Shocking Behaviour Turbine

[TanthNefzen]

So, in-game bugs (ie: developer's responsibility) have to be rectified by players spending turbine points? Just had a chat with my brother, who basically had a bugged character (wasnt giving him one of the feats he should have) and after contacting a GM, was informed he needed to BUY a reincarnation, to fix a BUG? If he'd chosen a feat wrong or whatever, this would be acceptable, but because the game doesnt work as it should, he'll be expected to pay around £9-£10? If this IS actually how turbine operate, i'll be cancelling my sub in pretty short order. as will the bunch of us that play together. I doubt any of us are willing to invest time and money into a game that will then charge you for their mistakes.

[SiliconShadow]

Either he didn't make the bug transparent enough or it wasn't a bug and an error and the GM saw that.

Did he go through to 3rd line support?

[blitzschlag]

what class and feat are we talking about?

what about a reroll?

[Tom318]

So, in-game bugs (ie: developer's responsibility) have to be rectified by players spending turbine points? Just had a chat with my brother, who basically had a bugged character (wasnt giving him one of the feats he should have) and after contacting a GM, was informed he needed to BUY a reincarnation, to fix a BUG? If he'd chosen a feat wrong or whatever, this would be acceptable, but because the game doesnt work as it should, he'll be expected to pay around £9-£10? If this IS actually how turbine operate, i'll be cancelling my sub in pretty short order. as will the bunch of us that play together. I doubt any of us are willing to invest time and money into a game that will then charge you for their mistakes.

Need more details, what feat are we talking about?

[sirdanile]

What feat are we talking about here and how is it bugged?

[Therigar]

who basically had a bugged character (wasnt giving him one of the feats he should have)

I see the problem. It was BASICALLY bugged -- that is English for IT WASN"T BUGGED. And it WASNT GIVING HIM ONE OF THE FEATS HE SHOULD HAVE -- that is English for HE FAILED TO TAKE THE RIGHT PREREQS.

Don't blame Turbine for what was the player's fault.

[blitzschlag]

I see the problem. It was BASICALLY bugged -- that is English for IT WASN"T BUGGED. And it WASNT GIVING HIM ONE OF THE FEATS HE SHOULD HAVE -- that is English for HE FAILED TO TAKE THE RIGHT PREREQS.

Don't blame Turbine for what was the player's fault.

while i assume the same, its no good etiquette to yell at people while there is no proof...

[Dexol]

So, in-game bugs (ie: developer's responsibility) have to be rectified by players spending turbine points? Just had a chat with my brother, who basically had a bugged character (wasnt giving him one of the feats he should have) and after contacting a GM, was informed he needed to BUY a reincarnation, to fix a BUG? If he'd chosen a feat wrong or whatever, this would be acceptable, but because the game doesnt work as it should, he'll be expected to pay around £9-£10? If this IS actually how turbine operate, i'll be cancelling my sub in pretty short order. as will the bunch of us that play together. I doubt any of us are willing to invest time and money into a game that will then charge you for their mistakes.

Give us some details and perhaps we can assist you with the problem, maybe it really is a bug and we can't, but it cant hurt to let us try

[donfilibuster]

I heard of feats that can't be removed by fred due to bug but never heard of a feat that you should have go missing.

If it was the latter case it would have been pretty obvious and the GM wouldnt have told you to reincarnate but rather to file a bug report.

[KillEveryone]

Did they take TWF on ranger but went past the level they get TWF for free and not swap out TWF before that point? Fred won't let you change TWF after you've hit the level you get it free.

Did the not have enough stat points into a particular stat that consisted of only points gained from creation, stat level ups, or tomes? Enhancement points don't count. Improved precises shot and TWF for example. You can't use your racial or class enhancement points into DEX to qualify.

Did they not take all the pre-required feats?

Are they at the appropriate level?

How do you know they are supposed to get a certain feat? Are you going off the character generator because that isn't always correct. I've seen Wild Empathy listed under bard in the generator as a given feat but bards don't get that ability.

A couple of examples of what isn't bugged.

[Therigar]

while i assume the same, its no good etiquette to yell at people while there is no proof...

You're right. I'm glad I didn't use curse words along with the yelling. Because players who don't know what they are doing ARE TOO FREAKING SOFT and need our understanding and support. I'm sure that it was all someone else's fault. Let's blame Turbine. Thanks for pointing it out to me.

[Crystalizer]

Did they take TWF on ranger but went past the level they get TWF for free and not swap out TWF before that point? Fred won't let you change TWF after you've hit the level you get it free...

this one is quite tricky indeed...

[MeToo]

Which feat are you talking about? What's the build?

There was a thread where a dwarf fighter (maybe rogue splash) didn't get his proficiency in Dwarven Axes so I know odd things do happen once in a while. I think he was level 6. He showed screenshots listing feats, equipment and to-hit that corroborated his story. He tried tech support. They couldn't help him but I think he ended up just re-rolling instead of waiting for them to fix it.

[Buggss]

You're right. I'm glad I didn't use curse words along with the yelling. Because players who don't know what they are doing ARE TOO FREAKING SOFT and need our understanding and support. I'm sure that it was all someone else's fault. Let's blame Turbine. Thanks for pointing it out to me.

Actually it was exactly what I thought when I read your condescending post.

Feel free to be condescending when we have the details but until then the assumption that it's the players fault is inappropriate.

[Buggss]

this one is quite tricky indeed...

Yep and it's one I fell foul of once too long ago. However there's nothing whatsoever to warn you about it so it's hardly surprising.

[TanthNefzen]

I see the problem. It was BASICALLY bugged -- that is English for IT WASN"T BUGGED. And it WASNT GIVING HIM ONE OF THE FEATS HE SHOULD HAVE -- that is English for HE FAILED TO TAKE THE RIGHT PREREQS.

Don't blame Turbine for what was the player's fault.

No, he was a level 8 cleric, took a fighter level, and as a dwarf, was not proficient in Dwarven Axes. As we all know, dwarven axes are classed as martial weapons for dwarves so after taking a fighter level, he should have been proficient in them. There ARE no prereqs to use Dwarven Axes as a dwarven fighter, therefore this is a bug. Yes, he took it further, and was given the same response.

[TanthNefzen]

Which feat are you talking about? What's the build?

There was a thread where a dwarf fighter (maybe rogue splash) didn't get his proficiency in Dwarven Axes so I know odd things do happen once in a while. I think he was level 6. He showed screenshots listing feats, equipment and to-hit that corroborated his story. He tried tech support. They couldn't help him but I think he ended up just re-rolling instead of waiting for them to fix it.

Posted my reply before getting this far down. arrogant/condescending post led me to reply before reading them all. VERY similar situation, barring he was Cleric/Fighter =)

[Fomori]

No, he was a level 8 cleric, took a fighter level, and as a dwarf, was not proficient in Dwarven Axes. As we all know, dwarven axes are classed as martial weapons for dwarves so after taking a fighter level, he should have been proficient in them. There ARE no prereqs to use Dwarven Axes as a dwarven fighter, therefore this is a bug. Yes, he took it further, and was given the same response.

The GM's cannot grant feats to your character. Giving them that power could (and would) lead to some serious abuse.

Did you contact customer support outside of game to see if they can pass this along to someone with the authority to correct this?

[SisAmethyst]

The problem is that GMs in DDO usually not have much rights to lay hand on something. That to say they can correct a mob that has spawn'd in a wall or other in-game issue. For bugs on a character level they most of the time can't do much as they even bound to a specific procedure which say that the bug first has to be qualified internal. This however may take a couple of time and even longer till it get fixed. As long as only a limited subset of players are affected even longer as if it is a widespread issue.
So I guess the GMs tend to mention that a reincarnation may solve the issue in case one not want to wait that long. That however doesn't mean that this is the only solution, but it is probably just the fastest and easiest.

[Yazston_the_Invoker]

The problem is that it was a bug, and the GMs in game cannot do anything about bugs themselves. In this case, they are probably told not to give out hearts of wood for free, for fear of setting a precedent for future issues where people believe they should get something.

My guess is that the GM told you to bug report it, and that the only solution he could offer is for you to do a LR and choose fighter at 1st level, which should get rid of the bug. Again, most likely because of policies already in place, he would not be allowed to give you the heart of wood for free, which sucks.

On the other hand, aren't they supposed to be adding hearts of wood into the treasure tables with U7? If that is true, then all you would need to do is play other toons until you get a lesser heart from a chest, and it wouldn't cost you anything. Hopefully that's the case, because I know what it's like to have an issue that can only be fixed by "paying" for it. (Name truncated during LR)