Shocking Behaviour Turbine

[TanthNefzen]

sadly my brother was told that the only way to fix it was to use a LR. Which is pretty annoying. Massively unimpressed with the whole escapade, despite it not happening to me =P GM's with no power is pointless, and it doesnt seem like any effort was made to actually rectify the situation after the event or during. Kinda lets down the "VIP" status when you're fobbed off by a powerless GM. Still playing, but sure as hell not paying.

[Therigar]

No, he was a level 8 cleric, took a fighter level, and as a dwarf, was not proficient in Dwarven Axes. As we all know, dwarven axes are classed as martial weapons for dwarves so after taking a fighter level, he should have been proficient in them. There ARE no prereqs to use Dwarven Axes as a dwarven fighter, therefore this is a bug. Yes, he took it further, and was given the same response.

I find this incredibly difficult to believe. In all my time here I've never encountered anything of this nature. There is more to this story than you are presenting.

We use to say, "Screenshot or it didn't happen." I sort of feel the same way. You begin by saying it is sort of a bug and now that you've been called out on it you say it is a bug. You start without offering any description of what is wrong and now you have an example that is extraordinarily unique.

Has anyone with a forum join date earlier than '08 ever encountered anything like this? Are there any threads touching on this type of an issue?

I really have a difficult time believing this is true.

[t0r012]

I'm sorry but I have to say I have a rather strict rule about not believing any rant that includes "my brother/friend/uncle/dog/pet rock"

[zorander6]

I'm sorry but I have to say I have a rather strict rule about not believing any rant that includes "my brother/friend/uncle/dog/pet rock"

What if it happened to my miniature giant space hamster?

[Zilta]

I'm sorry but I have to say I have a rather strict rule about not believing any rant that includes "my brother/friend/uncle/dog/pet rock"

Respect the pet rock or be smited with its rockyness!

[Fomori]

sadly my brother was told that the only way to fix it was to use a LR. Which is pretty annoying. Massively unimpressed with the whole escapade, despite it not happening to me =P GM's with no power is pointless, and it doesnt seem like any effort was made to actually rectify the situation after the event or during. Kinda lets down the "VIP" status when you're fobbed off by a powerless GM. Still playing, but sure as hell not paying.

Have you ever done tech support or known someone that has done tech support? I ask this because this kind of behavior is VERY common from those on the low rung of the totem pole. They are not given powers to handle most situations because their real intention is to be the first line of weeding out the real problems from the dross of all the trouble tickets. They are given the tools to handle a specific set of things and are given company lines for certain other situations.

Usually they do NOT put any effort into really solving your problem because they are not thinking about solving your problem but are running through a mental script of what they were told. Most of these techs are capable at helping people but usually the best get moved up quickly.

Thus if you were told that is the only way to do this by the first person you talked to, and in game, then it doesnt necessarily mean it is the only way. Even the next rung up, who has more powers, might not have the solution.

To be honest, to spend excessive effort on giving you a full level of satisfaction to a solution is probably not what the company wants from them anyways. They want you to move up the chain through their other means an let the GM get back to things he can fix. Its nothing again you or their customers but prudent business sense. You cannot please all of the people all of the time, so do what satisfies the majority and accept the attrition rate.

Thus you should make effort to contact the customer support in the out of game means, telephone... email... They are able to dedicate more time and effort to you, but at the cost of longer wait or response times. Also dont act like its the end of the world or make ultimatums. Nothing annoys a company more than knowing that unless they bend over backwards and sing a ditty, and even then, they might lose you as a customer. In their eyes you are already gone and you are not in a position of strength to make that tactic work. On the other hand dont be docile, be firm as to why you think its a problem and that just letting you speak with someone that has the authority to implement your proposed solution will be a big leap in making you happy.

[MeToo]

No, he was a level 8 cleric, took a fighter level, and as a dwarf, was not proficient in Dwarven Axes.

What's the cleric's base STR? There's a reference somewhere to the Dwarven Axe feat requiring 13 base STR (build + level ups + tomes only) but I don't know whether that applies here.

If that's not the issue, it looks like the same thing that happened four months ago. That was a level 6 dwarf rogue taking fighter at level 7. Turbine didn't help them either.

Have them get a bug report from in-game. Good luck.

[kinar]

What's the cleric's base STR? There's a reference somewhere to the Dwarven Axe feat requiring 13 base STR (build + level ups + tomes only) but I don't know whether that applies here.

If that's not the issue, it looks like the same thing that happened four months ago. That was a level 6 dwarf rogue taking fighter at level 7. Turbine didn't help them either.

Have them get a bug report from in-game. Good luck.

Thats some pretty damning evidence even by DDO standards in that thread right there...

I find this incredibly difficult to believe. In all my time here I've never encountered anything of this nature. There is more to this story than you are presenting.

We use to say, "Screenshot or it didn't happen." I sort of feel the same way. You begin by saying it is sort of a bug and now that you've been called out on it you say it is a bug. You start without offering any description of what is wrong and now you have an example that is extraordinarily unique.

Has anyone with a forum join date earlier than '08 ever encountered anything like this? Are there any threads touching on this type of an issue?

I really have a difficult time believing this is true.

methinks someone owes someone else an apology...or does it not count since MeeToo's forum date is 2009?

[donfilibuster]

There should be a sticky post somewhere regarding GMs and what can they help and what can directly solve and what needs be taken to a full support ticket or bug report.
Maybe there is and no one is reading it, i remember the small text on the in-game support saying that for bug reports you gotta use the provided link.

Now, after reading and hearing a few comments about GM it is fairly obvious they can't alter your toon directly.
As far as i have heard from players that got stuck or glitch they can reset quests when the glitch is apparent.
Like keys missing or npcs that don't advance the quest but the boss or goal is visibly finished, both which happened on recent packs.

But glitched feats, missing quest items or lost inventory, seems GMs can't help with that and is fairly reasonable.
For example, a guildie lost his necro item, but both the emerald and flame npcs refuse to give a new one.
Even if you haven't junked it and still have it the npc gives you a replacement.

The GMs seems to politely point you to the bug report or support tickets, but it is still a canned response so may be if the wording of it changes in some way along pointing you to the instructions for the ticket reports.
That'd be beside the sticky post so you know what to expect.

p.s. (and not suggest to buy a heart of wood at least until the case is resolved)

[Therigar]

I apologize.

Edit:

Now that I've apologized I have duplicated the "bug."

I created a dwarf cleric, leveled to L4 using veteran status. At L3 I took the feat Exotic Weapon: Dwarven Axe. You see where this is going don't you.

I took L4 as a fighter, left the boat, went to Lockania, went to Fred. I knew you saw this coming.

I used the respec to get rid of the unneeded Exotic Weapon: Dwarven Axe and traded for Toughness.

Anyone want to bet on the result?

Now, can we have the full story on the other two incidents?

My money is on this scenario. They took the Dwarven Axe feat in their initial class, leveled to fighter, then respec'd the feat -- causing it to disappear.

That isn't a "bug." It is not understanding the respec tool and some of the consequences.

I'll know more when I try it the other way, by doing the respec first and then taking the level. But that means playing a gimp cleric to L5 to test my theory.

Second Edit:

So, I started another cleric, veteran, L4 off the boat. Took the feat Exotic Weapon: Dwarven Axe. Played him till he had the XP for L5. Went to Fred. Did the respec. Took the fighter level. Bingo, able to use Dwarven Axe!

It appears certain that this is a consequence of using Fred AFTER taking the fighter level and the player using respec to exchange the feat Exotic Weapon: Dwarven Axe for something different. It is the same "bug" that affects rangers Two Weapon Fighting when they have done the same thing (taken the feat, then multiclassed to ranger and used a respec after the fact). This is Turbine's fault only in the sense that it is poor coding on the respec, probably related to how the data is recorded for the feat (instead of being held separately for each cause -- selected or innate -- it stores the data in the same place). So once it is changed it is changed universally. IIRC it may even be a Known Issue.

My apology stands. OP's brother did in fact have a L8 cleric that took a level of fighter. And, OP's brother in fact did miss out on the Dwarven Axe feat. However, I am confident that the reason is as I've described it. Same for the other post referenced by MeToo. Meaning it was a player issue caused by not understanding how respec works.

[TanthNefzen]

My apology stands. OP's brother did in fact have a L8 cleric that took a level of fighter. And, OP's brother in fact did miss out on the Dwarven Axe feat. However, I am confident that the reason is as I've described it. Same for the other post referenced by MeToo. Meaning it was a player issue caused by not understanding how respec works.

Confidently wrong then. Fred wasn't involved whatsoever. He simply levelled up as a Fighter to 8 cleric/1 Fighter, and didnt have the feat. He'd been using maces the whole time. Once again you make an assumption that isnt wrong. I appreciate the people that have actually read and tried to find a solution and i guess i can understand that base level GM's dont really have the power to do anything. I'm just not keen on the idea that this could happen to me at say... level 18 or so, gimp my character and i'll receive no support from the people who're supposed to provide it. To people like the OP: why bother? You assume alot, mainly that me/my brother are idiots. To be fair, i AM an idiot, and have already broken a ranger this way. There's been no post about that because it was my fault. I'm perfectly happy gimping my own characters and having to reroll, but when someone actually takes the time to carefully plan what they want surely they shouldnt be penalised because something doesnt work as it should do. Was quite funny at first, given the fact he spent 8 levels using simple weapons so as not to waste money/shards by using fred. Obviously him being out of pocket is a little less funny.

[Buggss]

Confidently wrong then. Fred wasn't involved whatsoever. He simply levelled up as a Fighter to 8 cleric/1 Fighter, and didnt have the feat. He'd been using maces the whole time. Once again you make an assumption that isnt wrong. I appreciate the people that have actually read and tried to find a solution and i guess i can understand that base level GM's dont really have the power to do anything. I'm just not keen on the idea that this could happen to me at say... level 18 or so, gimp my character and i'll receive no support from the people who're supposed to provide it. To people like the OP: why bother? You assume alot, mainly that me/my brother are idiots. To be fair, i AM an idiot, and have already broken a ranger this way. There's been no post about that because it was my fault. I'm perfectly happy gimping my own characters and having to reroll, but when someone actually takes the time to carefully plan what they want surely they shouldnt be penalised because something doesnt work as it should do. Was quite funny at first, given the fact he spent 8 levels using simple weapons so as not to waste money/shards by using fred. Obviously him being out of pocket is a little less funny.

Some people can't help it, they see so much cynicism, selfishness and deceit they see nothing else.

Some people are actually honest... honestly.

[Missing_Minds]

I find this incredibly difficult to believe. In all my time here I've never encountered anything of this nature. There is more to this story than you are presenting.

Actually, the OP probably isn't making this one up.

There is an issue with multi classing and dwarves taking fighter (so has been reported) such that the martial prof with dwarven axes is NOT granted.

I don't know if it was determined when, but the GM was only partly right. A TR would fix it, but as well would a lesser. (even a re roll)

Take fighter for the first level, then cleric and you'll be fine. If you follow in the same leveling path, I believe you will be bugged once again.


However, the GM has no tools to grant feats so there wasn't much they could do to fix this issue. I don't want the GMs mucking with player character databases.

Edit: and looks like you've seen it for yourself now as well. Only it doesn't take respecing out a feat to cause it to happen.