Something must be done...

[FluffyCalico]

on khyber we drag elemental to SE, 2 mobs (orthon, devil, kobold, orc or cat) to NE and the last (trog, troll or gnoll) to the room just before NE. once mobs are roughly in position, we just kill them straight, running south as we go. only if cat is present then there is prepping

If the group listens well you can just beat them all in south central then drag them out of the pile in order of slowness (that they run while dead) for the killing shot. No need to spread out all over the map.

[Woody00]

One other thing you can add to the list of annoying shroud things is the leaders discounting the bard. I PUG on my Warchnter and get tells after I hit the Join button:

"Whats a warchanter?"

"We need DPS" Leader with 6 other melee in party.

"What can bards do?"

"Bards are gimp."

[Calebro]

One other thing you can add to the list of annoying shroud things is the leaders discounting the bard. I PUG on my Warchnter and get tells after I hit the Join button:

"Whats a warchanter?"

"We need DPS" Leader with 6 other melee in party.

"What can bards do?"

"Bards are gimp."

Am I to assume that you sent a /tell informing the leader that you're a WC? Otherwise how would they know to ask what a WC is?

If this is the case, I have to tell you, it drives me friggin NUTS when I get /tells from puggers before they hit the LFM.
Many of them don't even hit the LFM, they simply send a /tell "Do you need xxx?" or "Invite me."

If any /tell needs to be sent, it will be sent by the leader if he/she has a question for you, otherwise just wait for an answer or join another group. That particular trend from other MMOs has reached us, and it's extremely annoying.

[Woody00]

Am I to assume that you sent a /tell informing the leader that you're a WC? Otherwise how would they know to ask what a WC is?

If this is the case, I have to tell you, it drives me friggin NUTS when I get /tells from puggers before they hit the LFM.
Many of them don't even hit the LFM, they simply send a /tell "Do you need xxx?" or "Invite me."

If any /tell needs to be sent, it will be sent by the leader if he/she has a question for you, otherwise just wait for an answer or join another group. That particular trend from other MMOs has reached us, and it's extremely annoying.

I recieved tells like that when I was lvl 16/17. I would send a tell to the leaders of 18-20 runs if they would take a 16/17. I found out that most leaders got more upset at someone under the level of the LFM just hitting join than someone under the level sending a tell.

Me: " Mind if a lvl 17 Warchanter joins"
Leader: "Whats a Warchanter?"

[Calebro]

I recieved tells like that when I was lvl 16/17. I would send a tell to the leaders of 18-20 runs if they would take a 16/17. I found out that most leaders got more upset at someone under the level of the LFM just hitting join than someone under the level sending a tell.

Me: " Mind if a lvl 17 Warchanter joins"
Leader: "Whats a Warchanter?"

Is that a group you still wanted to join?
I'd have just told them to please decline me.

[Aranticus]

If the group listens well you can just beat them all in south central then drag them out of the pile in order of slowness (that they run while dead) for the killing shot. No need to spread out all over the map.

and for most part this is the most difficult thing to do. getting people to listen. i've seen healers use their entire mana bar for dispatching the 4 bosses in part 5 because people didnt know the concept of pulling apart. even after telling the offending player, he could still argue with "you're wrong, i've done 20 shrouds"

[k0ukla]

I recieved tells like that when I was lvl 16/17. I would send a tell to the leaders of 18-20 runs if they would take a 16/17. I found out that most leaders got more upset at someone under the level of the LFM just hitting join than someone under the level sending a tell.

Me: " Mind if a lvl 17 Warchanter joins"
Leader: "Whats a Warchanter?"

Yeah I like when someone asks me in a tell if they are under level before hitting join.. doesn't mean I'll accept them but they def have more of a chance

[Auran82]

Ran a half pug/half guild shroud the other day with a makeup that would make many Shroud Pug leaders choke and die.

From memory we had:
4 casters (none melee specced)
4 Healers (2 Clerics, 2 FvS, again, none really melee specced)
1 Bard
3 Melee (think it was a rogue, a ranger and a fighter)

Had no issues at all through the entire run, part 4 took *just* over one pass (he had about 10% left when he vanished) had 2 of the healers healing, the other 2 swinging the most useful weapon they happened to be carrying.

No issues at all in part 5, no deaths other than the usual 4 -> 5 ones (though with 4 healers you would hope so)

Whenever I am in a shroud pug looking for a dps (no rogues or monks please) or get declined on my melee because they aren't 'dps' it always cracks me up. I mean, come on, we used to do this raid with half the group under level 15. Hell, we used to run it on elite (for favor usually) when the cap was 16.

[taurean430]

I'm digging these suggestions being offered, it helps alot.

I think I am just going to put up newbie shroud lfm's a few times and see how it goes. It shouldn't be any different than the umpteen times I've had to take over VON 5/6 due to imminent failure. Seems to me that there are just too few people playing at cap that actually check out the forums or wiki. By contrast, when I realized that my first toon wasn't working out this was the first place I came to for answers. Found too much info actually to process immediately, and a guild that still tolerates my newb self and teaches me things.

Things have got to get better in pugland regarding this raid. I spend too much time there on my toons grinding out their gear. Love the raid actually, and I just don't want to end up only running it with select people only.

With luck, I won't end up banging my head against the keyboard.

[cardmj1]

I have been running Shrouds again on a regular basis and I do pug alot. I try very hard to be patient and end up leading the some of the pug raids because I use my mic and use simple instructions. I don't mind it at all and will often be thanked by the original party leader and new players. But one particular issue I have is the total lack of social skills by some of the players I have come across.

For example, had a healer who bugged himself when flagging for the Shroud. He made his signet stone without talking to Valieria (I think that is the name of the npc for the alter in Meridia). Though he made the stone, he didn't go through the instructions of making an item for her and on how to use the stone. So I talked him through it while the party ran part 1. (We were running part one because he couldn't get himself to Meridia alone so another party member was talking him through a ship invite to use the navigator). Anyways, I get him unbugged, we finish part 1 and recall out. He gets the quests and we are ready to run the entire raid. I tell him to stick to my six and he will be just fine for part 1. He then proceeds to talk smack to everyone in the party that has gone out of their way to help him including me. ***? The enitre party helps him out and now he wants to talk **** about us? What is wrong with these people? Half way thru part 1, I just stop helping the new healer and just watch him die while still talking **** throughout the rest of the raid.

[Hrum]

As a relative new player who has reached raiding levels and have run shroud about 30 times now (I ransack cause im newb and need ingreds bad) ill provide some perspective that is obviously clearly lacking in this thread.

The entire weapon system in this game is rather obfuscated, the randomly generated loot is never good, and the auction house system is ****(or was **** in 5 hours from now). This ensures that new-ish players could NEVER have a half decent weapon for Shroud. Even if they truly understood exactly what types of weapons they should be using, obtaining them is neither cheap or easy.

Neither I nor my girlfriend who started at the same time have weapons that break DR in Shroud yet, we are working on them but the ~20 large ingreds we need is a bit oppressive (we have enough for 1 weapon now though! woo!) We also have not seen many boss beater weapons posted on the auction house at reasonable prices.

Unlike most new(and old) players, I relish the research and understanding process so I have a bit of a leg up in most situations. And I frequently lead shroud groups. But as Szrobun said; as a noname and noguild player I dont see many vets come play with me!

That said, it IS just shroud. Boss beaters arent REALLY necessary. Decent teamwork and sharp pointy objects are all that is required. Which ive seen in a majority of the runs ive done. In my 30~ runs ive seen maybe 3 failures total. Including the first few runs I went on where I had NO CLUE what I was doing- though we completed on my first runs because I told them I had no clue whatI was doing and they told me what to do and I did it.

Its going to be a bit harder now in u7, but primarily healers will just have to be more careful and precise, or more selective in the groups they join- no more runs with me because I dont have harry beaters because I dont have ingredients to make them because I cant do shroud because I dont have harry beaters because I............... Hopefully the new auction system will make finding DR beating weapons easier :/

[Aranticus]

you do not need a super weapon to run shroud. My rogue uses a +2 holy silver ss of pure good pulled from sc elite. I also have several +1 met of pg I've gotten from lowbie quests

As a relative new player who has reached raiding levels and have run shroud about 30 times now (I ransack cause im newb and need ingreds bad) ill provide some perspective that is obviously clearly lacking in this thread.

The entire weapon system in this game is rather obfuscated, the randomly generated loot is never good, and the auction house system is ****(or was **** in 5 hours from now). This ensures that new-ish players could NEVER have a half decent weapon for Shroud. Even if they truly understood exactly what types of weapons they should be using, obtaining them is neither cheap or easy.

Neither I nor my girlfriend who started at the same time have weapons that break DR in Shroud yet, we are working on them but the ~20 large ingreds we need is a bit oppressive (we have enough for 1 weapon now though! woo!) We also have not seen many boss beater weapons posted on the auction house at reasonable prices.

Unlike most new(and old) players, I relish the research and understanding process so I have a bit of a leg up in most situations. And I frequently lead shroud groups. But as Szrobun said; as a noname and noguild player I dont see many vets come play with me!

That said, it IS just shroud. Boss beaters arent REALLY necessary. Decent teamwork and sharp pointy objects are all that is required. Which ive seen in a majority of the runs ive done. In my 30~ runs ive seen maybe 3 failures total. Including the first few runs I went on where I had NO CLUE what I was doing- though we completed on my first runs because I told them I had no clue whatI was doing and they told me what to do and I did it.

Its going to be a bit harder now in u7, but primarily healers will just have to be more careful and precise, or more selective in the groups they join- no more runs with me because I dont have harry beaters because I dont have ingredients to make them because I cant do shroud because I dont have harry beaters because I............... Hopefully the new auction system will make finding DR beating weapons easier :/

[sweez]

because of some predominant rumor that 300 hp is a good number for frontline melees, i avoid using mass heal. yes, its more efficient but its only great if your melees can survive the casting time which with quicken can still be too long for some of them

Ugh, I remember a paladin who not only couldn't survive a mass heal cooldown, he couldn't survive *the time it takes to cast a quickened mass heal*. I love groups that have competent melee though, I can just cast mass heal when it's off cooldown and read the forums in the meantime.

[Hrum]

you do not need a super weapon to run shroud. My rogue uses a +2 holy silver ss of pure good pulled from sc elite. I also have several +1 met of pg I've gotten from lowbie quests

If only I knew at level 8 that I would need that +1 metalline dwarven axe of PG to break DR in Arreatrikos at level 20. Clearly the solution is to setup PSA spambots in the harbor:
"ATTN: ALL NOOBS! Save your Metalline weapons of PG."
"ATTN: ALL NOOBS! If you melee and dont max UMD or are not aligned as good; reroll! you wont break harry DR in shroud.

Thats my point aranticus, the weapon system is not at all simple. By the time a player understands what kind of weapons he needs, he is past the point in time where he should have them and is already 'overdue'. Isnt it basically this very reason they are adding the new low level raid in U7?

[Consumer]

you do not need a super weapon to run shroud. My rogue uses a +2 holy silver ss of pure good pulled from sc elite. I also have several +1 met of pg I've gotten from lowbie quests

I was lucky enough to pull a +3 MoPG Warhammer, +2 Holy Silver Bastard Sword of Parrying and a +2 Holy burst Silver Sickle of Enfeebling on my last toon but before that I have always had to buy boss beaters. They're a pretty rare drop most of the time and players on their first toon are unlikely to get one.

[SiliconShadow]

and this is why I hold my own raids or ones run by guildies

I ensure that I know *** is going on I even made a guildie test me on order of who to drop in pt 2 lol

and I mean really they couldn't solve their puzzles that's fine... but the fact they didn't call them out OR pull up a solver is a worry...

I never see your groups up anymore.. I swear I get all the bad ones.

[Kindoki]

The entire weapon system in this game is rather obfuscated, the randomly generated loot is never good, and the auction house system is ****(or was **** in 5 hours from now). This ensures that new-ish players could NEVER have a half decent weapon for Shroud. Even if they truly understood exactly what types of weapons they should be using, obtaining them is neither cheap or easy.

This is where your guild should be stepping in. There is no excuse for a guilded player to not have a DR breaker when they get to shroud level. They are either not asking, or not talking to the right person. I've given away dozens of Harry Beaters to people, both in and out of guild, just because they sounded like you... interested in learning, trying their best to be part of the team,and just lacking a little time/ing/plat to get what they need.

Who I don't give stuff away to is the person who doesn't speak up, doesn't acknowledge a deficiency, or even worse yet openly disregards offers of assistance. There have been at least a couple instances where I've seen someone get killed repeatedly in a quest/raid, looked at their myddo and seen them missing gear; but when I offered them gear they were offended.

In at least one instance I was told, "I only use gear that I pull myself, thank you". He was very polite, and therefore, so was I, but inside I was thinking "Then you're just a G-D roleplayer and you should announce yourself as such! Stop filling up spaces in my raids if you're not going to contribute!" Needless to say, as nice as that person was, they're on my 'friends' list. Roleplaying is fun. GIMPing is fun. Purposefully gimping yourself, without letting anyone else know, while creating a drain/drag on the rest of the party, is not fun.

But, for your specific situation. PM me with the weapons you use, and your character (and GF character) name. If I have something that'll help, I'll send it.

[sweez]

The entire weapon system in this game is rather obfuscated, the randomly generated loot is never good, and the auction house system is ****(or was **** in 5 hours from now). This ensures that new-ish players could NEVER have a half decent weapon for Shroud. Even if they truly understood exactly what types of weapons they should be using, obtaining them is neither cheap or easy.

Huh? The first time I *ever* entered Shroud on my gimped half-retired bard, I had a met of PG greataxe. There was gonna be *no way* I was going to join a Shroud without a Harry beater.

It was my first toon, I was just starting with the whole P2P thing, I was poor - but I knew what kind of weapon I needed and I knew I wouldn't join a single Shroud run till I got one. If it meant I'd have to wait a week (or more) to run a Shroud after getting flagged - so be it.

[sweez]

Isnt it basically this very reason they are adding the new low level raid in U7?

I'd say the reason for adding new content is $$$profit$$$, but then again, I could be wrong.

[Woody00]

The only boss beaters I have had trouble finding on the AH are THF beaters and those weps used in min/max DPS builds. I have several Short swords and clubs/maces DR breakers. I think thats the issue though is that if you are looking for a specific beater it may take a while. I usally tell people dont worry about what you are using just use something if you got it or can find it cheap on the AH. Enough runs and you can make a DR breaker or have the funds to pick up the wep you want.