Petition: Samurai

**gorgorothsixsixsix** · 10-25-2010, 06:52 AM

there are samurai in eberron? yeah. http://eberron.wikia.com/wiki/Samurai

special abilities (these are stuff i chose from http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Samurai_%283.5e_Class%29 and tweaked a bit when too powerful. my intention was to create a melee class who is strong against casters)

1. ancestral weaponry; the weapon chosen gains ghost touch property. (like kensei attack bonuses that would work only with the chosen weapon again)

2. Pledge of Loyalty: +4 bonus against mind-affecting effects. (enchancement?)

3. Kiai! (Ex): At 3rd level, a Samurai may convert a successful strike into a confirmed critical hit (...)

note: this would be a toggle button with x charges. like if you activate it and miss, charge is not used. but if you hit it's a crit for sure and charge used.

(...) He may use this ability a number of times per day equal to half his Samurai level + 2.

4. Whirlwind Attack: A Samurai gains Whirlwind as a bonus feat at 4th level.

5. Blindfighting: A Samurai gains Blind Fighting as a bonus feat at 6th level. If the Samurai already has this feat, he may choose a Combat Feat instead, but only if he meets the prerequisites of that feat.

6. Terrible Blows (Su): At 6th level, a Samurai's Ancestral Weapon bypasses Damage Reduction and ignores Hardness. (this would be too much i guess, maybe an enhacement starts with 5 bypass damage reduction or something like that)

6. Parry Magic (Su): At 8th level, a Samurai may use his Ancestral Weapon to parry magic targeted at him. When the Samurai is targeted by a spell or supernatural ability, he may take an Attack of Opportunity against the targeted effect. If he can make an attack roll against an AC equal to the spell or effect's DC with this Attack of Opportunity, the effect does not affect him. (super cool, no?)

note; (SU)per natural abilities doesn't work in antimagic field like beholders'.

7. Deny Caster Defenses (Ex): At 13th level, a Samurai attacking with his Ancestral Weapon ignores any AC bonuses on his targets that come from spells or spell-like abilities.

8. Reflect Magic (Su): At 16th level, an spell effect that would be dispelled by a successful use of the Samurai's Parry Magic ability can instead be reflected back on the caster, as per a spell turning effect.

even if not samurai, what other anti caster melee you would like to see in game?

**Emizand** · 10-25-2010, 06:55 AM

Originally Posted by gorgorothsixsixsix

what other anti caster melee you would like to see in game?

Occult Slayer

**gorgorothsixsixsix** · 10-25-2010, 05:17 PM

so after some more reading, i realized that this should be a prestige class for fighter instead of a new class.

something like, "samurai I" gives +4 bonus against mind-affecting effects, ghost touch property for ancestral weapon and kiai.

requirement for "samurai I"; whirlwind attack (which of course also requires combat expertise and spring attack)

and yes, combat expertise also requires 13 int.

then "samurai II" gives terrible blows, parry magic and blind fighting.

requirement for samurai II; iron will, discipline and lightning reflexes.

i make so many requirements i know because fighters already good enough and samurai prestige class would make them a bit too powerful. so he gotta use some of those bonus feats.

finally "samurai III"; deny caster defenses and reflect magic.

which requires nothing.

............................

the only problem is that int 13 but then again this would go great when multiclassing with rogues and even some tankish tempests.

oh, also katana pls

**Aranticus** · 10-25-2010, 06:19 PM

Many of the abilities that are listed are very poor for a mmo setting

**Aaxeyu** · 10-25-2010, 06:27 PM

Here's a suggestion: Learn the game before making suggestions.

**Mister_Peace** · 10-25-2010, 06:31 PM

Twf fighter, bastard sword and short sword

full ranks of Intimidate

brigandine armor

done

Edit: don't forget LN alignment

**voodoogroves** · 10-25-2010, 06:38 PM

Samurai is a base class in 3.x. Of course, it's pretty darn weak. I'd rather play a fighter with different skinned armor. That'd be nifty. The Samurai class has similar problems to many other 3.5 base classes in that it has non-scaling abilities in the class progression and was either ignored or dipped only. Swashbuckler is in a similar boat - optimized no one really took more than a few levels. That said, I'd love to see Scout and Swashbuckler.

Classes which would translate best as PREs or even base classes would have meaningful abilities that scale as the character progresses.

so - I guess - I don't need a samurai

And further, a samurai without kick-rear armor would be lame. I'd rather have new armor skins, new helmets and new weapons to look like one.

**Chai** · 10-25-2010, 06:53 PM

Originally Posted by gorgorothsixsixsix

there are samurai in eberron? yeah. http://eberron.wikia.com/wiki/Samurai

special abilities (these are stuff i chose from http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Samurai_%283.5e_Class%29 and tweaked a bit when too powerful. my intention was to create a melee class who is strong against casters)

1. ancestral weaponry; the weapon chosen gains ghost touch property. (like kensei attack bonuses that would work only with the chosen weapon again)

2. Pledge of Loyalty: +4 bonus against mind-affecting effects. (enchancement?)

3. Kiai! (Ex): At 3rd level, a Samurai may convert a successful strike into a confirmed critical hit (...)

note: this would be a toggle button with x charges. like if you activate it and miss, charge is not used. but if you hit it's a crit for sure and charge used.

(...) He may use this ability a number of times per day equal to half his Samurai level + 2.

4. Whirlwind Attack: A Samurai gains Whirlwind as a bonus feat at 4th level.

5. Blindfighting: A Samurai gains Blind Fighting as a bonus feat at 6th level. If the Samurai already has this feat, he may choose a Combat Feat instead, but only if he meets the prerequisites of that feat.

6. Terrible Blows (Su): At 6th level, a Samurai's Ancestral Weapon bypasses Damage Reduction and ignores Hardness. (this would be too much i guess, maybe an enhacement starts with 5 bypass damage reduction or something like that)

6. Parry Magic (Su): At 8th level, a Samurai may use his Ancestral Weapon to parry magic targeted at him. When the Samurai is targeted by a spell or supernatural ability, he may take an Attack of Opportunity against the targeted effect. If he can make an attack roll against an AC equal to the spell or effect's DC with this Attack of Opportunity, the effect does not affect him. (super cool, no?)

note; (SU)per natural abilities doesn't work in antimagic field like beholders'.

7. Deny Caster Defenses (Ex): At 13th level, a Samurai attacking with his Ancestral Weapon ignores any AC bonuses on his targets that come from spells or spell-like abilities.

8. Reflect Magic (Su): At 16th level, an spell effect that would be dispelled by a successful use of the Samurai's Parry Magic ability can instead be reflected back on the caster, as per a spell turning effect.

even if not samurai, what other anti caster melee you would like to see in game?

I think these Samaurai rules were written up to be more like Jedi and less like Samaurai. It parries magic with its sword and cuts through just about anything? Sounds like a lightsaber to me. (In Chris Rock's voice...) George Lucas gonna sue somebody!

**Xenus_Paradox** · 10-25-2010, 07:01 PM

No non-Eberron-specific classes until we get Artificers!

**Aranticus** · 10-25-2010, 08:16 PM

Originally Posted by Mister_Peace

Twf fighter, bastard sword and short sword

full ranks of Intimidate

brigandine armor

done

Edit: don't forget LN alignment

lawful yes but i do not think i seen anywhere stating a samurai must be neutral as well

**gorgorothsixsixsix** · 10-26-2010, 01:35 AM

Originally Posted by Aranticus

Many of the abilities that are listed are very poor for a mmo setting

trolls.

i already said this is fighter prestige class.

and this, is way better than kensei.

if kensei is not very poor, this is not too.

Originally Posted by voodoogroves

3.5 base classes in that it has non-scaling abilities in the class progression

did you even read? here are some stuff scaling with level;

6. Terrible Blows (Su): At 6th level, a Samurai's Ancestral Weapon bypasses Damage Reduction and ignores Hardness. (this would be too much i guess, maybe an enhacement starts with 5 bypass damage reduction or something like that)

3. Kiai! (Ex): At 3rd level, a Samurai may convert a successful strike into a confirmed critical hit (...)

note: this would be a toggle button with x charges. like if you activate it and miss, charge is not used. but if you hit it's a crit for sure and charge used.

(...) He may use this ability a number of times per day equal to half his Samurai level + 2.

besides, these are just what i picked from original samurai concept. otherwise they get vorpal property to ancestral weapon too but if i were to include that you would say too strong this time.

Originally Posted by Xenus_Paradox

No non-Eberron-specific classes until we get Artificers!

read only first line? here; http://eberron.wikia.com/wiki/Samurai

**voodoogroves** · 10-26-2010, 01:50 AM

Originally Posted by gorgorothsixsixsix

did you even read? here are some stuff scaling with level;

Standard internet procedure would have me one-up your snide comment, but I'm going to assume you were caught at a weak moment.

(1) Yes I read it.

(2) Why would Turbine create something completely different than what is in the D&D IP, given that this game is ALL ABOUT THE D&D IP? Because you think Samurai are cool?

(3) If they base the class on the IP, it's weak. It's incredibly weak.

(4) Your idea, while it shows you like to be creative, does nothing for me. I get you think it's awesome; we are each entitled to our own opinions.

(5) Flavor-wise, are there Samurai (the 3.5 class) in Eberron? Sure thing. They may not look anything like you think they do and they certainly by-the-book don't function like you're describing. Thing is, basically anything in D&D can be found in Eberron - that was one of the reasons it won the setting search - it's open-ended and expansive opportunities.

(6) Flavor-wise, if you want something that looks like a samurai, there is no such equipment set in the game. I'd much rather (and this is my opinion) have them add visual flavor than a poor version (yours) of an already poor 3.5 base class (the published one).

(7) If they add more mechanical elements, I'd much rather they focus on other D&D components that haven't been covered instead of yet-another Samurai. I'd much rather have a D&D-specific thing, than a transplant. Even if you dreamed up the coolest and most balanced awesome mechanic progression for the Samurai class, I'd still rather have a Warlock, Duskblade, Beguiler, Dragonfire Adept, Crusader, Artificer or other D&D-specific base class ... or a Spellsword, Knight Phantom, Weretouched Master, Enlightened Fist, Escalation Mage, Landforged Walker, etc. D&D or Eberron flavored PRC. Revenant Blades. Nonsomatic Chirugen. I'd much rather have something that oozed Eberron or at least D&D than a transplant that is in the "also found here" section. I'd rather have a "generic" non-eberron base class than one that has specific cultural ties which have been back-fit to "can be found in Eberron".

I also don't want to convert Sailor Moon to DDO, call me crazy.

I totally read what you wrote, and disagree with the choice of the class and your interpretation.

**gorgorothsixsixsix** · 10-26-2010, 10:46 AM

what i want is a melee class who can kill casters. can't tank many mobs but goes there, through magic, not affected, and kills the bastard. like my last sentence in the first post; even if not samurai, what other anti caster melee...

adding samurai, if they were to do what i suggested is not that hard. i'm not into something that looks like a samurai, i'm into something that cuts magic being a melee.

is kensei very weak? well, my samurai will be stronger than kensei at least. and again, it's not like i'm a dev and you have to accept my samurai as it is. even though i gave a detailed description, it's still conceptual because;

monk's flurry is not flurry, clerics has no domains, rangers can't track, the most fun ability of fighter, cleave sucks. can't sneak attack with bows, "action points" something completely else than what you see in other games eg. neverwinter nights or baldurs gate...

make 18 shortcut bars, fill it with 100 clickies, solo everything just jumping and firewalling. shows how far this is from real d&d.

everyone is a rambo. so don't tell me original d&d rules and stuff.

**richieelias27** · 10-26-2010, 01:02 PM

Hmm... What anti-caster melee should be added to the game? I pick Monk.

Oh wait, thats already in there.

Any sort of ability that flat out bypasses all DR, even just by 1 point, is completely contrary to the way DR works.

Autocrit-on-demand is just silly overpowered. Even with charges. And especially so if charges dont get used on a miss.

There is no such thing as attack of opportunity in DDO.

Enemy casters typically do not buff themselves with +AC spells.

Blindfighting is not a feat in DDO. Even if it were, it would be worthless once you had mantle+VoM

Whirlwind is worthless as an attack in DDO.

So, what is left? Ghost touch and +4 vs mind affecting spells... wait, you have protection vs evil already? Well theres always that ghost touch sword...

**Plutocracy** · 10-26-2010, 01:12 PM

Lots of ways to make samurai with existing stuff, like others have said.

Full fighter kensei (I'm sure many samurai certainly were) fits the flavor.

Or, fighter(kensei)/monk multiclass for the more clothed no armor version.

Really, the only thing missing is adding more great/bastard/long sword graphics with katana like curves.

**t0r012** · 10-26-2010, 01:12 PM

So, what is left? Ghost touch and +4 vs mind affecting spells... wait, you have protection vs evil already? Well theres always that ghost touch sword...

or pally hunter of the dead I and kensai II
combine the 2 and you can squeak out almost the exact same as the proposed samurai

**elujin** · 10-26-2010, 01:15 PM

makea a pally/monk whirling steel build and call it samurai

or a elf fvs/monk

/done

**Doganpc** · 10-26-2010, 01:23 PM

Totally off topic as this thread should be derailed by now, but similar to the guy who thinks you confused samurai with jedi...

What you see that could be considered a whirlwind attack is actually multiple critical hits in sequence. Samurai are more of a sword out, sword kill, sword readied/stowed. It does help when sword readied leads back into sword kill, but yeah thats my point for the day.

Dogan
pretends to know what he's talking about.

**AyumiAmakusa** · 10-26-2010, 01:25 PM

I want Mystic Theurge.

**gorgorothsixsixsix** · 10-26-2010, 03:37 PM