Rgr/Rog/Wiz Build Help

[Tahlisar]

Hello everyone.
I'm thinking about creating a new character. My favorite class is the Ranger, but I wanted to add some levels of Wizard and Rogue. I'm not sure how many levels I should add, or where my ability points/skill points should go in to be sure I can function as all three.

Basically, I only want the rogue so I can disable traps and unlock doors, other than that I have no interest in playing a rogue. So I was wondering if one level of rogue would be enough? As in, in the higher level quests would I still be able to find and disarm traps? I want this character for mostly soloing, so I'm trying to make her more self-sufficient.

I'm not sure if one level of Wizard would be sufficient, mostly for buffs and wands and such. I have no idea how wizards work, and I don't know anything about inscribing spells either. If I only took one level of wizard, would I be able to inscribe other spells? My other idea was to take 5 levels of Wizard, which is what I'm leaning more towards.

I also build elves or half-elves, and this one will be an elf.

So far, for brainstorming this character, I have thought of 14 Ranger/1 Rogue/5 Wizard. But then, since this is a three way multi-class, I'm not sure how the starting stats should be, where my ability increases should go, etc.
My draft is as follows:

STR 12
DEX 16
CON 11
INT 15
WIS 13
CHA 8

I know DEX is important for Rangers and Rogues and INT is important for Rogues and Wizards so I tried to get more points there. I know you have to have 14 in WIS to be able to cast all of the ranger spells, but I figured I could sacrifice some spells there in order to be a better wizard.

Currently my characters are a pure ranger, pure cleric, pure paladin, and a multi class monk cleric. So I'm fairly new at multiclassing xD

Any help/suggestions are welcome!

[Doxmaster]

Hello everyone.
I'm thinking about creating a new character. My favorite class is the Ranger, but I wanted to add some levels of Wizard and Rogue. I'm not sure how many levels I should add, or where my ability points/skill points should go in to be sure I can function as all three.

Basically, I only want the rogue so I can disable traps and unlock doors, other than that I have no interest in playing a rogue. So I was wondering if one level of rogue would be enough? As in, in the higher level quests would I still be able to find and disarm traps? I want this character for mostly soloing, so I'm trying to make her more self-sufficient.

I'm not sure if one level of Wizard would be sufficient, mostly for buffs and wands and such. I have no idea how wizards work, and I don't know anything about inscribing spells either. If I only took one level of wizard, would I be able to inscribe other spells? My other idea was to take 5 levels of Wizard, which is what I'm leaning more towards.

I also build elves or half-elves, and this one will be an elf.

So far, for brainstorming this character, I have thought of 14 Ranger/1 Rogue/5 Wizard. But then, since this is a three way multi-class, I'm not sure how the starting stats should be, where my ability increases should go, etc.
My draft is as follows:

STR 12
DEX 16
CON 11
INT 15
WIS 13
CHA 8

I know DEX is important for Rangers and Rogues and INT is important for Rogues and Wizards so I tried to get more points there. I know you have to have 14 in WIS to be able to cast all of the ranger spells, but I figured I could sacrifice some spells there in order to be a better wizard.

Currently my characters are a pure ranger, pure cleric, pure paladin, and a multi class monk cleric. So I'm fairly new at multiclassing xD

Any help/suggestions are welcome!

If this is a flavor build, good luck. If this is a real build, no. Just No.

If you only want the wizard levels for buffs. Stop. With a single level of rogue, a ranger can get a UMD high enough to use buff wands and scrolls.

[hermespan]

If this is a flavor build, good luck. If this is a real build, no. Just No.

If you only want the wizard levels for buffs. Stop. With a single level of rogue, a ranger can get a UMD high enough to use buff wands and scrolls.

wand and scroll buffs suck. Then again, so do low level wizard buffs so yea you are better off just using wands and scrolls so you don't lose -1 bab.

Rangers have buffs that are just as good as wizard buffs, so why on earth would they want to scroll or wand them?

Outside of GH, PfE and rage, rangers have all they need. You can get rage and PfE clickies, and a planar gird from Xorian Cipher for GH. Wizard + ranger is just wrong.

[Tahlisar]

I would like to know the answer to this question though, because it will determine if I multiclass into rogue at all.

I've never tried rogue, and like I said, I want to be able to disable traps and open locks. That's really the only reason I need the rogue. If I only have one level of rogue, will I be able to do this at higher levels? Does it depend on your rogue level or your skill points?

[Kourier]

If you have one level of rogue you can max out your rogue skills. So yes, you may take one level of rogue for trap skills and UMD and other things.

That said, this is an awful idea.

[Tahlisar]

I didn't come up with the idea on my own. I actually saw someone else who posted the idea, and a few other people who replied who have Ranger/Wizard/Rogue characters. They all seemed to like their characters. Thought I'd give it a try as well. I do solo a lot, but I also play in a group with two other people, so I think I'll be fine once I work the actual plan out.

[Kourier]

Ok first off then if you're really going to do this, drop int to 12 max. That's enough for rogue skills and other skills and you aren't doing any offensive casting with that build. Also dump wisdom. With a +6 item you can cast all your ranger spells. That saves you... 9 build points, which should be put into strength and con. 11 con is NOT enough.

Put your level ups into strength. That's for damage.

So something like...

14 str
17 dex
14 con
12 int
8 wis
8 cha

Whats the wizard for again?

[DrNuegebauer]

If you're REALLY going to do this, you'll need 15 int to cast wiz spells and 14 wis to cast ranger spells. That's not base, that's adjusted.

So dumpstat both as much as you can.

Str does damage, so that's a winner. Dex does - um? Con makes HP, so that is also a winner.

Start with:

S 18
D 14
C 14
I 10
W 8
C 8

You'll get the 2WF line for free with ranger anyway - so you don't really need more dex than that.

I don't get the concept? Why not just pump up UMD to use wands/scrolls for the wizard spells you're thinking about??

[blitzschlag]

If you're REALLY going to do this, you'll need 15 int to cast wiz spells and 14 wis to cast ranger spells. That's not base, that's adjusted.

actually he needs 13 int to cast lvl 3 spells (wizard lvl 5)

that beeing said, 5 wizard is really of no real benefit. extended basic haste and displace are ok but nothing to go nuts about...

[Talon_Moonshadow]

More to follow.

[Lobster5]

if you've got access to warforged then:

Wizard 12/Ranger 6/Rogue 2

Could be a fun build.

Alternatively you could go:

Wizard 11/Ranger 9 and dump the whole "traps" idea.


Here are the 28 point build stats and the feats I'd choose for each:

Wizard 12/Ranger 6/Rogue 2

STR 16 - level ups go here
DEX 14
CON 16
INT 14
WIS 6
CHA 6

Wizard bonus feats - Extend, Maximise, Quicken
Regular feats
1 Toughness
3 Power Attack
6 Empower
9 Mental toughness
12 Toughness again
15 Imp crit: Slashing
18: Imp crit: Ranged

Use the ranger levels to max search, that way the rogue and wizard levels can max disable and UMD.

Level progression:


1 Rogue
2-3 Ranger
4-10 Wizard
11-12 Ranger
13- 16 Wizard
17 - Rogue
18 - 20 Ranger


Wizard 11/Ranger 9

STR: 16 - level ups here
DEX: 16
CON: 16
INT: 10
WIS: 6
CHA: 6

Wizard bonus feats - Extend, Maximise, Quicken
Regular feats
1 Toughness
3 Power Attack
6 Empower
9 Mental toughness
12 Imp crit: Slashing
15 Imp crit: Ranged
18: Greater Two Weapon fighting (will need to have eaten a +1 dex tome by this stage but anyone at level 18 should have the means to do that

Level progression:

1 Ranger
2-7 Wizard
8-12 ranger
13 - 17 Wizard
18 - 20 Ranger



Both of these are decent, and different, solo builds. The former is a bit more versatile and survivable (evasion comes earlier, extra toughness feat) the other fights better (GTWF, higher BAB)

Both have:

Spells:

Blur
haste
displacement
firewall
reconstruct
max elemental resists
Fire/Cold shield
Stoneskin

Abilities

Manyshot
Imp 2 weapon fighting
Evasion
Favoured enemies
WF immunities



So both are survivable, self healing, self buffing and with decent melee ability. Get a divine power clicky and never look back.

[unbongwah]

Consider bard instead of wizard; you get a lot of the same buff spells, but a lot more skill pts, more HPs, higher BAB, Cure spells, and of course bard songs. I posted this build last week; it would be challenging to level, but I think it does what you seem to be after.

[Talon_Moonshadow]

ok, I could write a book about all of the possibilities with this kinda build combo. As you can see in my sig, my main is almost exactly what you were considering.

I am not a build expert, especially since I am not a min/maxer. So I do not actually recommend my build to anyone.

But I wil say that at lvl 20, he really came together and I am very happy with him.

That said: do yoi like to raid? Grind for loot? Play the AH game and have all the large scales you could ever imagine?

Then this is not the build for you.

Do you have a best friend who plays a Wizard? Who makes sure you are perma-displaced and likes to hear you say "Haste please"?

Then this is not the build for you.

If however, you enjoy being totally self sufficent. Playing a char that has capablitites that others do not....this just might be a fun build for you.

At end game, there is nothing quite so satisfying as having Displacement anytime you want it. And non-expensive-potion Haste on tap is real nice too.
Add Stoneskin wands. (or maybe spell)
Shield spell. (more useful if you can get a high AC)
Flame arrow wands if you feel like it.
Teleport scrolls. DDoor scrolls if you can find them. (or maybe even the spell)

This is a fun build.



Many ways to go about it. and get something similar. Wiz1, Wiz5, Wiz7, 8, 9, 11, 12....14.... All decent options to combine with some Rgr lvls.

The more Wiz lvls you take though, the less you will need melee/ranged abilities.

You need an Int high enough to cast the highest lvl of spells you build will have.......if you are using thise spells for buffs, or non-save spells.
But trying to be an offensive caster at all is difficult, and has some severe handicaps when trying to build for it.

So I went Wiz5 and just use my spells for buffs.

But before you go too far down that route, let me mention some other options.

Shroud green steel item....with Blur and Displacement. Or Haste. Are not too difficult to make actually. But you wont get them til you are pretty high lvl most likely.
(more useful to a TR who can re-use one from a previous life at lvl 11.)

Elf dragon mark can get you up to about 5 or 6 Displacements per rest. And Invisibility as a bonus.

High enough UMD can get you scroll use. Which is ok. But kinda frustrating at times and short duration.

And the bad side is the wiz lvls hurt your Base Attack Bonus and HPs. (but not as much as people seem to think it does)
Divine Power clickies can be used when ou need a boost to BAB.

Rgr11 is awesome IMO. It gives you most of what anyone would want from a Rgr.
But Rgr12 gives full +5 Barkskin.
And you need Rgr14 or 15 (cant remember right now) to get Freedom of Movement. And real nice spell.

Then there is Tempest III
And some people want that capstone.

Still Rgr11 is great IMO.
Many people like Rgr 6 too.
And I keep thinking about Rgr9 for evasion, but maybe Rgr6 with Rog or Mnk 2 is a better choice than Rgr 9.

Rog lvls.
First ask yourself: "why?"

Locks? ok, but you can UMD knock scrolls and get probably 80% of the ocks in the game I think. (at least 50% I'm sure.)

Traps? You have evasion....

UMD? ah! Now that can be addictive!

Rgr/Rog is a very popular option. You can actually get by with only Rog1. And still do Epic traps and UMD heal scrolls. (but it's not easy.)
However, I took Rog4 because I felt I didn't have enough skill points.

In fact, Rgr11/Rog4, 14 int, +2 tome, Human.......and I still ran out of skill points to do what I wanted!
It's not as easy as people make it out to be.

But many people take a single Rog lvl and turn out very happy with their builds.

I should mention SA damage though. Awesome! really wish I could take a whole bunch more Rog lvls and beef that up!
Rog 4 gives 2d6, the second tier of damage enhancements and Rog haste boost II.
Plus more skill points. (and I have Tharnes Goggles)

But I'n not trying to sell you on Rog 4. Just show what I get for mine.

Rog1 is fine.
(or Rog0 depending on taste)

Back to Wiz for a few than I'll wrap this up.

Wiz1. I have used this in some builds. Most fun on a WF Rgr I have. And used it for a Ftr based Elf to get AA.
You get wand use. Some scroll use.
A free spell feat. (best used for extend IMO)
Shield spell. could be very useful for a high AC build. And even a moderae AC build gets a lot from it at lower lvls....plus prot from Magic Missiles is nice.
Flame arrow wands are cool for an archer.
Expeditious restreat can be nice, but two minutes goes by real fast.
Blur scrolls are nice. Stone skin wands very nice.
Invis scrolls.

But overall, I do not like Wiz1.
(one option to note is a Half Elf with the Wizard Dilitent feat)

Wiz5. 10min Epeditious retreats, blurs, false lifes, Invis.....
1 Min Haste and Displacement! Fun, fun fun.
A second spell feat. I chose Mental toughness for more SP.
You could also use Mental toughness for an elf or half elf to get AA archer and free up another feat.
A little dragon marked halfling I know took Maximise I think (or empower) and got some real nice healing for free!

Wiz7 or 8.
I really want to make one of these.
Some people do it for Firewall.
I want it for DDoor, stone skin, and Fireshield!!!
But I have wands and scrolls for those. and the scrolls of Fireshiled actually last a decent amount of time.
Someday my catch of DDoor scrolls will run out thought. And I hate having to ration them the way I do.
(also enjoyed firewall scrolls when I could buy them.)

A WF with Wiz11 or 12 would get reconstruct. And Tensers. Seems like a good battlemage lvl to take IMO.


Ooopp...meant to mention races and why I toook human.
Human...more skill points! Human Versitility for traps! And now for damage and to hit for epics.
Human Toughness III

Half Elf is tempting for the same reasons, and could get full AA out of it. (at the cost of the extra skill point)(and looks )

Elf. Full AA. But....if Elf, why not dragon marks and forget those Wiz levels?

Halfling Dragon Marks are nice on any Rgr. Nicer with the Wiz lvls.

Drow.... Ilike Drow Rgrs.

WF. more benefit from Wiz lvls.

Others dont matter. could all work.


Ok...enough.
I think I covered a lot of points for you.

[OldAquarian]

Think about using Half-Elf Wizard Dilettant if all you want is arcane access (or Sorc - but I think Wiz makes more sense here)

[Phidius]

I agree with Talon - definitely a fun build, but it's not optimal for running with power gamers who insist on maximum efficiency in your designated role.

Personally, I prefer the WF 12 Wiz/6 Ranger/2 Rogue (or 2 monk) build as it's just a tougher beast than the 12 Ranger/7 Wizard/1 Rogue (or 1 Monk) build. I had a halfling of the later version that I shelved because I was just having too much fun with the WF version.

However, I recently got access to Drow and Veteran status on my F2P account, and I'm going to spend the limited Turbine Points on content (for faster and easier farming ), so I created the following build to avoid spending points on WF.

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 3.7.0 BETA
DDO Character Planner Home Page

Arcane Ranger
Level 20 True Neutral Drow Male
(1 Rogue \ 12 Ranger \ 7 Wizard) 
Hit Points: 285 = 20 (Heroic) + 10 (Draconic) + 28 (wizard) + 6 (rogue) + 96 (ranger) + 80 (con) + 3 (GFL) + 22 (Toughness) + 20 (racial)
Spell Points: 665 = 215 (wizard) + 112 (ranger) + 96 (int) + 42 (wis) + 200 (archmagi) 
BAB: 15\15\20\25\25
Fortitude: 25 = 2 (wizard) + 0 (rogue) + 8 (ranger) + 4 (con) + 1 (ritual) + 5 (item) + 4 (GH) + 1 (luck)
Reflex: 35 = 2 (wizard) + 3 (rogue) + 8 (ranger) + 11 (dex) + 1 (ritual) + 5 (item) + 4 (GH) + 1 (luck)
Will: 22 = 5 (wizard) + 0 (rogue) + 4 (ranger) + 2 (wis) + 1 (ritual) + 5 (item) + 4 (GH) + 1 (luck)

Abilities

Strength             22 = 14 + 6 (item) + 2 (Ram's Might)
Dexterity            32 = 16 + 5 (levels) + 1 (tome) + 6 (item) + 4 (APs)
Constitution         18 = 12 + 6 (item)
Intelligence         16/22 = 14 + 2 (tome) + 6 (item - situational)
Wisdom               14 = 8 + 6 (item)
Charisma             16/22 = 16 + 6 (item - situational)


Tomes Used

+2 Tome of Intelligence used at level 7
+1 Tome of Intelligence used at level 20


Skills

Balance 35 = 4 (ranks) + 11 (dex) + 15 (item) + 4 (GH) + 1 (luck)
Concentration 32 = 23 (ranks) + 4 (con) + 4 (GH) + 1 (luck)
Disable Device d20 + 56 = 23 (ranks) + 6 (int) + 15 (item) + 7 (tools) + 4 (GH) + 1 (luck)
Hide 30 = 4 (ranks) + 11 (dex) + 10 (item) + 4 (GH) + 1 (luck)
Jump 40 = 0 (ranks) 6 (str) + 30 (spell) + 4 (GH)
Move Silently 31 = 5 (ranks) + 11 (dex) + 10 (item) + 4 (GH) + 1 (luck)
Open Lock d20 + 42 = 4 (ranks) + 11 (dex) + 15 (item) + 7 (tools) + 4 (GH) + 1 (luck)
Search 49 = 23 (ranks) + 6 (int) + 15 (item) + 4 (GH) + 1 (luck)
Spot 45 = 23 (ranks) + 2 (wis) + 15 (item) + 4 (GH) + 1 (luck)
Swim 29 = 3 (ranks) + 6 (str) + 15 (item) + 4 (GH) + 1 (luck)
Tumble 27 = 1 (ranks) + 11 (dex) + 10 (spell) + 4 (GH) + 1 (luck)
Use Magic Device = 37 = 23 (ranks) + 6 (cha) + 3 (item) + 4 (GH) + 1 (luck)


Level 1 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+4)
Skill: Concentration (+2)
Skill: Disable Device (+4)
Skill: Hide (+4)
Skill: Move Silently (+4)
Skill: Open Lock (+4)
Skill: Search (+4)
Skill: Spot (+4)
Skill: Swim (+3)
Skill: Tumble (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+4)
Feat: (Selected) Toughness


Level 2 (Ranger)
Skill: Concentration (+2)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 3 (Wizard)
Skill: Concentration (+2)
Skill: Search (+1)
Feat: (Wizard Bonus) Extend Spell
Feat: (Selected) Weapon Finesse


Level 4 (Wizard)
Ability Raise: DEX
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+0.5)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 5 (Wizard)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+0.5)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 6 (Wizard)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+0.5)
Feat: (Selected) Dodge


Level 7 (Wizard)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+0.5)
Feat: (Wizard Bonus) Maximize Spell


Level 8 (Wizard)
Ability Raise: DEX
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 9 (Wizard)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Mobility


Level 10 (Ranger)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Search (+7)
Skill: Spot (+1)


Level 11 (Ranger)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+7)


Level 12 (Ranger)
Ability Raise: DEX
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+2.5)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+2)
Feat: (Selected) Spring Attack


Level 13 (Ranger)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+3)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)


Level 14 (Ranger)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1.5)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1.5)


Level 15 (Ranger)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+2)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Piercing Weapons


Level 16 (Ranger)
Ability Raise: DEX
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+2)


Level 17 (Ranger)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+2)


Level 18 (Ranger)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+2)
Feat: (Selected) Oversized Two Weapon Fighting


Level 19 (Ranger)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+2)


Level 20 (Ranger)
Ability Raise: DEX
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1.5)
Enhancement: Rogue Haste Boost I
Enhancement: Ranger Sprint Boost I
Enhancement: Drow Melee Attack I
Enhancement: Drow Melee Attack II
Enhancement: Drow Melee Damage I
Enhancement: Drow Melee Damage II
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Fluidity I
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Fluidity II
Enhancement: Elven Dexterity I
Enhancement: Elven Dexterity II
Enhancement: Ranger Item Defense I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness II
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Attack I
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Attack II
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Damage I
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Damage II
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Damage III
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Defense I
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Defense II
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Resistance I
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Resistance II
Enhancement: Ranger Tempest I
Enhancement: Ranger Tempest II
Enhancement: Wizard Lineage of Elements I
Enhancement: Wizard Lineage of Elements II
Enhancement: Wizard Lineage of Deadly Elements I
Enhancement: Wizard Elemental Manipulation I
Enhancement: Wizard Elemental Manipulation II
Enhancement: Wizard Elemental Manipulation III
Enhancement: Ranger Devotion I
Enhancement: Ranger Devotion II
Enhancement: Ranger Devotion III
Enhancement: Ranger Devotion IV
Enhancement: Ranger Dexterity I
Enhancement: Ranger Dexterity II
Enhancement: Wizard Wand and Scroll Mastery I
Enhancement: Wizard Wand and Scroll Mastery II