Chain Gun build

**Aranticus** · 10-05-2010, 06:20 PM

I fully agree that a repeater rogue is a better ranged toon than a fighter. Unfortunately the OP thinks otherwise and is insisting a repeater fighter has the most dps

Originally Posted by Failedlegend

Pure Halfling Rogue

Str 10+4(tome) = 14
Dex 16+6(Item)+3(Rogue)+3(Except) +4(Tome) +2(Halfling Dex) = 34
Con 12+6(Item)+4(Tome) = 24
Int 18+6(Item)+4(Tome)+5(Lvls)+3(Except) = 36
Wis 8
Cha 8

Note: you could also get int +2 higher with 6 lvls of wiz (13/7 would be an interesting mix) or with guild boosts so that's about 40ish which is around what a fighter would get in Str (I will never pretend to be able to match a barb) not to mention fighters don't have 14D6 SA and unlike a TWF a repeater rogue with IPS can hit an entire group of enemies at the same time....If all else fails you could whip out a stat damager, paralyze the entire room without even moving or even an insta-kill weapon like a disruptor.

Oh and on the incredibly rare occasion that I would need a melee weapon (not sure why I would) I'd just use Breeze or other Dex-Based weapon (there's 4 or 5 of em)

As far as to-hit with 34 dex and halfling to-hit boosts there's no issue there (probably even without to-hit boosts)

Oh and as a final note repeater rogues are fun as hell to play and are alot more engaging since you have to be paying attention.

**HellsChaos** · 10-05-2010, 06:42 PM

First, big shout out to supporters of my idea/already existing idea of repeaters being useful. I long let go of the notion of being DPS, but really just didn't, and still don't, believe that BASED ON NORMAL CIRCUMSTANCES (like not comparing to AA as repeaters don't have the same enhancements you tool) that a bow can out damage a heavy repeater...but that's my opinion. BTW, I can take it you looked me up, otherwise assuming I haven't made end game is presumptuous. I may not have made end game (and I consider anyone in 18-20 range to be end game) does not mean I don't have end game knowledge so don't be such an ass....you didn't need to reply. You know who you are.

Anyway, I know having 6 str is risky at first, but working off the knowledge that yes, str base items are easier to get, I was planning on fixing that. Since str damage doesn't apply to repeater damage, I only need a slight boost, and maybe a +2 tomb to reduce encumbrance. This is not a ranger using bow str, so duh...yeah, not my focus.

Improved precise is on the docket for later, thanks for the reminder.

**Bacab** · 10-05-2010, 07:51 PM

Originally Posted by HellsChaos

First, big shout out to supporters of my idea/already existing idea of repeaters being useful. I long let go of the notion of being DPS, but really just didn't, and still don't, believe that BASED ON NORMAL CIRCUMSTANCES (like not comparing to AA as repeaters don't have the same enhancements you tool) that a bow can out damage a heavy repeater...but that's my opinion. BTW, I can take it you looked me up, otherwise assuming I haven't made end game is presumptuous. I may not have made end game (and I consider anyone in 18-20 range to be end game) does not mean I don't have end game knowledge so don't be such an ass....you didn't need to reply. You know who you are.

Anyway, I know having 6 str is risky at first, but working off the knowledge that yes, str base items are easier to get, I was planning on fixing that. Since str damage doesn't apply to repeater damage, I only need a slight boost, and maybe a +2 tomb to reduce encumbrance. This is not a ranger using bow str, so duh...yeah, not my focus.

Improved precise is on the docket for later, thanks for the reminder.

TBH there are 2 times Bow's/ranged are ok for pure DPS.

Arcane Archers.

Manyshot.

Sadly AA's can't use repeaters.

Sadly Manyshot can't be used on repeaters.

It can be a fun build...

You really do *NOT* know what *THIS* community considers "end game".

I will ask a few questions...please answer them honestly.

1. How many Epic Demon Queens have you done?

2. How many Epic VoN 6's have you done?

3. How many ToD's have you done?

4. What's the Hardest Difficulty Shroud you have done?

If your answers are 0, 0, 0, Normal...

You may want to listen to what some people have to say.

BTW you saying

"but really just didn't, and still don't, believe that BASED ON NORMAL CIRCUMSTANCES (like not comparing to AA as repeaters don't have the same enhancements you tool) that a bow can out damage a heavy repeater"

Is like saying a 10 STR SORC dual-wields better than anyone in the game...except people who actually dual-wield.

Why would you make a ranged toon that was not the BEST ranged toon?

That fighter you made...is out classed by a Mechanic ROG for DPS. Oh and the Mechanic can UMD and get traps and have evasion.

The best part about the fighter you made and the mechanic ROG is....

For $9 dollars you can buy a Lesser Heart of Reincarnation and fix it for something better.

**Legohaiden** · 10-05-2010, 09:38 PM

Originally Posted by Bacab

/Snip...

Why would you make a ranged toon that was not the BEST ranged toon?

/Snip....

This is the problem with people....

here is a question for you.

Why do you have to play a cookie cutter toon thats max only?

Different strokes for different folks. If hes happy playing a ranged fighter why are you all shooting him down like hes selling crack to kids?

Not everyone is a power gamer.... not everyone will see level 20... not everyone will raid.

If hes happy, let it be at that. No one is holding a gun to your head demanding you make a toon like this immediatly.

I for one make toons that are specifically made for low-mid level. I never plan for them to get higher then 9-10

But im assuming that would be totally out of the question for a gamer like yourself? and there is nothing wrong with that.

Im just sick of all the kids on these forums screaming at someone because they are trying a different build then they themselves would try.

"OMG THATS MEGAGIMP!" "You'll NEVER get invited to Shrouds!"

^ this is not what he was looking for when coming here... he was simply asking for a friendly critique on his build. not asking for someone to build his build for him. Is it really so hard to say something like "Thats an interesting build, looks fun.... but i would do this differently"

common curtesy... try it... its good for you.

**PopeJual** · 10-05-2010, 09:54 PM

Originally Posted by Legohaiden

Different strokes for different folks. If hes happy playing a ranged fighter why are you all shooting him down like hes selling crack to kids?

Not everyone is a power gamer.... not everyone will see level 20... not everyone will raid.

If hes happy, let it be at that. No one is holding a gun to your head demanding you make a toon like this immediatly.

I for one make toons that are specifically made for low-mid level. I never plan for them to get higher then 9-10

It's fine for someone to make a character that does something less well than it potentially could.

Please don't just pat someone on the head and tell them that everything will be alright when they come asking for advice, though.

Let them make an informed decision.

Originally Posted by Legohaiden

If you like it, and feel its doing great damage, GO FOR IT!

thats all thats important.

...is not providing anything that will help someone make an informed decision.

Telling someone that their build will be fine below 10th level, but will produce significantly less DPS than an average melee build in most situations at high levels (and providing explanations to show why that is so) will allow the person to make an informed choice. If they decide to go for the not-ready-for-end-game build, that's fine.

Don't try to pretend that the end game doesn't exist or that any sorc3/fvs6/rog3 can pull their weight in a level 12 quest, though.

Backpack riding might be a valid playstyle, but let's not pretend that someone piking through an end game quest is something other than a piker.

**Legohaiden** · 10-05-2010, 10:05 PM

Originally Posted by PopeJual

It's fine for someone to make a character that does something less well than it potentially could.

Please don't just pat someone on the head and tell them that everything will be alright when they come asking for advice, though.

Let them make an informed decision.

...is not providing anything that will help someone make an informed decision.

Telling someone that their build will be fine below 10th level, but will produce significantly less DPS than an average melee build in most situations at high levels (and providing explanations to show why that is so) will allow the person to make an informed choice. If they decide to go for the not-ready-for-end-game build, that's fine.

Don't try to pretend that the end game doesn't exist or that any sorc3/fvs6/rog3 can pull their weight in a level 12 quest, though.

Backpack riding might be a valid playstyle, but let's not pretend that someone piking through an end game quest is something other than a piker.

I know what your saying here, but the point is, its his character, pass the advice... not the judgement. Im not solo'ing you out here, im talking in general.

Having fun with your character is 5,000x more important then acheiving MAXDPS. and if you disagree with that, your not enjoying your game as much as you could be.

For example my Fighter/Wizard... thats a drow (listens to the collective gasps) is INCREDIBLY fun to play on. And he uses a heavy sheild and plate armor!
I know he wont be an endgamer, but when i play on him i have alot more fun then my TwF Kopesh MaxBuild Fighter

**Aranticus** · 10-05-2010, 10:51 PM

Originally Posted by HellsChaos

but really just didn't, and still don't, believe that BASED ON NORMAL CIRCUMSTANCES (like not comparing to AA as repeaters don't have the same enhancements you tool) that a bow can out damage a heavy repeater...but that's my opinion.

which is why we are telling you opinion is wrong

BTW, I can take it you looked me up,

i did not

otherwise assuming I haven't made end game is presumptuous.

it is really not that hard to know whether someone made endgame based on what is being said

I may not have made end game (and I consider anyone in 18-20 range to be end game) does not mean I don't have end game knowledge

upon hitting L20, epic quests come into play. epics are another step up from regular L20 elite stuff due to the host of immunities and the sheer hp of everything in it

so don't be such an ass....you didn't need to reply. You know who you are.

i have been posting very factual replies. if the lack of emotion makes me an ass, then so be it. fyi, calling people an ass is infractable

Anyway, I know having 6 str is risky at first, but working off the knowledge that yes, str base items are easier to get, I was planning on fixing that. Since str damage doesn't apply to repeater damage, I only need a slight boost, and maybe a +2 tomb to reduce encumbrance

many mobs use spells such as waves of fatigue, ray of enfeeblement or poisons and diseases that reduce stat scores. having a low str means you are easily disabled. there are several problems here when str is lower

1. encumbrance: first you pack becomes heavier and this results in slower movement and at extreme loads, you are unable to move. many ranged toons rely on kiting, this opens you up to melee attacks

2. 0 str: when your str hits zero, you will be stunned for a few seconds. being stunned also open you up to critical hits. this combination is very deadly to ranged toons and many of them do not place emphasis on hp

**Aranticus** · 10-05-2010, 10:59 PM

Originally Posted by Legohaiden

Having fun with your character is 5,000x more important then acheiving MAXDPS. and if you disagree with that, your not enjoying your game as much as you could be.

this is your opinion. not everyone shares your opinion. conflicts of such nature arise in ddo as people impose their opinion on others. sure you can have fun but do not impose this opinion on a powergamer whose idea of fun is getting the most completions, shortest time, etc. the case is the same for the powergamer

I know what your saying here, but the point is, its his character, pass the advice... not the judgement. Im not solo'ing you out here, im talking in general.

For example my Fighter/Wizard... thats a drow (listens to the collective gasps) is INCREDIBLY fun to play on. And he uses a heavy sheild and plate armor!
I know he wont be an endgamer, but when i play on him i have alot more fun then my TwF Kopesh MaxBuild Fighter

unfortunately, my experience has been that a lot of players who play for "fun" tries to sneak into raids, epics, elite stuff. knowing what your toon can do and what it cannot is good. that said, because you know it cant and insist on making people make up for your lack of ability, now that is going to cause a lot of tension

**NaturalHazard** · 10-05-2010, 11:09 PM

um wont the rogue repeater have evasion/improved evasion, more dps via sneak attacks, be able to use heal/ raise scrolls?

Sure play what you like and what you enjoy but dont expect everyone to be open to taking you along to some of the more challeging content, if they dont think you can pull your weight.

Also as a fighter you get a lot of bonus feats right? is there a way he could get some melee ability as well? or would that just be a waste of time? as allocation of stats ect?

Can someone show him some math? I suck at math but im thinking AA beats this repeater build out for dps, and people complain that AA dps is not enough on its own only during manyshot is it good and that thing has a high cool down rate. And this is not for epics. also you can go elf and get AA and add fighter kensai or another class enhancement line for damage?

Also what aranticus said 12 str is a lil low, things throw enfeeble ect around a lot. 12 con is also a little low, esp if you dont have evasion, your not planning on adding any rogue or monk levels later are you?

It sucks that you cant use repeaters with manyshot and AA, i would love to have drow rogue mechanic and AA :P

**Hirosue** · 10-05-2010, 11:58 PM

To the Op . Repeaters area lot of fun but require very carefull play and character building. Before you even start to level get yourself a collection of repeaters including .

banish,smiting,para, disruption, WoE,WoP,elemental burst/good,Holy,GCB and so on

Improved precise shot is an absolute essentail. learn when to switch it off though.

farm house Denith favour to get large quivers ( probaly have 4 or 5 in you pack at the same time), and 1000 bolt stacks +3 adamantine,silver etc

farm shroud ingrediants on an alt and collect the ones to make a 3x acid/earthgrab heavy repeater , join a guild shroud and get it made at level 14.

learn what stat type repeater effects which mobs, i.e disruption on undead, smiting on constructs and so on

In this thread there seams to be an arguement about dps/fun. Both sides of the arguement are correct.

Repeater build is not a 1st rank damage dealer . I have built a few repeaters and played then to lvl 20 end game raids.On epic a pure repeater build is probably a wasted slot in a party because every other class can be more usefull. i.e healing types, pure rogues,wiz/sorc/bard, ftr/pally/barb, tempest melee rangers. Every class i have just listed is better than a repeater build in a 6 player epic party.

So you need to bring more than your repeater to the group. The answer is Multi-class. The fighter repeater build you posted is probably the worst build you could have made, sorry to be so blunt. Get Rogue skills, get UMD high enough for a good chance on raise scrolls. Also high UMD so you can use race restriced repeaters (22 needed).

So what to multiclass ? Well thats up to you. Rogue mechanic adds int bonus to damage but this still leaves you as as almost 1 trick build i.e repeaters only. .

i have built a lot of repeater builds in my time playing DDo and 2 rog/12 ranger/6 fighter split seams the most versatile, usefull and fun to me.

dwarf or warforged for hitpoints. CON is not a dump stat.

with +15 stat goggles and GH ends up with 62 disable ,58 search, 54 spot ( wild instincts spell) ,35 listen ( wild instincts spell)

18,34,24,24,18,14 410 hit points (HP inc minos helm,gianthold draconic vitality from Gianthold favour, +75 more possible with shroud hitpoints item and GFL item)

All the usefull repeater feats , tempest II and GTWF you will need to melee at some point,Evasion, limited self healing/buffing and evasion.

Code:

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 3.5.1
DDO Character Planner Home Page

Level 20 Lawful Good Dwarf Male
(6 Fighter \ 2 Rogue \ 12 Ranger) 
Hit Points: 350
Spell Points: 136 
BAB: 19\19\24\29\29
Fortitude: 17
Reflex: 22
Will: 7

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
Abilities        Base Stats          Modified Stats
(32 Point)       (Level 1)             (Level 20)
Strength              8                    12
Dexterity            18                    28
Constitution         14                    18
Intelligence         16                    18
Wisdom               10                    12
Charisma              6                     8

Tomes Used
+2 Tome of Strength used at level 7
+2 Tome of Dexterity used at level 7
+2 Tome of Constitution used at level 7
+2 Tome of Intelligence used at level 7
+2 Tome of Wisdom used at level 7
+2 Tome of Charisma used at level 7

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
                 Base Skills         Modified Skills
Skills           (Level 1)            (Level 20)
Balance               8                    18
Bluff                -2                    -1
Concentration         2                     4
Diplomacy             2                     3
Disable Device        7                    28
Haggle               -2                    -1
Heal                  2                     6
Hide                  4                     9
Intimidate           -2                    -1
Jump                  3                     6
Listen                4                    18
Move Silently         4                     9
Open Lock             8                    27
Perform              n/a                   n/a
Repair                3                     4
Search                7                    33
Spot                  4                    24
Swim                  2                     4
Tumble                5                    10
Use Magic Device      2                    22

Level 1 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+4)
Skill: Diplomacy (+4)
Skill: Disable Device (+4)
Skill: Heal (+2)
Skill: Jump (+4)
Skill: Listen (+4)
Skill: Open Lock (+4)
Skill: Search (+4)
Skill: Spot (+4)
Skill: Swim (+3)
Skill: Tumble (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+4)
Feat: (Selected) Toughness
Feat: (Automatic) Attack
Feat: (Automatic) Dwarven Stability
Feat: (Automatic) Dwarven Stonecutting
Feat: (Automatic) Giant Evasion
Feat: (Automatic) Heroic Durability
Feat: (Automatic) Light Armor Proficiency
Feat: (Automatic) Martial Weapon Proficiency: Rapier
Feat: (Automatic) Martial Weapon Proficiency: Shortsword
Feat: (Automatic) Martial Weapon Proficiency: Shortbow
Feat: (Automatic) Orc and Goblin Bonus
Feat: (Automatic) Poison Save Bonus
Feat: (Automatic) Simple Weapon Proficiency
Feat: (Automatic) Sneak
Feat: (Automatic) Sneak Attack
Feat: (Automatic) Spell Save Bonus
Feat: (Automatic) Trapfinding


Level 2 (Ranger)
Skill: Balance (+0.5)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Undead
Feat: (Automatic) Bow Strength
Feat: (Automatic) Defensive Fighting
Feat: (Automatic) Exotic Weapon Proficiency: Dwarven Waraxe
Feat: (Automatic) Martial Weapon Proficiency (ALL)
Feat: (Automatic) Shield Proficiency (General)
Feat: (Automatic) Sunder
Feat: (Automatic) Trip
Feat: (Automatic) Wild Empathy


Level 3 (Ranger)
Skill: Balance (+0.5)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Exotic Weapon Proficiency: Repeating Heavy Crossbow
Feat: (Automatic) Rapid Shot
Feat: (Automatic) Two Weapon Fighting


Level 4 (Ranger)
Ability Raise: DEX
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Jump (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Automatic) Diehard


Level 5 (Ranger)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Listen (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Spell (1): Camouflage
Spell (1): Jump
Spell (1): Longstrider
Spell (1): Merfolk's Blessing
Spell (1): Ram's Might
Spell (1): Resist Energy
Spell (1): Summon Nature's Ally I
Spell (1): Tumble


Level 6 (Ranger)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Listen (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Giant
Feat: (Selected) Weapon Finesse


Level 7 (Ranger)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Listen (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Automatic) Improved Two Weapon Fighting
Feat: (Automatic) Manyshot


Level 8 (Ranger)
Ability Raise: DEX
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Listen (+2)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Automatic) Improved Wild Empathy


Level 9 (Ranger)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Listen (+2)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Ranged Weapons
Spell (2): Barkskin
Spell (2): Bear's Endurance
Spell (2): Cat's Grace
Spell (2): Cure Light Wounds
Spell (2): Hold Animal
Spell (2): Mass Camouflage
Spell (2): Owl's Wisdom
Spell (2): Protection From Energy
Spell (2): Snare
Spell (2): Spike Growth
Spell (2): Summon Nature's Ally II


Level 10 (Ranger)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Listen (+2)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Automatic) Evasion


Level 11 (Ranger)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Heal (+1)
Skill: Listen (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 12 (Ranger)
Ability Raise: DEX
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Heal (+1)
Skill: Listen (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Evil Outsider
Feat: (Selected) Rapid Reload
Feat: (Automatic) Greater Two Weapon Fighting
Feat: (Automatic) Improved Precise Shot
Feat: (Automatic) Precise Shot
Spell (3): Cure Moderate Wounds
Spell (3): Neutralize Poison
Spell (3): Remove Disease
Spell (3): Summon Nature's Ally III
Spell (3): Wild Instincts


Level 13 (Ranger)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Heal (+1)
Skill: Listen (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 14 (Fighter)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Dodge
Feat: (Automatic) Heavy Armor Proficiency
Feat: (Automatic) Medium Armor Proficiency
Feat: (Automatic) Tower Shield Proficiency


Level 15 (Fighter)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Mobility
Feat: (Selected) Spring Attack


Level 16 (Fighter)
Ability Raise: DEX
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 17 (Fighter)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Improved Critical: Piercing Weapons


Level 18 (Fighter)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Extend Spell


Level 19 (Fighter)
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Precision


Level 20 (Rogue)
Ability Raise: DEX
Skill: Disable Device (+1)
Skill: Listen (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+1)
Skill: Search (+1)
Skill: Spot (+7)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Enhancement: Ranger Skill Boost I
Enhancement: Ranger Skill Boost II
Enhancement: Ranger Skill Boost III
Enhancement: Dwarven Constitution I
Enhancement: Dwarven Constitution II
Enhancement: Fighter Critical Accuracy I
Enhancement: Fighter Critical Accuracy II
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness II
Enhancement: Racial Toughness III
Enhancement: Racial Toughness IV
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Damage I
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Damage II
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Damage III
Enhancement: Ranger Tempest I
Enhancement: Ranger Tempest II
Enhancement: Rogue Disable Device I
Enhancement: Rogue Open Lock I
Enhancement: Ranger Search I
Enhancement: Ranger Search II
Enhancement: Ranger Search III
Enhancement: Ranger Search IV
Enhancement: Ranger Devotion I
Enhancement: Ranger Devotion II
Enhancement: Ranger Devotion III
Enhancement: Ranger Devotion IV
Enhancement: Ranger Dexterity I
Enhancement: Ranger Dexterity II
Enhancement: Ranger Dexterity III
Enhancement: Fighter Strength I
Enhancement: Fighter Strength II
Enhancement: Fighter Toughness I
Enhancement: Fighter Toughness II

get some melee weapon sets same as you did for repeaters.

Final and most important advice " Do NOT EVER kite trash mobs", this will seriously annoy everyone else in the party and make you look like an idiot. Stand in place and shoot , if mobs start melee you, stand still the tanks will soon get the agro away from you when they hit it . Sometimes, very rarely kiting is usefull i.e named mobs when the group is getting its arse handed to it.

p.s this build throws out 200 bolts per minute many more if hasted :O) The dps is small per shot multiplied by crazy rate of fire gives decent dps if you are using the right repeater vs the right mob.

**Failedlegend** · 10-06-2010, 12:12 AM

Originally Posted by NaturalHazard

It sucks that you cant use repeaters with manyshot and AA, i would love to have drow rogue mechanic and AA :P

A Half-Elf might be an interesting AA, mech too (again depending on what the race inherits from its parent races)...I wonder if AA not working on repeaters is WAI or something that hasn't really been asked.

It requires as caster class though doesn't it...might make some cool Rogue wiz combos (Int being the main for both classes) maybe 13/7 just so your not losing the capstone just for access to the PrE So a Mech2/Archmage1/AA or just Mech/AA if the pre-reqs are too much for the Wiz PRE.

Note: I was kinda hoping Half-Elfs could choose which there non-elf parent was but alas it was not done

@Hirosue it's been mentioned a couple times but rogue mechanics (at least 6 levels of rogue) have pretty much grabbed the #1 spot for repeaters since their the only class/pre that gets an attack stat for repeaters maybe something like this 12Ranger/6Rogue/2Fighter...hell even a pure rogue can get all the 100% required feats...although missing out on Shot on the Run kinda sucks

1 Rapid Reload
2 Rapid Shot
3 IC: Ranged
4 Precise SHot
5 Improved Precise Shot
6 Point Blank Shot
7 Toughness

**Hirosue** · 10-06-2010, 01:18 AM

Its horses for courses really regarding build and split choices.

My personal choice , considering all the ways to make a repeater build is to go for the one i posted as it brings a considerable amout of versatility to the build.

12 ranger gives a lot of free feats , tempest II, self heal and resists/prots, rams might, barkskin, 9/10 skill points per level, wild instincts spell +10 to spot and listen skill , 6 fighter gives additional hit points, critical confirmation chance ,more feats, 2 strength and the ability to melee reasonably well. 2 rogue gives trap skills, more reflex saves and UMD .

Some of the feats that you would get from the build i posted.

Heavy repeating crossbow, weapons finesse,twf, Itwf, Gtwf, toughness, imp critical ranged, imp critical piercing, Imp precise shot,evasion,diehard,rapid shot,rapid reload,dodge, mobility, spring, attack,extend ( drop extend and you can take shot on the run if you like, i prefer extend myself) , favoured enemy, undead,giant,evil outsider, many more from race/class. All martial weapons.

If you want all the feats and tempest you have to take 6 fighter to get them all.

I havent rolled a mechanic repeater build so i can not categorically say if the extra damage is worth giving up the versatility of the build i posted , however i doubt it.

p.s you really do want the hit points and ability to melee as a non squishy.Most pugs wont understand how a repeater build works and they will expect you to be able to take a melee role at some points during a quest. They will however squeal in delight when you para or earthgrab multiple mobs at the same time, care of improved precise shot.

pps. at lower levels a fearsome robe and a cursespewing repeater is great crowd control if the group sucks at agro management

ppps . this build sucks in pvp

**Bacab** · 10-06-2010, 03:34 AM

Multiple times in earlier posts I said...

"1. Repeaters suck for DPS...the end

2. They can be fun.

3. Please do not comment on "end game" unless you have been there.

4. Repeaters absolutely dominate up to the desert/gianthold...then they suck.

5. In a few months when people start denying you spots in raids because they quested with you and they feel your DPS is a joke...don't make a thread about it...Instead save my time and read these instead...
http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php...ight=repeaterq
http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php...light=repeater"

You can have fun with your repeater build. Just understand it WILL be sub-optimal one you hit The Desert or Gianthold.

Sad thing is you have a really low STR...so when you fight undead...you may be worthless (piercing).

You will be a one trick pony...and that is bad.

Have fun with it...but please do not argue with people who actually know what they are talking about.

BTW Arcane Archer is the best ranged DPS in game (if you aren't counting casters) and they generally wall way behind the big DPSers (like Barbs, Fighters, ROGs, melee Rangers, Monks)__________________

Notice I said they can be fun...

Notice I said they dominate UP TO Gianthold and The Desert.

What I don't want is this...

This "flavor" build trying to sneak into real raids. They will not pull there weight.

IF he wants to make this...he should. Just needs to know that towards "end game" its not viable.

I personally think the BEST Repeater build in the game is a Bard that uses Repeaters.

WHY? Because as a Bard you will still help everyone with your songs and haste/displacement...

Sadly...writing this makes me want to make a Repeater Bard. Remember you can always Re-spec out of something now (you used to not be able to change anything...)

I have seen people play repeaters as "Support DPS" before and do really well. They use the smiters/paralyzers/stat damagers/earth grab.

**Failedlegend** · 10-06-2010, 03:51 AM

Originally Posted by Bacab

I personally think the BEST Repeater build in the game is a Bard that uses Repeaters.

WHY? Because as a Bard you will still help everyone with your songs and haste/displacement...

Sadly...writing this makes me want to make a Repeater Bard. Remember you can always Re-spec out of something now (you used to not be able to change anything...)

I have seen people play repeaters as "Support DPS" before and do really well. They use the smiters/paralyzers/stat damagers/earth grab.

Kind of why I'm debating a 14/6 Bard/Rogue although I'm not sure how to build one...it's either that or pure rogue...or Rogue/Fighter but its starting to look like Shot on the Run isn't as cool as it sounded (especially since I rolled a test rogue just to see how ranged functioned and shooting doesn't slow your movements like casting does.

Oh and just so you know I build to play 1-20 and than roll a new toon...no epics I don't get the fun of super inflated hps and uber immunities....personally I think TR and Epic stunted the games ability to move beyond 20 and made min-maxing cookie cutters worse but that's another story.

Maybe this

Halfling Bard14/Rogue6 (Virtuso2(No feat req)/Mech1)

08 Str
18 Dex
12 Con
16 Int
08 Wis
12 Cha (is high cha needed on a bard or do you need just enough to cast all his spells)

1 Rapid Reload
2 Rapid Shot
3 IC: Ranged
4 Precise Shot
5 Improved Precise Shot
6 Point Blank Shot
7 Toughness or Extend?

Level Order? No idea...I suck at this part of builds.

**Bacab** · 10-06-2010, 03:58 AM

Originally Posted by Failedlegend

Kind of why I'm debating a 14/6 Bard/Rogue although I'm not sure how to build one...it's either that or pure rogue...or Rogue/Fighter but its starting to look like Shot on the Run isn't as cool as it sounded (especially since I rolled a test rogue just to see how ranged functioned and shooting doesn't slow your movements like casting does.

Oh and just so you know I build to play 1-20 and than roll a new toon...no epics I don't get the fun of super inflated hps and uber immunities....personally I think TR and Epic stunted the games ability to move beyond 20 and made min-maxing cookie cutters worse.

I enjoy TRing...

Epic quests suck...

Epic Raids are fun to me.

Epic Gear is really nice and neat.

I have to agree the journey of 1-19 is more fun than anything that happens (for the most part) at level 20.

I actually like TRing because its a toon I am attached too and that has neat gear stockpiled. I personally The Desert/GH/Vale as my favorite quests to run.

**wolflordnexus** · 10-06-2010, 06:27 AM

Originally Posted by Failedlegend

Kind of why I'm debating a 14/6 Bard/Rogue although I'm not sure how to build one...it's either that or pure rogue...or Rogue/Fighter but its starting to look like Shot on the Run isn't as cool as it sounded (especially since I rolled a test rogue just to see how ranged functioned and shooting doesn't slow your movements like casting does.

Oh and just so you know I build to play 1-20 and than roll a new toon...no epics I don't get the fun of super inflated hps and uber immunities....personally I think TR and Epic stunted the games ability to move beyond 20 and made min-maxing cookie cutters worse but that's another story.

Maybe this

Halfling Bard14/Rogue6 (Virtuso2(No feat req)/Mech1)

08 Str
18 Dex
12 Con
16 Int
08 Wis
12 Cha (is high cha needed on a bard or do you need just enough to cast all his spells)

1 Rapid Reload
2 Rapid Shot
3 IC: Ranged
4 Precise Shot
5 Improved Precise Shot
6 Point Blank Shot
7 Toughness or Extend?

Level Order? No idea...I suck at this part of builds.

I'd go human for the extra feat. Toughness is needed and extend is a necessity as well for me

You only need enough cha to cast spells.

I took all the rogue first so you can get your free light repeater as quickly as possible.

You could honestly go without the virtuoso freeing up 7 or so ap.

Level ups went to int as it will get you damage and skills you can drop spot if your comfortable with your trap knowledge and go haggle and other skills

Took the full line of attack bonuses to make up for lower dex you should hit fine without DP clickies but I'd carry a few anyway

Full wand mastery line lets you heal in a pinch

Took the undead and construct enhancements because its fun.

I kind of want to go make this guy now.

Code:

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 3.5.1
DDO Character Planner Home Page

Level 20 True Neutral Human Male
(6 Rogue \ 14 Bard) 
Hit Points: 252
Spell Points: 398 
BAB: 14\14\19\24
Fortitude: 9
Reflex: 20
Will: 11

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
Abilities        Base Stats          Modified Stats
(32 Point)       (Level 1)             (Level 20)
Strength              8                    10
Dexterity            18                    22
Constitution         14                    17
Intelligence         16                    24
Wisdom                8                    10
Charisma              8                    12

Tomes Used
+1 Tome of Intelligence used at level 3
+2 Tome of Strength used at level 7
+2 Tome of Dexterity used at level 7
+2 Tome of Constitution used at level 7
+2 Tome of Intelligence used at level 7
+2 Tome of Wisdom used at level 7
+2 Tome of Charisma used at level 7

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
                 Base Skills         Modified Skills
Skills           (Level 1)            (Level 20)
Balance               8                    24
Bluff                -1                     2
Concentration         2                     4
Diplomacy             3                    26
Disable Device        7                    30
Haggle                3                    10
Heal                 -1                     0
Hide                  8                    15
Intimidate           -1                     1
Jump                  3                     9
Listen               -1                     2
Move Silently         8                    15
Open Lock             8                    29
Perform              n/a                   28
Repair                3                     7
Search                7                    30
Spot                  3                    23
Swim                 -1                     0
Tumble                8                    15
Use Magic Device      3                    24

Level 1 (Rogue)
Feat: (Selected) Point Blank Shot
Feat: (Human Bonus) Rapid Shot


Level 2 (Rogue)


Level 3 (Rogue)
Feat: (Selected) Toughness


Level 4 (Rogue)
Ability Raise: INT


Level 5 (Rogue)


Level 6 (Rogue)
Feat: (Selected) Rapid Reload


Level 7 (Bard)


Level 8 (Bard)
Ability Raise: INT


Level 9 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Precise Shot


Level 10 (Bard)


Level 11 (Bard)


Level 12 (Bard)
Ability Raise: INT
Feat: (Selected) Extend Spell


Level 13 (Bard)


Level 14 (Bard)


Level 15 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Ranged Weapons


Level 16 (Bard)
Ability Raise: INT


Level 17 (Bard)


Level 18 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Precise Shot


Level 19 (Bard)


Level 20 (Bard)
Ability Raise: INT
Enhancement: Rogue Haste Boost I
Enhancement: Rogue Haste Boost II
Enhancement: Bard Extra Song I
Enhancement: Bard Extra Song II
Enhancement: Bard Extra Song III
Enhancement: Bard Extra Song IV
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Attack I
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Attack II
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Damage I
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Damage II
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Damage III
Enhancement: Bard Lingering Song I
Enhancement: Bard Music of Makers
Enhancement: Bard Music of the Dead
Enhancement: Bard Virtuoso I
Enhancement: Human Adaptability Intelligence I
Enhancement: Human Greater Adaptability Constitution I
Enhancement: Human Versatility I
Enhancement: Human Versatility II
Enhancement: Human Versatility III
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness II
Enhancement: Racial Toughness III
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training I
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training II
Enhancement: Bard Perform I
Enhancement: Bard Perform II
Enhancement: Bard Charisma I
Enhancement: Bard Charisma II
Enhancement: Rogue Dexterity I
Enhancement: Rogue Dexterity II
Enhancement: Bard Wand Mastery I
Enhancement: Bard Wand Mastery II
Enhancement: Bard Wand Mastery III
Enhancement: Bard Wand Mastery IV

**richieelias27** · 10-06-2010, 06:28 AM

Originally Posted by HellsChaos

Anyway, I know having 6 str is risky at first, but working off the knowledge that yes, str base items are easier to get, I was planning on fixing that. Since str damage doesn't apply to repeater damage, I only need a slight boost, and maybe a +2 tomb to reduce encumbrance. This is not a ranger using bow str, so duh...yeah, not my focus.

6 starting STR + a +2 tome + 6str item = 14 STR. That is 2 less str than what my Sorc runs with most of the time (and I didnt have to blow a tome to get there). Get hit with waves of exhaustion with even 16 str and you are more than likely encumbered in addition to being slowed. Being encumbered sucks. Being encumbered while being slowed = dead.

**Failedlegend** · 10-06-2010, 07:22 AM