Creating the Perfect Deepwood Sniper Build

[jeiyuu]

I would love to get everyone's input on how they see this build, and if there are any recommendations for improvement. Please know that I would like to keep this build as the strongest ranger possible. I realized that the Deepwood Sniper prestige is not complete, and therefor decided to omit a prestige from this build completely. Thoughts?

Please comment:

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Jeiyuu 
Level 20 Lawful Good Elf Male
(20 Ranger) 
Hit Points: 242
Spell Points: 400 
BAB: 20\20\25\30\30
Fortitude: 13
Reflex: 18
Will: 6

                  Starting            Ending          Feat/Enhancement
Abilities        Base Stats         Base Stats         Modified Stats
(28 Point)       (Level 1)          (Level 20)           (Level 20)
Strength             16                 21                   21
Dexterity            18                 18                   23
Constitution         12                 12                   12
Intelligence          8                  8                    8
Wisdom               10                 10                   10
Charisma              8                  8                    8

                  Starting            Ending          Feat/Enhancement
                 Base Skills        Base Skills        Modified Skills
Skills           (Level 1)          (Level 20)          (Level 20)
Balance               5.5               17                   17
Bluff                -1                 -1                   -1
Concentration         5                 24                   24
Diplomacy            -1                 -1                   -1
Disable Device       n/a               n/a                   n/a
Haggle               -1                 -1                   -1
Heal                  1                  1                    1
Hide                  8                 29                   29
Intimidate           -1                 -1                   -1
Jump                  3                  5                    5
Listen                0                  0                    2
Move Silently         8                 29                   29
Open Lock             n/a               n/a                   n/a
Perform              n/a               n/a                   n/a
Repair               -1                 -1                   -1
Search               -1                 -1                    1
Spot                  4                 23                   25
Swim                  3                  5                    5
Tumble                n/a               n/a                   n/a
Use Magic Device     n/a               n/a                   n/a

Level 1 (Ranger)
Skill: Balance (+1.5)
Skill: Concentration (+4)
Skill: Heal (+1)
Skill: Hide (+4)
Skill: Move Silently (+4)
Skill: Spot (+4)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Undead
Feat: (Selected) Toughness
Enhancement: Aerenal Elf Melee Damage I
Enhancement: Elven Ranged Damage I


Level 2 (Ranger)
Skill: Balance (+0.5)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Enhancement: Ranger Dexterity I


Level 3 (Ranger)
Skill: Balance (+0.5)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Point Blank Shot
Enhancement: Elven Dexterity I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Damage I


Level 4 (Ranger)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Balance (+0.5)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Enhancement: Aerenal Elf Melee Attack I
Enhancement: Elven Ranged Attack I


Level 5 (Ranger)
Skill: Balance (+0.5)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Giant
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Damage II


Level 6 (Ranger)
Skill: Balance (+0.5)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Weapon Focus: Ranged Weapons
Enhancement: Racial Toughness II
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Attack I
Enhancement: Ranger Dexterity II


Level 7 (Ranger)
Skill: Balance (+0.5)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Enhancement: Elven Ranged Damage II


Level 8 (Ranger)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Balance (+0.5)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Enhancement: Elven Dexterity II


Level 9 (Ranger)
Skill: Balance (+0.5)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Ranged Weapons


Level 10 (Ranger)
Skill: Balance (+0.5)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Construct
Enhancement: Ranger Dexterity III


Level 11 (Ranger)
Skill: Balance (+0.5)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Enhancement: Elven Ranged Attack II


Level 12 (Ranger)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Balance (+0.5)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Piercing Weapons
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Attack II


Level 13 (Ranger)
Skill: Balance (+0.5)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Damage III


Level 14 (Ranger)
Skill: Balance (+0.5)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Damage IV
Enhancement: Ranger Devotion I
Enhancement: Ranger Devotion II


Level 15 (Ranger)
Skill: Balance (+0.5)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Evil Outsider
Feat: (Selected) Power Attack
Enhancement: Aerenal Elf Melee Attack II


Level 16 (Ranger)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Balance (+0.5)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Enhancement: Aerenal Elf Melee Damage II


Level 17 (Ranger)
Skill: Balance (+0.5)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Enhancement: Ranger Devotion III
Enhancement: Ranger Energy of the Wild I


Level 18 (Ranger)
Skill: Balance (+0.5)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Mental Toughness
Enhancement: Ranger Devotion IV


Level 19 (Ranger)
Skill: Balance (+0.5)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Enhancement: Ranger Item Defense I
Enhancement: Ranger Energy of the Wild II


Level 20 (Ranger)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Balance (+0.5)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Elemental
Enhancement: Ranger Master of Archery
Enhancement: Ranger Energy of the Wild III

[NaturalHazard]

Um maybe you would want to take improved crit ranged earlier, and im not so sure about dodge and mobility? Do you really need them in this build?

[TheDearLeader]

Easy suggestion toward perfecting it would be to have it be 32-point instead of 28.

You don't need Mobility to pew-pew. Shot on the Run already accomplishes that. Dodge also is probably unnecessary. Maybe two more Toughness feats, since you're looking at some low HP? Or since you have UMD, perhaps Skill Focus : UMD?

You don't need Arcane Fluidity, save when UMDing specific arcane scrolls. You probably don't need to spend the AP for it. Also, that extra .5 of UMD @ level 20 could be spent somewhere else - nothing will ever round that .5 out for you.

You have the Devotion enhancement lines, but no Empower or other metamagic feat boost. This will cut into how effective these enhancement lines would really be, especially without human healing amp backing you up.

Also, come Update 7, you'll have more AP to play with since things such as Ranger Spot will cost you less enhancement points (1 per tier).

Just little bits of food for though.

[blitzschlag]

it has to be said deepwood sniper is the weakest pre ingame.

still, you want it, you get it.

some things to consider:

32 point build would benefit this.

strength does your damage. you wan't to kill stuff fast, buff your strength. levelups into strength. +5 dex enhancements + item + tome + exceptional = enough to hit

so
16 str + 5 levelup +6 item +3 exceptional +2 tome + rams = 34 str
16 dex + 5 enhancement + 6 item +3 exceptional +2 tome = 32 dex
14 con + 6 item +2 tome = 22
10 int or 10 cha (depending if you want the skillpoint or the umd +)

dodge and mobility worthless on this. get maximize and quicken. or improved critical piercing for rapiers.

get improved critical ranged earlier (lvl 9) even if you use the silver bow mainly.

[Glenalth]

Your path will be difficult and you are likely to get declined from groups for it. The difference between picking up Deepwood Sniper and not having a prestige enhancement at all is very small. You also have the double disadvantage of taking one of the least effective modes of combat in this game and combining it with the least effective prestige enhancement.

The sole combat ability that you are granted gives you +1 to threat and multiplier for a single shot. This ability is on a 10 second cooldown. If you want to make use of this ability you're going to want the widest threat range you can get. Your best bet is to pick up a Silver Longbow. After you get Improved Critical, it's enlarged threat range will be firing off the occasional arrow at 16-20/x4. Other bows will just be 18-20/x4. That's a 25% chance that your ability will do anything at all with the Silver Longbow and a 15% chance with any other bow.

Maybe someday they'll fill out the other tiers and rework the first tier to be useful.

[blitzschlag]

Maybe someday they'll fill out the other tiers and rework the first tier to be useful.

making it a stance where every 3rd or 4th fired arrow got the properties would be a step in the right direction.

[Glenalth]

making it a stance where every 3rd or 4th fired arrow got the properties would be a step in the right direction.

That would still be incredibly weak. There are a lot of posts out there on how to fix this though. I think Mr. Cow has a good concept that he has posted that focuses on the stealth abilities and grants precision damage (sneak attack).

Eladrin has stated in the past that this line could be changed to cover general ranged combat and not just bows.

[coolpenguin410]

You don't need Mobility to pew-pew. Shot on the Run already accomplishes that. Dodge also is probably unnecessary. Maybe two more Toughness feats, since you're looking at some low HP?

Shot on the Run requires Dodge and Mobility.

That I said, I feel that all three are useless. As a fellow sniper, you goal will be to find a decent perch and snipe away. You will be moving only when mobs get close or to avoid the occasional arrow or thrown weapon. I would recommend picking up a few melee feats. But save them until high level. Maybe power attack and improved crit. Another Toughness feat would not go amiss.

The odd number in CON doesn't help you. Drop it down to 12 and put the other two points into INT for an extra skill point or WIS for extra SP.

You're going to realize pretty fast that you will need some melee ability. It doesn't need to be much, just pick up the weapons that fit best for you and dual wield.

[AltheaSteelrain]

I'm a bow user so I don't know about xbows, though I am familiar with the repeaters, so given that the attack speed of the Great Xbow matches with the longbow, then you could do a 6 rogue/mechanic/12 any class combination to get int as damage bonus to your xbows, ala bow strength, then be proficient with the 18-20 x3 great crossbow, which when you get imp crit: ranged, would equate to a 15-20 x3 2d8 "rifle" that ensures you get your 14-20 x4 2d8 + other modifiers 35% of the time, or 1 in 3 shots.

Not bad eh?

[tihocan]

For an "optimal" build I'd go Str-based (16 Str/18 Dex at character creation, but level-ups in Str), relying on good gear to compensate for the lower to-hit.
Then drop Shot on the Run and pick Power Attack / Improved Crit (Slash or Pierce) instead, so you can melee decently. Btw take Improved Crit: Ranged earlier (L9).
Your last feat at L18 can be pretty much anything (e.g. Skill Focus: UMD, or Maximize, or another Toughness...).

[unbongwah]

Switch to - oh, I'm not supposed to say that? OK, then...

Stats: I would start 16 / 17 / 14 / 8 / 8 / 8 (-1 DEX +1 CON from your build). I would either go STR-based as tihocan suggests or, if you really want to be DEX-based, add Finesse and use rapiers: lower DPS but higher to-hit.

Feats: Toughness (1), PBS (3), WF Ranged (6), Imp Crit Ranged (9), Imp Crit Pierce or Slash (12), Power Attack (15), final feat up to you. [Swap in Finesse somewhere if you go DEX-based.] SotR isn't worth the feat cost on a pure ranger.

One advantage to DWS is it's pretty easy to switch to AA if and when you change your mind; just add Mental Toughness and respec your enhs.

[jeiyuu]

everyone, thank you so much for the suggestions. i will look into these tonight and see if i can rebuild this class, for now i may end up omitting the prestige enhancement for a bit.

unbagwah - thank you for your suggestions in starting stats and feat selection

ticohan - as always, your recommendations are on-point (and i can't wait for your deepwood guide in the new player forum. i've read both your AA and Tempest guides as a starting point for this build)

AltheaSteelrain - thank you for your insight on bows vs xbows, i think i will stick to longbows

coolpenguin410 - good catch on the odd value in setup, and as many are suggesting i will most likely drop the shot on the run feat line

blitzschlag - i would love to do a 32 point build, and i'm sure i will once i get through the game for the first time

Glenalth - i will keep an eye out in the AH for silver bows, hopefully they don't sell too steep

TheDearLeader - i can't wait for update 7, and am debating on waiting to build this character after the update (as i am not sure how it will affect the character)

NaturalHazard - thanks for the tip, will definitely implement taking the feats sooner, just as others have also recommended

everyone, thank you for contributing to the ddo community and aiding to my current addiction with the game and checking the forums.

[AltheaSteelrain]

np. I made a mistake (see how I am unfamiliar with great xbows? :P) they're just 18-20 x2 *sigh*... so if you go deepwood route w/ imp crit: its 14-20 x3 very poor, go stick with a Silver Longbow instead! :P

[Missing_Minds]

You forgot the most important part...

Wait another year for DS to actually be finished.

[AltheaSteelrain]

You forgot the most important part...

Wait another year for DS to actually be finished.

[Missing_Minds]

Think how bards feel. They got their stage I first, and they are STILL waiting to be finished.

[AltheaSteelrain]

Think how bards feel. They got their stage I first, and they are STILL waiting to be finished.

Don't start with the bard :P I am kinda bitter that the tier II doesn't give an extra +1/+1 song, and are practically underpowered even for pure class (though wearing epic marilith is kinda cool).

@topic

I rolled a vet great xbow user that I plan to be a 6 mechanic / 12 ranger / 2 wizard drow int based deepwood sniper, and it is so hard to increase the damage output of xbows/repeaters without getting mechanic I PrE *sigh*. Currently she is only at level 5, 2 ranger, 3 rogue, and if I reach level 6 rogue for the mechanic, and get ranger to level 4 for ram's might, I figure;

2d8 Great Crossbow
9 Int Bonus (28 int)
5 Weapon Enhancement
+3 House D returning Bolt
2 Ram's Might
9 Favored Enemy (situational)
------------------
2d8+19(28) 15- 20 x2 (14-20 x3 deepwood shot every 10 seconds)

This excludes weapon prefix/suffix damage and 6 rogue sneak attacks (w/c you will not get since my doctrine in ranged is shoot as far away as possible, switch and dive when target is in melee range)

Though I am not sure if firing deepwood shot during manyshot would affect your extra shots when using a bow, should be a great DPS combo if it did work that way.

Just for reference.

[NaturalHazard]

everyone, thank you so much for the suggestions. i will look into these tonight and see if i can rebuild this class, for now i may end up omitting the prestige enhancement for a bit.

unbagwah - thank you for your suggestions in starting stats and feat selection

ticohan - as always, your recommendations are on-point (and i can't wait for your deepwood guide in the new player forum. i've read both your AA and Tempest guides as a starting point for this build)

AltheaSteelrain - thank you for your insight on bows vs xbows, i think i will stick to longbows

coolpenguin410 - good catch on the odd value in setup, and as many are suggesting i will most likely drop the shot on the run feat line

blitzschlag - i would love to do a 32 point build, and i'm sure i will once i get through the game for the first time

Glenalth - i will keep an eye out in the AH for silver bows, hopefully they don't sell too steep

TheDearLeader - i can't wait for update 7, and am debating on waiting to build this character after the update (as i am not sure how it will affect the character)

NaturalHazard - thanks for the tip, will definitely implement taking the feats sooner, just as others have also recommended

everyone, thank you for contributing to the ddo community and aiding to my current addiction with the game and checking the forums.

Hey +1 to you for your attitude its refreshing to get someone like you posting on here, hope you enjoy then game. What server do you play on?

[NaturalHazard]

Hey do you absulotely have to stay pure ranger? You could gain a lot by adding levels of monk, rogue and fighter here, maybe even barberian, all depends on your play stlye and how you want your charactor to be. You could take the fighter kensai 1? to increase your bow dps even more. Um monk can add more ac, and a few so you can melee better, rogue umd, sneak attack. Barberian more str for more damage, fast movement. Its all up to you.

[DustTheWind]

I do believe barbs get enhanced crit multiplier but only while raging. Am I wrong? They used to get enhanced crit range also but I believe that was taken out. But I do think it would be possible to get a peroidic 16-20(x5) possibly while raging. Might take a while to get there though like maybe level 18. I think its the barbs 2nd tier that does that maybe.

I think also don't fighters eventually get something that enhances their crit range? I know they eventually get the damage enhancements also and a better choice of feats. However less skill points and no magic.