ok....

[chrisgina39]

it is just me or are people becoming more noobish

today someone kicked me out of a group becuase

me '?'
me 'no rouge has 22 int'
him ' most trap monkeys do and you would be able to disarm them so we all die'
me 'i can disarm them and what rouge specs 100% in traps?'
him 'not with assain specs
me 'do you know ANYTHING about rouges?'
this is where i got ignored im guessing

realy...(this was on xorain ciper)
people should learn more about other classes

anyone else got a story?



btw this is not a flame me becuase you dont like me or my spelling

[lordpummel1-1]

yes rogues can have 22 intell thank you. some do just spec out rogue cause thats what they like playing. How could you complain about anything anyone does ever with the way you play. And for all you know you were talking to an alt of someone who knows you and wouldnt take advice from you if there life depended on it.

[Aranticus]

me 'no rouge has 22 int'

14 base
2 tome
6 item
-------
22 int
-------
1 +3 tome
3 +3 exceptional
-------
26 int
-------
2 yugo pot (drink at your own risk)
2 house d pot
2 store pot
-------
32 int

ps: this isnt the max yet

[TheDearLeader]

Xorian Cipher. This is a Level 8 Quest. Lets assume that they're doing it on Elite for Funsies, level 10 quest. Lets assume that our fair rogue's character level is 9 for this exercise.

14 base
2 tome Possible @ Level 8, not likely.
6 item Unbound, No RR, we're looking at +4 at level.
-------
22 int So.. 18 Int.
-------
1 +3 tome
3 +3 exceptional Both the tome and exceptional are silly, given the context.
-------
26 int 18 int.
-------
2 yugo pot (drink at your own risk)
2 house d pot
2 store pot Again, all three rather silly, given the context.
-------
32 int ...18 int.

ps: this isnt the max yet

I'm not saying that any part of this calculation is anything less than factual - all these are ways of gaining a higher Int score.

But given the context of what we're talking about, Xorian Cipher, a 22 Int is asking a bit much.

We could say
Drow, Max Int (20)
+4 Item
+1 Level up
+1 Ship Buff

= 26 Int. Sure, entirely possible at level 7 without the usage of tomes. But rogues are stat-starved, and there's a good chance that Str/Dex/Con would lose out in there somewhere.

Good luck in your future gaming experiences. Keep your skills high and your items level-appropriate, and you'll go far.

[Malithar45]

Just out of curiousity, where did the mentality stem from that you needed a specific amount of Int to do anything? Is it just because its tied to the skills, or were things different at some point? See this a lot at the lower lvls, and there are some ability score runes scattered among quests, but more often than not it seems to be in the context of finding/disarming traps. Vers/skill boost, appropriate level +skill and +ability items were all I ever found myself needing with a starting Int of 12.

[Bobthesponge]

Just out of curiousity, where did the mentality stem from that you needed a specific amount of Int to do anything? Is it just because its tied to the skills, or were things different at some point? See this a lot at the lower lvls, and there are some ability score runes scattered among quests, but more often than not it seems to be in the context of finding/disarming traps. Vers/skill boost, appropriate level +skill and +ability items were all I ever found myself needing with a starting Int of 12.

probably because Search is based on INT. if you can't find the traps you can't disable them.

[Malithar45]

Right. I guess what I'm saying is I don't see why people focus so much on the ability score, rather than the skill score. Sure they're linked, but as was pointed out, you could expect a +2 boost to the skills from a +4 Int item, same you'd see in a skill boost, heroism, ect. Haven't run the Cipher in forever, but did just check and saw that it has Int runes that require 20-24 Int to deactive, so I get it now for that quest. But still, I've seen that far too often in lower lvls that don't have any runes.

[Aranticus]

14+2tome+5rr item+1ship=22

Also there are ML9 rr +6 items. These are really rare but they do exist

Xorian Cipher. This is a Level 8 Quest. Lets assume that they're doing it on Elite for Funsies, level 10 quest. Lets assume that our fair rogue's character level is 9 for this exercise.



I'm not saying that any part of this calculation is anything less than factual - all these are ways of gaining a higher Int score.

But given the context of what we're talking about, Xorian Cipher, a 22 Int is asking a bit much.

We could say
Drow, Max Int (20)
+4 Item
+1 Level up
+1 Ship Buff

= 26 Int. Sure, entirely possible at level 7 without the usage of tomes. But rogues are stat-starved, and there's a good chance that Str/Dex/Con would lose out in there somewhere.

Good luck in your future gaming experiences. Keep your skills high and your items level-appropriate, and you'll go far.

[yodino]

14+2tome+5rr item+1ship=22

Also there are ML9 rr +6 items. These are really rare but they do exist

This has really gotten out of context. There's no way you can expect an average rogue to have that kind of stat in INT for a Xorian Cipher run. I understand that your trying to show that it's possible, but no way would a rogue around level 9 be packing that.

I would pin the blame of the leader for assuming the rogue had that much int at level 9. I always ask prospective party members if they have that much of the stat that I'm looking for (If it's that kind of quest of course).

[dunklezhan]

you might expect a rog2/wiz6-8 to have int 22. My pure rogue (who I started at Int16 because I'm a ***** for skill points) had int 20 at that level. Both of my characters who fit that bracket had no trouble finding the traps on elite with level appropriate spot/search/disable gear.

But for Xorien Cipher, every run I've ever done, the expectation is that the arcane has the int for the runes, not the rogue.

[Lorz]

I would have kicked you both....because I need a rogue....not makeup.



Yes but I'm a bit of pain........

Actually op...I've been known to form entire groups get into quest and then realize hmmmm...a rogue or even some makeup would be nice....I do not let it stop the run. Really if you can complete it as is.....i would ask each player....what do you base your skill as a player on. One of my big criteria......getting the job done regardless. The one I forget to include more than makeup are those silly healers.

Don't worry about it...and yes the player base is getting worse skill wise....not better.

[EatSmart]

me 'no rouge has 22 int'
...
me 'do you know ANYTHING about rouges?'

Put yourself in their position:
You made a sweeping generalisation about the class that's incorrect
You used "rouge" not "rogue" when you play one
You made a rhetorical insult

That does rather pain you in a bad light. Many people play this game for fun and consider spending the time explaining/defending their opinions an irritating activity.

Them /expecting/ you to have a 22 int at lvl 10 simply because you are a rogue is unreasonable. "Hoping" is fine, "expecting" and getting uptight about it is not fine.

[Aranticus]

This has really gotten out of context. There's no way you can expect an average rogue to have that kind of stat in INT for a Xorian Cipher run. I understand that your trying to show that it's possible, but no way would a rogue around level 9 be packing that.

I would pin the blame of the leader for assuming the rogue had that much int at level 9. I always ask prospective party members if they have that much of the stat that I'm looking for (If it's that kind of quest of course).

Context is that the OP was putting the noob down when him/herself isn't that knowledgeable. These days it's not that uncommon to see mechanic repeater rogues that spot a high int

[chrisgina39]

Put yourself in their position:
You made a sweeping generalisation about the class that's incorrect
You used "rouge" not "rogue" when you play one
You made a rhetorical insult

That does rather pain you in a bad light. Many people play this game for fun and consider spending the time explaining/defending their opinions an irritating activity.

Them /expecting/ you to have a 22 int at lvl 10 simply because you are a rogue is unreasonable. "Hoping" is fine, "expecting" and getting uptight about it is not fine.

you say rogue i say rouge and insulting my spelling:P
but true 1 of many bad habits i got

[aradelothion]

Just out of curiousity, where did the mentality stem from that you needed a specific amount of Int to do anything? Is it just because its tied to the skills, or were things different at some point? See this a lot at the lower lvls, and there are some ability score runes scattered among quests, but more often than not it seems to be in the context of finding/disarming traps. Vers/skill boost, appropriate level +skill and +ability items were all I ever found myself needing with a starting Int of 12.

I think in this case it's specifically for the Int runes in Xorian Cipher.

[voodoogroves]

misread, sorry

[chrisgina39]

Dude is an assassin; he said so in the first post.

An assassin level 9 is going to have assassinate which is keyed off of INT. I've seen plenty of Assassins that push INT much higher than that. Simply drow 16 or 18 + 4 item + tome or ship buffs hits a 22 easily. Easily.

wrong nothing says im a assain i multi classed and he assumed it
also im elf and 14 start int assains usealy have more dex:P

[TheDearLeader]

14+2tome+5rr item+1ship=22

Also there are ML9 rr +6 items. These are really rare but they do exist

True. Such items exist. But nothing in this post says this player has the time invested in game to gather the necessary economy to own a tome, a RR item, or the rare +6 @ level 9 item. I think its impractical to assume everyone has such things laying around (although its nice when you do! ^^)

Dude is an assassin; he said so in the first post.

An assassin level 9 is going to have assassinate which is keyed off of INT. I've seen plenty of Assassins that push INT much higher than that. Simply drow 16 or 18 + 4 item + tome or ship buffs hits a 22 easily. Easily.

Paladins base their spellcasting off Wisdom; that doesn't mean I approve of a base 16-Wis Paladin just because I've seen a toon that pulls it off successfully. I wasn't suggesting that Int be a Dump-stat. I think it is agreed that rogues are rather tight on stat points, and to push one too high is at the detriment of the other necessary stats.

And, again, Tomes don't fall out of the sky, unless that sky is the DDO Store.

But for funsies, I'll do another possible "got up to 22 int realistically" scenario.
16 Base
+2 Levelups
+4 Generic item, or Fox's Cunning Pots.
=22 Int @ level 9.

So... yeah, possible. But *probably* not absolutely positive necessary, as long as their skills are put in appropriate places and their Spot/Search/Disable items are kept level-appropriate. Some skills boosts, some heroism pots, good times.

As I recall, the only traps that *need* a fully decked out mechanic rogue with max trap stats/gear at level would be A Cabal for One Elite (outside of his current character level) and IQ quests Elite (really outside of his character level). Especially with the nerfing of traps on Epic, the current values of trap DCs make it where most rogue-splash builds that bother to invest in a little bit of gear can manage the same results that a full rogue can.

[EatSmart]

you say rogue i say rouge and insulting my spelling:P
but true 1 of many bad habits i got

Yes, but see it from their perspective. When someone is playing a class pretty much every window they open such as their enhancment list, their stat page etc lists the correct spelling of their class somewhere. You're not giving people a lot of confidence in your knowledge of your class if you dont spell it right. Or to put it another way, if you keep doing something wrong dispite regular, irrefutable reminders that you're wrong, it suggests that you will or have made mistakes in more important and less obvious areas of gameplay/character design.

[chrisgina39]

Yes, but see it from their perspective. When someone is playing a class pretty much every window they open such as their enhancment list, their stat page etc lists the correct spelling of their class somewhere. You're not giving people a lot of confidence in your knowledge of your class if you dont spell it right. Or to put it another way, if you keep doing something wrong dispite regular, irrefutable reminders that you're wrong, it suggests that you will or have made mistakes in more important and less obvious areas of gameplay/character design.

so wait becuase i spell 'rogue' wrong people think i know nothin about them lol