Tier III Virtuoso Song Ideas

[Aashrym]

I was giving some thought to what I would like to see for the tier III Virt songs.

1) Unending Lullaby. WILL save vs perform for a sleep effect (IE helpless, free crits and sneak attacking), small chance to wake up on damage, fatigued state if wake up succeeds or if the original save is made. Single target (we still want enthrall to be useful) at range. Remove the chance to break from capering song completely so it is still useful. Wouldn't it be nice to have a sleep effect someone might actually use?

2) Song of Eternal Friendship. WILL save vs perform for a charm monster effect. Critical chance to hit dominate monster instead. All recurring saves are against the original perform check. This is single target to avoid making mass suggestion song useless, and has the advantage over mass suggestion that it does not require the target to be fascinated first.

And in the spirit of music of the dead and music of the makers let's add music of the garden. Available early to virtuosos and available to any other bard with extra song IV to fascinate plant monsters. Adding the green ear ability would be appropriate if we are going to see more plant creatures.

EDIT: Change the lullaby from fatigued to exhausted.

Aside: http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php...=1#post3300905 for war chanter and new capstone ideas.

Any thoughts on these ideas?

[Aerendil]

What I'd love to see:

General Virtuoso changes:
- make Enthrallment work with all Fascinate-ability songs such as Suggestion. Currently they do not and I presume this is a bug.
- make Enthrallment so that a separate hotbar key is not required for MoTM and MoTD. One enthrall song should mez any and all susceptible creatures in it's radius. As it currently stands, a group of 3 kobolds, 1 flesh golem, and 2 skeletons would require 3 separate songs to be sung. It's silly.
- improve Enthrallment penalty reduction as levels increase. Maybe change it to -4 penalty to enemy's to-hit at level 12, and -6 at level 18. Or -3 and -4 if the above is overpowered. Testing required.
- make the bardsong Suggestion and Suggestion, Mass not require Enthrall/Fascinate for the Virtuoso. This would allow for near-instant crowd-control. The current mechanic takes FAR too long and is rendered useless in all but solo situations.


That said, my thoughts on V3:

Bard Virtuoso III
Prereqs: Level 18 Bard, Bard Virtuoso II, Bard Charisma 3, Bard Lingering Song III, Bard Extra Song IV
Benefit: Your further studies into song have granted you another +2 bonus to your Diplomacy, Listen, and Perform skills, for a total of +6 to each. You also gain 2 more extra uses of Bardic Music per rest for a total of 7, and the ability to extend the duration of your beneficial songs by an additional 10% for a total of 30%. You can now expend a use of Bardic Music to interrupt enemy spellcasting, or to simulate the effects of a Slow spell. You may possess only one prestige enhancement line at a time for each class.

Song of Jarring
Benefit: Expend a use of Bardic Music to interrupt a single enemy's spellcasting. A successful Will save negates this effect. (DC is equal to a Perform check). Failure forces an enemy spellcaster to make a Concentration check (with DC equal to the Perform check) to complete casting a spell.

Song of Slowing
Benefit: Expend a use of Bardic Music to cause all enemies within range to attack and move slower, mimicing the effects of a Slow spell. A successful Will save negates this effect (DC is equal to a Perform check). Spell resistance applies.

*edit* - using same DCs as Virt 2 for the above abilities, I think those may be quite high and allow for nearly worry-free debuffing of enemies. So testing required obviously. I think I'd rather see something like Song of Slowing ignoring spell resistance, but having a saving throw that's possible - this would allow Virts to land debuffs on mobs that true casters might struggle to land their spells on, giving Virtuosos a role in certain quests/raids. /shrug

[Aashrym]

Increasing the penalty after breaking enthrallment sounds like a heck of a good idea to me. Even if it followed the inspire courage levels. -1, -2 at 8th, -3 at 14th, -4 at 20th.

[Damionic]

Not sure if its D&D or not..but a few ideas popped into my head.

Vibration Song.
"Years training your voice has gained you the ability to sing devastating vibrations to your foe"

Now..this would only work as a damage ability on foes weak to sound vibrations..such as Insects,Earth Elementals,Gargoyles,Oozes (the vibrations would shatter it inside out) Etc.

Something like 12d6 Damage (up to 30d6 at lvl 20) and a crit chance to destroy the target.

Bleeding Ears.
Your Voice is a lethal weapon..once unleashed your singing will send all hearing mobs on a (Fortitude and Perform Save) dropping to the floor (AoE Greater Command effect)

[Tazarith]

I'd like to see just a straight out Mass Charm or better yet Mass Dominate so as to have a trail of groupees by your side while you sing along and wack. With a DC based off of a combo of Char and Perform. Lets reward those Bards who have maximized their Charisma

[Aashrym]

I'd like to see just a straight out Mass Charm or better yet Mass Dominate so as to have a trail of groupees by your side while you sing along and wack. With a DC based off of a combo of Char and Perform. Lets reward those Bards who have maximized their Charisma

2 things on that comment:

1) It overshadows mass suggestion and enthrall.
2) A high charisma isn't normally relative to the DC's on perform. Generally it's save on 20 regardless scenario.

I thought along the lines of your comment but then I tried to balance usefulness for new songs and other songs. With massive number of songs and regen rate on songs the single target is better IMO.

I do think virts need more options, so AP for song abilities might be an idea, similar to archmage or arcane archer.

[Valindria]

I would want:
1. save or death song with damage on save. Similar to wail.

2. Improve enthrall to give a chance to hold/flesh to stone any in range. (if save vs hold still need to save vs entrall)

[salmag]

I would want:
1. save or death song with damage on save. Similar to wail.

2. Improve enthrall to give a chance to hold/flesh to stone any in range. (if save vs hold still need to save vs entrall)

This sounds like THE best idea for a Tier III Virtuoso, and it's worthy of a third tier.

+1

[Aashrym]

I would want:
1. save or death song with damage on save. Similar to wail.

2. Improve enthrall to give a chance to hold/flesh to stone any in range. (if save vs hold still need to save vs entrall)

Here's the issue I see with this:

If I had a class that did save or die and hold/flesh to stone based on perform save, who also had these great buffs and did +7/+7 to attack/damage with a song, could mezz CC just about anything out there, didn't need to bypass SR, could self heal and heal-over-time the party, and has the feats available without the required high caster stat to do it so can afford to take STR/CON and the melee feats and the songs regen.......I may or may not have made my point.


That would create trend of obsolete classes IMO. Overpowered. As it is I would find it hard to turn down a 20 virt over a chanter multi with the new songs. They are just worth more than that +1 damage with the tier II. Tier 3 with these suggestions would really take away something from wiz/sorc IMO. They seem much too much.