing, having to level again is enough of a downside to me. Hell, I'd probably quit first before ever considering TRing.

But this is me. I have probably played the game for literally over 7,000 hours. People that game in during the F2P won't have the same perspective. I'm fine with this.

As I stated before, the current TR, tough cookies. You lose them.
But if Turbine wants to create a Greater TR, so be it. I'd not hold it against anyone. If you are willing to talk with your wallet to save yourself some effort (aka just like mana pots from the store) I'm not going to stop you. But I'd never put Greater TRs in game loot tables or in game purchasable. It would be a store item only, and probably never on sale.

[arkonas]

just a thought people replied to your topic but some of the answers were just not good enough for you and you complain about everything in game. nothing will ever be good enough for a ddo player. they will always complain about something. if you want to propose something to turbine why not give them ideas? TR is a special thing that you need to earn by leveling to 20 and getting the tr heart. they gave you passive and clickies for the tr and you have to start over. why is that never enough? do you want to blow through the game one hitting everything fingering everything touch of death everything? etc... if you want a challenge try doing it the hard way. so my thought is no tomes should not carry over. it should only be on that life and that life only. YES i do have TRS. i like the fun to find another tome because that is what keeps me going not an easy ride

[steloro]

The downsides of TR are TP/token cost and insane exp curve. They will not go even if they get rid of the tome annoyance.

i open this thread
i hope dev read some of this
if wwith lesser and greater i keep bonus from tome...i want to keep with true

[Tobril]

just a thought people replied to your topic but some of the answers were just not good enough for you and you complain about everything in game. nothing will ever be good enough for a ddo player. they will always complain about something. if you want to propose something to turbine why not give them ideas? TR is a special thing that you need to earn by leveling to 20 and getting the tr heart. they gave you passive and clickies for the tr and you have to start over. why is that never enough? do you want to blow through the game one hitting everything fingering everything touch of death everything? etc... if you want a challenge try doing it the hard way. so my thought is no tomes should not carry over. it should only be on that life and that life only. YES i do have TRS. i like the fun to find another tome because that is what keeps me going not an easy ride

Do you actually have +3/+4 tomes?

If so and you're OK with losing them that's fine, but a lot of us don't like grinding our balls in the blender to get something we already had at one point.

[AylinIsAwesome]

With this thread, I should be able to claim that I have earned the Xp from 1-20 prior to my TR and it should be applied to my next Life.

With this argument, I should be able to claim that losing all of your BtC gear is just a "downside" to TRing.

[Macroscian]

So tell, according to you, what should these two people have done?

Yeah I do see both sides. For those who never had a chance to plan for TR it's a very poor situation. How long has it been since TR got in the game, a year? 1.5? With all the returning gamers I can see this is a big issue. I mean that. I'm unsure how common tomes +3 +4 were 1-1.5 years ago but that would be awful business not to arrange something for them.

For the completionist there would most likely be a compensation (these are two persons so far - at least who attend the forums - and one of them is going for the full 3 x 18 I think) when a new class is introduced. From what I've seen here, support is both eager to be seen helping and surprisingly visible here on forums.

"Game experience may change during online play."

And yes, seeing how this isn't a nerfing game, the natural way forward ought to be to make yet another insane difficulty accessible only to TR, with tomes +5 +6 +7 dropping, perhaps.

Yet I can't help thinking along the lines of

What about the people who did TR/completionist and waited with tomes and lived the pain of only getting the benefits of stats points and (rather puny) feat/automatic feat already?

So yes, agreed and not agreed. Happy gaming.

[AylinIsAwesome]

Yet I can't help thinking along the lines of

What about the people who did TR/completionist and waited with tomes and lived the pain of only getting the benefits of stats points and (rather puny) feat/automatic feat already?

Well, just responding to this part, just because it sucked for some people isn't a good reason to keep the status quo so it sucks for everyone.

[kernal42]

Well, just responding to this part, just because it sucked for some people isn't a good reason to keep the status quo so it sucks for everyone.

Correct.

Furthermore, such a change wouldn't increase the suckage for anybody; it would just reduce suckage somewhat unevenly. Fortunately, this unevenness is reduced as time goes by.

Cheers,
Kernal

[eonfreon]

When dealing with Tome use, yep. After you ate the +2 Tome and was Reincarnated as your example Badger, you didn't get to keep the stat.


Why a downside? Balance would be first thing to come to mind. People here want the bonus to stats from a TR and keep the Tomes they ate. Yea, that won't harm the game in any way.

How can it possibly harm the game? It's not like folks are asking for the tome to apply at level 1. It should apply at the minimum level. Heck I don't think anyone even cares if it applies in the same way that it applies when you LR. It would be no different then if I had banked a +3 or higher tome and then used it when I hit the appropriaqte level, except that I wouldn't have to keep banking it over and over should I continue to TR.

As far as adding longevity to the game, I guess that could be a worry. But I think most folks will find reasons to continue to play. +3 and +4 Tomes will simply not be hoarded like they likely are now. Yes, it would take away one grind, the constant "need" to get fresh tomes for when you decide to play the TR game. I really don't see that as a bad thing.

[eonfreon]

After 4 years of playing, having to level again is enough of a downside to me. Hell, I'd probably quit first before ever considering TRing.

But this is me. I have probably played the game for literally over 7,000 hours. People that game in during the F2P won't have the same perspective. I'm fine with this.

As I stated before, the current TR, tough cookies. You lose them.
But if Turbine wants to create a Greater TR, so be it. I'd not hold it against anyone. If you are willing to talk with your wallet to save yourself some effort (aka just like mana pots from the store) I'm not going to stop you. But I'd never put Greater TRs in game loot tables or in game purchasable. It would be a store item only, and probably never on sale.

See, I'd even rather it be a game play option rather then something one could buy in store. But I certainly wouldn't begrudge someone who just wanted to pay for it.

I'm largely in the same boat. I've leveled and rerolled so often in the 4 years I've played that I'm not even sure the chance to keep my +3 Tomes would entice me to TR. But it certainly wouldn't add to the turn-off that it is now.

[AylinIsAwesome]

As far as adding longevity to the game, I guess that could be a worry. But I think most folks will find reasons to continue to play. +3 and +4 Tomes will simply not be hoarded like they likely are now. Yes, it would take away one grind, the constant "need" to get fresh tomes for when you decide to play the TR game. I really don't see that as a bad thing.

See, I'd rather roll a new character than continue to grind out one freakin' tome on a single character. The former lets me try out something new, while the latter is just a grind that would likely burn me out as the months go by and I don't see any progress made.

[joneb1999]

As for the OPs original suggestion I think it would benefit both players and Turbine as I do think losing tomes on TR may very possibly put people off spending money on the points to get it. Some players may be completely put off and others may be more choosie and instead of doing a TR on a few toons they may just pick one.

Maybe Turbine are thinking they will TR and the have to buy new Tomes = more cash. Im not sure if this is the case really as tomes can be had in game on an uncommon basis but true hearts of wood are extremely rare in game.