The Noisemaker (Horc Bard 15/4 Fighter/1 Barb

[Daggerrr]

The inspiration is the axe singer, but this is a build that gives out much more dps.

It's a 36 point build as I'm planning to do my 3rd TR into this (past life barb & monk). If you just want to do 32, do 16 str or 12 char. Barb PL is very nice for this build, though.

Focus of the build:
A true dps bard with tanking potential. I think this build outperforms any bard builds in dps. A rogue 5/bard 15 build may have better dps in no fort/no aggro situations, but the sacrifice in hp and feats hurts the tanking potential and normal dps against mobs.

Before we start
Why 4/1 instead of 2/2 or some other splits:
1) The 16th lvl of bard is nearly uselss to this build due to its shortage of sp and its focus on close combat
2) Any extra feats are good for this build, I'm using it for sf: UMD, but stunning blow/quick draw/extra toughness may be very useful.
3) It's horc so it's short on hp. 4th lvl fighter brings toughness II and a feat slot for possible extra toughness.
4) Barb lvl is a must for this build, but 2rd lvl of Barb is rather weak compared to the 4th lvl of fighter
5) 2 fighter/1 barb is possible, again, extra feat and lvl 16 and 17 of bard is rather useless to this build.

Here we go:

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The  Noisemaker
Level 20 True Neutral Half-Orc Male
(4 Fighter \ 1 Barbarian \ 15 Bard) 
Hit Points: 334
Spell Points: 472 
BAB: 16\16\21\26\26
Fortitude: 14
Reflex: 9
Will: 13

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
Abilities        Base Stats          Modified Stats
(36 Point)       (Level 1)             (Level 20)
Strength             18                    26
Dexterity             8                     8
Constitution         16                    16
Intelligence         12                    12
Wisdom                8                     8
Charisma             14                    16

YOUR EYES ARE NOT TRICKING YOU, NO TOMES!

                  Starting            Ending          
                 Base Skills        Base Skills       
Skills           (Level 1)          (Level 20)        
Balance               3                 16            
Bluff                 5                  7            
Concentration         3                  3            
Diplomacy             6                 25            
Disable Device        n/a               n/a           
Haggle                6                 13            
Heal                 -1                 -1            
Hide                 -1                 -1            
Intimidate            2                 26            
Jump                  8                 23            
Listen               -1                 -1            
Move Silently        -1                 -1            
Open Lock            n/a               n/a            
Perform               6                 25            
Repair                1                  1            
Search                1                  1            
Spot                 -1                 -1            
Swim                  4                  8            
Tumble                0                  0            
Use Magic Device      6                 25            

Level 1 (Bard)
Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Barbarian
Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Monk
Feat: (Selected) Two Handed Fighting


Level 2 (Barbarian)


Level 3 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Toughness


Level 4 (Bard)


Level 5 (Bard)


Level 6 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Weapon Focus: Slashing Weapons


Level 7 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Power Attack


Level 8 (Bard)


Level 9 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Force of Personality


Level 10 (Bard)


Level 11 (Bard)


Level 12 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Improved Critical: Slashing Weapons
Feat: (Selected) Past Life: Berserker's Fury


Level 13 (Bard)


Level 14 (Bard)


Level 15 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Two Handed Fighting


Level 16 (Fighter)


Level 17 (Bard)


Level 18 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Skill Focus: Use Magic Device 
(Extend?  3 mins plus haste wont' be bad...  extra toughness?  
Quickdraw?  More intimi?  the possibility is endless)


Level 19 (Bard)


Level 20 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Greater Two Handed Fighting
Enhancement: Fighter Haste Boost I
Enhancement: Barbarian Sprint Boost I
Enhancement: Barbarian Power Attack I
Enhancement: Barbarian Willpower I
Enhancement: Bard Extra Song I
Enhancement: Bard Extra Song II
Enhancement: Bard Extra Song III
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Attack I
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Attack II
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Bravery I
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Bravery II
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Bravery III
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Damage I
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Damage II
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Damage III
Enhancement: Bard Lingering Song I
Enhancement: Bard Lingering Song II
Enhancement: Bard Lingering Song III
Enhancement: Bard Warchanter I
Enhancement: Bard Warchanter II
Enhancement: Orcish Fury I
Enhancement: Orcish Melee Damage I
Enhancement: Orcish Melee Damage II
Enhancement: Orcish Power Attack I
Enhancement: Orcish Power Attack II
Enhancement: Orcish Strength I
Enhancement: Orcish Strength II
Enhancement: Orcish Great Weapon Aptitude I
Enhancement: Orcish Great Weapon Aptitude II
Enhancement: Orcish Great Weapon Aptitude III
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness II
Enhancement: Improved Perform I
Enhancement: Improved Perform II
Enhancement: Improved Perform III
Enhancement: Improved Perform IV
Enhancement: Bard Charisma I
Enhancement: Bard Charisma II
Enhancement: Fighter Strength I
Enhancement: Fighter Toughness I
Enhancement: Fighter Toughness II

Some thoughts and comparison
1) The main weakness of this build is that it's not easy to have enough HP to tank TOD. But if you do add extra toughness feat and have good gear, with madstone the build can easily surpass 550 hp (you can rage easily for this build since most of your spells are just for buffing and last pretty long).
2) Compared to a straight up thf horc barb (or any high hp heavy tanking dps build).
This build in solo or non ideal groups performs way better. It has very high dps due to the super bonus of the warchanter songs (+3 for lvl 14 + 1 warchanter bonus + 2 AP= 6 attack, +3 for lvl 14 + 2 warchanter bonus + 3 AP = 8 damage rolls), constant blur, displacement, chant focus, greater heroism, freedom of movement (no more holds, lol). It can fascinate mobs, haven't tested on epic, but I suspect it can (max perform, 4 ap, 15 item, not even counting excep bonus and all sorts skill bonus). Full UMD, lots of skills.
Now in a epic raid, the dps of this build will fall short to a horc barb because they are getting the song effect too, but I suspect many groups will take you over a barb on any day of the week since... you are a bard.
3) Compared to the axe singer. Less HP, better dps, more effecient spread of feats.
4) Compared to pure bard builds. If they are simple warchanters, they can't even come close to what you can do with this build due to the 3 extra feats and melee splashes. Spellsingers and Troubadours are different builds completely and are flavors, but I'll say this build can contribute as much as any bard on epic setting since what it falls short of in other things it can make up in one department: This build will definitely hit stuffs on epic instead of only nicking and scratching the mobs.
5) The build requires no tomes and almost no gear (the build will perform well with all AH gears in non-epic stuffs)

Of coures...The ideal gear:
Epic Marilith and Epic SoS... remember, warchanter II can cast in medium armor. Everything else is up to personal taste.

Also:
AP is really tight for this build (way too many good things to choose). I strongly suggest to put 4 full ranks of perform in there because you are already kinda low on charisma for a bard and you want those songs to stick on epic.
I like Forces of Personality for this build. That way you really have an advantage in terms of saves compared to fighter/barbs, but it's apparently optional.
Compared to any intimi-tank, this one gets a very comparable intimidate due to +4 from warchanter II and relatively high charisma.

I may add some other stuffs, but for now I'd love some inputs (and a rating if possible)~

[Daggerrr]

Reserved

In response to wether to drop sf: UMD and get sf: Intim:

Certainly you can drop sf: UMD, I just came up with the build and haven't gone through all the cal in details yet. But I may go with a quickdraw for more dps. Intimi is considered a charisma based skill, that means you can easily add to it with a +5 shroud item.

23
3+3 cha +2exc = 7 on char bonus
1 focusing chant
4 GH
15 item
1 vom
4 Warchanter II
2 Barb pl
2 imp
2 command
______
that's 61

Now EVERY other build in this forum counts the following:
+1 (2 exc char)
+5 (exc char skills)
+1 (+2 tome)
______
that's 68

Now if you want more, I'm sure you can add SF to it or maybe I'm missing something else too...

UMD:
23 ranks
7 CHR mod
1 focusing chant
4 GH (self cast)
1 luck (VoM)
______
36

+5 shroud items, or tome + cartouche will get to 40
hell, you can even get above 44 and use a mass heal or some other crazy stuff..

[DrNuegebauer]

SF:UMD strikes me as a completely wasted feat?

Why not SF:Intim instead?

With very basic gear, you should be able to get a very handy UMD?

23 ranks
7 CHR mod
3 cartouche
4 GH (self cast)
1 luck (VoM)

That's 38 without any GS or exceptional...

You'll want the extra intim (imo)

23 ranks
7 chr mod
15 item
4 GH
3 SF: intim
2 imp intim 2
2 barb pl active feat

That's still only 56 intim....

[voodoogroves]

Somewhere I posted a link of the big things-by-level for bard breakpoints. You'll get Heroics, which can be handy. That said, I think you want to tank ... right? And you can't use that on yourself. You might consider dropping to 14 bard and Barb 2.

I see what you're trying to do - songs plus personal DPS. It's nice, though once you drop back and lose casting as well, I'm honestly going to suggest you consider a 12/6/2 split. Fighter 6/Barb2 or Barb 6 / Fighter 2 (or maybe Barb 7 / Fighter 1). Run the math, see if you like it.

Bards are fun in that there is a great variance between personal and group assets they bring to a group. Finding the balance you like to play should be a blast.

[Raithe]

You'll get Heroics, which can be handy. That said, I think you want to tank ... right? And you can't use that on yourself.

A bard can sing inspire heroism (heroics) to himself for +4 AC and +4 saves (tho the saves do not stack with GH).

[Irinis]

Somewhere I posted a link of the big things-by-level for bard breakpoints. You'll get Heroics, which can be handy. That said, I think you want to tank ... right? And you can't use that on yourself. You might consider dropping to 14 bard and Barb 2.

I see what you're trying to do - songs plus personal DPS. It's nice, though once you drop back and lose casting as well, I'm honestly going to suggest you consider a 12/6/2 split. Fighter 6/Barb2 or Barb 6 / Fighter 2 (or maybe Barb 7 / Fighter 1). Run the math, see if you like it.

Bards are fun in that there is a great variance between personal and group assets they bring to a group. Finding the balance you like to play should be a blast.

1/1 less on the songs from dropping to 12 might be a problem for what the OP is aiming for. Hitting Kensai is a really nice thing for personal DPS though. 14/6 fighter might be good, how much is the ability to rage worth over kensai?

I'd plan in one +2 tome for CON - since you get one BTC at 1750 favor you may as well use it.

[Daggerrr]

SF:UMD strikes me as a completely wasted feat?

Why not SF:Intim instead?

With very basic gear, you should be able to get a very handy UMD?

23 ranks
7 CHR mod
3 cartouche
4 GH (self cast)
1 luck (VoM)

That's 38 without any GS or exceptional...

You'll want the extra intim (imo)

23 ranks
7 chr mod
15 item
4 GH
3 SF: intim
2 imp intim 2
2 barb pl active feat

That's still only 56 intim....

@Drnuegebauer

Certainly you can drop sf: UMD, I just came up with the build and haven't gone through all the cal in details yet. But I may go with a quickdraw for more dps. Intimi is considered a charisma based skill, that means you can easily add to it with a +5 shroud item.

23
3+3 cha +2exc = 7 on char bonus
1 focusing chant
4 GH
15 item
1 vom
4 Warchanter II
2 Barb pl
2 imp
2 command
______
that's 61

Now EVERY other build in this forum counts the following:
+1 (2 exc char)
+5 (exc char skills)
+1 (+2 tome)
______
that's 68

Now if you want more, I'm sure you can add SF to it or maybe I'm missing something else too...

[Daggerrr]

Somewhere I posted a link of the big things-by-level for bard breakpoints. You'll get Heroics, which can be handy. That said, I think you want to tank ... right? And you can't use that on yourself. You might consider dropping to 14 bard and Barb 2.

I see what you're trying to do - songs plus personal DPS. It's nice, though once you drop back and lose casting as well, I'm honestly going to suggest you consider a 12/6/2 split. Fighter 6/Barb2 or Barb 6 / Fighter 2 (or maybe Barb 7 / Fighter 1). Run the math, see if you like it.

Bards are fun in that there is a great variance between personal and group assets they bring to a group. Finding the balance you like to play should be a blast.

You are totally right, bards are about finding that balance where you feel comfortable. I thought about the 12 cut off, but to sacrifice +1 on Inspire Courage song for the entire group, to squeeze my already very limited sp pool, to sacrifice all possible 4th lvl spells spells like Freedome of Movement and Dimension door was not something I was willing to go for. But I certainly can see the potential of adding more dps.. I think that I have to leave to someone else's build... hehe

I do hesitate between a 14 and 15 split, I have a capped bard already and in epic many people do ask for the heroic song (for ac), so I try to keep that in my build, but I definitely thought about dropping it. Right now I still lean toward keeping it based on my playing experience, I think barb 2 besides uncanny dodge and a bit extra hp doesn't offer a lot and this build should be fine doing without it. But a bard with the ac song can really make some friends... hehe

[Daggerrr]

1/1 less on the songs from dropping to 12 might be a problem for what the OP is aiming for. Hitting Kensai is a really nice thing for personal DPS though. 14/6 fighter might be good, how much is the ability to rage worth over kensai?

I'd plan in one +2 tome for CON - since you get one BTC at 1750 favor you may as well use it.

Yep, dropping to 12 is going to be a problem like I explained right above. I've TR'ed three times, of course I can get all the +2 tomes needed, and using any of them will be great.

As for 14/6, the one lvl barb can make a huge difference: fast movement, mini rage for burst, and sprint boost. Any one of them is important

[Hecore]

I'd strongly recommend the bunny hat for another +3 stacking to UMD, especially since it doesn't fill a slot.

And, out of curiosity, why aren't you including +2 tomes? I know you said that it can function perfectly fine without them, but you're talking about a 2x TR -- At least a single shard tier 3 GS accessory/weapon and a few +2 tomes should be assumed.

[Daggerrr]

I'd strongly recommend the bunny hat for another +3 stacking to UMD, especially since it doesn't fill a slot.

And, out of curiosity, why aren't you including +2 tomes? I know you said that it can function perfectly fine without them, but you're talking about a 2x TR -- At least a single shard tier 3 GS accessory/weapon and a few +2 tomes should be assumed.

Eh, just trying to prove a point that this build doesn't require even +1 tomes to meet any requirements. I'll probably list some tomes and equips later.

[Consumer]

Reply to PM:

To hit

20 BaB (madstone or divine power)
5 Weapon
22 Strength (54 sustainable str)
2 Shintao
= 49 to hit
-8 PA
= 41 to hit
5 Backstabbing
2 Flanking
= 48 to hit
7 Inspire Courage (morale)
2 Inspire Greatness (competence)
1 Haste (enhancement)
2 Recitation (luck)
= 60 to hit
1 lvl 20 Bard
= 61 to hit

DPS - 383


Changes:

- Drop Bard 15 take Barb 2 for extra rage duration and an extra rage
- Drop THF line and twitch
- Take Weapon Specialization: Slashing
- Take Haste boost II
- Max Orc PA
- Take Orc extra AB III
- Max starting str
- Pick up QD
- Pick up Stunning Blow
- Take stunning blow enhancement II
- Use FB set for total of 3 rages
- Use epic bloodstone and red scale where possible

New DPS - 459

Stunning Blow DC - 10 + 23 + 2 = 35 + 10 = 45 with stunning weapon

[Daggerrr]

Reply to PM:

To hit

20 BaB (madstone or divine power)
5 Weapon
22 Strength (54 sustainable str)
2 Shintao
= 49 to hit
-8 PA
= 41 to hit
5 Backstabbing
2 Flanking
= 48 to hit
7 Inspire Courage (morale)
2 Inspire Greatness (competence)
1 Haste (enhancement)
2 Recitation (luck)
= 60 to hit
1 lvl 20 Bard
= 61 to hit

DPS - 383


Changes:

- Drop Bard 15 take Barb 2 for extra rage duration and an extra rage
- Drop THF line and twitch
- Take Weapon Specialization: Slashing
- Take Haste boost II
- Max Orc PA
- Take Orc extra AB III
- Max starting str
- Pick up QD
- Pick up Stunning Blow
- Take stunning blow enhancement II
- Use FB set for total of 3 rages
- Use epic bloodstone and red scale where possible

New DPS - 459

Stunning Blow DC - 10 + 23 + 2 = 35 + 10 = 45 with stunning weapon

Big thank you, man! I need to think about the build a bit more to see what I can realistically change. Many people dont' realize the AP on the build is very tight because inspire courage enhancements (attack, bravery and damage) cost a ton of aps, then you have extra songs and lingering song. I simply could not max out Orc PA and Extra AB III with the left over APs...

But I'm probably going to switch to 14/4/2 split since it probably fits the flavor better. Hmm... working on it

[Consumer]

14 Bard / 4 Fighter / 2 Barbarian

Stats - 36 pt

Str - 20
Dex - 10
Con - 16
Int - 10
Wis - 8
Cha - 10


Feats

1 - THF
3 - PA
6 - Toughness
9 - ITHF
12 - IC: Slashing
15 - Barb PL
18 - Stunning Blow

2 (F) - WF: Slashing
18 (F) - Quick Draw
20 (F) - WS: Slashing


Enhancements

Bard Inspired Attack III - 6 AP
Bard Inspired Damage III - 6 AP
Bard Inspired Bravery II - 3 AP
Bard Warchanter II - 6 AP
Bard Lingering Song II - 3 AP
Bard Energy of Music II - 3 AP
Bard Charisma I - 2 AP
Bard Song Magic I - 1 AP

= 30 AP

Fighter Haste Boost II - 3 AP
Fighter Attack Boost II - 3 AP
Fighter Strength I - 2 AP
Fighter Toughness II - 3 AP
Fighter Flanking Mastery I - 2 AP
Fighter Stunning Blow II - 3 AP

= 16 AP

Barbarian Power Attack I - 1 AP
Barbarian Sprint Attack I - 1 AP
Barbarian Extend Rage I - 1 AP
Barbarian Extra Rage I - 1 AP

= 4 AP

Orcish Power Attack III - 6 AP
Orcish Extra Action Boost III - 6 AP
Orcish Strength II - 6 AP
Racial Toughness II - 3 AP
Melee Damage II - 6 AP
Power Rage II - 3 AP

= 30 AP

= 80 AP