Anyone notice a deterioration in Shroud PUGs lately?

[Crystalizer]

i didnt notice any deterioration, pugs are what they are
maybe i was in your run with my bard mirn, was smooth this is true
but i noticed some leaders stress about picking the good characters and all
i agree that when you wipe a couple of times in a shroud pug then the next one you really matter about who you group
and i apologize for the couple of shroud runs i leaded the last week without voice chat and some few chat guidelines, oh well we succeded them both guys
you dont need hardcore characters for a shroud, just peeps who know what to do IF you want it fast & easy

[fuzzy1guy]

Most of the better players on thelanis have realized the shroud lags like a mofo now since our server is a 10 year old piece of outdated junk. Seen how bad it is on the weekends lately? How about weekend primetime hours. Yeah.. Screw that mess.


And they stick to guild/friends only at oddball hours to minimize group time spent in that laggy mess. Or they got their few items they wanted and say screw that mess till we get a better server.

Which doesn't seem like it's going to happen....

Me personally i've started doing my shrouds late late at night and only during the week. I'm not doing a primetime or weekend shroud until this mess is fixed. It's not fun. And it's just not worth the trouble waiting for people to come back after the server barfs on them every few minutes. Just last night i enjoyed a nice 25 minute quick run thru the shroud again. No lag is a nice thing.


The in-game live event in deleras after the update is going to kill the thelanis server... There's no way we can handle it. We can't even handle normal weekend raid lag anymore.

Good shrouds require good leaders and at least a handful of good players. And those people are not pugging during the times when most people are on anymore.

The lag is just too bad.

[CrimsonEagle]

It is all my fault. I'm sorry.

I have been running the vale quest a ton lately getting ingredients and xp for my tr.

The amount of puggers that I have been pulling through those quests who have absolutely no gear, horrible builds and no knowledge of the game has been absolutely staggering.

They tell me that they are new, and have never done the quests, so I make sure that I hit all the flagging quests for them, walk them through making the signet stone, show them the quest entrance/quest giver for the shroud, and tell them they should start running it immediately and often.

Please forgive me, I am an evil, evil person and should have the skin flayed from my back!!!!!

Lol, sad thing is, this is not far from the truth. I normally dont pug much and I never realized just how many new people are now in this game. I cant decide if it is refreshing or frustrating. Guess it depends on how much they ignore me.

[sirgog]

Ran a shroud last night that went as well as any I've run lately. Mobs were even "Epic Warded" and had the accompanying lag.. 1 round part 4. No bard.

then again, I Joined a shroud yesterday(On the same character, so you know the outcome) where it was mostly a "Guild Run" and they were relatively new. it was the first shroud run for some of them even.

They warned me ahead of time, but hey, I figured what the hell....

Portal DPS was terrible. But they followed a good leader and we got through part 1 with little incident. Part 2 got a little scary. I was on my L17 Sorc and managed to get the aggro of both the earth ele and the Kobold. Wound up just taking both of them down while the rest of the group worked on Orc and Cat.

We got that part done first try.

Part 3 went as smooth as can be expected for a group that had probably 5 or 6 people that never played Lights out before. No wall. got it done with 4 chests.

we wiped in Part 4. We pretty much all expected it and had fun getting killed.

Moral of the story, its all about attitude. we were ALL shroud newbs at one point. expecting newer players to have all the gear and skill of 3+ year players is not realistic. If you cant deal with that, be more selective in your LFM's or dont join random shroud pugs.

BTW.... +1 "The Light Wardens" for a Fun spectacular failure. You folks will be up to speed on the shroud in no time for sure.

Those groups - with sensible new players that are trying but don't quite get there - are fun.

I can't stand the groups with the opposite sorts - those that don't say it's their first/second time, don't listen to instructions and do stupid things, or those where almost noone has the gear to melee Harry (basically, 400hp, 100% fort and either a DR breaker or a Greater Bane is enough on Normal).


The best solution: Start your own groups, and say 'completion only, no D-Door'. It weeds out 75% of the bad players.

[JohnWarlock]

I don't mind new players that much, as long as they follow two guidelines:

Listen and don't be an idiot.

What I mean don't be an idiot it's simple. If you don't know, don't come acting and playing like you know what you're doing and end up face first against a FAIL wall.

Don't tell me you know how to play your character, when a heal scroll for 110 hps fills more than half your health and you probably don't have heavy fort. Nothing is worse than the cocky newb that is the only one to die in the quest/raid.

[Micron]

What makes me giggle about Shroud pugs on Thelanis is the DDs. When I started on this server a year ago, the recall bug had long since been fixed. I found it amusing people were still casting them and thought it was a force of habit or something. Fast forward a year and 90% people are still making a fuss about DDs and reassuring everyone in their LFMs that there will be one at the end.

[Impaqt]

What makes me giggle about Shroud pugs on Thelanis is the DDs. When I started on this server a year ago, the recall bug had long since been fixed. I found it amusing people were still casting them and thought it was a force of habit or something. Fast forward a year and 90% people are still making a fuss about DDs and reassuring everyone in their LFMs that there will be one at the end.

Its way faster to take a ddoor and step out of the quest than it is to recall out.

[Micron]

Its way faster to take a ddoor and step out of the quest than it is to recall out.

I see. So it's taking a DD and stepping out vs waiting for the recall bar?

Recalling out usually takes me 5-10 seconds. I suppose the 2 or 3 secs you save can make a difference if you have someone in the group who tends to run for the altar as soon as Harry is dead.

[MeToo]

Its way faster to take a ddoor and step out of the quest than it is to recall out.

I guess that depends on how long load screens take for you and how willing you are to risk someone clicking the altar before you're out - locking you from getting end chests while forcing you onto timer.

I always recall and twitch if someone steps near the altar if I don't want completions (and part 5 chests). Really though, I get blanked on part 4 so often and I only really care about larges so I tend to stay in anyway.

About quality: I see it about the same as before - maybe with the bar for HP and DPS being set a bit lower until U7 since you can still complete with Harry exhausted and hamstrung with even new characters. I think it's just that many undergeared, new players are finally getting to this point in the game and they're still learning the ins and outs. Even for a good listener, it's a lot of information overload. It can be confusing what "don't go through the center" and "kill gnolls" mean until you get your bearings in there and get pulled through a few times by more experienced players.

After they've been through it the first time, good players will go out to the web and forums and read up. They'll learn to do the puzzles quickly (without a solver) by practicing and get a pair of halfway decent portal beaters if you help them. They probably already knew about silver+good for Harry and silver/good for devils but now they'll look into crafting a HP item. When U7 comes and we have to go back to quickened mass heals, they'll eventually re-roll and come back in with 400+ HP and more experience/gear. It will get better.

If you're looking to weed out bad communicators, start your own Shroud LFM and greet each as they join. If they don't respond in a timely manner to voice or chat, you can kick them before they start the raid.

[d4rkstars]

pug is a lotery and this will never change.

99% of people doing shroud now have no idea how hard it was at the begining of server, how many weeks it took us, just farming part 1 - then how many months doing shroud 1-4 never daring putting a foot in part 5.

most people will now tell you shroud is easy, because they are used to be dragged by experienced and geared players and dont evne notice how this place really is. As game evolve, it becomes more and more babysitting - people now have gear that allow them to shortman easily so enven half bad player will barely be noticed (it will just be longer).

but of course, from time to time, you will jump in a full beginer team, with people unable to think, and used to watch the other while thinking they are awesomely clearing shroud - even some people with no clue about shroud sometimes start the group as leader, this is ridiculous and ends in epic fail.

[knightgf]

Coming soon(TM): A 'casual' option to play shroud! This unique difficulty allows you to also use items purchased in the DDO store when you need that extra edge to take down those mobs!

[Delt]

Its way faster to take a ddoor and step out of the quest than it is to recall out.

The DDoor is more dangerous in a PUG though. First someone needs to cast it. You step through and get a load screen (which may or may not lag). Then you still need to step out. Plenty of opportunity there for someone to hit the altar and screw people before they get out.

Easier and safer to just recall. If someone hits the altar before you are out, well at least you can cancel the recall and grab the chests.

[Luacan]

"Jerk" shrouds. They run between 8pm-4am EST. I have never failed a shroud I have led, and don't intend to start. Anybody who listens is welcome to come along, and those who don't promptly earn a spot on my special list.

[jurgandal]

Most of the good guilds avoid pugging as much as possible. Why pug a shroud completion for an hour or two when when we can knock it out in less than 20 mins and do other things....

[sirgog]

The DDoor is more dangerous in a PUG though. First someone needs to cast it. You step through and get a load screen (which may or may not lag). Then you still need to step out. Plenty of opportunity there for someone to hit the altar and screw people before they get out.

Easier and safer to just recall. If someone hits the altar before you are out, well at least you can cancel the recall and grab the chests.

/death is faster still.

[Vistram]

I ran my first shroud (since TRing) last night but I was so drunk I don't remember completing it.

I had an end reward waiting this morning so it must have turned out OK.

[sirgog]

Just had a mostly guild shroud where Grease and Dispels were spammed. Wonder if this will get a comment from any of the PUGgers in there? (Was still a 1-rounder, had a LOT of deaths in part 5 after someone who won't be named dropped a Globe of Invulnerability on Harry, resulting in everyone losing Fireshield, Haste, Resist Fire and FoM).

[Moltier]

What? Failed Shroud pugs on Thelanis are back?
Finally some challenge!

[Arlith]

Just had a mostly guild shroud where Grease and Dispels were spammed. Wonder if this will get a comment from any of the PUGgers in there? (Was still a 1-rounder, had a LOT of deaths in part 5 after someone who won't be named dropped a Globe of Invulnerability on Harry, resulting in everyone losing Fireshield, Haste, Resist Fire and FoM).

Funny.

"I don't often PUG, but when I do I PUG DWAT!" - The most intersting man in the world.

[GlorkTheInvader]

Just had a mostly guild shroud where Grease and Dispels were spammed. Wonder if this will get a comment from any of the PUGgers in there? (Was still a 1-rounder, had a LOT of deaths in part 5 after someone who won't be named dropped a Globe of Invulnerability on Harry, resulting in everyone losing Fireshield, Haste, Resist Fire and FoM).

....but... but... how else will people make use of their Staves of Arcane Power?