bringing back the old adventure packs

[chrisgina39]

ok many of the adventure packs are rarely run anymore.Its very sad because some of them are very good in concept, story, or ,being created but something drags them down.I think they should be improved lets start with...

[Three Barrel Cove]
The pack

The consept is great' the explorer was ok but it could have been so much more.The quest are mostly fun the others I hated running the loot was marginal at best theres 1 named(club flame touch -5 spot +1 perform)
The story lines could use some work.
The cost 650 tp is insane for the pack it seems unfinished because of the price vs quality of the adventure pack. The pack could have so much more done to it like...

Improvements that you could make

The cost should be reduced by at least 300 tp the adventure pack is ok but not worth that much.

The quest are decent but some improvements that you could make are

[General]
Making them easier to find and to get to would really help this pack so trs may farm this.

Increasing the total xp at the end of the quest would help it stand out vs the others.

Adding more named items would help to bring people here it has alot of possibilities.

make it high lvl pack(hecore)

[Fire caves]
This quest was the least fun in my eyes but has some potential to make nice loot.

Try making this easier to navigate though
Adding some hidden places
Boosting the xp
Removing the locked doors

[Ramsacks trail]

This quest was quite fun but the requirement to do it(ea ff) aren't very good to newer players. also the puzzle was challenging but fun I would make it a optional to people who don't want to do it

Make the puzzle a optional
Increase xp
Remove the need of feather fall
Make some fun optional
Like the ranger assault event(see youtube)
Focus on the fun of it

[Ghost of chance]
This one is very hard too find i think you should make it easier to find and the puzzle make it so its easier to understand(like putting it on the ground)
the storylines confusing

Make the story clearer
Make the quest easier to find
Clear up the puzzle

[The trogs get]

The quest it very hard and weird i think you should change it and make the storyline a bit better.

Improve storyline
Make quest easier
Make a end reward worth it

[Two toed tobis]

improve the loot
make the quest worth the time

[guard duty]
This is fun but the start is quite a pain and the chest its well hidden

make chest easier to find
make start less of a hassle

[the explorer]
make named loot and something...more the explores nice but there's so much more you could have done
increase lvl range up



[Ruins of thenderal] LONG LIVE DAVE ARNESON

This pack is the saddest too die as its a tribute to dave arneson a guy who help make d&d (aka black moor)

The series is quite long I would make it expand over a few more lvls
and add/buff the end rewards and the xp
make restarting/flagging less of a pain
so

[general]
Expand the level range
Improve the quest xp
Make the chain more pug friendly
Make the side quest more appealing
Make colye less of a jerk(well squishy)



[RESTLESS ISLANDS]

This pack that lacks A LOT it has two quest and a raid

First off lets start with the explorer area

Problems with it

Its very long and confusing
The high water levels slow you to a point where its unbearably annoying
You cant find anything in it

Ideas
Make the explorer area easier
Drop the water levels
Make less mobs between the quest


The flagging
Slayers of the shrieking mines
This quest is very hard to do in a pug i soloed it because it was easier
Make the miners less squishy
Make the second beholder
Small xp vs time

Bring me the head of....
The quest goes too long with no shrine
Small xp vs time

Pre-raid(only pre-raid with named)

I will put it this way pit+cubical+colye=how bad it is
It is long
Its hard(ish)
If you fail a easy fail raid then u have to do it again

Make it separate from the raid(like atdq)
(from comment)

Titan raid

Make pillars non attack able from summons
Make the loot better



[sorrow dusk]

improve xp and loot
make it less confusing(quest places)
make explorer area better
also going though the explorer area is very annoying(ty otherworld)





[catacombs]

a pack of low xp per quest with bad end loot

ideas to make it more appealing

make the xp worth it the worst xp quest should be 1k at least 2k for normal quest and 3k for the hard ones
change the end rewards
make them BB and undead bane so that they have some potential
then cure minor make it +1-3 instead
the magic missile wand should cast faster(and 2 missile)
make the armors better
make the guy be closer to the quest(like 1 of him every floor)(from Gorbadoc)
making the chase part more fun and scary instead of boring if you see here by you u should be thinking 'oh ____'(idea from gorbadoc)

necro 1-3

the quest here all have a theme torture runner team and other

the tombs are run once so you can window farm the main crypt
the main crypt has the best xp and awesome named loot
there's also collect-able(scarabs)
that gives **** instead of rewards and they are bound
now the packs are not run often(except by new players wanting to try them out and main crypt farmers)


ideas
buff the xp of the tombs a little(its ok but lets make the compete)
give the tombs a chance to drop the named
buff the scarab rewards(you can go pretty far)
make the torture crypt less tortuous(try running tomb of the tormented and posting its not)(wow im asking this to the devs(no offense))

[DrenglisEU]

/Signed

[helicalius]

just making everything give out more xp and better end rewards is not a very contributing idea. the reason that these quests are dieing is because there arnt enogh people per server for these lvl ranges. with so many quests to choose from people just stick to sand/gianthold with a bunch of ftp quests that are embedded in the memory and everyone can do them blindfolded. your solution is that type that only treats the symptom and not the cause. while in reality there is not much you can do for these quests and the devs know it. whatever rp gamers are left will have to solo them with hireling or maybe find a three man team during the weakends. so basicly its a dead cause!

[chrisgina39]

i would have to disagree while you have a good point its not a lost cause
xp is like pie people are like flies they go where theres a ton of xp if the quest are say 5k xp base i would run them ALOT the only problem is some packs got too much love(delars im looking at you(even if its a tribute))

[KillEveryone]

I snipped a lot of stuff.

[Three Barrel Cove]
I agree with the loot. This is being looked at but it may be a while before it gets put in.

I like the quests the way they are and don't find them confusing or difficult to navigate at all.

I don't like the run from town to the entrance. This is just tedious. Have a NPC like Tangleroot that once you do the quests, they will tele you to the quest entrance you want to go. Having to run through the explorer isn't a challange, just tedious.

It is a bit expensive for the level of the pack. I already own but it should be a bit cheaper.


[Ruins of thenderal] LONG LIVE DAVE ARNESON
I hate the squishy. I hate the squishy. I hate the squishy. Did I mention I hate the squishy. I really, really, really, hate that squishy.

The chain is a bit long and it feels too repetative since you are going back into the dungeon you came out of until you have to do a different area of the chain. The quests are not too bad...except protecting that squishy.

The two side quests need something. They need favor. They need XP. The need loot. Some reason to run them. There is no reason to run at all.


[RESTLESS ISLANDS]
Getting to and from the quests are a bit confusing. It also falls under tedious to me.

I haven't done the quests at level so I can't comment on that.

Haven't done the pre-raid or raid so I can't comment on them.


[sorrow dusk]
I don't mind going through the explorer the first time much like other getting to other quests the first time. At least the run is short between most of the the entrances and the quest giver.


necro 1-3

They need to get rid of the "flagging" mechanic. I have a character that will never complete the Shadow Crype just to open it and use it as a group former. I'll be doing the same for the other main crypts.

I've only run the Shadow crypts flagging. The swim quest sucks, getting the mummy from one side to the other sucks with DA, I didn't mind shadow Knight or other one...can't rember the name but it is the one where you have a player lower bridges from the other side and you lower their bridges.

Haven't run the others because I've heard they were pretty much a PITA. If of the four that I have run with two just being no fun, I can imagine the other tourture quests are not any fun either. May hit them up on a TR.

Comments in Sky Blue.

I think with some of the newer gear that Turbine has added kind of set the bar for gear up a bit. Now people expect some killer gear for a low level quest.

I don't think adding XP will get people to run those othere quests either. Some just suck the fun out and I will only run those once on a TR if I really have to run it.

XP is also relative to your level. Add too much at lower levels and you just blow through them...not that people can't do that now. Leveling my first character or any of them for that matter, I didn't do half of the lower level content and I wasn't trying to power level.

Having a chance at some of the stuff found in the main crypt of the crypt quests won't compel me to run them either. I have a opener and group former. Granted, many do not but having to run a crappy quest many times because of a chance at named loot where you can window farm the main crypt and have a better chance just isn't going to help. Maybe adding a special named reward for those torture crypts I could see a compelling reason but that item would have to be really special and not found elsewhere. Making it part of a set would also help.

[chrisgina39]

3bc coments
ya they where blury in my mind at the time(but 2tt is still kinda confusing)


thendral
ya the chain is a little anoying to do(i think coyle is based on some1 gary/a dev hated)


restless
no coment(nothing to say)

nerco
most of the necro quest need a remake same with flagging mec
and the scarab rewards need a buff


and ty for opoins feel free to post more

[diamabel]

I like some of the mentioned quests because of the puzzles. Granted it's boring for a party of 6 to iddle while one is busy solving the puzzle.

I'm not sure if adding better loot and more xp would really be an improvement. If a player wants to reach the level cap as fast as possible, then the loot on low and mid levels isn't worth much of a glance. Such a player would rather aim to hit level cap and get the desired raid items.

I'd like to see more people running these areas. But if I have to chose between play it alone at my own pace and repeatedly rush it with a full party (during one play session) then I'll rather resort to playing the quest once every now and then and alone.


Maybe it would be better to rethink this level range, quest difficulty and dungeon scaling thing. As it is now we have more low and mid level quests than high level quests. You are going to outlevel the low levels rather fast without seeing all the content for this level range.
Some older CRPGs had an interesting approach for this. They would scale the encounters to your current level / your party's current level. If you reached a certain part of the game with say level 5 then the encounters (group composition, hit dice, etc.) was appropriate for level 5. If you replayed the game and visited the same part with level 10 (because you did some side quests) the encounters were scaled accordingly.

[Gremmlynn]

Better to implement a dynamic xp ransack mechanic based on number of quests or amount of xp available/level than to up the xp for individual quests. The mechanics change would make more quests more efficient than repeating the best quests (xp wise). Adding xp to current quests would, at most, just change which quests players run multiple times and simply move the "nobody runs it" problem to other quests.

[SardaofChaos]

First of all, it's Threnal not Thendral. Second, with some thought beforehand the only hard one with the squishy is the one where you have to protect him for 15 minutes. The others you just have someone less important grab them and follow along behind the party, or even in the case of the first one you can leave him sitting where he is until the quest is clear. The 15 minute one isn't even that hard if you have a healer keeping an eye on him, and if you don't then you are making it unnecessarily hard on yourself. I don't even see why you think it's dead, see people running the entire chain kind of often and individual portions almost every day.

Also, both of your complaints about the puzzles aren't worth anything. If you really don't possess the logic to figure them out, then find someone who does. I was able to complete both the lever/dart and the puzzle in ghost of a chance the first time without cheating. Now, something they could do is lower the search needed to find the trapped tiles in ghost of a chance, because there are a couple there I haven't been able to find even with a 30+ search, and that's asking a lot for a 6th level char. But they did the right thing in giving you more than one chance if you accidentally light the wrong tile.

[Diyon]

I like some of the mentioned quests because of the puzzles. Granted it's boring for a party of 6 to iddle while one is busy solving the puzzle.

I'm not sure if adding better loot and more xp would really be an improvement. If a player wants to reach the level cap as fast as possible, then the loot on low and mid levels isn't worth much of a glance. Such a player would rather aim to hit level cap and get the desired raid items.

I'd like to see more people running these areas. But if I have to chose between play it alone at my own pace and repeatedly rush it with a full party (during one play session) then I'll rather resort to playing the quest once every now and then and alone.


Maybe it would be better to rethink this level range, quest difficulty and dungeon scaling thing. As it is now we have more low and mid level quests than high level quests. You are going to outlevel the low levels rather fast without seeing all the content for this level range.
Some older CRPGs had an interesting approach for this. They would scale the encounters to your current level / your party's current level. If you reached a certain part of the game with say level 5 then the encounters (group composition, hit dice, etc.) was appropriate for level 5. If you replayed the game and visited the same part with level 10 (because you did some side quests) the encounters were scaled accordingly.

An interesting mechanic I noticed on a game a couple friends used to play (FFXI) was that it was possible to suppress your level down so that you could run stuff with lower level friends, basically just temporarily leveled you down, and then treated you like you were that level for exp, gear, and whatnot.

[Gorbadoc]

[catacombs]

a pack of low xp per quest with bad end loot

Also, it's not exciting and the advancement mechanism is stupid.

• Put a holographic projection of Doofus McBishop-Pants outside each quest entrance so we can advance the quest quickly. I know, that makes no sense. Do it anyway. It makes even less sense to make us walk all the way up the stairs for every freaking chapter. Think how boring the original Ghostbusters would have been if they'd actually showed the entire climb to the top of the building to fight Zuul. Same thing here.
• Make the chase sequence scary. I don't need to **** my pants, but I should at least get an elevated heart rate. Add stun traps. Make the wraith run faster. Give the wraith a Tendon Slice weapon. Put more levers along the way, and make it so that in some places, one random lever among several opens the next gate ("Let's see if this lever opens it... ****. Is she close? How close is she?").

[chrisgina39]

Also, it's not exciting and the advancement mechanism is stupid.

• Put a holographic projection of Doofus McBishop-Pants outside each quest entrance so we can advance the quest quickly. I know, that makes no sense. Do it anyway. It makes even less sense to make us walk all the way up the stairs for every freaking chapter. Think how boring the original Ghostbusters would have been if they'd actually showed the entire climb to the top of the building to fight Zuul. Same thing here.
• Make the chase sequence scary. I don't need to **** my pants, but I should at least get an elevated heart rate. Add stun traps. Make the wraith run faster. Give the wraith a Tendon Slice weapon. Put more levers along the way, and make it so that in some places, one random lever among several opens the next gate ("Let's see if this lever opens it... ****. Is she close? How close is she?").

ok those are great ideas im going to put them up ty

[chrisgina39]

An interesting mechanic I noticed on a game a couple friends used to play (FFXI) was that it was possible to suppress your level down so that you could run stuff with lower level friends, basically just temporarily leveled you down, and then treated you like you were that level for exp, gear, and whatnot.

that would help i out lvl things b4 i can run them/i forget to run them till later

[deathbob27]

I absolutely disagree with the majority of the comments made thus far. Threnal and Sorrowdusk are extremely high xppm area's. 3 barrel is rather annoying but the one good quest their makes up for it when farmed correctly. Restless isles might be a pain in the butt and very confusing. But if the game was easy would it be any fun? I would go to great lengths to find a chattering ring under my name as I know it is absolutely worth it.

Most of the mentioned alleged problem area's i have found extremely useful in completing the annoying lvl's while tr'ing. To be honest it is almost to easy to follow the beaten path while not having any past lives and missing this really cool content. If you don't like taking the easy path then dont, run these the back stories are absolutely worth reading.

[PurdueDave]

Three Barrel Cove...
This is a tough one. The quests are all fairly long runs and there's so many quests at around that level that it's very easy to just blow right by it.

Threnal...
I would improve this first by separating West from East & South. This would make the quest progression a bit less confusing and take care of the slight level disparity with West.
For West, make it a stand alone chain culminating in Threnal Arena. Have the ceremonial sword be a trade in for a Threnal Arena token (or some cooler named thing). At Threnal Arena combine the token with a masterwork weapon of your choice. The reward from Threnal Arena would then be a random set of magical enhancements (maybe restricted to decent ones, or maybe nudged by also supplying a resist energy potion or something) totaling to ML8 but with an ML6 restriction and bound to character. Or maybe a little better than that if you supply a bunch of khyber fragments. Kind of like crafting light.
Modify East 3 to have Coyle actually move around setting wards instead of playing the berserker. Even made 10X easier than it used to be, this is still quite an annoying quest. Also beef up the boss giant in South - maybe some voice over as well...even referencing STK. It seems a shame that the end of such a long chain feels like Giant caves light.

Restless Isles...
This is tough because it's competing with the desert. The two flagging quests are actually quite fun but the explorer zone and getting to the quests are very annoying; and that's with a good map.

CO6...
This suffers from chain level disparity. The story is pretty nice but to run in chain style requires under-leveling CO6 big time or crushing GMW at a penalty. The end rewards are also kind of weak. Really, some of the stuff that pops is like ML2...even with a BTA boost this is not up to snuff. I'd just beef up all the quests (GMW & CO6) to be in the 8-10 range on normal and tweak out the end rewards to be appropriate.

[Gorbadoc]

ok those are great ideas im going to put them up ty

Make it clear whether you're making a direct quote or a paraphrase, and include a citation. The way you've quoted me, the only things suggesting that maybe the words aren't yours are the abrupt change in format and the sudden temporary inclusion of proper spelling and punctuation.

[chrisgina39]

i was doing a quest att so i copied and pased not thinking i changed it and gave u creadit sorry about that

[Hecore]

Why not change 3BC from a low level area to a high level one? Increase the difficulty of mobs, xp, loot and favor, a few minor quest tweaks, and there you go.

They could even throw in that pirate themed raid that never seemed to get created.

[chrisgina39]

Why not change 3BC from a low level area to a high level one? Increase the difficulty of mobs, xp, loot and favor, a few minor quest tweaks, and there you go.

They could even throw in that pirate themed raid that never seemed to get created.

that a great idea it was potential theres WAY 2 many low lvl stuff

[diamabel]

An interesting mechanic I noticed on a game a couple friends used to play (FFXI) was that it was possible to suppress your level down so that you could run stuff with lower level friends, basically just temporarily leveled you down, and then treated you like you were that level for exp, gear, and whatnot.

I know that some MMO allowed to downscale your high level toon in power, in order to join a friend on his/her low level toon.

But that wasn't what I meant. Maybe if I elaborate it a little more. The CRPG I mentioned had a set of static and random encounters. The static encounters existed due to the story line. I can't tell whether or not these static encounters were adjusted or not as the number of monsters was always the same. If they were modified too then adjusting hit dice/levels, available spells and used equipment would be a way to do so.
But you could easily tell the difference between random encounters. Say you visited a cave with some beholders at level 9 you might meet 1-2 beholders per encounter. If you visited the cave at a later time, say with level 12, you would meet 2-4 beholders per encounter. If you would postpone visiting the cave until an even later point in time you had to be prepared to face an equal challenge for your current level.

Dungeon scaling as it is today seems to be a "quick fix". Calculate one or more factors and just multiply hitpoints, damage output, etc. with that. At least it appears to be this way. Given that every quest has a base difficulty level which can be adjusted by entering on normal, casual, hard, elite, epic this still gives you only a small window of opportunity to enjoy a challenging quest. While the current concept in itself isn't bad I wonder if the designers only had the established MMO traditions in mind (e.g. level to level cap as fast as possible, collect gear).


To come back to the original question. How to make some adventure packs more appealing. Increasing xp and items wouldn't be good a solution in the long run. Having drop better items in these quests would lead to the "korthos situation". Even if these items are frowned upon by some people, they have to admit that some items which you get on korthos will easily last to mid levels (+3 BAB for starters isn't that bad) or even later. Changing xp and item rewards would just lead players to reevaluating all quests for a given level range. Now you made some quests more appealing/interesting and at the same time made some quests unattractive. The basic issue still remains, some adventure packs are preferred and some are neglected by players.

I don't have a quick fix for this kind of problems, but to allow players to visit the quests at any time and scale the diffiiculty to their current level / current party level and thus allow them to earn xp and some level appropriate (random) gear could be a way. But I guess it would require lots of work to revamp all released quests this way.