Give us some clues on Bard Changes!

[Irinis]

I really hope that when you re-work Bard enhancements that you also consider that buffing others is a great part of the Bard class but the Bard himself has to have something to do during the quest as well.

War Chanters - They need to do good personal DPS

Spellsingers - They need to be able to cast spells, including spells that actually work in every type of content besides healing.

Virtuoso - If the main focus is songs, they need to have songs that work in more encounters

Nobody wants to get into a group to sing a few songs and go afk (well maybe a few pikers )

QFT and +1 rep.

[Rav'n]

3.5 ed.

Sustaining Song- A virtuoso of 3rd level of higher with at least 13 ranks in a perform skill can sustain his dying allies, assisting in their reconvery. Each round that the song continues, all allies within 30 feet of him automatically become stable (if dying) or regain 1 hit point (if stable and between -1 and -9 hit points). A sustaining song has no effect on enemies or on allies with 0 or more hit points. A virtuoso can keep up his sustaining song for 5 minutes. This is a mind effecting ability.

So..if Sustaining Song...helps someone recover from -1 to -9 HP....wouldn't you rather just hit them with a spell/wand/scroll..? Remember, songs don't activate until the song ends....meanwhile, everyone at -9/9 are now dead.

If in fact that's the way it's implimented.... yeah... that kind of sux.

[hydra_ex]

Spellsong vigour sounds to me like it's going to be sp regen.

Song of capering might be another skill song.

Sustaining Song might be a short term buff akin to divine intersession; i.e. they can't die while the buff is on. (Weaker than the capstone somehow, obviously).

[Noctus]

I really hope that when you re-work Bard enhancements that you also consider that buffing others is a great part of the Bard class but the Bard himself has to have something to do during the quest as well.

War Chanters - They need to do good personal DPS

Spellsingers - They need to be able to cast spells, including spells that actually work in every type of content besides healing.

Virtuoso - If the main focus is songs, they need to have songs that work in more encounters

Nobody wants to get into a group to sing a few songs and go afk (well maybe a few pikers )

/QFT

I really hope thats the way they are walking.

[LeslieWest_GuitarGod]

New songs are a very good start! How about adding new spells as well? Neverwinter Nights contained these bard spells (not all of them exclusive to bard of course):

Clarity - This spell removes the effects of daze, sleep, confusion, stun, and charm, and protects against all mind-affecting effects until it expires. For every effect removed by the spell, the target creature sustains 1 point of negative energy damage.

Keen edge - Adds the keen property to the targeted slashing melee weapon, increasing its critical threat range.

Improved invisibility - The target creature becomes invisible and impossible to detect using normal vision. After attacking or casting spells the target creature will become partially visible and detectable by enemies, but still retain a 50% cover bonus.

Gust of wind - This spell creates a blast of air that knocks down any creatures failing their saving throws. It is also powerful enough to disperse any cloudlike area of effect spells (such as cloudkill) that are in the path of the wind gust.

Greater magic weapon - You empower the touched weapon with a +1 enhancement bonus per 3 caster levels (maximum of +5). You can either directly target the weapon you want to cast this spell on, or you can target a creature, affecting the creature's main hand weapon.

Cloud of bewilderment - The caster blows forth a cloud of noxious air. Enemies in the area of effect are stunned and blinded for 1d6 rounds.

Dirge - The caster's song draws the energies of death and destruction. Any enemies in the area of effect suffer 2 points of strength and dexterity ability score damage each round. If the enemy leaves the area of effect, their dexterity and strength are restored.

Invisibility sphere - The caster brings into being a zone of invisibility that travels with him for the duration of the spell. All allies within the spell's area of effect are rendered invisible, but not to each other. Those that leave the sphere are visible once more.

Wounding whispers - The caster is surrounded with whispers that injure any creature that hits the caster for 1d6+1/level points of sonic damage.

Ethereal visage - The caster is surrounded by a ghostly nimbus of light that grants damage reduction 20/+3, prevents all spells of level 2 or lower from affecting the caster and provides a 25% concealment bonus.

Energy buffer - The caster gains damage resistance 40/- against all elemental forms of damage. The spell ends after absorbing 60 points of damage from any single elemental type. This spell stacks with — and is applied after — feat-based sources of damage resistance.

Healing circle - All friendly creatures within the area of effect are healed for 1d8 hit points, +1 points per caster level up to a maximum of +20. Healing spells have a reverse effect when used on undead, harming instead of healing them.

Tasha's hideous laughter - If the target fails their saving throw they will begin laughing hysterically. They will be unable to defend themselves until the spell wears off. A creature whose racial type is different from the caster's gains a +4 bonus on its saving throw because humor doesn't 'translate' well.

[Aashrym]

Due to the extremely amusing positive reaction to my mean little prank, I'll drop some more interesting information.

The three Tier II Bard PrE's have the following abilities (in no particular order):

Song of Heroism
Song of Capering
Song of Arcane Might
Inspire Recklessness
Spellsong Vigor
Sustaining Song

It's up to you guys to decipher which ones go with which PrE's, and you can speculate on what they do. (Until I drop more info. Gotta go fix more bugs now.)

My guesses:

Song of Heroism: warchanter, the double-strike song hinted at pre update 5, or a stacking bonus to hit.

Song of Capering: virtuoso, save against otto's resistable dance (might be a mass version or single target) against perform check

Song of Arcane Might: spellsinger, bonus to caster level for spells cast during the song

Inspire Recklessness: warchanter, bonus to hit with penalty to AC. This might be the double strike song with a penalty to AC.

Spellsong Vigor: spellsinger, improved SP reduction cost, bonus to casting speed, or SP regen over time.

Sustaining Song: virtuoso, HP regen over time.

I'm just happy we're seeing something new

[Rasczak]

"Song of Capering?" Best. Song name. EVAH.

Try explain that to a half-orc barb when you tell them they now need to caper..........

I am so beside myself to see these songs I will pay in bacon.....

I personally hope that virtuoso will be getting an enthrall that would have more effect on named. I.e they may not make a red/orange/purple named stand still but it provides interesting debuffs on the boss. Maybe have their songs cause more of a loss to mobs saves etc.

[Chaosprism]

This may have been said before:

But these new songs, can we actually get some NEW music rather than simply replaying the courage song?

New songs come in new packs, maybe we could just have the bards playing those?


New songs for tier 1,2 all 3 bards, thats 6 new songs. Please tell me you've got a music person to pen some new tunes to go with the songs !

[Razcar]

This may have been said before:

But these new songs, can we actually get some NEW music rather than simply replaying the courage song?

I really don't understand these request. We have voice chat in DDO! Use it!

For Inspire Courage I like to belt out the Imperial March (with my own lyrics that goes "Co co co-courage co-courage co", feel free to use them, I wont sue), Inspire Heroics gets a rendition of Tina Turner's "We do(n't) need another hero", and for Inspire Greatness I totally rock out with "Alexander the Great" by Iron Maiden. If I'm on my Spellsinger I croon a version of "I've put a spell on you" for the Spellsong Trance (I keep a pair of maraccas by the keyboard). I have also set my mic on max for that real "I'm right in your room"-experience.

And while the additions to the bard seems really nice, I would also like if the devs could take look at the game bug that seemingly makes fewer and fewer people able to hear me talk when I play my bard? Quite annoying to say the least.

[Irinis]

I really don't understand these request. We have voice chat in DDO! Use it!

For Inspire Courage I like to belt out the Imperial March (with my own lyrics that goes "Co co co-courage co-courage co", feel free to use them, I wont sue), Inspire Heroics gets a rendition of Tina Turner's "We do(n't) need another hero", and for Inspire Greatness I totally rock out with "Alexander the Great" by Iron Maiden. If I'm on my Spellsinger I croon a version of "I've put a spell on you" for the Spellsong Trance (I keep a pair of maraccas by the keyboard). I have also set my mic on max for that real "I'm right in your room"-experience.

And while the additions to the bard seems really nice, I would also like if the devs could take look at the game bug that seemingly makes fewer and fewer people able to hear me talk when I play my bard? Quite annoying to say the least.

Elan, stop playing DDO and get back to making out with Haley.

[marcosoneghett]

Eladrin, PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE, review the TUNES on the bard songs. Add unique sounds to each one. It`s a not difficult improvement to do and would give so much more flavor to our bards.
It would also enable us to compose little songs with different bard buffs

[The_Cataclysm]

Tasha's hideous laughter - If the target fails their saving throw they will begin laughing hysterically. They will be unable to defend themselves until the spell wears off. A creature whose racial type is different from the caster's gains a +4 bonus on its saving throw because humor doesn't 'translate' well.

Would be pointless to add this one. It has the exact same function as Otto's Resistible dance, and probably for good reason.

In PnP Otto's Irresistible Dance is the only one of the 3 Otto's dance spells we have. So when they were creating the game, I'm sure they realized that eventually they will get up to the point where they needed to add dance animations for monsters when they got to high enough levels. So rather than create 2 animations for each monster (laughing animation and dancing animation) they created a new spell that filled the same function as Tasha's hideous laughter and allowed them to only have 1 animation.

[Elfvyra]

I'm just hoping Virtuoso II will explain why the path is called, "Virtuoso of the Sword"....

[Valindria]

it's been a day, I'm ready for new information.

[CSFurious]

it would be nice if some of these were adapted to the war chanter prestige class

nonetheless, i think that half-orc war chanters will be overtaking stormreach this fall

http://www.deaths-sanctuary.com/Virrith/prc/War.html

[Valindria]

it would be nice if some of these were adapted to the war chanter prestige class

nonetheless, i think that half-orc war chanters will be overtaking stormreach this fall

http://www.deaths-sanctuary.com/Virrith/prc/War.html

Combine songs would make me very happy.

[LeslieWest_GuitarGod]

Would be pointless to add this one. It has the exact same function as Otto's Resistible dance, and probably for good reason.

In PnP Otto's Irresistible Dance is the only one of the 3 Otto's dance spells we have. So when they were creating the game, I'm sure they realized that eventually they will get up to the point where they needed to add dance animations for monsters when they got to high enough levels. So rather than create 2 animations for each monster (laughing animation and dancing animation) they created a new spell that filled the same function as Tasha's hideous laughter and allowed them to only have 1 animation.

Baah, that was then and this is now. I think the Devs have the resources now to make things happen like this. Sorry, but I'd like to see & hear the laughing animation! They can add the spell or simply rename ottos resistible to its proper name and change the animation... Subtle, but I think attention to detail like this can go a long way for many people enjoying the CC capabilities of their bards. I certainly would appreciate the extra work the devs put into animations like this.

Hmmm, thank you for reminding me, I forgot one more actual D&D spell that I think would be kick arse:

Eyebite - Level 6 bard spell. Each round, you may target a single living creature, striking it with waves of evil power. Depending on the target’s HD, this attack has as many as three effects.

Sickened

Sudden pain and fever sweeps over the subject’s body. A sickened creature takes a -2 penalty on attack rolls, weapon damage rolls, saving throws, skill checks, and ability checks. A creature affected by this spell remains sickened for 10 minutes per caster level. The effects cannot be negated by a remove disease or heal spell, but a remove curse is effective.

Panicked

The subject becomes panicked for 1d4 rounds. Even after the panic ends, the creature remains shaken for 10 minutes per caster level, and it automatically becomes panicked again if it comes within sight of you during that time. This is a fear effect.

Comatose

The subject falls into a catatonic coma for 10 minutes per caster level. During this time, it cannot be awakened by any means short of dispelling the effect. This is not a sleep effect, and thus elves are not immune to it.

The spell lasts for 1 round per three caster levels. You must spend a move action each round after the first to target a foe.

[Chaosprism]

I think animation wise it would be costly space wise to add a laughing animation.


/laugh animation is in there for humanoids though already so all humanoid enemies can do that.


So making a version of otto's dance that did the /laugh animation with a comic bubble "Ha Ha Ha!" over their head would be interesting if nothing else.

What level is the spell anyway? If it's not the same level as otto's dance then it might still be useful to have a single target disabler spell.



On a side note I think theres a few creatures that have the EYEBITE spell as an innate ability. (some daemons possibly)

[Valindria]

More information please.

[geezee]

From the big thread in the bard forum:

Then new songs look nice and all, but they really don't look like anything to write home about. We won't be able to use them constantly, as a lot of our songs are already used up for buffing and for cc.

It's gonna take more than 2 songs to make any melee stay pure bard. They havent said at what level the new presitge classes will be available. But there needs to be a considerable benefit to staying pure as well. Right now the capstone doesnt help a strength-based melee bard much at all.

Spellsingers are even worse off than warchanters. 2 new songs will not fix the weakness of bard casting cc. Without new spells spellsingers will still be third rate cc. It looks to me like spellsingers will continue to be relegated to healing roles in the end game.

And virtuosos? Need a lot more help than 2 new songs.