update 7: half-elf Dilettante

[psteen1]

With wand use at caster level 1 I'd rather have the option to take Toughness like any Human build would.

Yeah people are getting pretty excited here, but wands you can use at level 1 aren't all that great. Sure, we have self healing, but with a a cure light wounds wand. After level 5 or 6...Big woop. I would rather take toughness as a human, which combined with some enhancements can get you 50ish extra hit points depending on your class.

Or am I wrong? Anyone want to put together a list of level 1 wands and show that there is a wand worth using once you get out of the Harbor?

[Irinis]

Wouldn't a level 10 wand require a caster level to be 10? You'd have a percentage chance of the lvl10 wand working, better to train UMD. Looks like the Dilettante thing is really not that great, aside from Fighter for martial weapon proficiency.

[LunaCee]

Unless they've done a bunch of extra coding for this special ability alone... having effectively one level in any qualifying class lets you use ALL wands that class could use without a UMD/Level check. So unless they are sneaking in a change that finally has wand usage always take UMD and or class level checks beyond just HAVING one of said level... (and you had better believe that would raise a HUGE stink. Rangers for example wouldn't even be able to use cure light wands until 8th level roughly)

Expect wand usage to be universal unless they SPECIFICALLY state that it will not work as single level splashes currently work in game.

[Irinis]

Unless they've done a bunch of extra coding for this special ability alone... having effectively one level in any qualifying class lets you use ALL wands that class could use without a UMD/Level check. So unless they are sneaking in a change that finally has wand usage always take UMD and or class level checks beyond just HAVING one of said level... (and you had better believe that would raise a HUGE stink. Rangers for example wouldn't even be able to use cure light wands until 8th level roughly)

Expect wand usage to be universal unless they SPECIFICALLY state that it will not work as single level splashes currently work in game.

Ah thank you for the clarification. That is supercool then!

[Darkrok]

In addition, low level feat swaps are cheap. Nothing wrong with taking this feat early on and then swapping it to Toughness later.

[dkyle]

In addition, low level feat swaps are cheap. Nothing wrong with taking this feat early on and then swapping it to Toughness later.

The bonus feat can only be spent on Dilettante feats, not on Toughness or other feats. Otherwise Half-Elves would be essentially strictly better than Humans (extra skill point aside).

[tihocan]

I don't really see why anyone would take the Cleric one over Paladin, unless it happens that they can fit 13 Wis better than 13 Cha. A 25% chance on Raise Dead is quite irrelevant at high level when you can either get the same with UMD, or craft some raise dead clicky. So I guess it can be handy in the short term, but for people looking at long term usefulness, Paladin >> Cleric.

[Lear_beta]

I don't really see why anyone would take the Cleric one over Paladin, unless it happens that they can fit 13 Wis better than 13 Cha. A 25% chance on Raise Dead is quite irrelevant at high level when you can either get the same with UMD, or craft some raise dead clicky. So I guess it can be handy in the short term, but for people looking at long term usefulness, Paladin >> Cleric.

you can get a few more wands and scrolls from the cleric feat. but i agree that +2 saves and the most used wands&scrolls are available. and with a little UMD and atleast 14 char and a bit of UMD you should be able to reach atleast 25% chance of succeeding with a raise dead scroll on a half-elf with pally feat.

[dkyle]

you can get a few more wands and scrolls from the cleric feat. but i agree that +2 saves and the most used wands&scrolls are available. and with a little UMD and atleast 14 char and a bit of UMD you should be able to reach atleast 25% chance of succeeding with a raise dead scroll on a half-elf with pally feat.

A few more, maybe, but which wands are worth anything? Which scrolls, other than raise dead, are worth tolerating a caster level check for?

A +20 UMD will give a 25% chance of success on Raise Dead scrolls. Anyone who takes the Pali dilettante feat will have 13 CHA at level 1, so figure a +1 tome at some point, for 14 base CHA at endgame. On a non-class-skill-UMD build, +11 from ranks. Then +2 from base CHA, +3 from CHA item, +3 from Cartouche, and +1 from VotM gives +20.

So it's pretty trivial for anyone with the Pali dilettante feat to at least mimic what seems to be the main benefit of the Cleric feat by level 20.

[Eladrin]

Half-Elf Dilettante: Rogue
Prereqs: Half-Elf, 13 Dexterity
Benefit: You have learned a few tricks from less reputable sources. You deal +1d6 Sneak Attack damage, but this does not stack with the Rogue Sneak Attack ability. For item use purposes you count as a level one rogue in addition to any other classes you possess. This feat is not recommended for characters with actual rogue levels.

Everyone likes grenades, right?

Half-Elf Dilettante: Fighter
Prereqs: Half-Elf, 13 Strength
Benefit: You have trained with the best, and your martial skills have improved. You gain proficiency with all martial melee weapons, and for item use purposes you count as a level one fighter in addition to any other classes you possess. This feat is not recommended for characters with actual fighter levels.

Almost as much as they like greatswords!

[The_Cataclysm]

****, I was hoping for bard. Looks great though.

[orochinaga]

Do want bow strength for ranger pretty plz !

The fighter's dilettante looks fine, but I'll add a + 1 to attack bonus. (which will be unavailalle with a fighter spalsh)

It's too easy to get martial weapons with some multi classing or racial proficiency....

[Tiamos]

Half-Elf Dilettante: Rogue
Prereqs: Half-Elf, 13 Dexterity
Benefit: You have learned a few tricks from less reputable sources. You deal +1d6 Sneak Attack damage, but this does not stack with the Rogue Sneak Attack ability. For item use purposes you count as a level one rogue in addition to any other classes you possess. This feat is not recommended for characters with actual rogue levels.

Everyone likes grenades, right?

I dunno about everyone else, but I was kinda hoping Dilettante: Rogue would allow taking ranks in open lock and disable device. +1d6 sneak attack damage seems lackluster compared to say, unlocking the ability to use wands or getting +2 to all saves. (Granted it is easier for TWF classes to have 13 dex than it is for them to have 13 wis or 13 cha, however investing skills at 1:2 is a similar sacrifice for some classes).

[Coldin]

Half-Elf Dilettante: Rogue
Prereqs: Half-Elf, 13 Dexterity
Benefit: You have learned a few tricks from less reputable sources. You deal +1d6 Sneak Attack damage, but this does not stack with the Rogue Sneak Attack ability. For item use purposes you count as a level one rogue in addition to any other classes you possess. This feat is not recommended for characters with actual rogue levels.

Everyone likes grenades, right?

Half-Elf Dilettante: Fighter
Prereqs: Half-Elf, 13 Strength
Benefit: You have trained with the best, and your martial skills have improved. You gain proficiency with all martial melee weapons, and for item use purposes you count as a level one fighter in addition to any other classes you possess. This feat is not recommended for characters with actual fighter levels.

Almost as much as they like greatswords!

The dilettante feats are an interesting concept, that's for sure. I wonder what the other classes will hold?

[TiranBlade]

Do want bow strength for ranger pretty plz !

I was hoping for like a 5-10% Bonus to TWF from the ranger.

I'm look more for Barbarian, does it grant the lowest form of rage?

And what about monk?

On my soon to be Half-Elf Ranger I'm gonna take either Barbarian or Monk if either of them are good enough.

[googatron]

Half-Elf Dilettante: Rogue
Prereqs: Half-Elf, 13 Dexterity
Benefit: You have learned a few tricks from less reputable sources. You deal +1d6 Sneak Attack damage, but this does not stack with the Rogue Sneak Attack ability. For item use purposes you count as a level one rogue in addition to any other classes you possess. This feat is not recommended for characters with actual rogue levels.

Everyone likes grenades, right?

Half-Elf Dilettante: Fighter
Prereqs: Half-Elf, 13 Strength
Benefit: You have trained with the best, and your martial skills have improved. You gain proficiency with all martial melee weapons, and for item use purposes you count as a level one fighter in addition to any other classes you possess. This feat is not recommended for characters with actual fighter levels.

Almost as much as they like greatswords!

Holy ****..... screw halforc... I want halfelf!

[GhostNull]

Half-Elf Dilettante: Rogue
Prereqs: Half-Elf, 13 Dexterity
Benefit: You have learned a few tricks from less reputable sources. You deal +1d6 Sneak Attack damage, but this does not stack with the Rogue Sneak Attack ability. For item use purposes you count as a level one rogue in addition to any other classes you possess. This feat is not recommended for characters with actual rogue levels.

Would like to have seen something like a +2 bonus to UMD in addition to the Sneak Attack
With the enhancement lines later on adding more bonuses of course

Eladrin, I do think you need to clarify if, for example Dilettante: Cleric only allows a player to use level 1 wands (Cure Light Wands) or that they can use any clerical wand provided they meet the minimum level (Cure Serious Wands at character level 5).

[TiranBlade]

Would like to have seen something like a +2 bonus to UMD in addition to the Sneak Attack
With the enhancement lines later on adding more bonuses of course

If anything it will most likely be on the Bard Dilettante.

Ooooooh!!! Enhancements for each dilettante would ROCK!!!

[Razcar]

I don't think Dilettante: Wizard/Sorcerer/Cleric/FvS will work the same as splashing a single level of said classes. Right now if you splash Wizard on a Fighter you can use any arcane wand as long you meet the minimum level for the wand. If your overall level is 7 you can use Stoneskin wands.

Until we know more, either through a dev clarification or after testing on Lamannia, it is more logical to assume that this mechanic works for Dilettante as it works for other classes. I.e. that if wand-use is unlocked for wands from a specific spell list, you will be able to use that spell list's wands based on your current total levels - regardless what the rest of those levels are. Occam's razor.

[googatron]

I have to say, half elf is going to eliminate a few multiclasses and provide some new substance to class makeups... I'm actualy pretty excited about this race... more so than the barbarian fest of halforcs thats for sure...