Need some suggestions for a possible Half-Orc Fighter build

[Ziindarax]

I'm thinking about rolling a Half-Orc Fighter 18/Monk2 build, but note I will be True Reincarnating from a 28-point build Paladin into a 34-point build.

Here are the goals of the build I'm thinking of:

- Melee DPS Power House as well as a Hate Tank

- Epic Viable (I don't want to have to rely on buffs just to be able to land an ordinary hit).

- Able to be as self-sufficient (not need to rely on healer magic for sustenance) as is possible.

- 2 levels of monk for Evasion, as well the ability to use handwraps effectively.



@ level 3, I plan on using Con, Dex, and Int tomes. @ level 7, I would use some +2 tomes to improve my character further.


Edit: Here is a build I'm thinking of. I could switch stunning blows with Skill Focus: UMD to get 4 more points toward UMD.

color=red]WARNING![/color] This build is not compatible with 28-point builds (or at best, would only be minimally compatible).

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 3.7.3 (Pre-Release)
DDO Character Planner Home Page

Doom Wolf 
Level 20 Neutral Good Half-Orc Male 
(12 Fighter / 8 Barbarian) 
Hit Points: 462 
Spell Points: 0 

BAB: 20/20/25/30/30 
Fortitude: 19 
Reflex: 9 
Will: 5 

              Starting    Feat/Enhancement 
Abilities    Base Stats    Modified Stats 
(34 Point)    (Level 1)      (Level 20) 
Strength           18                26 
Dexterity          15                17 
Constitution       16                21 
Intelligence        6                 6 
Wisdom              8                 8 
Charisma           12                14 

Tomes Used 
+1 Tome of Strength used at level 3 
+1 Tome of Dexterity used at level 3 
+1 Tome of Constitution used at level 3 
+1 Tome of Charisma used at level 3 
+2 Tome of Dexterity used at level 7 
+2 Tome of Charisma used at level 7 
 
              Starting      Feat/Enhancement 
             Base Skills  Modified Skills 
Skills       (Level 1)      (Level 20) 
Balance            2              3 
Bluff              1              4 
Concentration      3              7 
Diplomacy          1              4 
Disable Device     n/a            n/a 
Haggle             1              2 
Heal               -1             -1 
Hide               2              3 
Intimidate         1              10 
Jump               4              11 
Listen             -1             -1 
Move Silently      2              3 
Open Lock          n/a            n/a 
Perform            n/a            n/a 
Repair             -2             -2 
Search             -2             -2 
Spot               -1             -1 
Swim               4              8 
Tumble             n/a            n/a 
Use Magic Device   3              13 
 
Level 1 (Fighter) 
Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Paladin 
Feat: (Selected) Toughness 
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Two Weapon Fighting 
Enhancement: Fighter Attack Boost I 
Enhancement: Fighter Critical Accuracy I 
Enhancement: Fighter Toughness I 
 
Level 2 (Fighter) 
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Exotic Weapon Proficiency: Khopesh 
Enhancement: Fighter Strategy (Trip) I 
Enhancement: Fighter Strength I 
 
Level 3 (Fighter) 
Feat: (Selected) Oversized Two Weapon Fighting 
Enhancement: Orcish Extra Action Boost I 
Enhancement: Orcish Fury I 
Enhancement: Orcish Strength I 
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I 
 
Level 4 (Fighter) 
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Weapon Focus: Slashing Weapons 
Enhancement: Fighter Attack Boost II 
Enhancement: Fighter Critical Accuracy II 
 
Level 5 (Fighter) 
Enhancement: Orcish Brute Fighting I 
Enhancement: Fighter Toughness II 
 
Level 6 (Fighter) 
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Stunning Blow 
Feat: (Selected) Weapon Specialization: Slashing Weapons 
Enhancement: Kensei Khopesh Mastery I 
Enhancement: Fighter Kensei I 
 
Level 7 (Fighter) 
Enhancement: Orcish Extra Action Boost II 
Enhancement: Racial Toughness II  
Level 8 (Fighter) 
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Improved Two Weapon Fighting 
Enhancement: Fighter Toughness III 
 
Level 9 (Fighter) 
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Slashing Weapons 
Enhancement: Orcish Strength II 
 
Level 10 (Fighter) 
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Power Attack 
Enhancement: Orcish Power Attack I 
Enhancement: Fighter Strength II 
 
Level 11 (Fighter) 
Enhancement: Fighter Attack Boost III 
Enhancement: Orcish Brute Fighting II 
 
Level 12 (Fighter) 
Feat: (Selected) Greater Two Weapon Fighting 
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Greater Weapon Specialization: Slashing Weapons 
Enhancement: Fighter Kensei II 
Enhancement: Fighter Khopesh Specialization I 
 
Level 13 (Barbarian) 
Enhancement: Barbarian Power Attack I 
Enhancement: Kensei Khopesh Mastery II 
Enhancement: Orcish Extra Action Boost III 
 
Level 14 (Barbarian) 
Enhancement: Barbarian Extend Rage I 
Enhancement: Barbarian Constitution I 
 
Level 15 (Barbarian) 
Feat: (Selected) Toughness 
Enhancement: Barbarian Extra Rage I 
Enhancement: Barbarian Hardy Rage I 
Enhancement: Barbarian Power Rage I 
Enhancement: Orcish Power Rage I 
 
Level 16 (Barbarian) 
Enhancement: Barbarian Willpower I 
 
Level 17 (Barbarian) 
Enhancement: Barbarian Extend Rage II 
Enhancement: Fighter Toughness IV 
 
Level 18 (Barbarian) 
Feat: (Selected) Toughness 
Enhancement: Barbarian Extra Rage II 
Enhancement: Barbarian Hardy Rage II 
Enhancement: Barbarian Power Rage II 
 
Level 19 (Barbarian) 
Enhancement: Orcish Power Rage II 
 
Level 20 (Barbarian) 
Enhancement: Barbarian Power Attack II 
Enhancement: Barbarian Constitution II

[Kamo]

You speak of wanting to be self sufficient, I would say you should go 18 fighter/ 2 rogue you get umd, and sneak attack damage. There is little need to use hand wraps when you are a THF half orc with a Min II great axe...

[Ziindarax]

You speak of wanting to be self sufficient, I would say you should go 18 fighter/ 2 rogue you get umd, and sneak attack damage. There is little need to use hand wraps when you are a THF half orc with a Min II great axe...

So...

To make both Intimidate and UMD viable without penalty, I would need to boost base Charisma by 4 (at least to negate the penalties), and Int by 4 so as to not take a penalty on how many skill points I get per level. This would leave me 24 points to invest in Strength and Constitution (and maybe Dexterity).

Edit: If I take the first level of Rogue @ creation, I can get 28 points with 8 INT. Enough to start the game with 4 points into numerous skills (Haggle, intimidate, and Use Magical Device). After the two levels of Rogue, how many skill points would I get for each level of Fighter (assuming TR's don't get any special tomes to use shortly after character creation)?

[unbongwah]

Evasion no longer works in heavy (or med) armor; light armor or robes only. So you either need to give up all that sweet full plate you've got or give up on Evasion.

EDIT: did you want to be a high-AC tank in your next life; or just a DPS hate-tank?

[Dwarfo]

you need to wear robes/cloth for monk for evasion and handwraps to work properly.

[Impaqt]

Handwraps ona Level 2 Mont are not effectitive.

Evasion on a 18Fighter is rarely effectiive in Epic content.

your better off splashing ranger or Paly so you maintain your BAB and get access to wand useage...

Or staying pure fighter and drink a lot of pots.

[Kamo]

A good way to get decent dps with decent Ac and evasion is Go a WF 18 fighter/ 2rogue. But unless you feel like investing alot of points into dex on a THF I recommend going pure fighter.

[Ziindarax]

A good way to get decent dps with decent Ac and evasion is Go a WF 18 fighter/ 2rogue. But unless you feel like investing alot of points into dex on a THF I recommend going pure fighter.

I think I will attempt 18 fighter/ rogue 2.

Here's what I'm thinking of:

18 Strength

16 Dexterity

16 Constitution

The rest are left at base levels. Except Charisma (I could attempt to raise it to 8, use a +2 Charisma tome to get to 10), and then use Charisma boosting items so as to buff intimidate, haggle, and UMD skills. From there I'd try to get 16 balance, and lower intimidate for UMD (I will be letting my weapon doing the agro-grabbing).

I am sure most will say, "why grab 2 levels of rogue if you aren't going to be a tank?". I'm grabbing rogue for UMD as a class skill as well as evasion, and with a high enough UMD (hypothetically speaking), I can use more than just healing and rezzing scrolls; I would also be able to use wands and offensive scrolls.

Hypothetically speaking, by doing this, I would be able to make a Half-orc who could provide emergency support as well as power-house DPS.


If that build is not viable, then I will go with a pure fighter using:

20 STR

10

As high a con as I can get and the rest are left at their base.

[jwdaniels]

If you leave your INT at base, you're not going to have anything close to enough skill points to max UMD, intimidate and haggle, especially as a half-orc.

[Ziindarax]

If you leave your INT at base, you're not going to have anything close to enough skill points to max UMD, intimidate and haggle, especially as a half-orc.

Ideally, if I were to focus on UMD first (and intimidate and jump second) would I come close to getting it to where I can use scrolls without fail?

Note: I still haven't TRed yet, just trying to work out a formula for an unorthodox build.

[unbongwah]

INT 12 gets you 3 skill pts per ftr lvl; that's enough to max Intim (1) and UMD (2) every lvl. Extra skill pts from rogue 2 (and INT +2 tome if you take one) can go into Balance & Jump.

If you plan to start with less INT than 12, I suggest you plan carefully for how to spread your pts and when to take your INT tome(s) to make sure you don't gimp your skills.

[Ziindarax]

It seems my build is not doable.

Despite taking two levels of rogue, as soon as I take first level fighter, UMD is no longer considered a skill that uses one point. So it appears DDO doesn't let you use the classic D&D trick of splashing a class so that a certain skill used up one point like a class skill rather than having to spend 2 points to get a full point into a specific skill. That really sucks.

@ level 4 with 13 Charisma, my UMD score goes to 11, and I've heard that you need 40 or more to use heal scrolls without failing. Thus, at my current rate (if I had TR'ed as a half-orc rogue/fighter) I would be a gimped Half-orc fighter.

That said, I will have no choice but to go full on fighter (or full on Barb) if I were to TR as a half-orc.


Note: I tested this with Ron's Character Planner, as well as in-game using a spare slot.

[Ziindarax]

Okay, here is a build that I think might work with Fighters (correct me immediately if you can't rage while wearing heavy armor). Kudos to Nick Robinsonchia for his Blitz barbarian build(s), and Junts for helping me realise that TWF would be better on a barbarian build (he recommended a different build, but I wanted to experiment with this build).

I will be using GS items, +6 str, con, and charisma items. I already have a min 2 great axe crafted, and all the stats that you see below completely ignore gear.

This build works best with Half-Orcs as far as DPS is concerned, but humans and Warforged are also compatible (humans get racial constitution and strength enhancements I do believe); warforged for their immunities and boosts to constitution, and humans because they trade a bit of strength for unpenalized intelligence and charisma.

Doom Wolves are built to destroy first, and possibly provide some limited tactical support on the scrolls front as well.

Read and share your thoughts.

As an added note: if there is another build that's just like this on the forums, please forgive my weak search-fu.

WARNING! This build is not compatible with 28-point builds (or at best, would only be minimally compatible).

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 3.7.3 (Pre-Release)
DDO Character Planner Home Page

Doom Wolf 
Level 20 Neutral Good Half-Orc Male 
(12 Fighter / 8 Barbarian) 
Hit Points: 462 
Spell Points: 0 

BAB: 20/20/25/3030 
Fortitude: 19 
Reflex: 9 
Will: 5 

              Starting    Feat/Enhancement 
Abilities    Base Stats    Modified Stats 
(34 Point)    (Level 1)      (Level 20) 
Strength           18                26 
Dexterity          15                17 
Constitution       16                21 
Intelligence        6                 6 
Wisdom              8                 8 
Charisma           12                14 

Tomes Used 
+1 Tome of Strength used at level 3 
+1 Tome of Dexterity used at level 3 
+1 Tome of Constitution used at level 3 
+1 Tome of Charisma used at level 3 
+2 Tome of Dexterity used at level 7 
+2 Tome of Charisma used at level 7 
 
              Starting      Feat/Enhancement 
             Base Skills  Modified Skills 
Skills       (Level 1)      (Level 20) 
Balance            2              3 
Bluff              1              4 
Concentration      3              7 
Diplomacy          1              4 
Disable Device     n/a            n/a 
Haggle             1              2 
Heal               -1             -1 
Hide               2              3 
Intimidate         1              10 
Jump               4              11 
Listen             -1             -1 
Move Silently      2              3 
Open Lock          n/a            n/a 
Perform            n/a            n/a 
Repair             -2             -2 
Search             -2             -2 
Spot               -1             -1 
Swim               4              8 
Tumble             n/a            n/a 
Use Magic Device   3              13 
 
Level 1 (Fighter) 
Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Paladin 
Feat: (Selected) Toughness 
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Two Weapon Fighting 
Enhancement: Fighter Attack Boost I 
Enhancement: Fighter Critical Accuracy I 
Enhancement: Fighter Toughness I 
 
Level 2 (Fighter) 
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Exotic Weapon Proficiency: Khopesh 
Enhancement: Fighter Strategy (Trip) I 
Enhancement: Fighter Strength I 
 
Level 3 (Fighter) 
Feat: (Selected) Oversized Two Weapon Fighting 
Enhancement: Orcish Extra Action Boost I 
Enhancement: Orcish Fury I 
Enhancement: Orcish Strength I 
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I 
 
Level 4 (Fighter) 
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Weapon Focus: Slashing Weapons 
Enhancement: Fighter Attack Boost II 
Enhancement: Fighter Critical Accuracy II 
 
Level 5 (Fighter) 
Enhancement: Orcish Brute Fighting I 
Enhancement: Fighter Toughness II 
 
Level 6 (Fighter) 
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Stunning Blow 
Feat: (Selected) Weapon Specialization: Slashing Weapons 
Enhancement: Kensei Khopesh Mastery I 
Enhancement: Fighter Kensei I 
 
Level 7 (Fighter) 
Enhancement: Orcish Extra Action Boost II 
Enhancement: Racial Toughness II  
Level 8 (Fighter) 
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Improved Two Weapon Fighting 
Enhancement: Fighter Toughness III 
 
Level 9 (Fighter) 
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Slashing Weapons 
Enhancement: Orcish Strength II 
 
Level 10 (Fighter) 
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Power Attack 
Enhancement: Orcish Power Attack I 
Enhancement: Fighter Strength II 
 
Level 11 (Fighter) 
Enhancement: Fighter Attack Boost III 
Enhancement: Orcish Brute Fighting II 
 
Level 12 (Fighter) 
Feat: (Selected) Greater Two Weapon Fighting 
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Greater Weapon Specialization: Slashing Weapons 
Enhancement: Fighter Kensei II 
Enhancement: Fighter Khopesh Specialization I 
 
Level 13 (Barbarian) 
Enhancement: Barbarian Power Attack I 
Enhancement: Kensei Khopesh Mastery II 
Enhancement: Orcish Extra Action Boost III 
 
Level 14 (Barbarian) 
Enhancement: Barbarian Extend Rage I 
Enhancement: Barbarian Constitution I 
 
Level 15 (Barbarian) 
Feat: (Selected) Toughness 
Enhancement: Barbarian Extra Rage I 
Enhancement: Barbarian Hardy Rage I 
Enhancement: Barbarian Power Rage I 
Enhancement: Orcish Power Rage I 
 
Level 16 (Barbarian) 
Enhancement: Barbarian Willpower I 
 
Level 17 (Barbarian) 
Enhancement: Barbarian Extend Rage II 
Enhancement: Fighter Toughness IV 
 
Level 18 (Barbarian) 
Feat: (Selected) Toughness 
Enhancement: Barbarian Extra Rage II 
Enhancement: Barbarian Hardy Rage II 
Enhancement: Barbarian Power Rage II 
 
Level 19 (Barbarian) 
Enhancement: Orcish Power Rage II 
 
Level 20 (Barbarian) 
Enhancement: Barbarian Power Attack II 
Enhancement: Barbarian Constitution II

[Fattiest]

Susan Boyle <-----------Name Recomendation

[Ziindarax]

Susan Boyle <-----------Name Recomendation

Seriously, what do you think of the build itself (the name in the builder is just the name of the build itself, my character name will be the same; Ziind Stargazer)?

[unbongwah]

Perhaps I'm stating the obvious, but: you could do rogue 2 / barb 18; even with INT 6 you get enough skill pts as a barb to max UMD. Bump it up to 8 if you want Intim too. EDIT: plus barbs get Imp Trap Sense, which makes Evasion a bit more useful to them than ftrs.

[Ziindarax]

Perhaps I'm stating the obvious, but: you could do rogue 2 / barb 18; even with INT 6 you get enough skill pts as a barb to max UMD. Bump it up to 8 if you want Intim too. EDIT: plus barbs get Imp Trap Sense, which makes Evasion a bit more useful to them than ftrs.

Actually, no. At character creation, if you put four points (or four increments) into a skill, you can only increase that skill by one point (or half-point after character creation from there on out it seems.. unless you skip putting points in it for a level). I could replace stunning blow (or one of the toughness feats) with Skill focus: UMD to take it up further, and use a UMD boosting item and Charisma items to boost it further. Unless I'm doing something wrong, the most you can increase a skill by on level up is by one increment (I've tried raising it further, but it's grayed out). :/

[Quikster]

Actually, no. At character creation, if you put four points (or four increments) into a skill, you can only increase that skill by one point (or half-point after character creation from there on out it seems.. unless you skip putting points in it for a level). I could replace stunning blow (or one of the toughness feats) with Skill focus: UMD to take it up further, and use a UMD boosting item and Charisma items to boost it further. Unless I'm doing something wrong, the most you can increase a skill by on level up is by one increment (I've tried raising it further, but it's grayed out). :/

if you start out as rog and put 4 points into umd, you get a skill of 4 with no other modifiers. Then if you take fighter your next level, you need to use 2 skill points in order to get 1 full rank in umd. This will be the case for every fighter level as umd is a cross class skill. You can still max it, it just costs you more.

So if you try to max a cross class skill, you need two skill points for every level. So your 18/2 idea is more than possible, you just need to make sure you have enough int to cover the skills you want. If you want umd and intim maxed you need 12 int in order to do that (that gives you three skill points per level to spend, you spend 1 on intim, two on umd each level, on rog levels you bump some other skills)

[Ziindarax]

if you start out as rog and put 4 points into umd, you get a skill of 4 with no other modifiers. Then if you take fighter your next level, you need to use 2 skill points in order to get 1 full rank in umd. This will be the case for every fighter level as umd is a cross class skill. You can still max it, it just costs you more.

So if you try to max a cross class skill, you need two skill points for every level. So your 18/2 idea is more than possible, you just need to make sure you have enough int to cover the skills you want. If you want umd and intim maxed you need 12 int in order to do that (that gives you three skill points per level to spend, you spend 1 on intim, two on umd each level, on rog levels you bump some other skills)

What do you make of the build I posted above?

Would I still be able to hit the no-fail heal zone (or approach it) with Charisma items and items that boost UMD?

[Quikster]

What do you make of the build I posted above?

Would I still be able to hit the no-fail heal zone (or approach it) with Charisma items and items that boost UMD?

I didnt read through it, but with umd as a non class skill heres what you will need.

11 ranks (max unless you splash a umd class)
6 cha mod (12 start 2 tome 6 item 2 exceptional You can boost it more but it requires more grind)
3 golden cart from deleras
6 shroud item
2 luck
4 greater herosism.


That gets you to 32 buffed. You can take skill focus for +3 to get to 35. At that point you can get the gloves from titan for another +2 (+5 but 3 dont stack with deleras necklace). Thats 37. You need 4 more cha points to get to 39. You can do 1 more exceptional, 2 more from a +4 tome, and 1 more from a +7 item. That will get you no fail heals self buffed and no ship buffs. BUT thats a LOT of grind.