Worst of the Worst Spells

[Aexicas]

One important note is that Ice Storm and Wall of Fire won't stack - the Wall of Fire will be extinguished by the storm.

We're going to be going through a bunch of the spells and take the ones that are "less than optimal" and see what we can do with them, as well as adding more "specialty" spells that will by their nature be mostly Wizard oriented. (Deconstruct, maybe?)

We're also considering doing a pass on spell point costs, and a possible redo of the Sorcerer and Wizard damage amplification and spell crit lines - breaking the four elements back apart, adding more tiers (that may go beyond 40%) and adjusting the costs appropriately (Possibly 1/1/1/1/1/1... rather than 1/2/3/4, for instance).

We'll want feedback on what the "worst of the worst" spells are. I know the Power Words are way up there on that list, and there are a bunch of other terrible ones - maybe I'll go make that my next blog post...

So, that being said, what are YOUR worst of the worst spells?

I've always thought that there were a lot that were lacking, but ice storm (which of course is now fixed) was a big one.

Now adays, here is my list, edited as per MadFloyd's direction! His original post is as such, for you to follow:

I was just going to start a thread on this myself.

So I'm encouraging participation in this thread!

Personally, I'd like to see something like:

- spell name
- 1-5 rating on spell cost (1 being bad, 5 being appropriate)
- 1-5 rating on spell effectiveness
- comments

Trap the Soul:
-Spell Cost: 4 (spell points), 1 (physical cost)
-Spell Effectiveness: 2
-Comments: Not enough need for it, and the components take too long to gather. Not to mention the HD limit. Take off the HD limit, and make khyber shards drop more? Would be set.

Deep Slumber/Sleep:
-Spell Cost: 2
-Spell Effectiveness: 1
-comments: Particularly Deep Slumber. 10 HD? At level 6? You might hit a hobgoblin or two, but, thats about it. Totally not worth putting on a sorcerer.

Sleet Storm:
-Spell Cost: 3
-Spell Effectiveness: 2
-Comments: Just.... Sleet Storm.

Stinking Cloud:
-Spell Cost: 2
-Spell Effectiveness: 2
-Comments: Really, see sleet storm. Not as bad, and not as good, at the same time. The effectiveness is really not there, except in very niche situations; not something you'd carry on your bar everyday as a sorc.

Honestly, mostly its the HD spells over the others, but a few of the cloud spells could use a buff.

What's on your "most useless" list?

[khaldan]

All of the power words;1;1;I've never seen a single one work outside of a quest on casual.

Contagion;2;3;This would be better, except the ability damage generally doesn't do enough, and the disease would need to tick every 4-6 seconds to be worth throwing.

Acid storm(the short term one, not the fog);2;2;It's like firewall/new ice storm, but doesn't last that long and ticks maybe 3-4 times. If it stacked with itself, it might be worthwhile.

DBF;3;2;It's like fireball, but with more sp and slightly more damage.

Most of the summons could use a slight buff.

[Elfvyra]

That's easy...

Any spell that affects 'X' HD or 'X' HP.

[dragons1ayer74]

That's easy...

Any spell that affects 'X' HD or 'X' HP.

In additon to this and most of the others listed how about any/most of the cloud spells are they still all broken as in not working at all other than visuals?

[Lissyl]

So, that being said, what are YOUR worst of the worst spells?

I've always thought that there were a lot that were lacking, but ice storm (which of course is now fixed) was a big one.

Now adays, here is my list:

Trap the Soul: Not enough need for it, and the components take too long to gather. Not to mention the HD limit. Take off the HD limit, and make khyber shards drop more? Would be set.

Deep Slumber/Sleep: Particularly Deep Slumber. 10 HD? At level 6? You might hit a hobgoblin or two, but, thats about it.

Sleet Storm: Just.... Sleet Storm.

Stinking Cloud: Really, see sleet storm. Not as bad, and not as good, at the same time.

Honestly, mostly its the HD spells over the others, but a few of the cloud spells could use a buff.

What's on your "most useless" list?

The HD spells do seem to be the absolute worst. Circle of Death, anyone? Undeath to Death? I don't think I've ever seen either of those actually hit a mob. The spells that target an area around a creature, but don't move when the creature does (during casting) are pretty annoying also. Halt Undead and Slow come to mind as an example of this.

Solid Fog, and yes...Sleet storm. Good gods I almost got kicked out of a group because they were certain it was me and not the hobgoblins casting it for quite a while.

Acid storm. That thing ticks less than Melf's does, and for about the same damage on average. Very short-lived for what it puts out.

[MadFloyd]

I was just going to start a thread on this myself.

So I'm encouraging participation in this thread!

Personally, I'd like to see something like:

- spell name
- 1-5 rating on spell cost (1 being bad, 5 being appropriate)
- 1-5 rating on spell effectiveness
- comments

[Eladrin]

I was just going to start a thread on this myself.

So I'm encouraging participation in this thread!

Personally, I'd like to see something like:

- spell name
- 1-5 rating on spell cost (1 being bad, 5 being appropriate)
- 1-5 rating on spell effectiveness
- comments

That's probably a good idea. Instead of the "Worst of the Worst" - more of a general spell rating thread.

[Bladedge]

Arcane and Divine spells or just Arcane spells?

[Duke-H-]

Not an arcane spell, but seriously.

Word of Recall

[Hafeal]

Spell name
Undeath to Death

- 1-5 rating on spell cost (1 being bad, 5 being appropriate)

3

- 1-5 rating on spell effectiveness

1

- comments
I have never seen it land either. Useless.

Spell Name

All 'Inflict" spells

- 1-5 rating on spell cost (1 being bad, 5 being appropriate)

5

- 1-5 rating on spell effectiveness

3

- comments

Need a boost to actually be an effective offensive weapon due to the inflated HPs of most mobs.

For MadFLoyd.

[Aesop]

Arcane and Divine spells or just Arcane spells?

E said both

Aesop

[Ranmaru2]

Sleet Storm: Just.... Sleet Storm.

This is commonly misplaced as a useless spell, as not enough people bother to use it in tandem with Freedom of Movement as they level up. Sure if you get dispelled it makes it difficult to move, but you can't complain about 50% concealment for the duration of the spell as the enemies are blinded. This spell can save clerics a bajillion spell points in heavy mob concentrated areas if you know where to use it at. It cancels enemy FWs, slows/trips enemies, and blinds. It is NOT useless in any way.

[Freeman]

Solid Fog: Does absolutely nothing since it was broken a year ago, making it completely useless.
Acid Fog: At least has the Acid damage, but it hasn't been slowing anything down as it should.

[Phidius]

Tenser's Transformation:

1. Cost - carry around pots of bull strength, get carried around in someone's backpack (probably to be left out of range of a rez shrine)

2. Benefit - Nothing that can't be gotten from a divine clicky and appropriate gear.


Sorry, I can't bring myself to list the spells that I find effective and fun.

[nanobot1994]

Wall of Fire.

That aside, the spells my wizzy never uses in quests are:

PW stun - Extremely overpowered in pvp, Extremely underpowered in the other 99% of the game (Yes, I personally love pvp, me being a wizzy, may or may not have anything to do with that)

Anything to do with HD or HPs is pretty much useless in quests. No clue at all how to fix that though.

On a side note, please dont nerf FW , right now, its one of the VERY few ways i can contribute to DPS, don't make me play a buff bot. I understand its over the top, but Ill be perfectly fine with it being nerfed if we get something to make a decent contribution to quests in its place. Not that anyone will care about this paragraph, but eh.

[fuzzy1guy]

my OPINION...
right down the list.

Trap the soul is fairly useless in most content. We need a 40hd and 50hd and maybe even 60hd version. (idk how far up the monsters go. but theres alot of stuff you can't trap with 10, 20 or 30.)


Acid rain - Far too short of a duration for the cost. Dmg kinda meh for the cost.

Cause fear - Oh great now we get to chase the weak ones all over. And it didnt work on the dangerous guys.
Needs tweak like the turn undead got. Root them in place cowering for a short time.

Circle of death - Nice if you want to run korthos/harbor at a much later level. Fairly useless otherwise.

Contagion - COULD be a nice DoT effect. but it's not.

Deep slumber - A nice idea. but yet again HD limits make it a worthless choice often.

False life - Some ppl like it. But you could just drink a cure serious.

Fear - See cause fear.

Feeblemind - Monsters cheat.. they dont often need stats to cast. And by the time you get it. You have better ways to stop something from casting.... Kill them.

Fire trap - Never tried it. Never seen it used. But a single point wall of fire type dmg that last for 30 seconds or so would rock here. Instead of a fireball that needs prepping.

Ghoul touch - Just a tweak to work on all monsters and not just 'humanoid' would give this a huge boost.

Greater Shout - With no enhancments to back it up. its dmg and effectiveness is pretty low for the cost. wasted slot.

Hypnotic Pattern - OMG GET IT OFF MY SCREEN! Far too visually distracting for the players. Good way to get booted out of a party.

Incendiary Cloud - Not nearly high enough damage to be worth casting.

Mind fog - While an awesome idea. It's saves are the same dc# as the things you'd be trying to lower the enemies will save for. Just cast 2 of the other instead of wasting a slot for mindfog.

Mordenkainen's Disjunction - Monsters dont have equipment...

Power word (blind kill stun) - Extreme low HP requirements make them all useless except in pvp.

Scare - See fear

Shout - See greater shout

Sleep - lol...

Sunburst - Very nice. But with no enhancments backing it up. Not so nice other than an expensive blind.

Symbol of - Stunning works, Persuasion works, The rest don't do much good. Especially with the long cooldowns.
Symbol of death is noticably the worst one... 150hp limit? SO um... kobolds?

Touch of Idiocy - Suffers same problems as feeblemind.


On top of those... all the fogs... with no speed debuff for the monsters. and monsters have no trouble seeing thru it like players do... Mostly useless and annoying. clickys win over wasting a slot right now.

Some just lack enhancments to make them halfway worthwhile. Some are based on true d&d HP or HD models and just do not function in ddo with the inflated mobs we have.

I'd also add in teleport and greater teleport. Those work great. But need some expanded locations list. At least the guild ship on both lists would be very nice.

[Eladiun]

Arcane

1) Meteor Swarm
2) Power Word Spells/ Any HP/HD Tied Spells (cheating yes but this whole class of spells fails due to MoB HP being much higher than PnP)
3) Acid Rain
4) Sleet Storm
5) Fog Spells

Note: I ranked based on suck and adjusted for spell level.

[freshlysnipes]

Camoflauge by far the worst of the worst. It is only good for hiding Hezrou cracks....

[RioRussell]

I was just going to start a thread on this myself.

So I'm encouraging participation in this thread!

Personally, I'd like to see something like:

- spell name
- 1-5 rating on spell cost (1 being bad, 5 being appropriate)
- 1-5 rating on spell effectiveness
- comments

Horrid Wilting:
Cost: 4
Effectiveness: 1 - I use this spell in one quest (vod for end bats), period
Potential Fix: Make it negative damage with a kicker (level drain, exhaustion), or make it a short duration DoT effect as-is.

[LeLoric]

A few spells that I wish would get some tune-ups.

Fear- the way mobs just run is not conducive to good game play or good spells. A necro based CC is nice but it needs to do something different to mobs.

Contagion- just doesn't do enough needs additional effects added instead of just stat damage which has become irrelevant in today's game. Give the dex stat one decreased movement and attacks. Give the con damage one a negative fort debuff. Other similar ones for the other effects.

Tenser's- This needs fixed make stat bonus +2 and arcane type or something other that stacks. Instead of no casting maybe remove all offensive casting (any that would break invis). To do this youd need to remove all scrolls from the game though anyone with some umd shouldnt get this bonus. Then add additional similar transformation spells.