PLEASE PLEASE make quarterstaffs finessable

[Drfirewater79]

DDO style of intimidate is not PnP style. It made sense to grant paladins it. The PnP rules are a bases and guideline, when things will not work properly, of course you have to house rule things. What you want is a way to help min max stats vs. more balanced stats.

so how is that any different then this situation .. its about bending rules because they dont work well as they are.

What i want has absolutely 100% nothing to do with stats vs balanaced stats.... where the hell are you getting that ... ???

I am talking pure dex ac builds the people who take finesse ... using quarterstaffs because they are the only weapon with life drain ability and dex builds who do less dps by the nature of there build being the ones who NEED these kinds of weapons stat damaging and level draining weapons. While STR builds right now the only quarterstaff wielders ... have thousands of weapon options INCLUDING THE FINESSABLE ONES .... perhaps if they thought more clearly on what classes and build types use what kinds of weapons and what classes and build types suffer from a serious lack of useable weapons at end game ... maybe then it wouldnt be needed.

But the truth of the matter is ... they have made AC less valid over the years ... not more ... they take the builds who where focused on AC and give them **** to use unless they are rangers ... and then over load the str builds with named items.

Then when someone asks for some freaking balance in this game ... people shoot off stupidity that has nothing to do with anything.

If you can give me ONE reason how quarterstaffs being finessable hurts anyone in this game .... then i would be happy to listen to it ... the truth is there is nothing that gets broken by a dex monk using quarterstaffs.

In fact quarterstaffs make more sense then freaking stupidity that is monks using short swords. Aside from the fact that they can now use wounding puncturing ... now that its been nerfed to all **** and worthless and requires a PRE whos main feature doesnt work while weapons are equip't dispite DnD rules stating that a monk may make melee ki strikes with his feet when his hands are full.

I mean really if you have nothing to add why troll me ... ?? at least others are making an attempt to debate it ... and in the end they all say the same thing ... it doesnt matter to them ... so why does it matter so much to you?

[Missing_Minds]

so how is that any different then this situation .. its about bending rules because they dont work well as they are.

What i want has absolutely 100% nothing to do with min max stats vs balanaced stats.... where the hell are you getting that ... ???

I am talking pure dex ac builds the people who take finesse ... using quarterstaffs because they are the only weapon with life drain ability and dex builds who do less dps by the nature of there build being the ones who NEED these kinds of weapons stat damaging and level draining weapons. While STR builds right now the only quarterstaff wielders ... have thousands of weapon options INCLUDING THE FINESSABLE ONES .... perhaps if they thought more clearly on what classes and build types use what kinds of weapons and what classes and build types suffer from a serious lack of useable weapons at end game ... maybe then it wouldnt be needed.

You answered and contradicted your own self.

[Azonalanthious]

Never even heard of breeze ... it must be that damd good ... that i never heard of it.

Its actually not horrible: http://ddowiki.com/page/Breeze Not the best weapon in the game of course and better for rogues, since the trips/paralyzing helps with sneak attacks, though ninja monks can put it to good use as well. But not horrible. Its been around longer then Nat Gann actually, by some time. Not currently epic-craftable, but I would expect it to be on the list when/if we get an epic abbot raid.

[Drfirewater79]

You answered and contradicted your own self.

NO ... you are assuming that max stats means you cannot have a dex based finesse balanced stat build?

How ignorant is that ...

my build has a 20 str 38 dex 22 con 13 int 28 wis 16 cha ... when wearing my standard items in wind stance
sound prettry freaking balanced to me ... my class specific stats are higher cause i built it with ac in mind ... and survivability.

But a 20 str isnt enough if you want to hit end game mobs with a quarterstaff ...
I know fighters that hit 34 str and cannot land a hit on some epic bosses without a GH and without turning off power attack / combat expertise.

Min max and balanced builds have nothing to do with the conversation ... at all .. your arrogance and ignorance to that fact shine with your troll heavy post replies.
All i was asking is for finesse builds which use dex to hit (which while i am balanced stats .. I am finesse build) to be able to use quarterstaffs.

at least if your gonna troll grow some freaking coconuts and be a man about it ... use your brains instead of flashing your ignorance card.

[Drfirewater79]

Its actually not horrible: http://ddowiki.com/page/Breeze Not the best weapon in the game of course and better for rogues, since the trips/paralyzing helps with sneak attacks, though ninja monks can put it to good use as well. But not horrible. Its been around longer then Nat Gann actually, by some time. Not currently epic-craftable, but I would expect it to be on the list when/if we get an epic abbot raid.

abbot raid .. yeah .. i do it on my caster and that is about it ... nothing i really want out of that raid that doesnt have a more important item to fill its space on my monk at least.
Still when you look at it telekinisis and paralizing ... worthless ... better to use handwraps of paralizing with stunning +2 .... at least that you can put icy burst ritual on it.

The whole point is you still cannot find energy draining ability on any weapon a dex build can use. And that ability is a major advantage for str builds ... and its on a weapon no respectable str build would use as his main weapon style.

[dunklezhan]

!!OFFTOPIC!!

Kevin Costner : LJ pwned Robin until Robin did a "sneak attack".
Cary Elwes : bad sticks on both ends.
Errol Flynn : honestly, I forget. but he had a devil of a time dealing with Tuck.
Book says: Fought all day and night to a standstill
Russell Crowe : never saw that version.

LJ probably had what.. STR of 18 and DEX of 12 while RH would have what? STR of 15 and DEX of 16? Hardly "finese" stats. Being quick and agile does not mean a "finesse" fighter.

Fixed one bit, and I can't beleive I'm about to have this argument, I really can't but...

Robin Hood with a dex of 16? Are you high?

The greatest archer of them all in a nation of archers? At least 18 base score, no trouble at all.

I'll not accept anything less for this epitome of english hero. I'll be magnanimous though and give Davy Crocket and William Tell equal scores. But I'm not accepting less than Dex 18 for Robin Hood, I don't care how fictional he is.

Robin gets dex 18 minimum, Arthur Pendragon gets Str 18 minimum. Those are The Rules. If you think different then I've got some shiny beads I'd like to swap you for your house.

/!!OFFTOPIC!!

[Jaid314]

abbot raid .. yeah .. i do it on my caster and that is about it ... nothing i really want out of that raid that doesnt have a more important item to fill its space on my monk at least.
Still when you look at it telekinisis and paralizing ... worthless ... better to use handwraps of paralizing with stunning +2 .... at least that you can put icy burst ritual on it.

The whole point is you still cannot find energy draining ability on any weapon a dex build can use. And that ability is a major advantage for str builds ... and its on a weapon no respectable str build would use as his main weapon style.

actually, about the only situation you'll use a life draining weapon that i've seen is against held mobs in epic play. in that situation, while a dex based wielder is clearly slightly disadvantaged (does less damage), they are still absolutely going to be able to use it to melee stuff down just fine.

[Missing_Minds]

my build has a 20 str 38 dex 22 con 13 int 28 wis 16 cha ... when wearing my standard items in wind stance
sound prettry freaking balanced to me ...

There you have it folks, his idea of "balanced" and not min maxing stats.

I stand by what I have stated.

[Missing_Minds]

Robin gets dex 18 minimum, Arthur Pendragon gets Str 18 minimum. Those are The Rules. If you think different then I've got some shiny beads I'd like to swap you for your house.

*laughs* Ok ok... he can have that +1 more to hit with ranged.

[Azonalanthious]

Robin gets dex 18 minimum, Arthur Pendragon gets Str 18 minimum. Those are The Rules. If you think different then I've got some shiny beads I'd like to swap you for your house.

Actually, I gotta go with Arthur being 18 CHA minimum, king, inspirational leader, whatnot. Maybe high wisdom too. But I have no trouble seeing him at 16 Str or really 14 -- Lancelot and the like needed 18 Str, but Arthur had the kick-*** epic raid sword, so didn't need top notch combat stats.

[Missing_Minds]

Arthur had the kick-*** epic raid sword, so didn't need top notch combat stats.

/offtopic actually, 2nd ed had Excalabur as a... +4 or +5 long sword of sharpness that glowed. Sharpness in DDO is the limbchopper effect. Don't know if they ever made a 3.x conversion.

[Jay203]

so.... give dex builds the ability to get +10 damage from power attack? got it

[dunklezhan]

Actually, I gotta go with Arthur being 18 CHA minimum, king, inspirational leader, whatnot. Maybe high wisdom too. But I have no trouble seeing him at 16 Str or really 14 -- Lancelot and the like needed 18 Str, but Arthur had the kick-*** epic raid sword, so didn't need top notch combat stats.

Apart from being sharp enough to cut anything he felt like cutting, the real power of excalibur was the scabbard, which made him immune from harm, until Morgana stole it, allowing Arthur to get his fateful wound in the battle with Mordred. It was the scabbard that allowed him to create Camelot.

I digress. Agree with you on the CHR stat, his WIS score came from Merlin - besides he wasn't that wise he was totally sucked in by Morgana, Lancelot, Guenevere etc etc.

But since you disagreed with my STR score assessment, you are now beholden to give me your house in exchange for these pretty beads. GIEF!!! GIEF NAO!

[Wraistlynn]

And its also the most useless piece of timber in the game ... its not good for a lvl 20 monk to use ... but the dreamspitter and the new staff are both weapons one could use in epic missions .... this is the whole reason for my post ....

I dont want to use a **** q-staff ... and i think its stupid to keep putting out the same q-staff over and over and making both not useable by dex monks ...

um. other than the dreamspitter can you name another staff thats even useful for attacking? yeah i've seen some quarterstaff builds around and IMO they are nerfing their own dps by using them. especially monks and rogues.

[Hobbelin]

um. other than the dreamspitter can you name another staff thats even useful for attacking? yeah i've seen some quarterstaff builds around and IMO they are nerfing their own dps by using them. especially monks and rogues.

My +5 holy q-staff of PG is pretty worthwhile attacking with. The fact that I get dex mod to sneak attack with it, double strike from monk wind stance and haste from my PrE means that I hit like a ton of bricks as well. I do not however understand why a dex monk would want a q-staff. 1d6 is reeeeeeaaaaaally weak. Coupled with sneak attack however it does decent damage. And more importantly it's a boatload of fun compared to the ever present kopesh assassin... Being immune to knockdown as an acrobat is a nice perk as well

[Hokonoso]

why would you not max str as a melee? all monks should max str, finesse died when ac became useless... the devs dont wanna make qstaff's finesseable because they dont want froobs to think finesse is useful because it's not. easiest way to stop the influx of ppl quitting the game due to bad decisions is to make it so no new weapons are based on gimp builds (ie finesse 2hers). there are enough gimp weapons out there, dont try to change all of the qstaff just to fit 1 ridiculous playstyle that no smart person would ever use.

flavor is fun in an rpg, but there are plenty of said staves out there for the OP, no need to nerf future ones to fit a flavor build.

[Mr_Tank]

For an acrobat rogue you should try and pick up one of the Q-staffs out of mindsunder. 1d10 X3 goodness. Can't get a dr braking one but they are slashing, piercing, and bludgeoning damage type. Once more not a finesseable weapon but as a dex monk or any level 20 monk you should be using your fists not a Q-staff.

yeah i've seen some quarterstaff builds around and IMO they are nerfing their own dps by using them. especially monks and rogues.

Yes 40+ base with 80+ sneak attack attacking about as fast as you can in this game is by far a less useful way to build a toon than a dex monk.

[Hobbelin]

Yes 40+ Base With 80+ Sneak Attack Attacking About As Fast As You Can In This Game Is By Far A Less Useful Way To Build A Toon Than A Dex Monk.

Qft

[Elphvyra]

I guess my only question is... Are QS Finessable in 3.5 Rules? I think most of you can see where I'm going here....

[Drfirewater79]

!!OFFTOPIC!!

Fixed one bit, and I can't beleive I'm about to have this argument, I really can't but...

Robin Hood with a dex of 16? Are you high?

The greatest archer of them all in a nation of archers? At least 18 base score, no trouble at all.

I'll not accept anything less for this epitome of english hero. I'll be magnanimous though and give Davy Crocket and William Tell equal scores. But I'm not accepting less than Dex 18 for Robin Hood, I don't care how fictional he is.

Robin gets dex 18 minimum, Arthur Pendragon gets Str 18 minimum. Those are The Rules. If you think different then I've got some shiny beads I'd like to swap you for your house.

/!!OFFTOPIC!!

He had to have a end game 38-42 ... dude split an arrow .. something even mythbusters couldnt do.