request for a WF Pally build.

[avatar28]

Hi, i've only dabbled in playing pally's on my server, however i'm soon going to TR my sorc, and I was thinking of making him into a pally. Alignment is already LG.

However, I want to go WF sword and board. Was thinking about giving him a scimitar or kopesh to use.

I'm looking at maybe going for close to max AC, and was thinking 16 starting dex would suffice in order to max out shield and heavy armor bonus with the prestige III line for defender. I'm not too concerned with going high dps for this character, after all, he will be using a shield 100% of the time. so i'm looking at starting with low Str, and low Int, and I would like him to have a good Wis score and a high Cha. because I would be nerfing his Str, i'm looking to make up for some lost dps by adding a high cha modified damage, and possibly consider taking power attack.

I realize that by nerfing Str, I will be greatly reducing his attack and damage bonus, so in order to mitigate that, I could pick up weapons finesse, and dump str all together and jack up his dex. The flipside to that would be, again losing damage.

I'm willing to sacrifice dps for ac and better saves. I was hoping to minimize dex though, so after eating a +2 dex tome, I would cap out max dex bonus with defender II and any possible items that would allow me to raise the cap on the shield + armor.

Sorry if I sound confusing, but i'm at a loss to try and role this guy, hopefully some experienced pally's can help me with this build.

just to recap:

-high AC (near max)
- mediocre dps
-sword and board
-WF as race.
- good saves
- high Cha.


last note:

in order to facilitate an overall good build, I would be willing to go fleshie if it means my build would benefit greatly (i.e. dwarf with an axe, elf using longswords.)

ty

[avatar28]

after playing with the character planner i've decided that WF is not the way to go in order to build a viable pally. the ability scores are horrible.

so, i'm open to suggestions ....

[emptysands]

after playing with the character planner i've decided that WF is not the way to go in order to build a viable pally. the ability scores are horrible.

so, i'm open to suggestions ....

If you want AC you should go Dwarf - gets you Dwarf Arm Mastery. With 32pt you'll need to go THF - although with "holy sword" dwarf axes in shield mode this might work out.

Here is something rough I've got in blueprint mode at the moment. Main problem is the enhancements.

STR 16 + 2 = 18 + 6 = 24 + 1 (epic) + 3 (excpt) = 28 + 5 lvl + 1 (+3 tome) = 34 + 4 (stance)
DEX 11 + 2 = 13 + 5 = 18 + 2 (epic) + 2 (excpt) = 22
CON 16 + 2 = 18 + 6 = 24 + 2 (dwaf) + 2 (excpt) = 28 + 1 (epic/tome) + 1 (excpt) = 30
INT 11 + 2 = 13
WIS 8 + 2 = 10 + 6 = 16
CHA 14 + 2 = 16 + 6 = 22 + 1 (epic) + 3 (excpt) = 26 + 2 (pally cha II) = 28


UMD:
11 skill
+7 @24CHA
+4 GH
+2 luck
+3 bunny/cartouche
=27
+6 CHA skills
+2 epic CHA
=35
+3 CHA skills pot

===
HP:
20 Heroic Durability
10 Draconic Vitallity
200 Paladin level 20
160 @CON26
22 Toughness (Feat)
30 Greater False Life
20 Dwarf Toughness II
20 Paladin Toughness II
45 GS MinII Item
22 Minos/Toughness Item
=
549
40 DOS Stance
20 @CON28
20 @CON30
= 609
40 yugo pot


FEATS
Level 1: Toughness
Level 3: Two Handed Fighting
Level 6: Extend and maybe switch to Combat Expertise at 20
Level 9: Improved Critical: Slashing Weapons
Level 12: Improved Two Handed Fighting
Level 15: Power Attack
Level 18: Greater Two Handed Fighting


AC target:
10 Base
15 Epic Vambraces of Inner Light (MDB: 1)
9 Epic Kundarak Warding Shield +7 (MDB: -)
5 Protection +5
1 Paladin Bulwark of Good
2 Chaosguard
5 Barkskin
2 Recitation
1 Haste
4 Insight +4
2 Alchemical
= 56
6 MDB 1 + 2 (blue) + 2 (dwarf) = 5 or 20 DEX
= 61


AC MODE:

5 CE
4 Inspire Heroics
3 Dodge +3
= 73

SOD MODE:
3 Paladin Bulwark of Good IV
1 Defender of Siberys III
4 Defender of Siberys III stance
2 SOD Set
=
83
2 MDB 1 + 2 (blue) + 2 (DOS) +2 (dwarf) or 24 DEX (need +4 tome)
=
85


Enhancements are tricky:

== SOD (27AP)
Paladin Defender of Siberys III (8AP)
Paladin Courage of Good I (+2 vs fear aura, 1AP)
Paladin Focus of Good I (+3 Concerntration, 1AP)
Paladin Paladin Armor Class Boost I (+2AC for 20sec, 1AP)
Unyielding Sovereignty (6AP)
Bulwark of Good IV (+4AC, 10AP)

== Dwarf (21AP)
Dwarven Axe Damage II (+2 axe damage, 6AP)
Dwarven Constitution II (+2 CON, 6AP)
Dwarven Toughness II (+20 HP, 3AP)
Dwarven Armor Mastery II (+2 MDB, 6AP)


== Paladin (32AP)
Paladin Weapons of Good (1d6 holy vs evil plus 2d6 light damage vs EO/Undead, +vs DR/Good, 2AP)
Paladin Charisma II (+2 CHA, 6AP)
Paladin Toughness II (+20 HP, 3AP)
Paladin Resistance of Good II (+2 saves aura, 3AP)
Paladin Extra Lay on Hands II (+2 LOH, 3AP) - Heals (10 + LEVEL) x CHAMOD [210HP (base@20)]


Divine Might II (+4 sacred damage for 1min, 3AP. Req 16 CHA)
Paladin Exalted Smite II (+CHA to hit, 7+lvl damage, +1CM/CR. 4sec cool down 3AP)
Paladin Extra Smite Evil III: (6AP)
Paladin Divine Righteousness I (200% hate for 1min/turn, 2AP)
Paladin Divine Sacrifice I (5d6 Good, CM+1, 1AP)

[avatar28]

thx for the reply, dwarf looks good, however a few things I see wrong with the build (for me).

I won't take any THF or TWF feats.

I want this guy using a tower shield, so that is probably the first feat I will take.

secondly, I am not concerned with con that much. 300-350 hp is plenty enough for me

third, i'm not gonna eat a +2 tome for every stat. ( i have 6 other toons ) so dex, and cha are about the only tomes i'll eat for this build.

and lastly, I won't take +5 stat increases at levels 4,8,12,16,20. I will be taking Cha instead.

This guy is not going to be great dps, but more or less a tank with mediocre dps, with great saves, and insane AC.

i'm looking for a Cha pally build with minimum dex to max out armor mastery and DOS III armor/dex modifiers.

[k1ngp1n]

thx for the reply, dwarf looks good, however a few things I see wrong with the build (for me).

I won't take any THF or TWF feats.

I want this guy using a tower shield, so that is probably the first feat I will take.

secondly, I am not concerned with con that much. 300-350 hp is plenty enough for me

third, i'm not gonna eat a +2 tome for every stat. ( i have 6 other toons ) so dex, and cha are about the only tomes i'll eat for this build.

and lastly, I won't take +5 stat increases at levels 4,8,12,16,20. I will be taking Cha instead.

This guy is not going to be great dps, but more or less a tank with mediocre dps, with great saves, and insane AC.

i'm looking for a Cha pally build with minimum dex to max out armor mastery and DOS III armor/dex modifiers.

Ugh. Honestly, do this, and the toon will be one more useless 'doorstop pally' that gets on everyone's DNG list.

[blitzschlag]

This guy is not going to be great dps, but more or less a tank with mediocre dps, with great saves, and insane AC.

how you wanna take aggro mate? what you gonna tank if the wizard using a light repeater will pull the aggro off you?

you won't have insane ac or medicore dps. great saves is true however

[avatar28]

please don't trash this build - if you have suggestions on how to make this build better - by all means.

I'm not going to sacrifice ac and cha for strength and dps.

THIS IS NOT A DPS BUILD

please understand that.

I have many barbs and ranger/fighters that got heaps of dps.

This is more of a support/roleplay role.

If people don't want to group with me because i'm "gimp" then go find another cookie-cutter build that will hit the numbers you want.

I want to make something different. I have a good reputation for being a good player on Sarlona, and all my toons get accepted into whatever I want - because i'm a skilled player. And i'll take a skilled player who knows what he/she is doing over some number cruncher dps clone.


so please people, If you are experienced at making pally's help- me with this build... that's all I ask.

[TFPAQ]

please don't trash this build - if you have suggestions on how to make this build better - by all means.

I'm not going to sacrifice ac and cha for strength and dps.

THIS IS NOT A DPS BUILD

please understand that.

I have many barbs and ranger/fighters that got heaps of dps.

This is more of a support/roleplay role.

If people don't want to group with me because i'm "gimp" then go find another cookie-cutter build that will hit the numbers you want.

I want to make something different. I have a good reputation for being a good player on Sarlona, and all my toons get accepted into whatever I want - because i'm a skilled player. And i'll take a skilled player who knows what he/she is doing over some number cruncher dps clone.


so please people, If you are experienced at making pally's help- me with this build... that's all I ask.

You stated that this is "more of a support/roleplay role". I guess I would ask you to define support as it would be applied to your group.

A couple of posts raised questions on intim. From your response, you aren't building an intimi-tank. So what is this chars role? It will sig. effect how people make recommendations to you. "High" or "insane" AC with no dps or intimi makes you pretty much into a doorstop; at least without knowing what you are looking to do ...

Are you going to 20 with capstone and spending your days in Amrath, etc? Are you going to use your CHA to spank the MOBs (DM, etc). Divine Sacrifices, etc ...

What is your focus on the build?

[spartin]

The only way I see to make this build using your requirements mildly useful is to splash fighter or rogue and Max out intimidate. At least then you would be usefully in 2 or 3 quests. Note I said usefull, not required.

[Asketes]

Secondly, I Am Not Concerned With Con That Much. 300-350 Hp Is Plenty Enough For Me

until You Get A Couple 300-400 Point Fireballs To Your Face.

Then:

Awe, Doorstop Pally Needs Another Rez /sadface

please Don't Trash This Build - If You Have Suggestions On How To Make This Build Better - By All Means. don't Get Upset When You Don't Get Answers To Your Questions, Maybe 1% Of The Population, At Best, Plays For Rp. **statistical Data Not Accurate**

This Is More Of A Support/roleplay Role. doorstop Pally

I Want To Make Something Different. I Have A Good Reputation For Being A Good Player On Sarlona, And All My Toons Get Accepted Into Whatever I Want - Because I'm A Skilled Player. And I'll Take A Skilled Player Who Knows What He/she Is Doing Over Some Number Cruncher Dps Clone.


So Please People, If You Are Experienced At Making Pally's Help you Are Asking For A Role Playing Pally, Not A Real Pally. People Are Answering Your Questions Honestly- Me With This Build... That's All I Ask.

[Asketes]

doorstop pally tanks, doorstop pally dies, doorstop pally rezes...

doorstop pally looking good, doorstop pally rp'ing in the hood


doorstop pally.............. in my pocket!

[emptysands]

thx for the reply, dwarf looks good, however a few things I see wrong with the build (for me).

I won't take any THF or TWF feats.

I want this guy using a tower shield, so that is probably the first feat I will take.

secondly, I am not concerned with con that much. 300-350 hp is plenty enough for me

third, i'm not gonna eat a +2 tome for every stat. ( i have 6 other toons ) so dex, and cha are about the only tomes i'll eat for this build.

and lastly, I won't take +5 stat increases at levels 4,8,12,16,20. I will be taking Cha instead.

This guy is not going to be great dps, but more or less a tank with mediocre dps, with great saves, and insane AC.

i'm looking for a Cha pally build with minimum dex to max out armor mastery and DOS III armor/dex modifiers.

By all means. However lack of Tower Shield feat can be covered by using the GH raid shield or epic VON6 large shield. The later has better AC anyway.

If you don't want to use +2 tomes for everything on an AC Paladin tank build I suggest you look at something else.

Any melee build with less than 400 HP is a waste of space - expect to be rejected from most of the content you want to play in order to get good AC. TOD for example requires you to not only have a decent build, but be known as a good player. 300 HP will be less than my 28pt fleshy first build gimp wizard.

Most 32pt builds Paladins will not worry about getting DMIII or DMIV - the cost is very high.

Insane AC is meaningless if you can't get it - you need options in order to run the quests so that you can get that the loot. AC builds require lots of loot - it will take you a long time to collect everything.


Go look at the Rock Candy build - this is a nice WF AC evasion build that is very easy to operate.

[avatar28]

wow, I won't post on this forum again,
some people think linear and are quite rude.

Hey Asketes

QFT and go get a life!
you're opinion is not welcome in this thread.

[r3dl4nce]

Mate, you asked for advices. You CAN'T build a tank with 300-350 HP. You can't build a melee with ZERO dps. Go build your toon as you like, don't mind listening to the good advices from the experts. In the end, it's YOU TOON and you are free to play it as you like, just play it solo, no party will accept you after a quest with a so useless build.

[Joseph]

Avatar,

+1 Rep to you for sticking to your guns on the build you want to play, regardless of whether it works or not.

I sent you a PM.

There are a few people who gave good advice in here - but overall, wow. Almost the whole thread deserves negative rep.

To the rest of you negative posters, wow. You need to stop behaving like dogs fighting over a bone and get your heads out of your back sides. Give the guy some credit and some help rather than ripping him to shreds and telling him that he should just be another 'clone warrior' in your sith army.

[Joseph]

This is more or less the build I posted for Avatar. As he has 32 point builds, mentioned that tomes are not a problem, and has a forum account sine 2007, I will assume he is not as ignorant or uninformed as some people here would like to have him believe.

Personally I support what he is doing. As long as he is aware of the attitudes some of the people have expressed in this thread, I am sure he will happily inform any group he is interested in joining that he is not a powergamer and is a S&B paladin, he should do fine. He won't want to be in your groups, and you won't want him in yours.

Problem solved. You can have fun being great and he can have fun being mediocre. For the record:

I have fun playing mediocre characters. It relieves the stress of being great at more important things than DDO.

RACE: Human

• Human Healing Amplication
• Human Action Boost / Skill Boost (+ to UMD)
• +1 to a single stat

WEAPON: Bastard Sword

• this is because you get glancing blows with it, and Human and Dwarf equal each other in this respect. No other two one handed weapons give glancing blows when used with a shield.

CLASSES: Fighter1/Paladin19
Fighter 1

• Bonus Feat (Toughness - for free)
• Tower Shield for free
• Respec at 20 to a Pure Paladin (take the tower feat or toughness when you respec if you feel they are that important or not - as you like)

Paladin 19

• This is obvious - the class you wanted to play

FEAT RECOMMENDATIONS: To support the style of play you are interested in...
Level 1 (Fighter)

• Fighter - Weapon Focus Slashing
• Fighter Bonus Feat - Toughness
• Human Bonus Feat - Bastard Sword

Note that if you will not take the THF feats, you should at least take Cleave and Great Cleave (both are on different timers).

Add - Combat Expertise is a must have (take it at level 6 or level 9 - the extra AC and to hit won't balance out until then).

Personally I like Improved Shield Bash - but that is because when everyone else dies I can fight, shield bash, and tumble to safety (no -4 to hit penalty for moving if attacking out of a tumble animation - and you can tumble while blocking - so you can be mobile and keep your shield DR) - as with many of my views, many disagree with me (even when I carry them to the shrine).

Finally - Stats (my recommendations - remember - as a pure Paladin, you want to shoot for a natural 20 in Charisma).

ST: 14 (you will put +2 level up points here)
DX: 14 (you can add tomes or items here)
CN: 14 (CON 14 is not a MUST - but it is preferable - CON 12 is just too dicey unless you are on an Elf)
IN: 14 (skills of Jump, Balance, Intimidate, and UMD).
WS: 8 - you can use items and pots to cast until you get an item - plus you mentioned tomes. Always leave this at 8.
CH: 15 - +3 level up points, and one +2 tome to equal 20.

On the Stats - obviously this is not the best, most powerful, supreme build in the game - but it is serviceable, and it will work very well for what you want to do.

As you level, remember to start out with Adamantine Full Plate - don't switch to Mithril FP until you eat that +2 dex tome you mentioned - then you will (should) also have a +4 dex item, and the +2 tome, returning +5 ac from Mithril FP (or +4 more AC than you would have in Adamantine FP - it balances out against the DR3/- of Addy Plate/.

When you eat your heart of wood at level 20, you should then either have one of the shields that grants tower proficiency, or you can decide if it is worth it to you to take the feat (dropping fighter 1 will cost you two feats - you won't need WF Slashing anymore at L20, but you will likely want to keep Toughness.

Enhancements are all you.

[Khellendros13]

wow, I won't post on this forum again,
some people think linear and are quite rude.

Hey Asketes

QFT and go get a life!
you're opinion is not welcome in this thread.

You are asking for a Pally build that will be useless. Most people in this thread are telling you this. No one else is getting aggressive.

350hp is ok on a melee toon with no evasion?

You have been around for at least 2+ years, I would of thought you would of realised this is asking for trouble.
Furthermore, you intend to grind for AC gear but not +2 tomes all around? This seems like a bad joke to me.

You asked for advice, got advice that didn't marry with your ideas and thus got bum hurt. Get over it or roll a real Pally

[Dylvish]

You are asking for a Pally build that will be useless. Most people in this thread are telling you this. No one else is getting aggressive.

350hp is ok on a melee toon with no evasion?

You have been around for at least 2+ years, I would of thought you would of realised this is asking for trouble.
Furthermore, you intend to grind for AC gear but not +2 tomes all around? This seems like a bad joke to me.

You asked for advice, got advice that didn't marry with your ideas and thus got bum hurt. Get over it or roll a real Pally

While I agree with most of this, I have to admit, I have a Human DoS paladin, and he will only be at 360ish health at 20. I find it hard to get much higher on em (this is naked however, not counting gear, not sure if you were factoring gear in or not), and he has a 16 con after my +2 tome.

[emptysands]

While I agree with most of this, I have to admit, I have a Human DoS paladin, and he will only be at 360ish health at 20. I find it hard to get much higher on em (this is naked however, not counting gear, not sure if you were factoring gear in or not), and he has a 16 con after my +2 tome.

16 CON on a human Paladin is good, given the pressures on other ability scores. I'm guessing 360 without gear looks like:

10 Base
200 Paladin@20
60 16 CON
22 Toughness Feat
20 Paladin Toughness II
20 Human Toughness II
10 Agent favor
= 342.

Add gear:

342
60 +6 CON
30 GFL
20 Item Toughness (Minos)
= 452
45 GS Item
20 +2 ExCON
20 Rage spell
= 547

Anything over 450 is reasonable, anything over 500 is good. I've survived evon1 on 550 even after forgetting to equip my minos.

400 HP with gear is a bad place for any melee.

[Delt]

Well, the OP wanted a gimpy build and Joseph gave him one. High five to both of you for the chuckle.